- 12-25-2012, 01:48 PM #54
We won't know until BB10 is released, they are using 7digital for music and Rovi entertainment for Movies and TV shows. We haven't seen what they're doing as far as cloud goes but they own NewBay and their services and software are already on PC/Mac, iOS/Android/WP8. These recent purchases and partnerships they made up to the release of BB10 will play a big role in its "ecosystem".
12-25-2012, 11:25 PM #59
- 299 Posts
From what I have seen, BB10 looks very good. At first glance, the android app portability feels like a huge positive, but it's only so if the OS/Hardware is better than android, otherwise you are best off just getting android device. I understand SOME business users will look at it, especially if RIM provide incentives, but others are just sick of waiting.
Here are some random thoughts:
* The biggest issue - the OS may be superior, but will have limited market reach (high-end only) due to price at the start, this will not be well received in their strongest markets; they are targeting their weakest market (the iphone5, SIII and to a lesser extent Lumia 920 crowd). It will likely be at the 199 on contract pricing and over 600 MSRP. Their biggest markets will keep buying their old stuff at the lower price points... for a while ... until the low-end Android and WP7/8 devices continue to gain popularity
* RIM have done a pretty poor job in the past, BB7 devices were buggy and just not very good overall (in my opinion). People remember that and BB7 owners are less likely to upgrade.
* The camera software tech is from Scalado, Nokia bought that company, so their will be limits to any big new advances for them there
* No 'halo effect' from other devices / ecosystem. Windows 8 will sell in the hundreds of millions, even if it's less popular than previous versions.
* Windows Phone has a huge head start
* Blackberry does have the high-security market cornered and will get that business
* Blackberry will likely screw something up in a way that we haven't thought of yet
- 12-26-2012, 06:37 AM #60
I agree about missing the small "apps". I switched to WP7 a year ago and was convinced I would stay with it. However, I miss the "Bedside Mode" on my BB, and BB10 looks interesting enough, I think I may have to reconsider.
- 12-26-2012, 06:44 AM #61
12-26-2012, 06:59 AM #62
- 1,698 Posts
I agree with brmiller that there is cause for concern. BB10 does indeed look to be packaged up quite nicely. MS seem to be trundling along at their own pace, which is just fine if we're assuming RIM is dead... but there's always a chance that BB10 could snatch a large portion of those iPhone & Android deserters which WP NEEDS.
Microsoft need to keep their finger on the pulse. People said Windows Phone would never gain traction. They are being proved wrong, but no one said it would be easy. If MS can iron out the creases in Wp8 and optimise the ecosystem to the maximum (in an impressive time) they'll maintain their projected marketshare goals. I also hate to say this, but apps like Instagram are a MUST for any successful platform.
Last edited by Big Supes; 10-03-2013 at 12:16 PM.Google - "Don't be evil. . . much!"
- 12-26-2012, 08:28 AM #63
Just like mrmiller1976 I have used a devil alpha and wp8. Obvious dare2blink u never used bb10 as if u have u would have worries. Just like I have worries from wp8. In comparing the 2 platforms wp8 is like a flashier version of android. Wp8 has more in common with ios/android than bb10. the wow factor wp8 is all the colours u see on the home screen the wow factor disappears when u start using the os. Bb10 on the other hand I agree dose seem to be missing the wow factor until u use the os then u get a lasting wow factor as u can do things no other platform can. BlackBerry appeals to more people then wp8 and all other windows phones combined as I believe more curves were sold than all wp since it launched. Remember RIM currently owns third place in the world market and wp8 is trying to catch them
12-26-2012, 08:30 AM #64
- 22 Posts
What in the world are you talking about? The quality of bb10 and features above all OS? Like what? Quality wise that is nonsense as ios and wp8 (despite a couple of bugs that will undoubtly be fixed very soon with updates) are as high quality as it gets. The average consumer could not care less if their browers is 0.5 seconds faster at loading sites . BB10 does not offer a compelling case at all, and looks like a slightly better android phone. As soon as wp8 gets the notifications that is already confirmed as coming there will be nothing on blackberry that is better. The whole design of the OS is boring and does not stand out. I think you might be confusing enthusiasm with desperation but hey, this is literaly their last chance after all. I think they might have a chance in the corporate environment but the in the consumer market? No way
- 12-26-2012, 08:31 AM #65My next phone...
- 12-26-2012, 08:38 AM #66My next phone...
- 12-26-2012, 09:13 AM #67
@dare2blink after you leave the home screen whats amazing in the phone?(dont bash, answer the question) A multi-language keyboard is compelling for people who speak more then 1 language, keyboard that learns where you press is compelling for people who hate typing on virtual keyboards. And the small features crystal_planet and randy jones listed are things no-one does as good as BB
- 12-26-2012, 09:15 AM #68
12-26-2012, 09:49 AM #69
- 14 Posts
Will BB10 take down WP8? Maybe not. Is it possible? Yes, it is, if Microsoft allows it. I know in big corps, things aren't always smooth sailing just because they have billions of dollars at their disposal. Problems still exist amongst and between different departments, but I find that Microsoft has too much money to be playing around with WP8, and that's what they're doing. They are yet to hit the ball out of the park, and its the waiting to do this that might kill them.
Microsoft is in the perfect position to come out on top. Their biggest threat isn't even Apple at this point, or RIM, it's Google. But ONLY if they allow it. They have potentially the most robust ecosystem, they have huge amounts of money to throw at their problems, one of the best R&D teams in the technology industry, and their reputation of being last in the door, but first to the table is pretty much unrivalled. (See Xbox and Windows computing). But, with all these things going for them, I don't see them moving at the pace they should be moving with. I have to think it is a problem with a managerial line. Some one, or some group of people are making all the wrong moves. They're making it way too easy for companies that don't have nearly as much resources as they do, to compete.
The complaints on WP8 should be plugged already (no Notification Hub, simpler management for ringtones, etc). These things should be fixed by January 2013 for the latest. There are some marvellous features in Windows 8, not found in WP8. How is that even possible? I don't know! The picture-unlock is a cool feature, bring it to the phone. It will be a first for a phone I think. The gesture in Win8 to close applications; bring that to the phone as a force-close option, where if you place your finger to the top of an app, and drag the app all the way down, it closes. But, if you drag it midway to the screen, you bring up the task switcher. Easy, and intuitive! Fix the view on the task switcher, so that people can properly see their running tasks. Add real, Live Wall Papers to the lock screen. Some more customisation wouldn't hurt either. There are simple customisation tweaks that will make the phone feel more..."free" a la Android, without sacrificing the control MSFT has over the experience. Have the option to change Tile colours individually. Maybe even an option in the colour picker to automatically change Tile colours after certain set periods of time. This ensures your phone always looks surprisingly different (You never know what colour theme you'll see when you pick up your phone) - no other OS even has the potential to do that. Add an option to change the font sizes for headings. These are small additions to customisation that will not interfere with the look of WP8, while still bringing more openness to the platform. These are just examples.
No apps? Fly out to India, get a group of four dozen of the best coders you can find, sit them in a room, make them an offer, and let them get to work. Instagram won't jump on board? Call the CEO of Instagram up, and tell him Microsoft will develop the Instagram app, using our own resources, and we'll pay you to do it. All you have to do is sign this, we'll take care of everything else.
Where is the marketing? Where is the real guerilla marketing? They have these boring personalities using WP8 devices, why? Look at the phone, look at the celebrities that match up with the look and feel of the device? Pay Justin Beiber x-amount of dollars to endorse it. Pay the labels to use the phones in music videos. Put it in the hands of Beyonce, Adam Levine, Drake, Lil Wayne, Adelle, Rob Dyrdek, Kobe Bryant (that yellow L920 will go nicely with the Lakers). Put a pink L920 (make one if you have to), L820 into Nicki Minaj's hands, and pay her to use it in her next video. In fact, offer her that Signature Pink L920 for keeps, as her own personal phone. If there is a demand for it, manufacture more and sell it. Or, make it a 1-time only Signature Phone, the Nokia Lumia 920 by Nicki Minaj (in hot pink) where she gets a small cut of all sales of that phone. Put her face on the box of that particular model 920 or 820! Have her go on 106 & Park, and pull it out briefly on the show, let her advertise it there. You won't believe the amount of "Barbie" followers this girl has. Teen girls and young adult chics will run to stores in droves to get their hands on their idol's phone. It seems tacky and desperate, but look around you, we are desperate, and these are the moves you have to make to get awareness out there. Sponsor these dance and talent shows with WP8. Iron Man 3 is coming out, get it in the move. The L920 in red, or yellow will look great in Tony Stark's hands; it compliments his Iron Man suit perfectly. I know the movie has finished filming, but the idea remains. Get it into the hands of a movie that falls in the same category as Iron Man. Just get it into a movie. What's the use of having so much money at your disposal and not using it? Do a RedBull Event, where Nokia is part sponsor (Show off the ruggedness and durability of the Nokia Lumia 920 at the event). You don't need a degree in business or marketing to figure this out. Microsoft has everything in place to blow past RIM, and Apple...but what are they doing? Giving these other companies a chance to get ahead, leaving MSFT to play catch-up again.
WP8, to me, is the most intuitive and sensibly functional OS on the market right now. I honestly believe it is the best mobile phone OS. The fact that I know WP8 could be hugely successful, and it's not, or taking its time to get there is disappointing and even frustrating.
You can't Windows Phone 8 has stagnated, not yet. It's way too early to say that. The OS is barely two months old, and as you've said already, sales reports have not been released yet. Just as you say it's too early to call it a success, it's also too early to call it stagnated. Yes, there is a shortage of Lumias, but Lumias aren't the only Windows 8 Phones out there.
@the poster above you
The virtual keyboard in WP8 also adjusts itself in its digital space to compensate for errors in typing.
- 12-26-2012, 10:05 AM #71
Here is why I think BB10 has a solid chance to beat WP for 3rd place, and to possibly move into second:
1. Blackberry's were cool once upon a time. A lot of people had them and loved them. They moved on, not because they disliked their blackberry's, but because other companies had something better. They may be tempted to move back once RIM is putting out an OS with cool features.
2. Apps. RIM is launching with over 100,000 apps, just like WP8. The port between BB10 and Android is super easy, which makes it much more likely that midsized developers will support it. Midsize developers are the developers the really make a difference for a platform. The heavy hitters like Rovio, Netflix, Amazan, etc will hit all the platforms because they can. Think developers that are the size Rovio was one Angry Birds started to take off on the iPhone. They make cool apps people want but can really only support a platform or two. If they can easily port their Android app to Blackberry, they may be more inclined so support it as a third platform since there will be minimal extra time and effort involved.
3. It just looks like a good OS. They have taken the best of all the platforms, and some of you say that like it is a bad thing. They have live tiles (albeit implemented differently than WP), they have the grid of icons (which many perfer to a list lik in WP), they have a more controlled app store, they have security. Where is the downside of taking the best of all worlds?
4. One phone, two personalities. A BB10 device can have completely seperate work and personal profiles. To the point that you companies IT department can preform a remote wipe and completely erase the business side and not touch the personal side. In a world where BYOD is becoming more and more common, this will be a huge selling point. You won't have to even see your work email when you are in personal profile. You won't see any work apps on your phone. No work files. When you are at work you don't have to worry about your silly ringtone for your signifigant other going off in the office. That will be a big selling point to a lot of people.
5. Gestures. This one may be more minor, but I LOVE gestures in Windows 8/RT and really am bummed that WP8 doesn't make use of them. It is the most natural way to interact with a touchscreen and BB is the first one to bake them right in to the OS and do it right. I think people will dig that.
I have been a dedicated WP fan since Pre-NoDo and have rocked an HD7 (T-Mobile), Titan, and Lumia 900. I nearly bought an 8X on Monday, but Best Buy will only do early upgrades for iPhones and it would have cost me and extra $150 to get it at the AT&T store. BB10 has me thinking I may just ride it out till my full upgrade in July and decide between WP8, BB10, and an iPhone then. BlackBerry 10 has a lot of promise and if Microsoft doesn't take that threat seriously, Windows Phone will join Palm's webOS in the "It was a good OS but just couldn't make it" club.
- 12-26-2012, 10:32 AM #72
So you think blackberry 10 is just going to be initially without bugs?? Right. The gripes people find in windows phone 8, they'll find problems with bb10. And just like Microsoft, they are starting with a brand new os with NO major appealing apps. Functional or not, being without Skype, Instagram, Netflix, and other major players on release day is going to be a problem.
12-26-2012, 10:59 AM #74
- 626 Posts
How is Blackberry launching with more than 100,000 apps?
What are the price points going to be?
I'm pretty confident BB10 will at least dent WP8 mindshare and gobble up some marketshare no doubt about that but its going to be a back and forth battle between RIM and MS.
MS has a lot more cards up its sleeve and I bet were going to see some really cool features arrive with Windows 8.1/8.5 Blue or whatever they decide to call it in February.
- 12-26-2012, 11:19 AM #75
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