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  1. Simon Tupper's Avatar
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    #26  
    But getting Vimeo is a good idea, it's probably the next Youtube.
  2. dalydose's Avatar
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    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by ammarmalik2011 View Post
    Because Bing and Windows Phone have been a runaway success? No they should stick to what they have and try to penetrate the market there. As of right now Bing and Windows Phone are non-existant in terms of market. Otherwise we're looking at another Kin and Zune.
    I'm not sure you know what "non-existent" means. Both Windows Phine and Bing exist with name recognition and are rising in popularity.
  3. Gadgetman110's Avatar
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    #28  
    Several years ago, before Google bought YouTube, Microsoft DID make a YouTube competitor. It was called SoapBox. It was MUCH nicer than YouTube. And it was a complete failure. Sad. It really was very nice.
  4. Laura Knotek's Avatar

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    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gadgetman110 View Post
    Several years ago, before Google bought YouTube, Microsoft DID make a YouTube competitor. It was called SoapBox. It was MUCH nicer than YouTube. And it was a complete failure. Sad. It really was very nice.
    I never even heard of it and had to look it up on Wikipedia. I guess I never knew about it since I never used MSN back in 2007. I had a hotmail account at the time, but that was it (and hotmail was basically only for TechNet newsletters).
  5. snowmutt's Avatar

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    #30  
    If MS could get a Netflix or similar service with name recogntion and a library already in place, that would be the only way I would think it would be a great idea. And what a great idea it would be. However, I do not think now is the point where MS needs to be spreading itself any thinner trying to start it's own service.

    What I love about Danny's thread here is that it opens up an even larger can of worms:

    How much does MS want to be involved in Google's infrastructure, and how much can it get away with building it's own? Let's just spot Apple and Microsoft for a moment here. Let's say they can play nice enough with their cross platform agreements and that XBOX music/movies becomes a good iTunes competitor. Can MS create a strong enough search engine/email service/mobile OS/internet browser/streaming services/business secure and document provider that MS clients do not need Google in any way? Or does MS have to find a way to interact with them to some degree to become the player they want where they are weak and maintain their strength's?

    I have no answer, but I love the idea of a complete ecosystem that has access to other tools, but no need for them. Can MS build that?
    A closed mouth gathers no feet.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
  6. brmiller1976's Avatar
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    #31  
    Microsoft could easily replicate every Google Service out there. The problem is how to monetize it to make it pay off. Google uses Services to collect personal, private information about you that it resells to advertisers and profilers. Every new service from Google that you use provides it valuable information about you that it can further use to flesh out your personal profile. It can target you with ads, sell information about you to private investigators or government agencies, sell information about you to banks or other companies who want to know your personal information, etc.

    If you start with Gmail and e-mail your significant other, Google can scan through each e-mail and determine your age, marital status and sexual orientation. Your bank statements mailed back will tell them that you have a Premier Account with JP Morgan Chase and are probably a holder of some significant assets. If you use Chrome to log on to your bank's site, they can scrape and report back your balance and other data, as well as your browsing habits. If you do a search for "Citibank Citigold," that can tell them that you're considering switching banks.

    Then, they can go to banks who want your business and say "hey, here is Joe. He's a gay guy in a domestic partnership with someone who lives 800 miles away. He frequently flies back and forth to see his partner, and has a Chase Premier Bank account with $120,000 in combined balances. He's interested in switching banks, and wants an account that is easier to access in Missouri, as well as has an affiliation with American Airlines, his preferred airline. Citibank, you offer just such an account. Will you pay us $50 for Joe's information and the ability to access him?"

    It's a profitable business that more than covers the cost of the services.

    Microsoft lacks that business model. The way they make money is by less-targeted banner ads, and through sales of Windows, Office, other software, and services. They'd have to work out a business model that links expensive server farms for a YouTube competitor to sales of software, devices or services. A bit tougher.
    snowmutt and benrp like this.
  7. snowmutt's Avatar

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    #32  
    Wow, brmiller, you make Google sound so sinister.

    The fact they truly are helps your case a little.

    But still, so negative!!
    A closed mouth gathers no feet.
  8. brmiller1976's Avatar
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    #33  
    I was a hard-core Google user for a while.

    Then I received an ad that absolutely blew me away, and the only way they could have known about my need to travel and target me so uniquely was to scrape my Gmail.

    I decided to dig a little and was blown away at what I learned. I left Google then, and never went back.
  9. dogfish54's Avatar
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    #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    I was a hard-core Google user for a while.

    Then I received an ad that absolutely blew me away, and the only way they could have known about my need to travel and target me so uniquely was to scrape my Gmail.

    I decided to dig a little and was blown away at what I learned. I left Google then, and never went back.
    Anything you can share on this? I completely agree about Google but have no proof. I think they are the biggest single threat to the internet, but I sound like I need a tinfoil hat when I tell people why.

    To the OP, what if Microsoft killed Bing and started sunsetting Outlook.com and entered into an agreement with Google for solid and reliable API access? I know it will never happen.

    Microsoft are kinda screwed with the lack of youtube support by Google, they can retaliate, but are not in a position of strength right now and just may alienate their customers.
  10. brmiller1976's Avatar
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    #35  
    Most people don't want to believe the facts, even when you show them to them. I share what I know and let people make up their own minds. If someone chooses to let Google resell their lives, that's totally okay... I just point out later, when some outrageous thing happens, that they willingly accepted it.

    Life is much too short to waste too much time on it. Do your diligence, let people know about it, and if they choose to believe that Google is just really nice and gives them free services with no motives, well... Not much you can do for 'em.
    snowmutt and benrp like this.
  11. msualum's Avatar
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    #36  
    Ok - late to the party but I have a concept. MS should buy Netflix or Hulu and move Bing video to that platform for actual recognition. YouTube is trying to break into the actual video rental. That is where they want to head. I think MS could take an established video / movie rental site and have free access for uploads / viewing of personal stuff. They need to do something...
  12. Kinalyx's Avatar
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    #37  
    Im sorry to all of the WP or windows or microsoft fanboys out there, but there is no replacing google. Im trying out a WP because i love the new nokia's and i really want to try it out. If MS and Google would get along, things would be great. I would love to have a google search bar on my home screen, or be able to just have a youtube app that went directly to youtube the way it should.

    Im not a Google or Android fanboy either, i want to make that clear. I like my google services because theyre what im used to, and theyre what i like. I dont want to have to change everything i do just to have a different phone.

    Shawn
  13. Zokudu's Avatar
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    #38  
    I would say a bigger name to look into buying is justin/twitch.tv. If they expanded upon the VoD concept and allowed uploading as opposed to just streaming. Morph it into a streaming + uploaded video site the same way google is attempting to make youtube livestreaming major events a thing. Not to mention twitch is a huge community for streaming all kinds of content, they would have a large userbase to begin with. Similar to Skype.
  14. longcipher's Avatar
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    #39  
    I've been thinking about this a lot. MS seems to think that they need to have similar services to Google's offerings. People aren't going to switch to a MS ecosystem for a new email experience. People love Gmail. People love YouTube and a MS clone would be pathetic. MS needs to give people a reason to be interested. That "killer app" or innovative hardware will draw them. They obviously haven't thought of it yet -- but that's the answer. Lead, don't follow. Forget trying to get apps from 2 years ago -- forge ahead and make a market.
    Last edited by longcipher; 01-09-2013 at 09:39 PM.
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  15. Chregu's Avatar
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    #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by 12Danny123 View Post
    Why use the Xbox brand? well because the Xbox brand is widely known. when people see something to do with Xbox they will instantly wanna know about it.
    Why not call it "Office Videos", as MS Office is also very successful? ;-)

    I wouldn't care about a video service by Microsoft, as long as they do it right, and I doubt that very much. Sure, in this argument are two sides: Folks from the US and the rest of the world. Just look at Bing, I'm sure it's great in the US, but it just sucks terribly around here. In my country it's even still beta, but they are still selling Windows Phone here with no possibility to change the search service. They basically sell a beta product, sad but true.

    Also, funny story, I switched the browser language from English UK to English US (because the Music Search which was available under WP7 is now gone under WP8 for no reason at all and somebody suggested to try the language change), and suddenly there where new features under the Search Button. None of them helpful, but it shows how much Microsoft cares about the rest of the world.

    So I would trust Microsoft to build a solid service in one market, but they could never pull it off in the rest of the world.

    After all this remarks that hopefully explain my opinion: Before Microsoft explores new market areas, they should fix what they have, and this everywhere. Google search and maps are great around here, Bing is terrible, and it would be exactly the same with Youtube and Officetube.
  16. ilabene's Avatar
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    #41  
    Everybody's saying Vimeo, what about Dailymotion? I always thought that was kind of the "underground YouTube."
  17. 4Tiles's Avatar
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    #42  
    Bing.com/video




    The reason MS doesn't do a YouTube, is YouTube is not profitable. Microsoft had a YouTube competitor, it was called Soapbox. They pulled the plug on it because it is a terrible business model. Microsoft's solution is Bing Video which is one of the most trafficked online video sites on the Internet every month. Instead of hosting the videos they let all the other companies incur the bandwidth costs and they aggregate everything right on the Bing website.

    I am a fan of the idea of Microsoft purchasing Netflix because there is a business model there at least.
    Last edited by 4Tiles; 01-14-2013 at 04:40 AM.
    SergeMcG likes this.
  18. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by briankariu View Post
    Oh God, I think MSfans are worse than Fandroids or iSheep.
    Windows Phone7 was not a success, no matter how much you wish it to be.
    Windows Phone 8, as good as it is, still has to penetrate the market.
    In my honest opinion, Microsoft should just drop the pride, make good with google and give a dozen WP8 phones to top devs in both play store and iOs app store.
    If they can stimulate developer interest, we may very well have a hit with windows phone 8
    What do you mean? Didn't EVERYONE who attended BUILD 2012 get a free Windows Phone AND Surface RT? I mean, there's only so much you can do to convince devs. While they could go the route of just THROWING money at the devs, those devs could easily take the money, half-*** some apps, then never give them support.

    A better suggestion would be to have MS subsidize the phones and get them out there where you have a flagship like the Lumia 920 free on-contract. The other option would be to give people $15-20 of free MS Store money with a Windows Phone purchase, as that would be free money to devs as well. The devices though, I think that they were already handed out.
    SergeMcG likes this.
  19. wpstan's Avatar
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    #44  
    I think that MS should develop their own Utube app...why not..they have their own search engine so why not make their own Utube..they have the resources..I say go for it
  20. Coreldan's Avatar
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    #45  
    The only Google service I use anymore is YouTube. I dont see why MS would need to compete with that, would most likely be too hard for no gain.

    I used all Google services before, but switched all I could to MS services when I got a Windows Phone and Win 8. Havnt looked back.
  21. ag1986's Avatar
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    #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    Microsoft could easily replicate every Google Service out there. The problem is how to monetize it to make it pay off. Google uses Services to collect personal, private information about you that it resells to advertisers and profilers. Every new service from Google that you use provides it valuable information about you that it can further use to flesh out your personal profile. It can target you with ads, sell information about you to private investigators or government agencies, sell information about you to banks or other companies who want to know your personal information, etc.

    If you start with Gmail and e-mail your significant other, Google can scan through each e-mail and determine your age, marital status and sexual orientation. Your bank statements mailed back will tell them that you have a Premier Account with JP Morgan Chase and are probably a holder of some significant assets. If you use Chrome to log on to your bank's site, they can scrape and report back your balance and other data, as well as your browsing habits. If you do a search for "Citibank Citigold," that can tell them that you're considering switching banks.

    Then, they can go to banks who want your business and say "hey, here is Joe. He's a gay guy in a domestic partnership with someone who lives 800 miles away. He frequently flies back and forth to see his partner, and has a Chase Premier Bank account with $120,000 in combined balances. He's interested in switching banks, and wants an account that is easier to access in Missouri, as well as has an affiliation with American Airlines, his preferred airline. Citibank, you offer just such an account. Will you pay us $50 for Joe's information and the ability to access him?"

    It's a profitable business that more than covers the cost of the services.

    Microsoft lacks that business model. The way they make money is by less-targeted banner ads, and through sales of Windows, Office, other software, and services. They'd have to work out a business model that links expensive server farms for a YouTube competitor to sales of software, devices or services. A bit tougher.
    Wow, that is by far the largest amount of poorly-informed FUD I've ever read. Google does not sell your data to anyone. Citibank could, for example, come to Google and say hey, we want to target anyone who's searching for Citigold or who is browsing sites that talk about Citigold. In the first case, ads are just shown when you search for Citigold on Google.com and in the second, when you're on sites that talk about it. Neither of these means that Citibank finds out anything about you. In the case of Gmail ads, the Adsense system treats your Gmail page like any other site and shows ads based on the content of the mail you're reading - the nature of the interface means that Adsense doesn't know where the data is coming from. Text gets sent to Adsense just like any other site text, adsense says hey, this matches Advertiser X's keywords, please show this ad and Gmail does so. Gmail is just another publisher as far as the Adsense system is concerned.

    I'm an Adwords/Adcenter professional and Google's Adwords targeting options are almost identical to those found in Bing Adcenter - this would indicate that both of them collect the same data on users, no? Furthermore, it would be business suicide for Google to sell data in the manner you postulate - where would be the need for banks/whatever to come back and keep paying? If you want an example of a true privacy nightmare, Facebook is your bunny.
  22. #47  
    Hey people, that only think US exists on this planet, you do realize that Hulu and Netflix is not an international video service? It's only for US, and for MS to compete with Google they have to offer the same service worldwide, which Google does with Youtube. That leaves only Vimeo but MS won't take it, because Vimeo is set for something else, not for clips like on youtube. In order to make an analogy between youtube and vimeo I would say that youtube equals cinema and vimeo equal theatre, they both offer a similar show but you don't get the same feel, it depends by your taste.
    MS should launch in Xbox Videos an online public video service and in the same time the chance to rent/buy movies through this service. But! IT should not be like Xbox Music, they have to recode everything from ground up, their Xbox eco-system that is newly created lacks stability.
  23. Jaskys's Avatar
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    #48  
    Fighting youtube ?
    No way, it's too big no way to beat it....
  24. despertador's Avatar
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    #49  
    No, that would be a waste of time and resources. Although Microsoft still can make an awesome video service, not much people would really care about uploading there. YouTube has way too much videos there for people to even think about checking out the alternatives. They should just focus on what they already have, and make it better!
  25. ilabene's Avatar
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    #50  
    I'm confused as to even why people are suggesting Netflix and Hulu. They're nothing like YouTube. That's why, DailyMotion!
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