Tried to be google-less for the last to weeks ... failed :-(

rdubmu

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I haven't used google regularly for probably since 2009 or whenever bing first rolled out. I still use it occasionally. Bing thou works 99% of the time. And the 1% of the time i can not find what I need on Bing, usually Google can't find it either. They equal search providers. I just choose to use Bing instead.

As for other services. Google Calendar is much better than anything other than outlook (the application). The Live Calendar is horrible. So I use Gmail because my university is a Google Apps user, and then I the same calendar for personal and education. I don't think I will ever loose google 100%, but if google disappeared I would be just fine.

I wish my school subscribed to office 365, we use this at work and it is freaken awesome compared to google apps. I would use my work calendar for personal but I do not want my bosses looking at my personal calendar. ;P
 

a5cent

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Thanks to a comment on the wpcentral homepage, I've found that even bing.de has more features than bing.ch, and it's NOT in beta.
<snipped>Or maybe there are just not enough of us, making us too unimportant to care.

I think your suspicion is correct. Also don't forget our four official languages which complicates things further.

I feel that Microsoft just doesn't understand anything about the world outside the U.S. For example, I really don't understand why the website www.bing.ch exists in the first place. Why not just stick with www.bing.com, and make everything else configurable?

For example, although I live in Switzerland, I am interested in news from Germany, the U.S., China, anything related to the EU and Switzerland. I prefer most of my web searches to be in English, but I want to quickly switch to French or German searches when necessary. I'm rarely interested in restricting my searches only to sites in Switzerland. Unfortunately, Microsoft insists on pigeonholing everyone, based on what country they currently live in. That might work in the U.S. where most people speak exactly one language and aren't much interested in the happenings beyond their boarders, but that is completely different for Europeans. We cross boarders constantly and we typically speak more than one language, and that affects what we are interested in and how we use search.

Like I said, all this stuff should be configurable, and not based on the country code of the domain you use to search.
 

socialcarpet

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I live in the U.S. and I think Bing is merely adequate. I tried sticking to Bing only when i first got my Lumia 900 ( i used Bing exclusively on my computer too) and i made it about a month. I even took the "Bing it on challenge" and Google won by a landslide. I really wanted to like Bing, especially since I am stuck with a permanent Bing button on my phone.

But the truth is, its just not as good as Google. I still use it because the button is there, but I've never once seen it give me better/more relevant search results than Google. It is adequate for most things though.

As for the rest of this, I don't see the point in inconveniencing myself greatly just to try and be Google free. Yes, Google is an advertising company that will info-mine your internet surfing habits, but if you think Bing doesn't do the same thing, you're deluding yourself. Every company with a presence on the web does it in one form or another. Unless you're going to delete your Facebook account and every other identifying piece of info on the web and surf the internet using Tor from now on, there is no sense in working yourself up into a lather over this stuff and thinking you are some kind of internet privacy warrior because you use Bing and hotmail.
 

spaulagain

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Wrong. Google is an advertising company. Search is only a means of collecting the data they sell or use in add targeting. Since you aren't paying Google for their services, you aren't the customer.

Have you ever "gmailed" your mother about an illness... Google knows about it. Have you ever "gmailed" a friend about marriage problems... Google knows about it. Have you ever searched for the morning-after-pill on the internet while logged in... Google knows about it. People might find this far fetched, but it's really barely the basics. I've worked on these kinds of systems and they can literally deduce information about you that not even you yourself know. Google collects incredible amounts of data on each of their users. The creepy thing is, that you have no idea who has access to it.

If you are fine with that, great, no problem. That is your choice to make. Although I have nothing to hide, I still don't want people jumping to conclusions about me, based solely on Google's profiling algorithms.

Chrome too is primarily a means of collecting data. Surely they aren't giving it to you for free, out of the goodness of their hearts. The tricky thing about Chrome is that it has access to your entire computer and every file on it. I view Chrome as spyware and would never install it on any system I use, ever.



I completely disagree. Google boycott isn't silly. It's just that some people care more about privacy than others. If you don't care about your privacy that is fine, but other's aren't crazy because they do. What I dislike is that many consumers are completely ignorant in regard to how Google makes their money. Many consumers don't realize to what extent they are sacrificing their privacy in exchange for Google's "free" services. I would prefer if consumers could at least make more informed decisions on the matter.

I do agree that we can go overboard though... at some point protecting your privacy boarders on paranoia.


No, I'm not wrong. They started out as a search company. Advertising is how they get their money from search. Otherwise they would be a non-profit company. Yahoo and Bing use advertising as well.

And yes, I know all about their tracking of search etc. I use those services at the company I work for. And the reason those services are so effective for businesses is because Google's consumer products are so good at what they do that a majority of consumers use their products instead of the other.
 

a5cent

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Siri wouldn't return anything simply because there were almost no restaurants listed in an online database. Also, simple changes in accent were unrecognizable. I think that Local Scout is in a similar situation now. And it SHOULD work, but I honestly don't believe the problem is from lack of trying :winktongue: localization is an extremely difficult feat because it requires software engineers who are also proficient in multiple languages and oftentimes there are none of these in a particular language OR they don't want to work for Microsoft. Let's only hope that this will change with the continued sales of WP8

TellMe already recognizes German, French and Italian. That is by far the most challenging engineering task, but it is already completed, at least as far as Switzerland is concerned.

In regard to Local Scout, well, the button to launch Local Scout simply doesn't exist in WP. You can't even start it. You are likely correct that this is due to a lack of data (although Microsoft does have more than nothing). Interestingly, Nokia has more than enough data for all of Europe, but they apparently haven't merged their POI databases. I was under the impression that Microsoft and Nokia were going to merge ALL their mapping data, but as of yet it hasn't happened. Anyway, none of this requires bilingual engineers. Most junior developers could get this job done.
 
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Sep 25, 2011
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If you've used Google for a long time you can't just leave it all of a sudden. Bing and Hotmail/Outlook are both mediocre services. Everyone uses Google and Gmail because quite simply they are superior services. Google Maps are awesome. This is me not being a ******, this is me stating a fact(I'm not even an Android user). Go check out some stats on how many people use Google and how many people use Bing. Google is the BEST search engine out there BY FAR.

As someone said above, Microsoft does not understand the world outside the US which is why Windows Phone has been such a miserable failure in Europe and Asia. Wanna see how Good Microsoft is outside the US? Go check out the Bing maps of Japan. People on this forum talk about simply 'switching' to outlook are people who've probably not used email/calendar/maps etc from other providers. Because if they did then they'd know you can't just 'switch' over from something you'd been using for 10+ years.
 

tgp

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I live in the U.S. and I think Bing is merely adequate. I tried sticking to Bing only when i first got my Lumia 900 ( i used Bing exclusively on my computer too) and i made it about a month. I even took the "Bing it on challenge" and Google won by a landslide. I really wanted to like Bing, especially since I am stuck with a permanent Bing button on my phone.

But the truth is, its just not as good as Google. I still use it because the button is there, but I've never once seen it give me better/more relevant search results than Google. It is adequate for most things though.

As for the rest of this, I don't see the point in inconveniencing myself greatly just to try and be Google free. Yes, Google is an advertising company that will info-mine your internet surfing habits, but if you think Bing doesn't do the same thing, you're deluding yourself. Every company with a presence on the web does it in one form or another. Unless you're going to delete your Facebook account and every other identifying piece of info on the web and surf the internet using Tor from now on, there is no sense in working yourself up into a lather over this stuff and thinking you are some kind of internet privacy warrior because you use Bing and hotmail.

I agree with pretty much everything in this post. I too tried Bing it on, and Google won almost every time. There were rumors that if you log in to Bing's & Google's respective sites when you do a search, the results are different. I didn't try it, but I don't doubt it.

Another thing we've found at work is that when Microsoft releases something new, like a beta product, Google will find where it can be downloaded but not Bing. Explain that one! When Windows 8 RC was released, we used Google to find the download site. It showed up in a Bing search after a few days, and the resulting hits were identical to Google's.

I'm probably in the minority here when I say that I couldn't care less what Google or anyone else collects about me. If they want to waste their server storage on my data, more power to them! The thing is, that data is what helps make Google's search results better than the competition. Bing and most other major search engines collect data too; they just aren't as good at using it as Google.
 

a5cent

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No, I'm not wrong. They started out as a search company. Advertising is how they get their money from search.

I don't care how they started out. I'm interested only in how they operate now. The Google of yesteryear and that of today are entirely different organizations.
 

a5cent

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People on this forum talk about simply 'switching' to outlook are people who've probably not used email/calendar/maps etc from other providers. Because if they did then they'd know you can't just 'switch' over from something you'd been using for 10+ years.

I don't think it is a matter of how long anyone has used Google's services, but a matter of how they use them. For example, Google's contacts manager has features which Exchange Server does not, and anyone requiring those features will have a hard time switching. However, even someone with 50 thousand contacts should have no problem switching if those contacts are structured simply. I can understand how someone with a lot of custom Google maps will have a hard time switching, but I can't imaging any reason why someone couldn't instantly switch from gmail.

It's something that must be evaluated on a case by case basis.
 

danbbrantley

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Bing has been just as good as Google for me. It's actually better, because I end up with a gift card for $5 every month from searching with them. If I'm searching for something scientific, I'm using database searches anyway as I have that option on my university laptop.
I will concede that Google Maps is better than Bing Maps, but I have to say, I find Outlook to be much better than GMail, especially if you're big in to social networking. I've used Gmail religiously for the last 5 years or more and recently discovered how much better Outlook is. It's just way, way prettier too.
 

Napocensis

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Guess MS Switzerland is still living in the last ice age :wink:, I don't see any other good reason why leaving the Swiss behind. Or maybe there are just not enough of us, making us too unimportant to care.

Another reason would be not joining the US in WW1 and WW2 and keeping all that money in your banks... It's payback time! By MS.
 

a5cent

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Another reason would be not joining the US in WW1 and WW2 and keeping all that money in your banks... It's payback time! By MS.

Yeah, right, MS is punishing Switzerland for having stayed neutral, but is rewarding Germany for having ... ehm... what was the role they played in WW2? You seriously need to get your brain fixed.

And yeah... who would have the nerve to keep a lot of money in banks... outrageous! lol
 

spaulagain

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If you've used Google for a long time you can't just leave it all of a sudden. Bing and Hotmail/Outlook are both mediocre services. Everyone uses Google and Gmail because quite simply they are superior services. Google Maps are awesome. This is me not being a ******, this is me stating a fact(I'm not even an Android user). Go check out some stats on how many people use Google and how many people use Bing. Google is the BEST search engine out there BY FAR.

As someone said above, Microsoft does not understand the world outside the US which is why Windows Phone has been such a miserable failure in Europe and Asia. Wanna see how Good Microsoft is outside the US? Go check out the Bing maps of Japan. People on this forum talk about simply 'switching' to outlook are people who've probably not used email/calendar/maps etc from other providers. Because if they did then they'd know you can't just 'switch' over from something you'd been using for 10+ years.


I've been using Gmail for several years. I just switched to outlook.com and I'm never looking back. I hesitated at first, but after trying it for a week I couldn't believe how much better it was. Gmail is joke compared to Outlook.com

Gmail is not a superior service.
 

Luminatic

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I think your suspicion is correct. Also don't forget our four official languages which complicates things further.

I feel that Microsoft just doesn't understand anything about the world outside the U.S. For example, I really don't understand why the website www.bing.ch exists in the first place. Why not just stick with www.bing.com, and make everything else configurable?

For example, although I live in Switzerland, I am interested in news from Germany, the U.S., China, anything related to the EU and Switzerland. I prefer most of my web searches to be in English, but I want to quickly switch to French or German searches when necessary. I'm rarely interested in restricting my searches only to sites in Switzerland. Unfortunately, Microsoft insists on pigeonholing everyone, based on what country they currently live in. That might work in the U.S. where most people speak exactly one language and aren't much interested in the happenings beyond their boarders, but that is completely different for Europeans. We cross boarders constantly and we typically speak more than one language, and that affects what we are interested in and how we use search.

Like I said, all this stuff should be configurable, and not based on the country code of the domain you use to search.

Great idea, IMHO. I'm the same ... Switzerland is not an island, even though some Swiss believe so (But that's an entirely different subject) :wink:


BTW, not being able to buy music via Zune is someting that had annoyed me as well ... thanks to the help of a friendly MS supporter (I have a good impression of MS support, btw) I was able to switch that option on by adding a german hotmail account. But I'm not the average user, I'm not scared by technical terms and things. An average Swiss person would only notice that he can buy music in iTunes, but not in Zune.
(Btw, as a Nokia user, I have the possibility of using their service for buying music, thanks god. Not sure if this works worldwide, but it works for me. A lot of Nokia users and others don't know about this option. I think Nokia should advertise this more ... but that's another story altogether.)


Someone wrote about Siri problems when using french ... didn't know Apple had similar problems. Interesting.


Thanks everyone for contributing here!!! Maybe I should write MS a letter.
 

Luminatic

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Another reason would be not joining the US in WW1 and WW2 and keeping all that money in your banks... It's payback time! By MS.
I didn't see a twinkling smilie, but I suppose you meant this as a joke cause I really don't want to go into a discussion about which country has done which bad things in the past and present. We might hide money, but 1) I'm not personally hiding any in my cellar 2) We're not the only ones, even though media are making the world believe this and 3) The rest of the world were and are no angels either. You just need to check some history books or watch some good, well-researched documentaries to find out what I mean. I'm not going to talk about the things former non-Swiss have done and are doing to other people in this thread, because that would be completely off-subject and belongs to another forum.
 
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Jalik

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Bing is okay for me. Not always as good as google search but good enough mostly. However, what is about to drive me away from WP is the limited German keyboard library (it really matters). When I use the English keyboard everything works really really well, but using the German keyboard sometimes is a real fight. This tells alot about the commitment of MSFT and other companies for non-US/UK markets :(
 

SnailUK

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Surely its obvious. If nobody from a country bothers using bing why put effort into it? As people start using bing, they ramp it up, as they understand what people want to do.
Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Board Express
 
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Surely its obvious. If nobody from a country bothers using bing why put effort into it? As people start using bing, they ramp it up, as they understand what people want to do.
Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Board Express
Uhh why the **** would someone from a particular country use Bing if Bing sucks in that country and Google works perfectly fine?
 

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