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  1. BBMINI's Avatar
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       #1  
    Just saw this and thought it was interesting. Potentially a class action suit.
    Lawyer sues Microsoft over Surface tablet storage

    Makes me think it might be worth it for new WP8 phone users to see how much of the stated built-in storage is actually available and not being used up by programs and preinstalled stuff
    Branta likes this.
  2. larrynj's Avatar
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    #2  
    Makes me think we need some laws prohibiting the number of lawyers in the country.
  3. mlm1950's Avatar
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    #3  
    I would think that most people buying a 32 GB device would likely expect to have more than half of that space available for their own use.

    Assuming the facts are correct, what the heck is on there that takes up that much space?
    Philip Hamm likes this.
  4. BBMINI's Avatar
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       #4  
    ^^ Totally. Until now I've never thought about it much or looked into the items I've bought over the years, but I've always basically expected that a XXGB device of any kind (tablet, phone, laptop, whatever) has XXGB available for ME rather than XXGB of total storage before the manufacturer loads all their required stuff onto it.

    Will be interesting to see what happens with this and if other people have the same experience and claim.
  5. ZombieBacchus's Avatar
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    #5  
    I am not a fan of lawsuits like this.

    Though, I was pretty shocked to find out just how big Windows RT/Office and the Microsoft apps were. 16 GB is pretty crazy. I would have thought they would be able to squeeze RT into a smaller footprint since there are no legacy apps. I think there may be a ton of code in there that is not needed. Perhaps as they update RT we will see the OS size shrink a bit.

    If I though about only having 16 GB for apps before I bought it I may have purchased the 64 GB model. Oh well, still LOVE my Surface!
  6. martinmc78's Avatar
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    #6  
    Thing is it doesnt say anywhere that 32GB is what you have available - it says it comes with a 32GB drive so this ***** lawyer hasnt really got a leg to stand on. When you buy a pc it advertises that it has a 1TB hd but what have you got by the time the OS is loaded on it? Is he now going to put class action lawsuits against all the PC manufacturers? Microsoft could always send him a new surface tablet with no OS loaded on it so he gets his 32GB - he could always turn it into a skateboard or something.
  7. mparker's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by BBMINI View Post
    Makes me think it might be worth it for new WP8 phone users to see how much of the stated built-in storage is actually available and not being used up by programs and preinstalled stuff
    IIRC my Lumia 920 had something like 27Gb free out of the box. People buying 8GB phones won't be happy, but anybody else should be ok.
  8. vertigoOne's Avatar
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    #8  
    So true, it is universally understood that if you buy hardware with software pre-installed, it is going to utilize the built in space. The expandable storage options really make this a non-issue anyways IMO.
  9. Highdefjunkie's Avatar
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    #9  
    If he wins it means every single manufacturer of a phone, computer or tablet is game to be sued. It'll never hold up in court.
  10. BBMINI's Avatar
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       #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by martinmc78 View Post
    Microsoft could always send him a new surface tablet with no OS loaded on it so he gets his 32GB
    Hilarious comment. Would be awesome if they would do just that. Ultimate smart-arse move.
  11. inteller's Avatar
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    #11  
    I want to be able to sue people for ignorance...I would become the ruler of the world.
  12. inteller's Avatar
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bacchus1313 View Post
    I am not a fan of lawsuits like this.

    Though, I was pretty shocked to find out just how big Windows RT/Office and the Microsoft apps were. 16 GB is pretty crazy. I would have thought they would be able to squeeze RT into a smaller footprint since there are no legacy apps. I think there may be a ton of code in there that is not needed. Perhaps as they update RT we will see the OS size shrink a bit.

    If I though about only having 16 GB for apps before I bought it I may have purchased the 64 GB model. Oh well, still LOVE my Surface!
    Yes, but you get ****ING OFFICE. How many other tab makers can say that? You wouldn't believe how many times I've whipped out the Surface and said "watch this" loaded Word ....the iPad owners are drooling over Office.

    That's why Microsoft will make those -suckers- pay for a yearly subscription just to be able to edit their own documents while we get it for FREE.
  13. palandri's Avatar
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    #13  
    If what he's saying is true. I think he has a good case. If a 32GB tablet only has 16GB of usable space, it should advertised as such.
  14. martinmc78's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by palandri View Post
    If what he's saying is true. I think he has a good case. If a 32GB tablet only has 16GB of usable space, it should advertised as such.
    No chance as 2 of us have already mentioned a win for him would open up similar cases against every PC and phone manufacturer with an OS preloaded. Not going to happen. They may have to change advertising laws as a result to give stated free space available but he wont get anything out of microsoft.

    Ordered my surface RT 32gb yesterday and right after it ordered a 64GB sd card saved myself 150 on the 64GB model
    palandri likes this.
  15. palandri's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by martinmc78 View Post
    No chance as 2 of us have already mentioned a win for him would open up similar cases against every PC and phone manufacturer with an OS preloaded. Not going to happen. They may have to change advertising laws as a result to give stated free space available but he wont get anything out of microsoft.

    Ordered my surface RT 32gb yesterday and right after it ordered a 64GB sd card saved myself 150 on the 64GB model
    I hear you. What you said makes a lot of sense.

    The way I am looking at it is, if he had 27GB or 25GB or even 23GB of available space. I don't think he would stand a chance. Having only 16GB of available space on an advertised 32GB tablet just seems way too deceptive to me. That why i think he has a good case.

    It will be interesting to see how this turns out.
  16. inteller's Avatar
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    #16  
    there is too much precendent with other devices having less than advertised space. The only argument here is "how much is too much" when it comes to system space and I think you'd see multiple vendors jumping on the defendent's docket because no one wants to be pinned down with how to calculate unformatted space.

    How come no one ever did this before? Oh that's right because its not Microsoft.
  17. stephen_az's Avatar
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    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by palandri View Post
    If what he's saying is true. I think he has a good case. If a 32GB tablet only has 16GB of usable space, it should advertised as such.
    So does a laptop with a 128 GB SSD have 128 GB available? Sorry but this is a frivolous lawsuit and will probably be tossed out in short order. BTW, if a 32GB Android tablet came with a full version of Microsoft Office and full Suite of standard Windows OS utilities, etc., it would not have that much more space. It is a common complaint among tablet owners that once you add apps your space goes away. Yes, Windows RT is large but it is also a full blown OS that preloads applications not available anywhere else. Much like an ultrabook with a small SSD, it is expected that you will need external storage to make up for internal limitations. Suing essentially because you have to use the available media card slot is frivolous by any definition. FWIW, I am also waiting for the Surface Pro to be released to hear someone complain after buying the 64GB version that they loaded Office Professional and Adobe CS 6 and all of their space was gone.
    palandri likes this.
  18. crystal_planet's Avatar
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    #18  
    Blah blah blahMicro$oftYadda yadda yaddano integrityblah blah blahevil empire
  19. palandri's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by swyost View Post
    So does a laptop with a 128 GB SSD have 128 GB available? Sorry but this is a frivolous lawsuit and will probably be tossed out in short order. BTW, if a 32GB Android tablet came with a full version of Microsoft Office and full Suite of standard Windows OS utilities, etc., it would not have that much more space. It is a common complaint among tablet owners that once you add apps your space goes away. Yes, Windows RT is large but it is also a full blown OS that preloads applications not available anywhere else. Much like an ultrabook with a small SSD, it is expected that you will need external storage to make up for internal limitations. Suing essentially because you have to use the available media card slot is frivolous by any definition. FWIW, I am also waiting for the Surface Pro to be released to hear someone complain after buying the 64GB version that they loaded Office Professional and Adobe CS 6 and all of their space was gone.
    What you say makes a lot of sense. The courts may see it that way and throw it out.

    Like I said, the way I am looking at it is, if he had 27GB or 25GB or even 23GB of available space. I don't think he would stand a chance. Having only 16GB of available space on an advertised 32GB tablet just seems way too deceptive to me. That why i think he has a good case. I think the average consumer would be deceived and I think that's how a judge would look at it.

    We'll have to wait and see what the court does.
    Last edited by palandri; 11-15-2012 at 07:31 PM.
  20. MaulerX's Avatar
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    #20  
    Doesn't stand a chance. It is advertised as having 32GB. Which is factually correct. What is left for you to use is another story and Microsoft never said you actually have 32GB at your disposal.

    Another thing, forget about installed software for a minute. Any and all hard drives NEVER have the exact amount of storage advertised. It has been like this since the dawn of time. Microsoft doesn't need yo shoot this guy down. The Judge will do it himself.
  21. paulschapman's Avatar
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    #21  
    I am reminded of an old saying

    "A lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client"
    hellboarder likes this.
  22. Mark_Venture's Avatar
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by MaulerX View Post
    Doesn't stand a chance. It is advertised as having 32GB. Which is factually correct. What is left for you to use is another story and Microsoft never said you actually have 32GB at your disposal.
    If there was a reasonable disclaimer on the box saying how much was available for use, or saying that not all that 32GB is available for use, then it would be a little different.

    I will say this... At least this page -> Surface specifications says "*System software uses significant storage space. Available storage is subject to change based on system software updates and apps usage. 1 GB = 1 billion bytes. See Surface.com/storage for more details." And on that storage page it does say the 32GB device has 16GB free, and the 64 has 45GB free. That should help MS's case.

    Quote Originally Posted by MaulerX View Post
    Another thing, forget about installed software for a minute. Any and all hard drives NEVER have the exact amount of storage advertised. It has been like this since the dawn of time.
    Really?? Hmm.. when I started with computers, hard drives were measured in bytes and binary (or base 2), just as the OS reports them. More recently (like around 2000) HD makers switched to DECIMAL, which is why now see that "1GB = 1Billion bytes" on everything.
  23. FinsUpDNC's Avatar
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    #23  
    Many tech people noted the space thing, that said.....you have 30 days to return the device. You can get every dime back.
  24. cddigi's Avatar
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    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by beestee View Post
    So true, it is universally understood that if you buy hardware with software pre-installed, it is going to utilize the built in space. The expandable storage options really make this a non-issue anyways IMO.
    Except you can't install Metro apps to the SD card.
  25. Ed Boland's Avatar
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    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by cddigi View Post
    Except you can't install Metro apps to the SD card.
    This^^^ is the problem with 32GB RT models...
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