Can the Blackberry 10 edge Windows Phone out of 3rd place?

[maj71303]

I see BB10 being very competitive and giving it a great fight. MS is trying to fight battles on to many fronts and lacks focus on picking it's fights. RIM has one focus which is the mobile market and it looks like BB10 will be the real deal. Things are about to get interesting.

 

[sirfly2fly]

BB will always have the die hards and physical keyboard crowds. That will never change. They will also have a foot hold in emerging markets due to their data compression and edge speeds. BB will never be a force in the established markets again. China, Europe, US and Australia already passed them by for the other options. Too many people have moved on to bigger and better. I loved my BBs over the years, but I will only give up my WP8 device when WP9 comes out. The integration of systems from computer, tablet, and phone is where the next Gen is going. Apple and MS already have that area covered. Android is so open they can manage with any system. BB has very limited integration into computer side. I'm sure its better with BB10 but will never be competitive and always have limited functionality. Let them have the emerging markets.

Or could it be going to M2M? QNX and their NOC will give them opportunity to go beyond mobile handsets... and can u explain the computer,tablet, integration going on?

 

[maj71303]

People seem to throw RIM just to the low end developing nations and think that will be it. That low end leads to the high end in user experience. That have a name brand recognition that WP lacks and when they launch it's going to surprise a few how well they do.

 

[The_Traveler]

There is, in my world, two larger questions:

1) Can RIM survive as a hardware/software developer? This is a point I try to make: RIM does not have the resources of Apple, which is the only other company left standing that is a strict "in house" mobile provider. They have the money and the HUGE fan base to cover the monster investments it takes in R&D to develop the iPhone, test, produce, ensure the supply chain, market it, distribute it as well as all the investments for the software development, updates, and support. There is no way you can put a single dollar on these rising costs. Even Apple is starting to get criticized for falling behind and becoming stale. RIM does not have the luxury of the cash flow of Apple. Let's not forget that BB10 became so important due to RIM falling behind in the first place. Let us not forget how many times RIM has delayed BB10. It does look like they are doing this launch right, and that BB10 will be a nice OS. But- can they continue to keep up with the frantic pace of mobile? In a year and a half will they just fall back again, unable to keep up with the innovations of other companies? This is RIMs challenge. MS and Google not only have OEM's taking care of the hardware development and supply chain costs, they are both huge companies with many ventures with many other revenue streams flowing in. BlackBerry is it for RIM. While I expect CrackBerry loyalists to make BB10 a huge success in 2013, I find that scary for their future.

2) Is there room enough in the mobile market for more then 2 or 3 OS's? If so, then this is a unimportant question. I personally think that at even a 70% market share for iOS and Android leaves plenty of sales and room in the billion dollar industry that is mobile for both RIM and WP to thrive. The third place finish is only really important if you believe there won't be enough room for a fourth OS.

I am very, VERY excited for BB10. I love competition and choices. No, I am not planning on leaving WP, but I accept that it is silly to close off yourself to options. Right now, I am 80% sure I will be a WP 8 user (On my beloved Focus S WP7 right now, no hurry to leave it), with a 10% curiosity to BB10, and a 10% open mind to Android as both ICS and JB has improved it performance tons.

I am cheering for all 4 OS's to survive.

My guess is that RIM is trying to see how well BB10 goes before licensing out the software. They are going to use this to ramp up demand, then long term they may license it out, and let OEM's do the hardware.

RIM CEO says licensing of BlackBerry 10 'conceivable' | Mobile - CNET News

 

[irvin792]

There is, in my world, two larger questions:

1) Can RIM survive as a hardware/software developer? This is a point I try to make: RIM does not have the resources of Apple, which is the only other company left standing that is a strict "in house" mobile provider. They have the money and the HUGE fan base to cover the monster investments it takes in R&D to develop the iPhone, test, produce, ensure the supply chain, market it, distribute it as well as all the investments for the software development, updates, and support. There is no way you can put a single dollar on these rising costs. Even Apple is starting to get criticized for falling behind and becoming stale. RIM does not have the luxury of the cash flow of Apple. Let's not forget that BB10 became so important due to RIM falling behind in the first place. Let us not forget how many times RIM has delayed BB10. It does look like they are doing this launch right, and that BB10 will be a nice OS. But- can they continue to keep up with the frantic pace of mobile? In a year and a half will they just fall back again, unable to keep up with the innovations of other companies? This is RIMs challenge. MS and Google not only have OEM's taking care of the hardware development and supply chain costs, they are both huge companies with many ventures with many other revenue streams flowing in. BlackBerry is it for RIM. While I expect CrackBerry loyalists to make BB10 a huge success in 2013, I find that scary for their future.

2) Is there room enough in the mobile market for more then 2 or 3 OS's? If so, then this is a unimportant question. I personally think that at even a 70% market share for iOS and Android leaves plenty of sales and room in the billion dollar industry that is mobile for both RIM and WP to thrive. The third place finish is only really important if you believe there won't be enough room for a fourth OS.

I am very, VERY excited for BB10. I love competition and choices. No, I am not planning on leaving WP, but I accept that it is silly to close off yourself to options. Right now, I am 80% sure I will be a WP 8 user (On my beloved Focus S WP7 right now, no hurry to leave it), with a 10% curiosity to BB10, and a 10% open mind to Android as both ICS and JB has improved it performance tons.

I am cheering for all 4 OS's to survive.

I agree with #1, in the past RIM hardware always lagged behind the current crop of smartphones when released. And their software was always buggy as all heck.
I feel ttheonly reason BB10 looks dso good is because they have not really been doing anything else, once this starts going live and the pace gets frantic again will RIM fall behind again?

 

[Dare2Blink]

I seriously doubt that will be the case. what is wrong with xbox music? It works great for me? does rim allow any music service that allows unlimited streaming for free and unlimited downloading for 10 dollars a month? In case you have not noticed Skype is still in preview mode and no, even then it does not suck at all. By now it is common knowledge that instagram is in the works for a while now and with regards to games considering the recent promotion being made It should not be too long before Microsoft finally starts to deliver on that front.

 

[Dare2Blink]

You should really get you device replaced by nokia, not get a different brand. The problems that you described have nothing to do with platform issues as are just a sign of a defective device.

 

[ny_yankees]

Nearly 20,000 new BlackBerry 10 apps submitted this past weekend - Yahoo! News

Developers submitted 19,071 apps in 36 hours, bringing RIM closer to its goal of offering more than 70,000 apps at launch.

 

[Angry_Mushroom]

I can see BB10 easily outselling WP8 and eventually maybe even iOS. RIM has some serious clout still left from ye olde days. Question now is. Will it surpass WP8 in popularity? At this point it could outsell the WP8 with out hurting our base. Remember. Both OSes are now fighting over the annoyed Android and Apple users.

 

[elibohnert]

Yes, BB has more of they key apps. BB also has the best notifications. I have owned 4 BlackBerry's and 4 Windows Phones and the only thing I liked about WP was the fast and easy UI. With BB10 they will be making BlackBerry user friendly again.

 

[elibohnert]

I seriously doubt that will be the case. what is wrong with xbox music? It works great for me? does rim allow any music service that allows unlimited streaming for free and unlimited downloading for 10 dollars a month? In case you have not noticed Skype is still in preview mode and no, even then it does not suck at all. By now it is common knowledge that instagram is in the works for a while now and with regards to games considering the recent promotion being made It should not be too long before Microsoft finally starts to deliver on that front.

BB has BBM Music which is $5 a month for 50 songs and you get to keep all your friends 50 songs also for free.

 

[fatclue_98]

I consider myself an enterprise user and to that end, BB10 will HAVE to offer Outlook Live Services calendar syncing if it hopes to woo back their old faithfuls. The minute OS6 & 7 dropped support for Live Services calendar syncing was the minute I left the platform. It may sound trivial to switch platforms over one function, but that one function is 80% of my smartphone needs.

 

[dogfish54]

Look at what happened with Nokia and Symbian and I think you'll see what will happen with BB10 and BB7. BB7 will drop off much faster than expected and BB10 just won't gain traction fast enough. Sure, it may have nearly as many apps as Android, so why not just get an Android device? RIM is going to be the manufacturer without an ecosystem. Nokia made a tough choice giving up control and going with Windows phone. Microsoft has been a TERRIBLE partner to Nokia, but I think that the only company that has a chance of surviving on their own is Apple. Samsung couldn't pull off a new OS right now, I don't see RIM doing it.

 

[vlad0]

Well if they can piggy back ride on Android's "eco" system ... a lot of their issues as a software developer will kind of go away. I thought that is what Nokia will do with Maemo/MeeGo, and work on QT simultaneously.. but that didn't work.. maybe RIM can pull it off.

The only problem with android's apps is that they need a VM, and that would defeat the purpose of having such a clean system such as QNX in the first place. They also need a solid map/locations service application..

I dunno.. its a tough call. Like I said before, carrier support is everything... if they want to sell your phone, you get sales, if they don't.. you are done.

 

[Villain]

windows phone has to take 3rd place from blackberry first.



BB10 looks amazing has has a ton of ittle features/settings wp doesn't have BUT im going to wait a few months to see if MS starts to support WP at least a bit

 

[vlad0]

MS starts to support WP at least a bit

What's wrong with the support now ? They are doing a pretty good job so far..

 

[bradleyj]

I can't believe I am saying this: but I think BB10 has a shot at overtaking WP8. I thought RIM was dead, and figured their delayed launch of BB10 would be the nail in their coffin. However, other comments here are right, the WP8 launch didn't have much luster. I know WP8 was a big change, but it seems like app development has really slowed for WP8. Also MS is not taking advantage of things like Skype properly.

I want a good communication tool, that is what a phone is for. Perhaps RIM can do that better? We'll see. WebOS looked great (it was great!) but it died, perhaps BB10 will be the same way.

 

[the real smackbo]

Rim doesn't have enough capital to over take windows .. And talk about lack of apps .. Bb has no chance they should just partner up with somebody and develop software instead of trying to regain a foothold in the hardware business

 

[sirfly2fly]

Rim doesn't have enough capital to over take windows .. And talk about lack of apps .. Bb has no chance they should just partner up with somebody and develop software instead of trying to regain a foothold in the hardware business

Capital doesn't decide who overtakes who, we the consumers will, no matter how much money each company has in the bank and BB10 will have more then 46/50 top apps...

 

[conanheath]

Capital doesn't decide who overtakes who, we the consumers will, no matter how much money each company has in the bank and BB10 will have more then 46/50 top apps...

Ya, since major devs have just been chomping at the bit to develop for BB this far. My Playbook after almost two years still doesn't have Netflix, descent FB app, SkyDrive, one note, etc. I'm not talking side loading or third party apps. I'm talking the real deal, no work around. It really doesn't matter, BB or MS, whoever is third and fourth are still going to struggle to get dev support. Why would I write for 3% or 7% coverage when I can write for the other two with 70% coverage? But I would still write for MS because I can change a little code here and there and have PC, RT and WP covered. Triple play. Simple math will decide who gets the support. BB will still have a good hold on emerging markets but without SkyDrive, icloud, one note, gmail and ass. apps, and so many other features baked into OS, they don't have a chance. It's ecosystem and BB messenger won't save them this time. They may surprise, but their ecosystem is just so limited outside of enterprise market.