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Windows Central Podcast 37: Windows 10 Mobile is still dead

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Why Microsoft's Surface phone could be MUCH more than a mere 'phone'

Surface Pwn 5

Surface Pro 5, Project NEON details leaked on LinkedIn?

XP-YESSSSSSS

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Surface table meets Windows 10

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Simple and secure, just the way I like it

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uber micro

Halo Wars 2 has something for everyone. Here's our full review.

Oldie but goldie

We reviewed Microsoft's decade-old Surface table

Creators Update comin' at ya

These are the coolest new features in the next big Xbox One update (video)

Buyer's guide

The Razer Blade 14 is the best laptop Razer has to offer

Windows 10 app gems

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Tower of power

Here's what we think of Dell's XPS Tower Special Edition

Quite a deal

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Introducing our ultimate laptop buyer's guide

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Attn Android and iPhone users: What you need to know about Windows phone

Old is new?

The original Surface Pro still holds its own in the 2-in-1 world

Xbox Greenlight?

No, internet, Microsoft isn't opening Xbox to all UWP games

Falling in love

HP Envy 34 review: An ultrawide curved all-in-one after my heart

2015 machine in 2017?

Surface 3 still holds its own in 2017

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  • 1 Post By MaulerX
  • 1 Post By brmiller1976
  • 1 Post By a5cent
  1. lee.eubanks's Avatar
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       #1  
    Rubbish. Verizon has totally screwed us over, or AT&T is being very generous.
  2. brmiller1976's Avatar
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    #2  
    It's likely that the much smaller volume of CDMA handsets = higher costs per handset (which are passed on to the end consumer).

    It also looks like HTC is NOT going the low-margin route on the 8X. Pricing may be the 8X's Achilles' heel.
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    #3  
    Is the off-contract price for the 8X the same on Verizon and AT&T?
  4. sentimentGX4's Avatar
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    #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    It also looks like HTC is NOT going the low-margin route on the 8X. Pricing may be the 8X's Achilles' heel.
    Even if HTC wasn't willing to go low margin, there is no reason the 8X should be >$600 unlocked. It's a 4.3" phone with an old Snapdragon S4 processor!! It's also rather bulky. The phone should be $400. The only thing going for it are the different colors.
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    #5  
    Making a 720p 4.3" screen is a bigger technical challenge than making one 4.7" The processor is still just shy of the tip top of the line too.

    Besides, according to The Verge it's only $100 more. The AT&T 920 price is subsidized even without the contract, that's the reason it's so cheap.
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    #6  
    what's the best guess about when, if ever, the Verizon off contract price for the HTC 8x will drop from its current $540? I really don't want to give up my unlimited wireless data plan, but I'm not sure I want to spend 600 bucks on a new phone, even if I want to move to the windows universe.
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by saedude1983 View Post
    Rubbish. Verizon has totally screwed us over, or AT&T is being very generous.
    The word "generous" is not part of business vocabulary. Isn't it obvious that AT&T is simply subsidizing the L920 to a larger degree than the 8X? Isn't it obvious that this is part of what Nokia got from AT&T, in return for the L920 being a carrier exclusive?
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    #8  
    I know being exclusive to AT&T ticked off alot of people. However, you can clearly see the benefits of exclusivity: Price to consumer.
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    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by MaulerX View Post
    I know being exclusive to AT&T ticked off alot of people. However, you can clearly see the benefits of exclusivity: Price to consumer.
    And for Nokia, hopefully, more sales at industry standard profit margins.
  10. mlm1950's Avatar
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    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by a5cent View Post
    The word "generous" is not part of business vocabulary. Isn't it obvious that AT&T is simply subsidizing the L920 to a larger degree than the 8X? Isn't it obvious that this is part of what Nokia got from AT&T, in return for the L920 being a carrier exclusive?
    For what you get, selling the 920 for $99/$459 to customers sounds pretty generous to me.
  11. a5cent's Avatar

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    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by mlm1950 View Post
    For what you get, selling the 920 for $99/$459 to customers sounds pretty generous to me.
    If that is how you feel, great! If enough non-AT&T subscribers feel similarly and switch to AT&T in order to get the L920 it's a win-win-win situation:

    a) AT&T can pick off some of the competitions customers and sell new two-year contracts
    b) Nokia sells more L920s
    c) Customers get a good deal on a high-end Lumia's

    However, none of the above has anything to do with generosity.
  12. Keith Wallace's Avatar
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by a5cent View Post
    The word "generous" is not part of business vocabulary. Isn't it obvious that AT&T is simply subsidizing the L920 to a larger degree than the 8X? Isn't it obvious that this is part of what Nokia got from AT&T, in return for the L920 being a carrier exclusive?
    Actually, that's not necessarily the case. Several months back, there was an article on Engadget where they stated a willingness on the part of Nokia to share more money with carriers. It very well might be that Nokia is the cause of this pricing, in the form of giving AT&T the other $100 of a typical flagship device so people can buy the Lumia 920 cheaply.

    The only thing that makes such a statement iffy is that the Lumia 820 (on AT&T) is $50, while the 822 is $100 (on Verizon).
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by mlm1950 View Post
    For what you get, selling the 920 for $99/$459 to customers sounds pretty generous to me.
    ...until you get your first bill. :D
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    #14  
    I am paying less than $60.00 a month for my plan and 4 phones a L 900 2 iphones (a 5 and 4S) and a galaxy SII Skyrocket famil text 3 3Gb data plans and my umlimited data plan.
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    #15  
    Cant speak to the 920 but the 8X is 550 or 600 and the 822 is 450 or 500.

    Screen quality is what I noticed. Even then, I will prefer Nokia's feature packed smartphone with a lesser screen over HTC's gorgeous display.
  16. brmiller1976's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by sentimentGX4 View Post
    Even if HTC wasn't willing to go low margin, there is no reason the 8X should be >$600 unlocked. It's a 4.3" phone with an old Snapdragon S4 processor!! It's also rather bulky. The phone should be $400. The only thing going for it are the different colors.
    Without knowing what the build list is, it's rather silly to be tossing around what the price "should be."

    The phone was designed from the ground-up for Windows Phone, which entails significant design and tooling costs. It has a high-end SLCD2 screen, NFC, and a host of other features.

    It is not "bulky," and its "old" processor is the same one that powers the best-selling smartphone in the world, the Samsung Galaxy S III.

    If it's not your cup of tea, you can pick up a cheap Android device with similar "hardware specs." Just remember that typically, you get what you pay for.
    a5cent likes this.
  17. mlm1950's Avatar
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    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by a5cent View Post
    If that is how you feel, great! If enough non-AT&T subscribers feel similarly and switch to AT&T in order to get the L920 it's a win-win-win situation:

    a) AT&T can pick off some of the competitions customers and sell new two-year contracts
    b) Nokia sells more L920s
    c) Customers get a good deal on a high-end Lumia's

    However, none of the above has anything to do with generosity.
    AT&T is offering a generous discount on the Lumia 920 in order to sell more phones and thereby attract more customers.
    Last edited by mlm1950; 11-15-2012 at 11:00 AM.
  18. a5cent's Avatar

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    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wallace View Post
    Actually, that's not necessarily the case. Several months back, there was an article on Engadget where they stated a willingness on the part of Nokia to share more money with carriers. It very well might be that Nokia is the cause of this pricing, in the form of giving AT&T the other $100 of a typical flagship device so people can buy the Lumia 920 cheaply.

    The only thing that makes such a statement iffy is that the Lumia 820 (on AT&T) is $50, while the 822 is $100 (on Verizon).
    Yes. I agree with everything you've stated including the "iffyness"

    However, in this case I've been told by Nokia employees that the subsidy paid by AT&T was part of the exclusivity deal. Since neither those Nokia employees nor I was at the table when the deal was made, I wouldn't be willing to guarantee its truthfulness, but I believe it is. On the other hand, the two approaches aren't mutually exclusive either, so make of it what you will. ;)
    Quote Originally Posted by mlm1950 View Post
    AT&T is offering a generous discount on the Lumia 920 in order to sell more phones and thereby attract more customers.
    According to Wikipedia, generosity is the habit of giving without expecting anything in return. I don't think that applies to AT&T or any other for-profit company, particular not to multinational conglomerates like AT&T. I have no idea why you find it necessary to make that association, but you are free to misunderstand economics if you want to.
  19. mlm1950's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by a5cent View Post
    According to Wikipedia, generosity is the habit of giving without expecting anything in return. I don't think that applies to AT&T or any other for-profit company, particular not to multinational conglomerates like AT&T. I have no idea why you find it necessary to make that association, but you are free to misunderstand economics if you want to.
    I don't know why you continue to incorrectly believe that the word generosity is always synonymous with the word generous, which is also defined as: "substantial: pleasingly large in size or quantity".

    I even used in a sentence for you a couple of posts up to help you understand the difference, though it would appear it was all for naught.
  20. a5cent's Avatar

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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by mlm1950 View Post
    I don't know why you continue to incorrectly believe that the word generosity is always synonymous with the word generous, which is also defined as: "substantial: pleasingly large in size or quantity".

    I even used in a sentence for you a couple of posts up to help you understand the difference, though it would appear it was all for naught.
    Maybe because English isn't my native language? I don't know. I'm aware of the usage you're referring to, as in: "a generous helping of ice cream". In that context the meaning seems obvious to me. In the context you've used it in I wouldn't infer that meaning. I still wouldn't. Anyway, this is starting to feel like a useless squabble, as I'm sure the semantics where I used the word were clear. I don't understand why you didn't just use an alternative, instead of sticking with a word I was apparently misunderstanding and wasting our time. Enough said.
    Last edited by a5cent; 11-16-2012 at 02:57 PM.
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