1. mstabes's Avatar
    I own a Huawei Mate 8 and a 950XL. I have always preferred the Windows Phone OS over Android. I don't know why that is, but for me it just works the way I like an OS to work.

    But I stopped using the 950XL about six months back, simply because the apps available on Android (and that I actually use) were not available on WP.

    And so it is that I have thrown in my lot with Android - not because of the OS, but because of app availability on the platform. And that's so sad for me, knowing that MS is really at the behest of app developers (or lack thereof).

    Is the situation ever likely to change? I really hope so, because every day I wish I could go back to my WP.

    Mart
    03-29-2017 03:43 AM
  2. xandros9's Avatar
    Nope, the situation is unlikely to change, and has in fact gotten worse.

    Microsoft does not appear to care about the platform beyond the odd minor tweak here and there, and developers see that, which makes it even less of an appealing proposition.
    03-29-2017 08:54 AM
  3. Neill Baldwin's Avatar
    I own a Huawei Mate 8 and a 950XL. I have always preferred the Windows Phone OS over Android. I don't know why that is, but for me it just works the way I like an OS to work.

    But I stopped using the 950XL about six months back, simply because the apps available on Android (and that I actually use) were not available on WP.

    And so it is that I have thrown in my lot with Android - not because of the OS, but because of app availability on the platform. And that's so sad for me, knowing that MS is really at the behest of app developers (or lack thereof).

    Is the situation ever likely to change? I really hope so, because every day I wish I could go back to my WP.

    Mart
    Same boat. I own a 950 and a Galaxy S7 edge. The Edge is a great phone but I still prefer the Windows platform, minus the app situation. I'll use my 950 every once in awhile until the apps start bother me or the scaling on certain sites in Edge drive me up a wall.
    03-29-2017 10:08 AM
  4. libra89's Avatar
    I think it is the problem - to a point, that is.

    What I mean by that is that for some people, they have all of the apps they need so it isn't a problem. For others (and I would say this is a decent amount of people, myself included), they have most of the apps and/or an acceptable workaround like this video shows:

    The last group of people have apps here but they are lacking an essential app that either doesn't have a workaround or the workaround is unacceptable.

    The quality of first party apps is seriously varied. Some are pretty much up to speed with their equals on the other two platforms, others are a feature or two behind and the rest are not even close to being there. It really depends on the apps you use.
    03-29-2017 10:30 AM
  5. jeffchapik's Avatar
    The app gap may be the final nail in the coffin for WM now. But 3 or 4 years ago, the biggest problem in my opinion was that Microsoft apparently never incentivized the carrier store sales people to push the platform. I dealt with a number of them, as most of friends and family members were using Windows phones at time (I'm one of the few left!) At both AT&T and Verizon, with only one or two exceptions, the sales person always tried to steer me to either an iPhone or android instead, when I specifically asked to see a Windows phone. In the Verizon store, she as much as ridiculed me, saying that WP was terrible and hard to use, and why would I want one?





    You almost had to insist to even get to see one, as some stores didn't have them on display. Is it any wonder they never gained popularity? Big fail, Microsoft.
    03-29-2017 11:01 AM
  6. etphoto's Avatar
    I think the lack of apps are a problem for those people out there that, for some reason, seem to think they can't function without the latest greatest app. So, yeah, its a problem I guess.

    Twitter: @PhotographyET
    TgeekB, aximtreo, editguy and 1 others like this.
    03-29-2017 12:53 PM
  7. meattray's Avatar
    Different people have different needs. Some require different apps for work with social media, some require specific banking apps and some just find it much easier to use the device if there's an app readily available. Sure you can use a workaround with Windows but if there's an app, some people just want the simple solution.

    I've long used BlackBerry devices and bother things so I'm used to the workarounds and it's fine by me, but other people don't really think so.
    03-29-2017 02:27 PM
  8. TgeekB's Avatar
    Like everything in life, its a problem if you let it be one.
    As others have said, unless you need a specific app for work or other special need they are a convenience (perhaps). For some of us we seem to be getting by just fine. Its a personal choice.

    Sent from mTalk on my SP4
    03-29-2017 04:02 PM
  9. LuxuryTouringZone's Avatar
    I'd say a lack of apps and a lack of consistent, yearly smartphone releases.
    03-29-2017 06:54 PM
  10. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    The 'app gap' didn't bother me until about a year ago. I didn't care about stupid apps like Snapchat or Pokémon Go, but unfortunately many major apps have been pulled over the past year and it's clear that Microsoft is not committed to the platform at this time. The loss of the eBay app was the final nail in the coffin for me, and many other major apps have very poor developer support or have been abandoned. I still prefer the Windows Mobile platform and still have my Lumia 950 but I've had to switch to a Google Pixel as my primary phone although I would still switch back to Windows Mobile if the situation improves.
    03-29-2017 08:53 PM
  11. sd4f's Avatar
    It's lack of support in every sense. The issues are much broader than just one thing.

    The problem is largely a circular problem. Low user adoption, means low developer support means low user adoption, means ...

    MS isn't supporting the platform, I don't blame them, there's no point throwing good money after bad. They are doing the absolute bare minimum to stop it from becoming abandonware. The same can't be said of third parties who have pretty much left.

    Everything MS has tried has more or less fallen flat (social media integration, UWP, Continuum, etc.), and frankly now, I don't think it's recoverable, it's just far too late. The other platforms are so mature, and have such a head start, that I don't think MS can offer anything compelling enough to compete.

    However, it's not all rosy for android. In spite of its huuuge market share, on android central, read an article how only now will all the android app stores generate more revenue than apple's app store. That's not just google's but all of them, of which there are a few others. Google's one is about 60% of apple's.

    This is where apple positioned themselves incredibly well. Premium devices only, targeting premium markets and getting premium customers. Android, on the other hand, gets huge use from people who will never spend a single cent on an app. Right now, positioning windows as a premium platform just can't happen, because it's far away from a premium experience.

    If MS wants to compete, it needs to do one thing; generate value for developers. That will get them to support the platform, and in turn help bring users. If it's profitable, they'll make apps. If the apps are there, users will use it. The fundamentals of W10M are good, it's just there's as much incentive for developers to develop as theater actors performing to an empty room.
    03-30-2017 12:21 AM
  12. darrell reimer's Avatar
    The app gap may be the final nail in the coffin for WM now. But 3 or 4 years ago, the biggest problem in my opinion was that Microsoft apparently never incentivized the carrier store sales people to push the platform. I dealt with a number of them, as most of friends and family members were using Windows phones at time (I'm one of the few left!) At both AT&T and Verizon, with only one or two exceptions, the sales person always tried to steer me to either an iPhone or android instead, when I specifically asked to see a Windows phone. In the Verizon store, she as much as ridiculed me, saying that WP was terrible and hard to use, and why would I want one?





    You almost had to insist to even get to see one, as some stores didn't have them on display. Is it any wonder they never gained popularity? Big fail, Microsoft.
    Exactly!!!! The same thing happened to me - over and over again. Over the years, I've bought 2 Lumia 625 and 2 830 phones for my kids and wife; in all cases (and in different stores) I had sales personnel question why I wanted these, and try to talk me out of buying a Windows phone. It was almost like they were on commission for Android and Apple; I knew way more about the phones than anyone on staff. None had ever used a Windows Phone! Even when I ditched my iPhone 4 way back and picked up my first ATIV S, the sales person had to 'go to the back' to dig around and find the phone, buried under boxes of 'other product'...
    jeffchapik and aximtreo like this.
    03-30-2017 12:31 AM
  13. Krystianpants's Avatar
    Nope, the situation is unlikely to change, and has in fact gotten worse.

    Microsoft does not appear to care about the platform beyond the odd minor tweak here and there, and developers see that, which makes it even less of an appealing proposition.
    950/950XL was for the "fans". And as such Ms was betting a lot of them would join insider and want to be at the forefront of what they are doing. But really the fans were there helping MS collect data and perfect the kernel to work with arm devices. MS has also been working on making windows 10 work with android in a much better way. Even something like Project Rome that syncs android apps with UWP equivelant.

    This is likely because in the future companies like Google and MS will compete against what OS runs in the "continuum" mode of an android smartphone. S8 already showcases a mix of chrome OS/windows for the interface. Samsung went as far as partnering with vmware to create a full windows virtualized solution(In the future they may not have to virtualize). It wouldn't be far fetched if windows 10 on arm became the standard OS that android phones display when docked(depending on brand, there may be chrome OS versions). This allows ms to stay relevant in mobile but also can launch their own version eventually with full windows in all form factors. I already predicted this path and the S8 almost seems to point to me being correct. Still it's a bit early to tell what Samsung wants to do. But they seem to love the idea of hybrid devices.

    Samsung is the leader in the android world. A lot of companies follow them, they may have kickstarted a trend.
    PerfectReign likes this.
    03-30-2017 08:37 AM
  14. garak0410's Avatar
    I have to agree...the lack of apps is a problem.

    Going back to the Amiga days, I would try to sell people on them to get them to go with it...but always, "can it run Lotus?" "Is it IBM Compatible?" I'd say no but if you got an Amiga 2000, you can use a Bridgeboard. I'd lose them there.

    Same with Windows Phone. The lack of apps is critical now. For some, Windows Phone may work for them. But what is an operating system if people don't develop for it?

    I love Windows Phone but I saw the writing on the wall with the release of the 950XL when Verizon didn't get it. And since, more and more apps have been pulled from the store or we have no hope for newer apps. I fire up my ICON now and then to keep up with insiders because I do care for the platform. But I can no longer do the "I don't need apps"...I do need them...
    03-30-2017 09:16 AM
  15. Scott Pisciotta's Avatar
    It's easy. Price a cutting edge phone for around $299, take a $300 loss per phone, put 10 million in the market at a loss of 3 billion which is nothing for MSFT, and make your last stand.

    Then developers will come over. It's clear the iOS bridge was a joke (see the Facebook 1.2 gig app) that is horrible.
    03-30-2017 02:11 PM
  16. Sedp23's Avatar
    I'd say a lack of apps and a lack of consistent, yearly smartphone releases.
    Along with the app gap this is the biggest problem. There's pretty much no cdma phones, no flagships no nothing...that isolates millions of users right there alone (sprint and Verizon)

    But why even bother if Microsoft doesn't care to try to get more hardware from other manufacturers....ive been on windows since the first HTC touch pro and Samsung Omnia and it's never looked as grim as it does now

    Sent from Idol 4s
    libra89, Elky64 and aximtreo like this.
    03-30-2017 02:16 PM
  17. SL2's Avatar
    I think the lack of apps are a problem for those people out there that, for some reason, seem to think they can't function without the latest greatest app.
    Your post makes no sense. Who said anything about the latest or greatest? The apps I need have never been available. Not sure if you're flamebaiting. :D
    If there's something I hate more than people complaining it's people hinting that third party apps are somehow inferior or just for fun, compared to what the phone offers out of the box.
    Look, people may need apps for reasons that doesn't apply to you. If you don't like this thread then don't read it. The title should give you a hint of what it's about.
    03-30-2017 02:57 PM
  18. Nokia5110's Avatar
    So, I bought this new lumia 625 and shoved my sim card. I expected to make right away given that I had credit (no data credit though) and contacts on my sim. Well, I couldn't use the damn thing! Had I bought the phone at a local shop I would have returned it immediately and found something that could work without having to log onto,...

    To complicated for some markets!
    03-30-2017 03:00 PM
  19. kaktus1389's Avatar
    The problem of WP is that MS never really pushed it hard enough. OK, they actually tried under Ballmer, but it was almost too late back then even though they would have like 10% market share by now if they would continue with Ballmer's policies.

    Another problem of WP is that press used to hate everything that came from Microsoft so many people just fell for it.

    I just illustrated you the infinite loop that represents the real problems of WP which are actually the real causes for WP not having apps - both things I mentioned above lead us to low market share and low market share leads us to lack of interest on developing WP apps - simple as that. It's true that there are new apps coming to the MS store, but they're not pushing UWP vision and their mobile OS strong enough to see more UWP apps -> for one UWP app that comes to the Store, there is an app that gets discontinued.
    03-30-2017 05:02 PM
  20. TgeekB's Avatar
    The problem of WP is that MS never really pushed it hard enough. OK, they actually tried under Ballmer, but it was almost too late back then even though they would have like 10% market share by now if they would continue with Ballmer's policies.

    Another problem of WP is that press used to hate everything that came from Microsoft so many people just fell for it.

    I just illustrated you the infinite loop that represents the real problems of WP which are actually the real causes for WP not having apps - both things I mentioned above lead us to low market share and low market share leads us to lack of interest on developing WP apps - simple as that. It's true that there are new apps coming to the MS store, but they're not pushing UWP vision and their mobile OS strong enough to see more UWP apps -> for one UWP app that comes to the Store, there is an app that gets discontinued.
    It's not ready to be pushed. When that time comes, we'll see how they respond.

    Sent from my Alcatel Idol 4S
    FXi2, aximtreo and editguy like this.
    03-30-2017 05:31 PM
  21. Awhispersecho's Avatar
    Too many problems and mistakes by MS to count. MS is the biggest problem. Lack of support, lack of vision, lack of commitment, too slow, wasting momentum when you had some. The list goes on and on.

    Carriers and press were the other main problem. The tech press rarely said 1 thing good about the platform. They are made up of Android and Iphone users and there was never a chance the would give MS a fair chance.

    The carriers however were a huge issue. They would talk people out of buying the phones, they would criticize the platform. I even had 1 guy tell me that MS was about to file bankruptcy and go out of business. People forget that at 1 point Verizon had to pay a penalty to Apple because they didn't mee their quarterly sales quota. The carriers were paid to promote the other platforms and punished when they didn't meet their end of the deals.
    laevanay likes this.
    03-30-2017 06:17 PM
  22. Elky64's Avatar
    To me it's the whole ball-n-wax or "all of the above". I find upon each use(830/650/950), there's a lack of, fluidly, stability, consistency aaand apps. Then I am reminded of the platforms uncertainty along with MSFT's lack of commitment. Combine those facts and who, in their right mind, is going to put a positive spin on the platforms future other than the diehards? And I'm totally not in agreeance that anyone else (carriers, press etc etc) other than MSFT is to blame, you reap what you sow.

    As for apps, once wasn't much of an issue for me back when but now it has become dire. Starting to lose count as of late the times we've been left in the lurch due to an app being non-existent, the developer decided to drop support, or the app was literally pulled. Last time I looked the techno field was about advancements yet we seem to be going backwards in many respects, starting to feel like 2012 rather then 2017.

    Then there's hardware availability and we're not even talking new, it's been an absolute joke IMO. Going back to 2012 I've found WP to be very selective as to what was available yet could not say the same for the other platforms, can't believe in many respects the same holds true even today.
    libra89 and aximtreo like this.
    03-31-2017 12:58 AM
  23. Neill Baldwin's Avatar
    The apps I miss are not just for fun and games. 1 has to do with my work and another is my insurance company. Yes, some of this is "just" convienance but if I'm going to ignore phones that have that convienance, I could just get an old flip phone. I just think it's a shame that people just didn't have the exposure to WP for whatever reason, marketing, carrier bias, etc... When my mother in law was going to get her first smart phone I really thought about Windows because the live tiles were big, easy to see, and simple for her to use. On the other hand, features like Continuum and the flawless syncing with my laptop make it good for people that need a little more.
    03-31-2017 02:44 AM
  24. fatclue_98's Avatar
    The apps I miss are not just for fun and games. 1 has to do with my work and another is my insurance company. Yes, some of this is "just" convienance but if I'm going to ignore phones that have that convienance, I could just get an old flip phone. I just think it's a shame that people just didn't have the exposure to WP for whatever reason, marketing, carrier bias, etc... When my mother in law was going to get her first smart phone I really thought about Windows because the live tiles were big, easy to see, and simple for her to use. On the other hand, features like Continuum and the flawless syncing with my laptop make it good for people that need a little more.
    Take away Continuum and it's very hard to make a case for Windows. When WP8.1 was here there were still quite a few apps available. The majors anyway. It's certainly becoming a business oriented OS and maybe that's enough for some. It is for me during working hours but it's a challenge just to pay my GEICO bill since the app was discontinued a couple of years ago and the exodus within the last year alone has been pronounced. It's tough, there's no way to sugarcoat it.
    03-31-2017 10:45 PM
  25. Kot Prada's Avatar
    I own a Huawei Mate 8 and a 950XL. I have always preferred the Windows Phone OS over Android. I don't know why that is, but for me it just works the way I like an OS to work.

    But I stopped using the 950XL about six months back, simply because the apps available on Android (and that I actually use) were not available on WP.

    And so it is that I have thrown in my lot with Android - not because of the OS, but because of app availability on the platform. And that's so sad for me, knowing that MS is really at the behest of app developers (or lack thereof).

    Is the situation ever likely to change? I really hope so, because every day I wish I could go back to my WP.

    Mart
    Got my 950 XL a week ago... I have no problems with apps at all.

    I have a few small complaints about OS... but nothing about apps or their lack.
    TgeekB and Sven_Van_de_Velde like this.
    04-02-2017 07:30 AM
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