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  1. jimmy1one's Avatar
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       #1  
    I'm having an issue with all the rage regarding apps. I want to interact with my contacts not with the phone. We task the phone just as we task any computer system it comes down to a group of feature sets, speed of implementation and reliability not how many app are in the marketplace. BWT most or what I need should be included in the OS as standard functions not features. What we have here is a glorified personal assist IMHO a grand idea long awaited. If you believe that's the case then implementation is sorely lacking in the OS, admittedly WP 7 does a better job but still there seems to be a disconnect?
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  2. jalb's Avatar
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    #2  
    It depends on your personality I guess. My wife has hundreds of apps installed on her phone and claims to use them all. I'll take a good mobile site any day.
  3. HeyCori's Avatar
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    #3  
    Personally I think an app bubble is developing. The need for an extensive app library will lessen as the OS itself becomes more feature rich. Just look at Mango and how much it can do right out of the box. Overtime the major operating systems (Android, iOS, WP7, Blackberry) will become less reliant on apps to "complete" their eco-system. The things people will, within reason, want to do with their phone will be baked right into the OS. That's going to leave a lot of app developers on the outside looking inside. There's going to be a huge fallout when customers no longer need a specific set of apps. And like any bubble, once it bursts the only devs that will be left are the biggest and best. That's just my unscientific opinion. :D
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  4. Reflexx's Avatar
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    #4  
    There is a limit to what you can build straight into the OS before it starts to become cluttered.

    Many different people have different needs, and these needs are met by quite a variety of apps.

    If these apps could somehow integrate themselves with the OS so that it starts to blur the line between OS and app. That's the goal that WP is working towards.
  5. selfcreation's Avatar
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    #5  
    if you like apps get an Iphone ( IOS = app launcher )

    if you want reliable and easy to use = WP7 ( most stable OS )

    if you want customization get an Android... ( most Custom ROMS and UI )

    if you want to do E-mails + BBM get a Blackbery.... ( only true push )

    if you want a OS that doesnt Update , get WEBOS ( LOL sorry i had to add it )

    what the H*LL is symbian? (seriously .. huh? lol . )


    that’s it ,, that’s all.... lol
    Last edited by Se1fcr3ation; 09-01-2011 at 11:48 AM.
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  6. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
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    #6  
    Yeah, but most people don't want just a couple of features, the want a mixture of all of them. I got a WP7 because it was something new, I'm re-upping my contract with another WP7 because I get the apps I want, it's easy/fun to use, I like the basic customizing that can be done [need more tile color options though], and the text/chat integration [need more services though]. All in all, WP7 give me the best mixture the best feature.

    Quote Originally Posted by Se1fcr3ation View Post
    if you like apps get an Iphone ( IOS = app launcher )

    if you want reliable and easy to use = WP7 ( most stable OS )

    if you want customization get an Android... ( most Custom ROMS and UI )

    if you want to do E-mails + BBM get a Blackbery.... ( only true push )

    thats it ,, thats all.... lol
    And iTunes sucking on Windows doesn't help the iPhone either. :)
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  7. bear_lx's Avatar
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    #7  
    in todays time, smartphones are more than just phones... they do it all, basically small computers. so average smartphone user would expect all of those things! every platform has its own "nitch" as self creation shared with us, but more and more people are expecting a bit of it all. i knwo i do... **** when the retail for as much as tablets and full blown pc's, we should expect it. but are apps over rated? maybe too much emphasis put on what apps are available, but there is dfefinately a high demand fro quality apps , so i would say no
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  8. smartpatrol's Avatar
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    #8  
    I agree with the idea that an "app bubble" is forming. More and more functionality is being integrated into the OS itself. GPS/maps/navigation, barcode/QR/visual search, social network integration, email, IM, etc. are all becoming standard parts of any mobile OS. (EDIT: and of course MS Office is even part of the WP7 OS)

    Meanwhile, mobile web browsers are becoming far more powerful and integrating standards like HTML5, as well as vastly improving Javascript performance. LOTS of apps are just fancy ways of pulling content off the internet. I have apps on my phone for WPCentral, Engadget, IGN, Weather Channel, IMDB, Flixster, Stock Watch, Twitter, Facebook, etc etc etc. With the exception of apps that use Live Tiles, I see no reason why any of these apps will exist a few years from now. All of that content, with all of the app-style bells and whistles, will be just as possible to do in your web browser.

    I think there will always be some market for apps, but nowhere near as big as it is now. If all your app does is aggregate/present information from the web, it will be basically useless before too long. And, if your app is some piece of basic functionality with widespread demand, it will get integrated into the OS itself before too long.

    We are rapidly approaching a future where it doesn't matter if your OS has 30,000 apps vs 300,000 apps vs 3,000,000.
    Last edited by sharksandwich; 09-01-2011 at 12:24 PM.
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  9. Jazmac's Avatar
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    #9  
    The answer is, absolutely. Nielsen recently released a study that described the top 50 Android Apps Account for 61% of ALL apps used. ALL apps.

    Not 300,000, not 200,000 and not even 30,000 currently in the WP market. But 50 apps account for 61% of all apps people spend their time with and my guess is all 50 are currently sitting within the 30,000 WP app market has. Well, 29,999. I still want Words With Friends and I understand it's coming. lol.
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  10. HeyCori's Avatar
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    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Techblogger View Post
    The answer is, absolutely. Nielsen recently released a study that described the top 50 Android Apps Account for 61% of ALL apps used. ALL apps.

    Not 300,000, not 200,000 and not even 30,000 currently in the WP market. But 50 apps account for 61% of all apps people spend their time with and my guess is all 50 are currently sitting within the 30,000 WP app market has. Well, 29,999. I still want Words With Friends and I understand it's coming. lol.
    And I'm guessing that slots 1-49 is different versions of the Facebook app. :D
  11. gerrymad's Avatar
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    #11  
    Apps are worthless and they are valuable. It all depends on what you like. The ability to add apps is valuable as it allows you to add a feature which perhaps only a relatively small number of people want. Don't forget that games are technically apps. Does everybody need Angry Birds built in on their phones? My son would say definitely yes. In the end apps allow me to have my phone my way. I see today that Navigon is coming out with an app. The nice thing is that I can get that one if I prefer it to one of the others. Alternatively I can just stay with the built in maps if that serves my needs.
  12. Umm Yeah's Avatar
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    #12  
    I think a smartphone needs to have a solid list of basic features right out of the box - a solid stable UI, an enjoyable UX, and good calendar, email, tasks, memos, and SMS/MMS built-in apps.

    The iPhone has a good mix of all of these, as well as a strong set of apps, but it's only available in one form factor. Android has multiple form factors but a mediocre UI/UX. A user can hobble together a usable Android smartphone by using all the third party apps to compensate for the missing built-in functionality but the results aren't always as stable as they can be with built in apps.

    WP7 has a great UI/UX, great integration of email and, in Mango with workarounds, calendar support. The third party apps are growing and MS seems to really be working hard/spending the money to make it grow in the areas that consumers want. I wish tasks and memos were handled better, as I use these constantly for work. I know there are third party apps for both and there is the synchronized OneNote app, but that requires opening the Office hub and then OneNote. I would like for OneNote to be pinned to the start screen, along with Tasks. (I think that might be the case in Mango, FYI, but I'm not sure)

    Anyway, back on topic, apps are important up to a point. If one maker has 100,000 apps and another has 300,000, does it really matter? With numbers that large, most, if not all, of the most popular apps will exist in both environments. As stated earlier, the top 50 apps make up well over half of those used so the real key is to have the RIGHT MIX of apps, not the most. But just as megapixels became shorthand for how good a camera is, the number of apps has become shorthand for how functional a smartphone is. The reality is that I'd just as soon not have 10,000 fart apps available to me but I don't want to deny other the subtle variations and tonal qualities found in the plethora of flatulence simulators in the Android and iPhone app stores.
  13. Jazmac's Avatar
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    #13  
    Here is the link if you want to read up on the survey.

    Linkage
  14. Dagolara's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by Techblogger View Post
    The answer is, absolutely. Nielsen recently released a study that described the top 50 Android Apps Account for 61% of ALL apps used. ALL apps.

    Not 300,000, not 200,000 and not even 30,000 currently in the WP market. But 50 apps account for 61% of all apps people spend their time with and my guess is all 50 are currently sitting within the 30,000 WP app market has. Well, 29,999. I still want Words With Friends and I understand it's coming. lol.
    Have a link handy for this, I'd like to read it?
  15. Jazmac's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by Umm Yeah... View Post
    I think a smartphone needs to have a solid list of basic features right out of the box - a solid stable UI, an enjoyable UX, and good calendar, email, tasks, memos, and SMS/MMS built-in apps.

    The iPhone has a good mix of all of these, as well as a strong set of apps, but it's only available in one form factor. Android has multiple form factors but a mediocre UI/UX. A user can hobble together a usable Android smartphone by using all the third party apps to compensate for the missing built-in functionality but the results aren't always as stable as they can be with built in apps.

    WP7 has a great UI/UX, great integration of email and, in Mango with workarounds, calendar support. The third party apps are growing and MS seems to really be working hard/spending the money to make it grow in the areas that consumers want. I wish tasks and memos were handled better, as I use these constantly for work. I know there are third party apps for both and there is the synchronized OneNote app, but that requires opening the Office hub and then OneNote. I would like for OneNote to be pinned to the start screen, along with Tasks. (I think that might be the case in Mango, FYI, but I'm not sure)

    Anyway, back on topic, apps are important up to a point. If one maker has 100,000 apps and another has 300,000, does it really matter? With numbers that large, most, if not all, of the most popular apps will exist in both environments. As stated earlier, the top 50 apps make up well over half of those used so the real key is to have the RIGHT MIX of apps, not the most. But just as megapixels became shorthand for how good a camera is, the number of apps has become shorthand for how functional a smartphone is. The reality is that I'd just as soon not have 10,000 fart apps available to me but I don't want to deny other the subtle variations and tonal qualities found in the plethora of flatulence simulators in the Android and iPhone app stores.
    I agree. I keep saying the majority of those buying smart phones are not that sophisticated but those in the android world, with nothing but a PC to compare anything with insists the clamor must be running the tiny-est of apps on the biggest hardware you can get.
  16. jimmy1one's Avatar
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       #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by sharksandwich View Post
    I agree with the idea that an "app bubble" is forming. More and more functionality is being integrated into the OS itself. GPS/maps/navigation, barcode/QR/visual search, social network integration, email, IM, etc. are all becoming standard parts of any mobile OS. (EDIT: and of course MS Office is even part of the WP7 OS)

    Meanwhile, mobile web browsers are becoming far more powerful and integrating standards like HTML5, as well as vastly improving Javascript performance. LOTS of apps are just fancy ways of pulling content off the internet. I have apps on my phone for WPCentral, Engadget, IGN, Weather Channel, IMDB, Flixster, Stock Watch, Twitter, Facebook, etc etc etc. With the exception of apps that use Live Tiles, I see no reason why any of these apps will exist a few years from now. All of that content, with all of the app-style bells and whistles, will be just as possible to do in your web browser.

    I think there will always be some market for apps, but nowhere near as big as it is now. If all your app does is aggregate/present information from the web, it will be basically useless before too long. And, if your app is some piece of basic functionality with widespread demand, it will get integrated into the OS itself before too long.

    We are rapidly approaching a future where it doesn't matter if your OS has 30,000 apps vs 300,000 apps vs 3,000,000.
    Sharksandwich you and Dizzymaker seem to have grasped my question so let me refine it a little more. Would you guys at this point, knowing what you know, go out and buy a stand alone GPS system? Would you take your Desktop on vacation to have access to your DVD collection. Or how about paying for a browser or email program. MY answer is no to all three questions, a no brainer's no brainer. If you break down what you really want your personal assistant to do why are we reinventing the wheel with all these app that have proven alternatives on the full blown OS?
    What's the sense in having a dog if you have to bark?
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  17. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
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    #17  
    Most Android apps sit idle, top-50 apps make up 61% of all usage


    Quote Originally Posted by Dagolara View Post
    Have a link handy for this, I'd like to read it?
    Goodbye Dooley! You will NOT be missed!:@
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  18. jimmy1one's Avatar
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       #18  
    Just look am I onto something or have we been taken like I said
    Free Capture & Creation

    " The GALAXY Notes advanced pen input functionality is combined with the full touch screen to create a new input experience. The incorporated digital S Pen can be used for accurate sketching and artwork, and instantly capturing ideas freely before they float away.
    The GALAXY Note features S Memo, a multimedia application designed to record all forms of user-created content. Pictures, voice recordings, typed text, handwritten notes or drawings can all be captured via a single application and converted to a memo, to be edited, annotated and shared as desired.

    A one-step screen-capture function also allows users to instantly capture any screen; captured images can also be freely and accurately annotated using the S Pen before being filed or shared.

    The S Pen functionality has been deeply integrated into the GALAXY Notes native applications to provide a richer interactive experience. Users will benefit from increased accuracy and control when editing or personalizing captured videos or photographs; and users will be able to draw and send handwritten images and notes via text message, email, and Samsungs ChatON communication service."
    What's the sense in having a dog if you have to bark?
    hit me up on twitter
  19. Reflexx's Avatar
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    #19  
    I don't see an "app bubble". But apps may look different in the future than they do now.

    With the launch of Windows 8, Microsoft is pushing for Web Apps. These are apps created using a combination of HTML5 and Javascript. And maybe some special APIs available that allow it native access to to certain functions in the OS. And phones will eventually be able to take advantage of these apps.

    So there will be a lot of apps that will be primarily web based as opposed to being on your phone.

    But in general, apps are software. And there isn't going to be a software bubble. Because as the abilities of the platform change, new different kinds of things will be available to do. We'll start seeing apps with functionality that we currently only imagine PCs doing.

    Eventually, mobile devices might serve as PC replacements for those that don't need a huge amount of power. We may just have docking stations that we plug our phone into. And in a few yrs, I wouldn't be surprised if our mobile phones were as powerful as some of the i3 laptops on the market right now.
  20. bear_lx's Avatar
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    #20  
    my answer is no to 2, i mat still take my laptop, but not for a dvd collection, more so for bigger display while web browsing. i think that there is a demand for "quality apps" given we dont need fart machines and finger doodles, but apps like garmin gps replace a stand alone gps system... apps like pandora replace the need for xm or sirus radio subscription. apps like kik messenger eliminate the need for unlimited texts plans.... so there is a demand for "quality apps" however back to original point, there are a lot more important features on a phone than its app selection, like hardware, OS, and stability...
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  21. Dave Blake's Avatar
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    #21  
    M2C

    WP needs developers. < I said Period MS will build in to the OS to make it a viable alternative to other OS's while attempting to leave a large enough hole for developers to fill so that developers can be profitable. This is true of all the successful OS's so dont play to much in to what is missing from any OS these holes were left for a reason. WP will continue to evolve and things will be added but things will be left out as well. Microsoft could give us a complete platform that fills all the holes that would not allow for development (symbian) that will not allow the OS to grow. If any platform does not allow for developers to developed and be profitable then the OS will stagnate and lose users. If you want apps go get them if you dont then dont but dont expect Microsoft, Google, Apple or anyone else to build a system so complete that apps arent needed.

    :ninja: Dave
  22. Umm Yeah's Avatar
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmy1one View Post
    If you break down what you really want your personal assistant to do why are we reinventing the wheel with all these app that have proven alternatives on the full blown OS?
    I always refer to Androids as the "Handyman's Special" because they come as limited shells and they really NEED to be fleshed out with third party apps to be run optimally. That said, third party apps are limited in what APIs they have access to. Third party apps are often less stable and not as ingrained into the OS as the built in apps.

    For instance, when my wife switched from her BlackBerry to her Android (I know, I know, but she was young and WP7 wasn't around then!), one of the things she liked about her BB was that you could set custom sound profiles and set them to switch during certain hours, called "bedside mode". Android only had three sound profiles - Normal, Vibrate, and Silent. She found a third party app that would let her sort of create a custom sound profile, but Androids APIs only allowed for the changing of sounds for ALL emails, or ALL messages, and ALL other sounds. BB allowed for much more variations.

    That's just one example, but it shows how preferable it is to have a richer built in app environment than to have a stripped down model that relies on thrid party apps too much. (And by the way, MS, if you are listening, look in BB's bedside mode and customized sound profiles. WP7's options in that area are woefully inadequate as well.)
  23. jimmy1one's Avatar
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       #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Big D5 View Post
    M2C

    WP needs developers. < I said Period MS will build in to the OS to make it a viable alternative to other OS's while attempting to leave a large enough hole for developers to fill so that developers can be profitable. This is true of all the successful OS's so don’t play to much in to what is missing from any OS these holes were left for a reason. WP will continue to evolve and things will be added but things will be left out as well. Microsoft could give us a complete platform that fills all the holes that would not allow for development (symbian) that will not allow the OS to grow. If any platform does not allow for developers to developed and be profitable then the OS will stagnate and lose users. If you want app’s go get them if you don’t then don’t but don’t expect Microsoft, Google, Apple or anyone else to build a system so complete that apps aren’t needed.

    :ninja: Dave
    I'm thinking I've still missed the mark. As Reflexx has stated apps have a place it is a question what that place is not where it is. Big D you say there is a reason thing are left out, pray tell?
    If you want to know what an apps place is in the long run it wll be calling full fledged programs from the OS which will be synched via the WP or Metro clear as mud by taking a look at Windows 8. Want to see Metro look at your home screen on WP7. I'm not saying it will look exactly the same but essentially Metro is Windows 8. If you agree that's true hard to see how anyone would not then Take a look at the text below. If you want to know what time it is do you buy a watch or a clock factory?

    "The GALAXY Note’s advanced pen input functionality is combined with the full touch screen to create a new input experience. The incorporated digital S Pen can be used for accurate sketching and artwork, and instantly capturing ideas freely before they float away.
    The GALAXY Note features S Memo, a multimedia application designed to record all forms of user-created content. Pictures, voice recordings, typed text, handwritten notes or drawings can all be captured via a single application and converted to a ‘memo’, to be edited, annotated and shared as desired.

    A one-step screen-capture function also allows users to instantly capture any screen; captured images can also be freely and accurately annotated using the S Pen before being filed or shared.

    The S Pen functionality has been deeply integrated into the GALAXY Note’s native applications to provide a richer interactive experience. Users will benefit from increased accuracy and control when editing or personalizing captured videos or photographs; and users will be able to draw and send handwritten images and notes via text message, email, and Samsung’s ChatON communication service."
    What's the sense in having a dog if you have to bark?
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  24. 3migo's Avatar
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    #24  
    I'd agree that Apps are slightly overrated. I utilize a few apps daily such as stocks, weather, news, ebay, things of that nature, but I see some people that are playing a game on their phone during every second of down time they have...

    I got over apps within the first 3 months I had my iPhone, and just wanted a few essentials, and a GOOD phone. Eventually everybody moves up on the hierarchy of smartphone needs, and progresses beyond wanting apps for everything, and then desires quality software with reliable hardware.

    The "lack" of apps on platforms like Wp7 and Blackberry is just a weak argument made by iOS/Android fanboys that want to bash every other OS that isn't their own.
  25. smartpatrol's Avatar
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    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmy1one View Post
    Sharksandwich you and Dizzymaker seem to have grasped my question so let me refine it a little more. Would you guys at this point, knowing what you know, go out and buy a stand alone GPS system? Would you take your Desktop on vacation to have access to your DVD collection. Or how about paying for a browser or email program. MY answer is no to all three questions, a no brainer's no brainer. If you break down what you really want your personal assistant to do why are we reinventing the wheel with all these app that have proven alternatives on the full blown OS?
    Definitely wouldn't buy a stand-alone GPS, web browser, or email client. I'm not a big fan of watching movies on a phone though, so I still have plenty of entertainment value in my 17 inch laptop. (Although we're probably less than 5 years away from being able to store dozens of 1080p movies on your phone, and play them back on an HDTV through the HDMI out. . . or even stream them from the cloud).

    Back in the day, you had to buy or otherwise obtain software such as: a TCP/IP networking stack, web browser, storage drivers, winzip, video/music player, CD burning software, etc etc. Nowadays, the idea of an OS without that stuff built-in is completely archaic. Every OS is constantly adding new functionality with each release, and rendering many 3rd party applications obsolete as a result.
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