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  1. peestandingup's Avatar
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       #1  
    It’s Not Just About Price: Nokia’s Elop Says They’re Not Getting The Retail Traction They “Prefer” | TechCrunch

    It's funny to me that he's blaming the front line salespeople. I agree with that somewhat, but aside from the design, the 900 didn't exactly blow anyone away with their mediocre camera quality & last gen screen/specs. But that's more Microsoft's fault.

    Also, whether you guys believe it or not, the lack of apps are a BIG deal to most people. I use basically all the platforms out there, and not having stuff on WP that I'm used to having on Android/iOS (like Instagram, Path, & higher quality apps overall that are updated frequently & not abandoned) is a real buzz kill.

    IMO, both MS & Nokia are screwing up. But MS more than Nokia.
  2. fatclue_98's Avatar
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    #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by peestandingup View Post
    It’s Not Just About Price: Nokia’s Elop Says They’re Not Getting The Retail Traction They “Prefer” | TechCrunch

    It's funny to me that he's blaming the front line salespeople. I agree with that somewhat, but aside from the design, the 900 didn't exactly blow anyone away with their mediocre camera quality & last gen screen/specs. But that's more Microsoft's fault.

    Also, whether you guys believe it or not, the lack of apps are a BIG deal to most people. I use basically all the platforms out there, and not having stuff on WP that I'm used to having on Android/iOS (like Instagram, Path, & higher quality apps overall that are updated frequently & not abandoned) is a real buzz kill.

    IMO, both MS & Nokia are screwing up. But MS more than Nokia.
    If you peruse these boards enough you'll note that most of us are waiting to see what develops with WP8 (Apollo). I gotta think most people are waiting as well, why get into a 2 year contract on WP7 if Apollo may bring what you're missing now? June 20th, or whatever date MS actually chooses, can't come soon enough
  3. peestandingup's Avatar
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       #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by fatclue_98 View Post
    If you peruse these boards enough you'll note that most of us are waiting to see what develops with WP8 (Apollo). I gotta think most people are waiting as well, why get into a 2 year contract on WP7 if Apollo may bring what you're missing now? June 20th, or whatever date MS actually chooses, can't come soon enough
    True & I agree with that somewhat. But these forums represent a VERY small percentage of overall customer base. So really, I'd wager the only people that even know about WP8 (or WP in general) are us & the geeks. Which is a problem.

    But WP8 still doesn't take care of the perception issues & app problems. Its kinda like saying everything will be OK once Blackberry OS 10 gets here. All of these things needed to happen a year or two ago.
  4. Jake_M's Avatar
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    #4  
    I don't really mind the lack of apps if the browser works, but my god the browser can't do ****.

    None of the websites usually recognize it as a mobile browser, and if they do the functionality is lost. I wouldn't mind not having apps if my browser could handle the main website, but it can't.
    My apps are on JMTK Application Development
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  5. sinime's Avatar
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    #5  
    Idk, I'm in love with that rumored Nokia purview WP8 device. It just looks cool. I think the design of it will sell phones. Assuming it is real.



    And no, I don't want the pink or yellow versions.
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  6. jimski's Avatar
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    #6  
    Forgot where I read it, but more than 50% of all current Smartphone users, "have never downloaded an app". Another 10-20% have installed less than 5 (or something like that). So apps do matter, but only to a small percentage of users who actually use them.

    Sent from my Lumia 900 using Board Express Pro
  7. sinime's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimski View Post
    Forgot where I read it, but more than 50% of all current Smartphone users, "have never downloaded an app". Another 10-20% have installed less than 5 (or something like that). So apps do matter, but only to a small percentage of users who actually use them.

    Sent from my Lumia 900 using Board Express Pro
    This is true. I can't find the article, but only a small percentage of app developers actually make money. Most break even or just flat out loose money.

    On a side note, when I was on my Pre, I had a limited app catalogue and I had a few apps that I used all the time. Went to WP7 and had a better selection, kept seeing other apps I "needed". Now 7 months in to iOS, and I still mainly use the same few apps (iOS versions of course) that I used on my Pre. In the end, apps don't matter to me.

    Although I do wish the tiles had more color options though. Like a blue that fades to a darker blue down the tile and/or let me select a.background picture for the tile view. That would make WPx look better IMHO.
  8. fatclue_98's Avatar
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    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by peestandingup View Post
    True & I agree with that somewhat. But these forums represent a VERY small percentage of overall customer base. So really, I'd wager the only people that even know about WP8 (or WP in general) are us & the geeks. Which is a problem.

    But WP8 still doesn't take care of the perception issues & app problems. Its kinda like saying everything will be OK once Blackberry OS 10 gets here. All of these things needed to happen a year or two ago.
    You just mentioned the biggest problem, we don't know what's coming with Apollo. I agree with jimski regarding the apps, outside of Droid geeks I don't think people really put that much stock into apps.
  9. sdreamer's Avatar
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    #9  
    Iuno... I think the biggest problem as a whole is just coverage. What happened to AT&T pushing the Lumia device hard, making it as big as the iPhone? Out of all the carriers, I've seen T-Mobile and Spring pushing the HTC One series, and Verizon pushing the Motorola Droid series all over the place, and where is AT&T, pushing general advertisements about their service, an not really any one device. I think what Android did was have Verizon push all that marketing, then they exploded with the Motorola Droid, even though it wasn't as great as the iPhone at the time. AT&T had the chance, and didn't follow through with the Lumia 900. I don't think I've seen AT&T ever push a single device. I think Nokia would actually have better mindshare if they went with any other carrier than AT&T.
  10. eastbayrae's Avatar
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    #10  
    The only reason most mention apps is because Apple has you conditioned to think that way. A phone isn't an app jukebox.
    When all else fails empty the magazine...
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  11. cgk
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    #11  
    Well whatever the excuses people want to put out, unless something changes Nokia along with RIM will end up in the dustbin of history.

    Sent from my Lumia 800 using Board Express
  12. reeshy's Avatar
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinime View Post
    Idk, I'm in love with that rumored Nokia purview WP8 device. It just looks cool. I think the design of it will sell phones. Assuming it is real.

    Click to view quoted image


    And no, I don't want the pink or yellow versions.
    this design is really astonishing !! only Nokia can make it !!
  13. Winterfang's Avatar
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    #13  
    No duh. Look the T-mobile 4G deal, free 4G phones this Saturday including
    HTC One: awesome!
    Galaxy 2: still pretty sweet
    Nokia Lumia 710: wait what?

    Might as well announce things like LGmytouch, that phone is selling great. Not to sound like a broken record but I being saying the same thing since we started, we need cool phones. Not the Lumia 900 isn't cutting it, maybe 2 years ago but not now.
  14. bear_lx's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinime View Post
    Idk, I'm in love with that rumored Nokia purview WP8 device. It just looks cool. I think the design of it will sell phones. Assuming it is real.

    Click to view quoted image


    And no, I don't want the pink or yellow versions.
    i personally think that thing is hideous... id rather use a phone from "miami vice" or "saved by the bell"
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  15. jmerrey's Avatar
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    #15  
    I'm not sure where you guys get the idea that apps don't mean anything to people.

    Just one example. I have many friends who use instagram to share photos. Yes, there are alternatives, but to the average joe who uses instagram, those aren't viable alternatives. It's like saying 'no, we don't have a beach, but we have a sandbox in our backyard." It's just not the same.

    ...and yes, something needs to change. Maybe apollo will spark that change, but I'm getting very worried. "Mango will turn heads...lumia will turn heads...apollo will turn heads" is what we keep hearing, but the market share is absolutely awful, as is the interest level. I want this thing to succeed, the thought of using an iphone makes me want to scream ;)
  16. Winterfang's Avatar
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    #16  
    Apps are very important. If WP7 had a lot of apps it will make up for the lack of features.
  17. theefman's Avatar
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    #17  
    Dont need all, just the apps that matter. Cant be lacking the blockbuster apps from other platforms and have nothing blockbuster of your own to offer. And yes, more devices are needed. Nokia said they would be releasing devices every three months to counter the numerous android releases, what happened to that? Cant even get the one device launched in multiple regions in time.

    I personally think all the problems are down to Microsoft's tortoise approach to advancing the OS, WP has been without cutting edge devices and features for too long and that in turn has meant fewer standout devices, weaker support from carriers and poor interest from consumers. Not to mention the continued abysmal promotion and marketing from seemingly everyone but Nokia which has been a problem since before the OS even launched and is completely disgraceful that the situation hasnt changed in 2 years.

    Bottom line, MS needs to make the OS jawdropping and then tell people about it. Anything else and they might as well not bother.
    Squatting Hen likes this.
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by peestandingup View Post
    It’s Not Just About Price: Nokia’s Elop Says They’re Not Getting The Retail Traction They “Prefer” | TechCrunch

    It's funny to me that he's blaming the front line salespeople. I agree with that somewhat, but aside from the design, the 900 didn't exactly blow anyone away with their mediocre camera quality & last gen screen/specs. But that's more Microsoft's fault.

    Also, whether you guys believe it or not, the lack of apps are a BIG deal to most people. I use basically all the platforms out there, and not having stuff on WP that I'm used to having on Android/iOS (like Instagram, Path, & higher quality apps overall that are updated frequently & not abandoned) is a real buzz kill.

    IMO, both MS & Nokia are screwing up. But MS more than Nokia.
    Look at the sales numbers on the Galaxy S2 and tell me resolution matters. For that matter, look at the sales numbers on the Galaxy Nexus and tell me a mediocre camera matters. The key is mindshare with the people that SELL the phones. Elop is spot on.
  19. Nataku4ca's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinime View Post
    And no, I don't want the pink or yellow versions.

    whats wrong with the yellow one? i like that one, lol
    im also crossing fingers for those concepts and hoping for more at the same time, Nokia need more high end phones
  20. sinime's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Nataku4ca View Post
    whats wrong with the yellow one? i like that one, lol
    im also crossing fingers for those concepts and hoping for more at the same time, Nokia need more high end phones
    Yellow just isn't my cup of tea. I'd go for a black, blue or maybe a green. IDK why I gravitate to darker colors.
  21. N8ter's Avatar
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    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by DizzyMaker View Post
    i personally think that thing is hideous... id rather use a phone from "miami vice" or "saved by the bell"
    Agree, the ugliest phone I've ever seen made worse by how absolutely bulky it is.

    PureView will pretty much always be limited to niche prosumer smartphones until they can fit it in a phone that doesn't completely bastardize all current consumer preferences. The cameras in the One X/GS3/i4[S] and Sony Devices all perform extremely well without needing this type of chasis. If Nokia wants to focus on PureView, it will be a problem and it will cost them because devices like that have very limited viability in markets like the US.
  22. N8ter's Avatar
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by freestaterocker View Post
    Look at the sales numbers on the Galaxy S2 and tell me resolution matters. For that matter, look at the sales numbers on the Galaxy Nexus and tell me a mediocre camera matters. The key is mindshare with the people that SELL the phones. Elop is spot on.
    Let's put it into perspective:

    Galaxy S II

    Announced 2011, February
    Status Available. Released 2011, April

    On AT&T (US Carriers always lag in availability of Samsung devices)

    Announced 2011, August
    Status Available. Released 2011, October

    Yes, WVGA was still common - even on newer devices in April 2011.

    Lumia 900

    Announced 2012, January
    Status Available. Released 2012, April

    So 1 year after GS2 launch, and 6 months after it came to AT&T Nokia wants to compete with:

    1. Old QC processor vs. the Exynos in the AT&T GS2
    2. A Worse Camera, and it only does 720p video instead of 1080p (IIRC, Correct me if I'm Wrong)
    3. A. 1.3 MP VGA FFC
    4. Barely a better screen, if better at all - Lower PPI due to screen size difference
    5. BT 2.1 vs 3.0+HS
    6. No WiFi Direct
    7. No NFC
    8. 512 MB vs. 1GB RAM
    9. No SD Card Slot
    10. [Subjective] WP7 instead of Android, when Ecosystems matter more now than ever

    The GSII is being eclipsed by the GS3 and you can't even buy it in AT&T corporate stores anymore (only the Skyrocket), but the Lumia is still there going strong with specs from 2 years ago.

    The only spec that the Lumia 900 bests is the fact that it has LTE (if we're disregarding the Skyrocket), 0.2" bigger screen (if we're disregarding the Skyrocket), and the fact that it's a WP7 device (which is entirely subjective). Oh, and it has a bigger battery (Again, if disregarding the Skyrocket).

    There is significant spec lag in the WP7 device ecosystem compared to Android and iOS.

    App issue has been discussed ad nauseum. There will always be those people who seriously think the browser is all they need. The Playbook fans on crackberry thought the same thing, and that didn't turn that device into a success.
    Last edited by N8ter; 06-15-2012 at 04:50 PM.
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    Winterfang likes this.
  23. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by peestandingup View Post
    It’s Not Just About Price: Nokia’s Elop Says They’re Not Getting The Retail Traction They “Prefer” | TechCrunch

    It's funny to me that he's blaming the front line salespeople. I agree with that somewhat, but aside from the design, the 900 didn't exactly blow anyone away with their mediocre camera quality & last gen screen/specs. But that's more Microsoft's fault.

    Also, whether you guys believe it or not, the lack of apps are a BIG deal to most people. I use basically all the platforms out there, and not having stuff on WP that I'm used to having on Android/iOS (like Instagram, Path, & higher quality apps overall that are updated frequently & not abandoned) is a real buzz kill.

    IMO, both MS & Nokia are screwing up. But MS more than Nokia.
    I'm sorry but I fail to see how all of this is supposedly Microsoft 's fault. Despite the campaign they did to educate salespeople there still were quite a few that sabotaged sales of WP devices.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jake_M View Post
    I don't really mind the lack of apps if the browser works, but my god the browser can't do ****.

    None of the websites usually recognize it as a mobile browser, and if they do the functionality is lost. I wouldn't mind not having apps if my browser could handle the main website, but it can't.
    That's because the site developers are coding with webkit in mind. If they used the generic html5 tags the sites would work better. It's not the browser at all and the desktop sites work as they do on the PC.

    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfang View Post
    Apps are very important. If WP7 had a lot of apps it will make up for the lack of features.
    What lack of features? Even iOS6 is now starting to provide features that WP has had since 2010.
    Quote Originally Posted by N8ter View Post
    Let's put it into perspective:

    Galaxy S II

    Announced 2011, February
    Status Available. Released 2011, April

    On AT&T (US Carriers always lag in availability of Samsung devices)

    Announced 2011, August
    Status Available. Released 2011, October

    Yes, WVGA was still common - even on newer devices in April 2011.

    Lumia 900

    Announced 2012, January
    Status Available. Released 2012, April

    So 1 year after GS2 launch, and 6 months after it came to AT&T Nokia wants to compete with:

    1. Old QC processor vs. the Exynos in the AT&T GS2
    2. A Worse Camera, and it only does 720p video instead of 1080p (IIRC, Correct me if I'm Wrong)
    3. A. 1.3 MP VGA FFC
    4. Barely a better screen, if better at all - Lower PPI due to screen size difference
    5. BT 2.1 vs 3.0+HS
    6. No WiFi Direct
    7. No NFC
    8. 512 MB vs. 1GB RAM
    9. No SD Card Slot
    10. [Subjective] WP7 instead of Android, when Ecosystems matter more now than ever

    The GSII is being eclipsed by the GS3 and you can't even buy it in AT&T corporate stores anymore (only the Skyrocket), but the Lumia is still there going strong with specs from 2 years ago.

    The only spec that the Lumia 900 bests is the fact that it has LTE (if we're disregarding the Skyrocket), 0.2" bigger screen (if we're disregarding the Skyrocket), and the fact that it's a WP7 device (which is entirely subjective). Oh, and it has a bigger battery (Again, if disregarding the Skyrocket).

    There is significant spec lag in the WP7 device ecosystem compared to Android and iOS.

    App issue has been discussed ad nauseum. There will always be those people who seriously think the browser is all they need. The Playbook fans on crackberry thought the same thing, and that didn't turn that device into a success.
    It's not about specs its more about the ecosystem and user experience which will change greatly when WP8 and when W8 tablets and PCs are released.
  24. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by N8ter View Post
    Let's put it into perspective:

    Galaxy S II

    Announced 2011, February
    Status Available. Released 2011, April

    On AT&T (US Carriers always lag in availability of Samsung devices)

    Announced 2011, August
    Status Available. Released 2011, October

    Yes, WVGA was still common - even on newer devices in April 2011.

    Lumia 900

    Announced 2012, January
    Status Available. Released 2012, April

    So 1 year after GS2 launch, and 6 months after it came to AT&T Nokia wants to compete with:

    1. Old QC processor vs. the Exynos in the AT&T GS2
    2. A Worse Camera, and it only does 720p video instead of 1080p (IIRC, Correct me if I'm Wrong)
    3. A. 1.3 MP VGA FFC
    4. Barely a better screen, if better at all - Lower PPI due to screen size difference
    5. BT 2.1 vs 3.0+HS
    6. No WiFi Direct
    7. No NFC
    8. 512 MB vs. 1GB RAM
    9. No SD Card Slot
    10. [Subjective] WP7 instead of Android, when Ecosystems matter more now than ever

    The GSII is being eclipsed by the GS3 and you can't even buy it in AT&T corporate stores anymore (only the Skyrocket), but the Lumia is still there going strong with specs from 2 years ago.

    The only spec that the Lumia 900 bests is the fact that it has LTE (if we're disregarding the Skyrocket), 0.2" bigger screen (if we're disregarding the Skyrocket), and the fact that it's a WP7 device (which is entirely subjective). Oh, and it has a bigger battery (Again, if disregarding the Skyrocket).

    There is significant spec lag in the WP7 device ecosystem compared to Android and iOS.

    App issue has been discussed ad nauseum. There will always be those people who seriously think the browser is all they need. The Playbook fans on crackberry thought the same thing, and that didn't turn that device into a success.
    I was using the GS2, which is still the top-selling device on my carrier, Bell, (Canada) as an example of a great-selling device with 800x480 resolution to demonstrate that most people don't care about pixel count as long as they can read the damn thing. One note of correction: the GS2 has the same size screen as the Lumia 900; 4.3", which means it also has the same pixel density, and therefore the 900 wins the screen contest due to ClearBlack. The Nexus was the device I used to demonstrate that many people don't care as much about a great camera, although I will concede its importance to more people than high rez.
  25. scottcraft's Avatar
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    #25  
    I think WP8 needs to be impressive for WP to start the growth it needs. By all rights I should switch to another platform after using an HTC Trophy for a year. Currently I'm on my third Trophy. The first broke right after Mango was release.It had some sort of antenna problem and wouldn't make calls. That one was replaced due to reboots after the 8107 update. The one I have now reboots. I absolutely love the os even though there are missing features, but this phone has hardware and software issues. Right now I would have a hard time recommending the Trophy to a Verizon customer. I know the apps will come with platform growth so that isn't an issue to me (even though there are apps I want that are on other platforms), but a phone with a large high-resolution display, top-notch camera and LTE are requirements. Please wow me Microsoft!
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