HTC beat Nokia at it's own game.

[Winterfang]

Screwing up in general. Bad sales, bad advertising, underwhelming devices.
The 8X and the 920 are kind of different to compared. They both have their pros and cons.

 

[selfcreation]

Just to let everyone know, I had a post on page two of this thread, it stated (maybe not exactly, but something like) "this thread is one of the worst that wpcentral has seen, and we even have a moderator posting his opinion as fact."

That post has been deleted by someone, I'm assuming a mod.

Really?

Yeah this was your post: ( im not the one that deleted it BTW )

** including the original post, this could be the worst thread ever on wpcentral; we've even got a mod speaking opinion as if it's fact...**

Why was my opinion though of as a fact? cause you decided to! . did i say it was a fact? no! , im just a regular JOE like every one else.the ONLY difference between me and you is that I spend more time filtering Insults ,spams, trolls and USELESS comments like yours that BRING nothing to the table.

Yeah, I'd imagine a message saying "you're all stupid, ESPECIALLY the moderator" wouldn't have a long life span.

hmm I hope its its AGAINST forum Rules.

Yeah, I just noticed another post by someone else in this thread that quoted the said mod's post and disagreed with it got deleted as well...

He dint disagree he trolled:

Deleted post: Seriously dude. You're a moderator. You really need to step away from the fray.

FYI: Being a MOD means nothing. aside from having to Filter your USELESS comments.

Apparently, there are now two rules in the community:

1) Thou shalt not criticize Nokia, ever, for any reason.
2) Moderators shall not participate in any discussion at all, unless it is to enforce #1.

this one hurt my head , are you serious? we dont Participate much cause we are to busy dealing with your OFF TOPIC , none related USELESS comments.

you could insult MS , NOkia , Samsung , HTC etc... for all I care , just dont troll like your doing by INSULT other members.


you guys are still fairly new ,I STRONGLY recommend you read the Forum rules.
http://forums.windowscentral.com/wpcentral-meta/announcements.htm


Specially this one:

Moderators: Do not post complaints about Moderators. Windows Phone Central has the highest regard for individuals who volunteer their time to be a moderator. Every day, our moderators read through hundreds of threads and posts, and all decisions by them are final. We trust that any action that a moderator takes will follow the above rules and guidelines. Please send a PM to a Moderator if you have questions about a locked or edited post/threads

 

[anon(5335877)]

Cristal_Planet everyone with an objective point of view knows Nokia is screwing up. Even Microsoft bailed out and appointed HTC as their flagship makers.

Wait, so first people complain about how everyone supports only Nokia and think that WP only needs Nokia to succeed, then Microsoft decides to support HTC as the face of WP8 (instead of playing favorites with Nokia) and now it turns into Microsoft bailed out of Nokia?

 

[anon(5335877)]

Screwing up in general. Bad sales, bad advertising, underwhelming devices.
The 8X and the 920 are kind of different to compared. They both have their pros and cons.

Bad sales? How much did the HTC Titan II sell?

I agree the advertising isn't that great, and their presentation isn't very exciting. But how can the Lumia be underwhelming? What did you expect, the 41MP sensor?

Oh wait, so how come for Nokia to be amazing they need that, but HTC puts in their standard 8MP sensor from the One X and it's amazing? I'm sorry, but that's just not fair.

 

[jmerrey]

Hey I'll add something constructive, please don't delete it!

I'm really not sure Nokia screwed up the launch. There is quite a buzz around the 920 in the general tech community. Yes, there is some much warranted criticism of the camera advertising screw up and lack of release date/price, but I have also seen quite a lot of positive press re: the 920 as well. Maybe it's a wp8 thing, but I haven't seen much mention of the ativ at all.

edit: btw I think we'll see some well deserved buzz around the htc devices as well

edit #2: woah! I mean WOW...

 

[Winterfang]

I agree the advertising isn't that great, and their presentation isn't very exciting. But how can the Lumia be underwhelming? What did you expect, the 41MP sensor?

 

[anon(5335877)]

Click to view quoted image

*sigh* Double standards.

 

[theefman]

I know it's not politically correct to say this, but criticism of Nokia isn't "hate," it's common sense.

Nokia has advanced itself -- with Microsoft's blessing -- as the "principal Windows Phone company." The undercurrent is "Noka = Windows Phone, Windows Phone = Nokia." Fans of Nokia insist that it -- and only it -- is a legitimate contender for showdowns involving Windows Phone and other ecosystems.

And frankly, that would be fine if Nokia was executing well.

But they're not.

Sales are plummeting. The stock is at penny-stock levels. The bonds are rated as "junk" (speculative) by ratings agencies. Just last quarter, they lost half a billion dollars, and this quarter is expected to be even worse. The Lumia 900 exclusive on AT&T only hit 30% of anticipated sales levels.

The big turnaround event was supposed to be the unveiling earlier this month, and that turned out to be one of the worst (if not the worst) unveilings in technology history (certainly in the mobile tech space). A total unmitigated disaster where the primary news wasn't the product (which itself had no solid launch or carrier information), but a scandal about a fabricated ad that called the product features themselves into question in the highest-profile media in the world.

If Nokia continues its current ways, there won't be a Nokia in 12 to 24 months. And that means "the primary Windows Phone carrier" will be out of business. The impact on those of us who use Windows Phone is thus incalculably bad. It would mean every article headline would say "Windows Phone's future in doubt as Nokia closes its doors."

I think even Microsoft recognizes this. That's why HTC is the "Signature Partner" for WP8. They're hedging their bets. If Nokia continues to fail, they need a big-selling partner to point to and say "Nokia is one partner among many, see, HTC is doing well."

If Nokia fans want the rest of us in WP-world to quiet down, tell Nokia to give us something tangible to be excited about. No more excuses.

In the mean time, we'll continue being excited by HTC's tangible and detailed explanation of how it intends to advance WP. There's no reason Nokia couldn't do the same. Coddling Nokia's incompetence isn't helping ANYONE.

And with all the negatives you try to pin on Nokia the biggest one was the fact that the OS they signed on for was basically nothing more than a stop-gap and yet they blew past each and every other WP OEM in a matter of months. Their stock price, lower sales were nothing to do with their execution with WP, but rather with their diminishing Symbian sales.

And now for the simple reason that Nokia had a below par conference, advertising fumble and no word on the apparent all important release date they are now seen as irrelevant. Well I think we will see that Pureview, wireless charging, accessories and Nokia's continued excellent support will see them continue as the premier WP device maker. Nothing revealed by any other WP OEM looks like it will change that.

 

[selfcreation]

Bad sales? How much did the HTC Titan II sell?

I agree the advertising isn't that great, and their presentation isn't very exciting. But how can the Lumia be underwhelming? What did you expect, the 41MP sensor?

Oh wait, so how come for Nokia to be amazing they need that, but HTC puts in their standard 8MP sensor from the One X and it's amazing? I'm sorry, but that's just not fair.

Nokai is Not really underwhelming , but are just over rated, people praise nokia like they SAVED or MADE WP, witch is simply not true!

Im pretty sure (not stating a fact) that Samsung was the most sold WP to begin with.

Nokia was given MILLIONS of $$ from Microsoft witch allowed them to Market their phones more and to BUY exclusivity with Developers (fact) ,

im sur if MS gave MILLIONS of $$ to HTC and Samsung you would see more marketing from them as well. (opinion)

And honeslty All Nokia has going for them right now is a superior Camera witch simply does not appeal to me cause my 1000$ camera on my desk is WAAAY better then any thing a phone could ever offer me!

it honestly all come down to preference , the rest of the specs on ALL other WP are VERY similar because MS has SPECIFIC guide lines to what a WP hardware can have!

 

[theefman]

Nokai is Not really underwhelming , but are just over rated, people praise nokia like they SAVED or MADE WP, witch is simply not true!

Im pretty sure (not stating a fact) that Samsung was the most sold WP to begin with.

Nokia was given MILLIONS of $$ from Microsoft witch allowed them to Market their phones more (fact) , im sur if MS gave MILLIONS of $$ to HTC and Samsung you would see more marketing from them as well. (opinion)

And honeslty All Nokia has going for them right now is a superior Camera witch simply does not appeal to me cause my 1000$ camera on my desk is WAAAY better then any thing a phone could ever offer me!

it honestly all come down to preference , the rest of the specs on ALL other WP are VERY similar because MS has SPECIFIC guide lines to what a WP hardware can have!

What do you think the WP marketshare would be like today without Nokia? They have the biggest share of WP devices sold today, without that WP would be counted in the 1% still. Or have we forgotten all the promos and launches they've done over the last 9 months?

And yes, they have a deal with MS that gets them some financial compenstaion. Benefit of that is that ALL WP8 devices will have Nokia Drive. What is the contribution of any other OEM to the WP platform?

*sigh* Double standards.

It's gotten quite a bit apple-esque around here, first the 920's size and weight werent a problem when comparing to the iphone 5 and all the Nokia advantages were detailed, now all of a sudden its a deal breaker and Nokia brings nothing to the table. Strange, huh? :dry

 

[Big Supes]

Cristal_Planet everyone with an objective point of view knows Nokia is screwing up. Even Microsoft bailed out and appointed HTC as their flagship makers.

Bring me up to speed, dude! When did this happen, and how?

 

[theefman]

Bring me up to speed, dude! When did this happen, and how?

Must have been Joe Belfiore's clone at the Nokia conference.

 

[anon(5335877)]

Windows Phone 8X by HTC has a 4.3-inch display and Beats, launches early November | The Verge

HTC is unveiling its flagship Windows Phone 8 handset today, the Windows Phone 8X. The branding might sound Microsoft-like, but there's a good reason for that — the two companies have joined forces on a marketing campaign that will make HTC the face of Windows Phone 8. HTC's 8X device is a fresh approach to a Windows Phone device from the company, one that was designed from scratch according to HTC's Graham Wheeler. "The designers actually took inspiration from the Start Screen and actually a live tile, they thought about a live tile and how that would look if that was actually a physical something you hold."

 

[selfcreation]

What do you think the WP marketshare would be like today without Nokia? They have the biggest share of WP devices sold today, without that WP would be counted in the 1% still. Or have we forgotten all the promos and launches they've done over the last 9 months?

And yes, they have a deal with MS that gets them some financial compenstaion. Benefit of that is that ALL WP8 devices will have Nokia Drive. What is the contribution of any other OEM to the WP platform?

I think WP would be where it is. if MS dint give cash to NOKIA they would have given it to an other OEM. witch would of been able to use that cash to the SAME THING Nokia`s has been doing.

Keep in MIND Nokia was about o declare bankruptcy before MS saved them, so how do you Think Nokia did so much advertising? with Microsoft`s CASH!. and the marketing over the last 9month, they dint really have a choice unless they planed to Closed their doors.....

so no I didnt forget that Nokia is alive because of MS,

All OEM`s have their OWN marketplace that you can get exclusive apps in, The Only reason we are getting NOKIA Drive is cause MS gave them cash to develop it and then said we are talking it for the OS. lol

Not to Mention MS gave Nokia Special treatment with the WP OS , they are the ONLY OEM allowed to play with the core of the OS!

 

[anon(5335877)]

I think WP would be where it is. if MS dint give cash to NOKIA they would have given to an other OEM. witch would of been able to use that cash to the SAME THING Nokia`s has been doing.

Keep in MIND Nokia was about o declare bankruptcy before MS saved them, so how do you Think Nokia did so much advertising? with Microsoft`s CASH!. and the marketing over the last 9month, they dint really have a choice unless they planed to Closed their doors.....

so no I dint forget that Nokia is alive because of MS,

All OEM`s have their OWN marketplace that you can get exclusive apps in, The Only reason we are getting NOKIA Drive is cause MS gave them cash to develop it and then said we are talking it for the OS. lol

Not to Mention MS gave Nokia Special treatment with the WP OS , they are the ONLY OEM allowed to play witht he core of the OS!

I don't think they would have given it to another OEM, because Samsung and HTC don't seem to be in the same position that Nokia is in.

I thought Nokia already had Nokia Drive, it was just for Symbian. It's not like they had to make something entirely new.

 

[selfcreation]

I don't think they would have given it to another OEM, because Samsung and HTC don't seem to be in the same position that Nokia is in.

I thought Nokia already had Nokia Drive, it was just for Symbian. It's not like they had to make something entirely new.

you right ,

but I think we are getting NOKIA drive because of the partner ship.

I think IF MS had a deal with HTC and Samsung ( witch probably wouldn't happen )

The WP OS would have beats Audio from HTC ( on all phone)
The WP OS would also have Face recognition from Samsung ( on all phone)

maybe,

witch to me would be more useful then Nokia Drive witch is just an other GPS app , not like we dont have like 5+ of them in the marketplace. :happy:

 

[theefman]

I think WP would be where it is. if MS dint give cash to NOKIA they would have given it to an other OEM. witch would of been able to use that cash to the SAME THING Nokia`s has been doing.

Keep in MIND Nokia was about o declare bankruptcy before MS saved them, so how do you Think Nokia did so much advertising? with Microsoft`s CASH!. and the marketing over the last 9month, they dint really have a choice unless they planed to Closed their doors.....

so no I didnt forget that Nokia is alive because of MS,

All OEM`s have their OWN marketplace that you can get exclusive apps in, The Only reason we are getting NOKIA Drive is cause MS gave them cash to develop it and then said we are talking it for the OS. lol

Not to Mention MS gave Nokia Special treatment with the WP OS , they are the ONLY OEM allowed to play with the core of the OS!

Microsoft saved them from bankruptcy? Did I miss that? When exactly did this happen? And why would MS do this when they werent even making WP devices then? And Nokia had another OS they could have gone with so there's no telling how their fortunes would have turned out if they hadnt gone with an OS that was not competitive.

And you would think that with all that history with HTC they would have been first in line to get that cash, but they werent. Microsoft approached Nokia and they struck a deal, its not as if Nokia is just there getting some free cash every quarter.

And you do know that Drive was available for Symbian before MS came along, dont you? And that now that valuable asset will now be on every WP8 device?

And why do you think Nokia is the only OEM allowed to modify the OS? Why not HTC or Samsung? Why would MS pay them and then also allow them to modify the OS?

I strongly disagree that WP would be where it is, if MS would have given the cash to any other OEM they would have done it before Nokia came along. Without them we would have been condemned to devices with no imagination for the life of WP7.

witch to me would be more useful then Nokia Drive witch is just an other GPS app , not like we dont have like 5+ of them in the marketplace. :happy:

How many of those are free and provide offline navigation in over 100 countries?

 

[Big Supes]

I think WP would be where it is. if MS dint give cash to NOKIA they would have given it to an other OEM. witch would of been able to use that cash to the SAME THING Nokia`s has been doing.

Keep in MIND Nokia was about o declare bankruptcy before MS saved them, so how do you Think Nokia did so much advertising? with Microsoft`s CASH!. and the marketing over the last 9month, they dint really have a choice unless they planed to Closed their doors.....

so no I didnt forget that Nokia is alive because of MS,

All OEM`s have their OWN marketplace that you can get exclusive apps in, The Only reason we are getting NOKIA Drive is cause MS gave them cash to develop it and then said we are talking it for the OS. lol

Not to Mention MS gave Nokia Special treatment with the WP OS , they are the ONLY OEM allowed to play with the core of the OS!

Forgive me if I'm wrong, dude, but I didn't think Nokia were anywhere near declaring bankrupt before hopping into bed with MS. I was of the understanding that Nokia was on the slippery slope, MS offered a way back, and Nokia took it. They still had to streamline the business by selling off various assets and cutting down on staff to really push WP forward.

IMO, Nokia could have adopted Android. Knocked out the Lumia series with dual-cores, running ICS, and made a mint. They could be competing with Samsung for top spot by now...

 

[Winterfang]

*sigh* Double standards.

How come? Nokia has the best phone camera, this camera is enough to differentiate from the other oems. They didn't put it on Windows Phone.

Now the 8X came out and suddenly the 920 looks antiquated. I said it before, Nokia hides ugly designs in bright colors, this phone looks great and offers colors.

It doesn't represent the best HTC has to offer neither in terms of specs but it was made from the ground up with Windows Phone in mind, something I've being asking for a long time.

The 8X design didn't came from Android or Meego, it was done for Windows Phone. It looks great, is light, is fresh. It had people talking, and to be honest, the name HTC looks more appealing than Nokia. Which has done nothing for Microsoft in the states. ( it has worldwide though)

 

[selfcreation]

Microsoft saved them from bankruptcy? Did I miss that? When exactly did this happen? And why would MS do this when they werent even making WP devices then? And Nokia had another OS they could have gone with so there's no telling how their fortunes would have turned out if they hadnt gone with an OS that was not competitive.

And you would think that with all that history with HTC they would have been first in line to get that cash, but they werent. Microsoft approached Nokia and they struck a deal, its not as if Nokia is just there getting some free cash every quarter.

And you do know that Drive was available for Symbian before MS came along, dont you? And that now that valuable asset will now be on every WP8 device?

And why do you think Nokia is the only OEM allowed to modify the OS? Why not HTC or Samsung? Why would MS pay them and then also allow them to modify the OS?

I strongly disagree that WP would be where it is, if MS would have given the cash to any other OEM they would have done it before Nokia came along. Without them we would have been condemned to devices with no imagination for the life of WP7.

about 2 years ago ( when they made the deal with MS )

the OS Nokia had where doing horrible! why do you think MS approached NOKIA in the first place? .. lol ,

they where closing ALL store and falling FAST, and stocks plummeted , Nokia Shares have only started to grow over the last 2-3 months. thanks to what you think? mego and synbian? no way ,

HTC and Samsung dint need MS`s cash! maybe they did get approached and refused the deal, we dont know.

Yes I know Nokia drive was arround before WP , but what I was trying to say ( corrected it in he next post ) is that the ONLY reason we got Nokia drive on ALL WP was cause of the MS/Nokia partnership. do you think Nokia is happy that HTC and Samsung is gona have NOKIA drive on their phones? lol

I dont agree with this:

Without them we would have been condemned to devices with no imagination for the life of WP7.

What imagination did NOKIA bring to WP7? Cya colour with carbon fiber casing?