1. baileystein's Avatar
    I randomly look up high resolution photos of windows phones (yes) and just observe them.

    I noticed something interesting today. The lockscreen. I attached the image below for visual reference.

    Notice the notification center? No. You do not slide down from the top. You look at the bottom.

    So the "detailed" spot is where your favorite app is (or most important by choice). In this example, calendar is the detailed spot. So you just got notified with your next appointment.

    And people complaining that it isn't the same: This is much more organized than the notification system in android. My tablet gets filled quite easily. (Don't worry, surface is on it's way :)

    It also shows the amount of Skype calls you missed, email, and...an AP notification.

    I'm guessing it stands for the Associated Press. Maybe it would let you know when there is a new story?


    AND WHAT ABOUT THE START SCREEN FOR CRYING OUT LOUD? And that isn't good enough?

    #JustSayin'
    brmiller1976 likes this.
    10-28-2012 07:21 PM
  2. brmiller1976's Avatar
    The main complainers about notification centers are people being passive aggressive and complaining that Windows isn't like iOS or Android. It is like a Windows user complaining that Mac OS X doesn't have a taskbar, or that Android lacks live tiles.
    10-28-2012 09:11 PM
  3. thed's Avatar
    No, my complaint is not that WP isn't like iOS or Android. My complaint is that there is no way to see toasts that you missed. I don't see how the new lock screen changes that.

    Sent from my HTC Trophy using Board Express
    10-28-2012 10:15 PM
  4. Xsever's Avatar
    Pressing on those notification icons should display more info about them.

    #featurerequest
    Getintothegame likes this.
    10-28-2012 10:27 PM
  5. manicottiK's Avatar
    thed is right, the thing that's missing is a way to view toast notifications that were missed. Such a listing isn't a notification center in the Android or iOS sense (which is good for me because I don't want their notification center) since it would only log toasts. Live Tiles aren't an alternative because they act as a counter or small display and can't tell me which toasts I missed.

    I'll give you an example use case. I'm the developer behind the WP7 version of DrexelOne Mobile, a portal for our students, faculty, and staff. (We also have iOS, Android, and Blackberry builds and did have webOS until HP killed it.) If a student so chooses, Drexel will send a toast out to them as grades are posted, holds are placed on their records, their DragonCard balance runs low, etc. The live tile can show the count of how many alerts there have been, but not which type. As things exist today, toasts that are missed and simply lost.

    A toast log could show the list of missed toasts and tapping one of them could launch the app and bring the student directly to the correct page (grades, holds, DragonCard, etc). An unattractive alternative is to build such logging into server-side components and for the client-side app to then poll the list on start-up. This denies the user a quick-look capability and requires every developer to modifiy both the client- and server-side apps.

    The current lack of a toast log requires users to dedicte a tile for every app of interest rather than just the apps of high-interest and it requires developers to implement live tiles as well as toasts when toasts alone are all that is needed.
    nizzon, AngryNil, thed and 4 others like this.
    10-29-2012 09:59 AM
  6. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
    I agree. People are putting false words in the mouth of people who don't agree about the way things works. That "new" lock screen has been discussed for a while now.

    A simple solution, as stated 10000000 before, would be to allow the toast notification to stay up until they are dismissed.
    No, my complaint is not that WP isn't like iOS or Android. My complaint is that there is no way to see toasts that you missed. I don't see how the new lock screen changes that.

    Sent from my HTC Trophy using Board Express
    thed and doublebullout like this.
    10-29-2012 10:11 AM
  7. rkgriffin's Avatar
    A simple solution, as stated 10000000 before, would be to allow the toast notification to stay up until they are dismissed.
    I would hate that unless there was an option to turn it off. I hate things in any OS that sit there until I do something with them. Half the time I would just dismiss them to get rid of it so to continue with what I was doing. This means I just end up missing them in a way.

    The simple solution is to have a live tile that shows the number of toasts you currently have unchecked and when you click on the live tile it opens up a toast log. Very simple.
    10-29-2012 12:40 PM
  8. power5's Avatar
    thed is right, the thing that's missing is a way to view toast notifications that were missed. Such a listing isn't a notification center in the Android or iOS sense (which is good for me because I don't want their notification center) since it would only log toasts. Live Tiles aren't an alternative because they act as a counter or small display and can't tell me which toasts I missed.

    I'll give you an example use case. I'm the developer behind the WP7 version of DrexelOne Mobile, a portal for our students, faculty, and staff. (We also have iOS, Android, and Blackberry builds and did have webOS until HP killed it.) If a student so chooses, Drexel will send a toast out to them as grades are posted, holds are placed on their records, their DragonCard balance runs low, etc. The live tile can show the count of how many alerts there have been, but not which type. As things exist today, toasts that are missed and simply lost.

    A toast log could show the list of missed toasts and tapping one of them could launch the app and bring the student directly to the correct page (grades, holds, DragonCard, etc). An unattractive alternative is to build such logging into server-side components and for the client-side app to then poll the list on start-up. This denies the user a quick-look capability and requires every developer to modifiy both the client- and server-side apps.

    The current lack of a toast log requires users to dedicte a tile for every app of interest rather than just the apps of high-interest and it requires developers to implement live tiles as well as toasts when toasts alone are all that is needed.
    Sorry, but as a developer, why can't you create a pivot inside your app that lists the toasts? You get a number on the lock screen and on the live tile. Missed the toast? Click the tile to see them. Isn't the server already being used to push out the toast? Why cant the app log that as a background task? There is no quick look if ALL toasts are placed into a notification drawer. The toast will not really show any less text than a notification center would. Some toasts may be a couple words, some app toasts may be a lot more. I know that my FB app keeps notifications long after I have viewed them in some other way. I would hate to have a notification center that did not clear if I was in FB and read the notification before seeing it in the notification center. I would have to clear it again. That is just as annoying to me as missing a toast and the apps not keeping that info in my app someplace.

    I love that someone is creating apps for such a small user group and for WP. That is great. Push the platform by showing other developers how much can be done with WP instead of just being frustrated at functions not available in the OS. Use what it can do better.
    10-29-2012 01:27 PM
  9. DrewT3's Avatar
    Sorry, but as a developer, why can't you create a pivot inside your app that lists the toasts? You get a number on the lock screen and on the live tile. Missed the toast? Click the tile to see them. Isn't the server already being used to push out the toast? Why cant the app log that as a background task? There is no quick look if ALL toasts are placed into a notification drawer. The toast will not really show any less text than a notification center would. Some toasts may be a couple words, some app toasts may be a lot more. I know that my FB app keeps notifications long after I have viewed them in some other way. I would hate to have a notification center that did not clear if I was in FB and read the notification before seeing it in the notification center. I would have to clear it again. That is just as annoying to me as missing a toast and the apps not keeping that info in my app someplace.

    I love that someone is creating apps for such a small user group and for WP. That is great. Push the platform by showing other developers how much can be done with WP instead of just being frustrated at functions not available in the OS. Use what it can do better.
    As a user, there are apps that I want to get notifications from but I don't want to waste one of my five lockscreen slots or a visible live tile spot for. For example, I get messages once in a while on WhatsApp, but otherwise don't want to have it taking up space on my screen. A catch-all notification tile that shows all the toasts would be a fine solution.
    nizzon likes this.
    10-29-2012 01:41 PM
  10. thed's Avatar
    Sorry, but as a developer, why can't you create a pivot inside your app that lists the toasts? You get a number on the lock screen and on the live tile. Missed the toast? Click the tile to see them. Isn't the server already being used to push out the toast? Why cant the app log that as a background task? There is no quick look if ALL toasts are placed into a notification drawer. The toast will not really show any less text than a notification center would. Some toasts may be a couple words, some app toasts may be a lot more. I know that my FB app keeps notifications long after I have viewed them in some other way. I would hate to have a notification center that did not clear if I was in FB and read the notification before seeing it in the notification center. I would have to clear it again. That is just as annoying to me as missing a toast and the apps not keeping that info in my app someplace.

    I love that someone is creating apps for such a small user group and for WP. That is great. Push the platform by showing other developers how much can be done with WP instead of just being frustrated at functions not available in the OS. Use what it can do better.
    But that doesn't fix the problem from a UX standpoint. The point of a toast is to give a quick bit of information about something, so the user can decide if it's important enough to open the app and check it out in more detail. Just having a number doesn't provide any information. Forcing the user to open the app just to read toasts is missing the point.
    10-29-2012 01:50 PM
  11. Major's Avatar
    Notifications are a big deal. My theory is that MS is reticent to include a notification center because it wants to coerce developers into utilizing live tiles more. There are a couple of problems with that approach. First, an app needs to be pinned to the Start screen in order to receive live tile notifications. Second, live tiles don't always work. A notification center at the OS level would solve all that, but they probably think that it will make developers lazy and turn tiles into plain old icons, negating a signature feature.
    10-29-2012 04:11 PM
  12. aubreyq's Avatar
    I agree. People are putting false words in the mouth of people who don't agree about the way things works. That "new" lock screen has been discussed for a while now.

    A simple solution, as stated 10000000 before, would be to allow the toast notification to stay up until they are dismissed.
    Notifications are a big deal. My theory is that MS is reticent to include a notification center because it wants to coerce developers into utilizing live tiles more. There are a couple of problems with that approach. First, an app needs to be pinned to the Start screen in order to receive live tile notifications. Second, live tiles don't always work. A notification center at the OS level would solve all that, but they probably think that it will make developers lazy and turn tiles into plain old icons, negating a signature feature.
    Looks like we shouldn't hold our collective breaths and give up on this notification request, huh?
    1jaxstate1 likes this.
    10-29-2012 04:14 PM
  13. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
    I'd take that too. Anything!
    I would hate that unless there was an option to turn it off. I hate things in any OS that sit there until I do something with them. Half the time I would just dismiss them to get rid of it so to continue with what I was doing. This means I just end up missing them in a way.

    The simple solution is to have a live tile that shows the number of toasts you currently have unchecked and when you click on the live tile it opens up a toast log. Very simple.
    10-29-2012 04:14 PM
  14. 1jaxstate1's Avatar
    Whatever became of that website MS put up asking "What would you like to see" that popped up. LOL. Probably get a 404 error now.
    Looks like we shouldn't hold our collective breaths and give up on this notification request, huh?
    10-29-2012 04:20 PM
  15. aubreyq's Avatar
    Whatever became of that website MS put up asking "What would you like to see" that popped up. LOL. Probably get a 404 error now.
    LOL! Probably.
    10-29-2012 04:26 PM
  16. Landsharkk's Avatar
    As a user, there are apps that I want to get notifications from but I don't want to waste one of my five lockscreen slots or a visible live tile spot for. For example, I get messages once in a while on WhatsApp, but otherwise don't want to have it taking up space on my screen. A catch-all notification tile that shows all the toasts would be a fine solution.
    Maybe this has been mentioned already, but using the new WP8 notification/lock screen, couldn't a developer create an app that grouped notifications together to be displayed on the lock screen?
    10-29-2012 04:40 PM
  17. AngryNil's Avatar
    Sorry, but as a developer, why can't you create a pivot inside your app that lists the toasts?
    So I should open every app that pushed a toast to me to view it?

    That defeats the entire purpose.
    10-29-2012 05:08 PM
  18. manicottiK's Avatar
    as a developer, why can't you create a pivot inside your app that lists the toasts? ... Isn't the server already being used to push out the toast? Why can't the app log that as a background task?
    There are two ideas in your message: 1) that logging the alerts should be an app responsibility, and 2) that there's no need to expose that log outside of the apps themselves. Let me address these one at a time.

    1. Apps aren't notified of incoming* toasts or tile updates and thus can't log them. If a toast is tapped, the app is launched, but the app doesn't know that it was launched because of a toast (unless the toast included a launch argument, a feature that became available with Mango.)

    The server-side of an app could log toasts on its side, create a new web service API for the client app to request that list, and update the app to make that call. But that makes every developer repeat a lot of the same work when the more efficient alternative is to have MS make toast logging a basic service of the OS that's automatically available to all apps and simplifies client- and server-side development and that makes the Windows Phone platform more attractive to develop for.

    2. Even having an app-accessible toast logging service available in the phone isn't ideal because it would still require that users pin all apps that might send toasts AND that the server-side of all such apps also send updated tiles at the same time so that tile counts can be updated. Without both of these, users wouldn't know which apps had missed toasts logged. So, it still requires client- and server-side upates to apps, all to close a gap that Windows Phone has relative to the other platforms.

    Having said all of that, I understand that most folks don't have much of a need for such a feature. Of those who do, only a subset want a "missed toast" app or an Android/iOS-style notification center. This is likely why MS prioritized it where they did and why we don't yet have such a thing.

    * Note that tiles updated locally through background tasks or tile schedules are different, but create the same basic problem of pushing the work from the center where it can be done once by MS to the edges where it has to be done repeatedly.
    10-29-2012 05:34 PM
  19. Getintothegame's Avatar
    Man. I like the ideas, they're pretty simple, too. What about swiping left at the start menu to bring up previous notifications?
    10-29-2012 06:06 PM
  20. AngryNil's Avatar
    Man. I like the ideas, they're pretty simple, too. What about swiping left at the start menu to bring up previous notifications?
    I think this is the best solution, and if they want to leverage Nokia's Harmattan UI, they can include some social features in there too.
    10-30-2012 01:27 AM
  21. blehblehbleh's Avatar
    Well in the mean time everyone can pick their most important app to show detailed info for on the lock screen.
    10-30-2012 05:41 AM
  22. nizzon's Avatar
    And picking that app will be easy... oh wait, no it wont. :/
    10-30-2012 06:45 AM
  23. blehblehbleh's Avatar
    And picking that app will be easy... oh wait, no it wont. :/
    Then you got probs mang
    10-30-2012 04:30 PM
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