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  1. peterh226's Avatar
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       #1  
    I'm having a lot of problems navigating sites with drop down menus. Walmart.com, Lowes.com and many other sites... When you click on the menu, the drop down appears but does not stay visible so you can pick a sub-menu item. For my wife this was a show stopper. These sites work fine on the iPhone.
    Am I missing something here? It really makes it hard to surf a lot of sites.

    Thanks for any comments.
    Lumia 920
  2. Tyresian's Avatar
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    #2  
    Normally when you click on a drop down it will bring up a special full screen list view selector.

    I cannot tell you why you aren't seeing this. Provide a link directly to a page that has it for people to test?
  3. peterh226's Avatar
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       #3  
    Try Walmart.com: Save money. Live better.

    Over at the left, if you click "Electronics & Office" or any of these, once you hold long enough for the pull down to appear, as soon as you move over to click one, it goes away.

    I'm seeing comments about lots of other sites as well with this problem.
  4. jposthauer's Avatar
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    #4  
    You have to click it really really fast....that's a feature.
  5. peterh226's Avatar
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       #5  
    I think it might work on slow phones, but the 920 does not give me a chance. After playing with this and surfing, my wife wants an iPhone 5...

    I'm just trying to figure out how people are not going nuts about this one.
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  6. allos autos's Avatar
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    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by peterh226 View Post
    I'm having a lot of problems navigating sites with drop down menus. Walmart.com, Lowes.com and many other sites... When you click on the menu, the drop down appears but does not stay visible so you can pick a sub-menu item. For my wife this was a show stopper. These sites work fine on the iPhone.
    Am I missing something here? It really makes it hard to surf a lot of sites.

    Thanks for any comments.
    Lumia 920
    Have you tried putting the browser into desktop mode? I have the same problem with some sites (granted I'm using IE9), and switching to desktop mode has always fixed it.
  7. peterh226's Avatar
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       #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by allos autos View Post
    Have you tried putting the browser into desktop mode? I have the same problem with some sites (granted I'm using IE9), and switching to desktop mode has always fixed it.
    Not here. Both Desktop and Mobile fail when trying to pick the submenu.
  8. allos autos's Avatar
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    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by peterh226 View Post
    Not here. Both Desktop and Mobile fail when trying to pick the submenu.
    I just realized the browser on my Surface does the same thing. Time to do some information gathering myself. In the meantime: Walmart.com: All Departments
    weespeed8 likes this.
  9. Filipe Martins's Avatar
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    #9  
    I confirm I have this problem on Surface RT and WP8.

    It looks like the equivalent of 'hovering' the mouse behaviour isn't being replicated properly on IE10. I have had several discussions with Surface RT and they acknowledge this is happening and are looking into it. I have been on the phone everyday to keep them on their toes but the highest number of people that do that the quicker they will sort out the patch.

    The only thing I haven't been able to test is whether this happens on a touchscreen running Win8 (my laptop isn't touch enabled unfortunately...)

    I am yet to call WP8 support to do the same... The work around it at the moment on my surface is to use the trackpad to hover the mouse, let the drop-down menu open and then touch the relevant link.

    I am starting to get a bit frustrated I've got to confess... This is basic java programming... to add to the **** up that SSL authentication tick box doesn't shown when connecting with ActiveSync on the mail app and I am struggling to recommend the Windows solution for general implementation at my company.

    Please get on the phones to the Surface and WP8 support to get them to look into the issue, the more the merrier.
  10. socialcarpet's Avatar
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    #10  
    Either web developers start testing their websites for IE10 mobile compatibility, or we get more standards compliant browsers like Opera, Firefox or Chrome on Windows Phone.

    Unfortunately until one or both of those things happens, this is going to be a recurring story.
  11. ace182's Avatar
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    #11  
    I have the same problem on both my Surface and my WP8 (Lumia 920). And the worst of it is one of the sites I need is for work and I cant use it so Im back on my laptop to try and get acces to the site. They need to fix this ASAP. Makes the browser unusable on some sites.
  12. MKIVGTIVR6's Avatar
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    #12  
    I wish we had other major browsers on our OS.. I love the way chrome handles tabs on android and ios...
  13. wingcutter's Avatar
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    #13  
    Same issue on my 920. I am stunned by MS' stupitity. I am loving my 920 dispite WP8 early adopter issues, but this is enough to drive me crazy... Enough to drive me back to my old phone.
  14. pankaj981's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by wingcutter View Post
    Same issue on my 920. I am stunned by MS' stupitity. I am loving my 920 dispite WP8 early adopter issues, but this is enough to drive me crazy... Enough to drive me back to my old phone.
    Dont blame MS here...its a practice in web development to test rendering of sites on different browsers before pushing them for use. The site is not yet optimized for mobile IE and Walmart needs to fix it. Not MS unless its a issue with the browser not following standards, which I highly doubt
  15. manicottiK's Avatar
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    #15  
    The issue is that MS is doing the right "computer" thing and that Apple is doing the right "user" thing.

    When WebKit sees a mouseover/hover attribute on an HTML element, it translates the first tap event into a mouseover event and the second tap to a click event. IE (8, 9, 10, desktop, tablet, phone) all treat a tap as a tap. (I don't know what Firefox and Opera do. Chrome is WebKit-based, so it probably does the same thing that Safari does.)
  16. socialcarpet's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by pankaj981 View Post
    Dont blame MS here...its a practice in web development to test rendering of sites on different browsers before pushing them for use. The site is not yet optimized for mobile IE and Walmart needs to fix it. Not MS unless its a issue with the browser not following standards, which I highly doubt
    I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for web devs to go out of their way to update their sites to work with an OS that is only on 2-3% of the smartphones out there.

    The real answer is Microsoft needs to allow us to have a WebKit browser too, for situations such as this.
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  17. manicottiK's Avatar
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    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by socialcarpet View Post
    I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for web devs to go out of their way to update their sites to work with an OS that is only on 2-3% of the smartphones out there.
    This won't be a 2-3% issue for long: Windows 8 Pro and RT both have the same issue. Site developers will fix their code to be touch aware or lose access to far more users. The market will drive the fix.

    WebKit already works with touch because it "lies" to the underlying JavaScript about what actually happened. (Note, I think that they made the right decision here -- there were no standards upon which to base any action and the one that they chose made the most sense to users.) There is a touch standard being considered (submitted by MS, I think). WebKit should adopt it and developers should code for it, without chucking their existing support for non-touch (and by extension for fake-touch) browers.
  18. socialcarpet's Avatar
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    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by manicottiK View Post
    This won't be a 2-3% issue for long: Windows 8 Pro and RT both have the same issue. Site developers will fix their code to be touch aware or lose access to far more users. The market will drive the fix.
    I hope you are right, but I think even with the best possible conditions, we will see at best 10...MAYBE 15% marketshare within two years. This is assuming Microsoft keeps pressing developers and addresses the shortcomings of the OS promptly, Nokia sticks around and keeps making great phones and all goes well.

    I don't think some people appreciate just how hard it is to gain marketshare when people have been firmly invested in one platform for years. As great as Windows Phone is, it still doesn't have many killer features that will convince massive numbers of people to defect from their OS of choice.

    I do think we will see steady growth, but like I said, 5-10% growth over two years is optimistic, that would be a substantial increase over the LAST two years.

    Developers and websites are not going to really care about making stuff 100% compatible and catering to us in large numbers until we have something more like 25%+ marketshare and I think thats at least 3 years away.

    As for Windows RT, if the current tablet sales numbers are any indication, I don't think it will be any help at all in getting people to adapt to mobile IE.

    The short term answer for us is still a WebKit browser alternative for Windows Phone, unless you want to wait 2-3 years to be able to view the non-mobile versions of every single website and be able to know with confidence you can operate almost any drop down menu on a site.

    I know I don't want to wait 2-3 years+ while Microsoft stubbornly tries to make mobile IE and Bing stick. Give us some $#$%*@ options.
  19. socialcarpet's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by pankaj981 View Post
    Dont blame MS here...its a practice in web development to test rendering of sites on different browsers before pushing them for use. The site is not yet optimized for mobile IE and Walmart needs to fix it. Not MS unless its a issue with the browser not following standards, which I highly doubt
    Asking them to test it on mobile IE is like asking them to test it for Netscape 3.0 ... You have to realize, outside our little bubble here almost NO ONE uses this browser. If they run some stats on their website, they are going to see 1.2% of visitors running mobile IE and they are not going to give a sh**.
  20. manicottiK's Avatar
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    #20  
    IE 10 on my ThinkPad with Windows 8 and a touchscreen handles touches exactly the same way that Win RT and WP8 do. As Win8/IE10 gain share, developers will make changes. We've already done this at http://drexel.edu, but you can't really see it on the phone because the design is responsive and falls into a mobile layout, just as it does for Android and iPhone. Others will follow us.

    That said, unless Win8 grows quickly and drives people to touchscreens, the programmers will follow later rather than sooner.

    SocialCarpet is right that market share changes slowly in the mobile world. Our mobile app, which is used only by our students, faculty, and staff, is available on four platforms (and was also available for webOS). Looking at our downloads, WP represents under 3%, and it's growing in at the expense of BB, but iOS or Android. Still, it's growing rather than shrinking...
  21. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by socialcarpet View Post
    The short term answer for us is still a WebKit browser alternative for Windows Phone, unless you want to wait 2-3 years to be able to view the non-mobile versions of every single website and be able to know with confidence you can operate almost any drop down menu on a site.
    You're still confused about what your preferred solution would actually incur.

    Your short term solution would remove the last thing that has any chance of motivating developers to ensure their websites are standards compliant. Your short term solution would further reduce the number of non-WebKit based browsers on the mobile web, further postponing the point at which developers decide to start testing their mobile sites with something other than just a WebKit browser (IE, Firefox, Opera or any other non-WebKit based browser will do). The chance that this point in time is postponed indefinitely is rather large, effectively putting Google (and to a far lesser degree Apple) in charge of web standards.

    The only answer that protects the mobile web from falling into the jurisdiction of a single company is to restrict WP to only using IE, while jumping all over the websites that can't develop standards compliant web pages... like Walmart (call them, write them, ridicule them on their forums). This is just a further example of the quick and easy path not being the better one.
    Last edited by a5cent; 12-30-2012 at 08:03 PM.
  22. socialcarpet's Avatar
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    #22  
    I don't really care about the future of IE or being a part of some browser crusade. The truth is we can all send angry emails to web developers until our fingers fall off. It won't make a damn bit of difference until mobile IE makes up a significant percentage of the visitors to these sites, say 30% or more and even the most optimistic but REALISTIC view doesn't have that happening for years.

    I get what you are saying, in terms of, if MS gives in and people use alternative browsers then web devs will really never have any reason to change... But do I want to sit here with a cocked up browsing experience praying that WP and RT get enough market share to motivate developers to make the needed changes.

    I don't care how they go about it, if it's WebKit or Opera or what, but I want an equal browsing experience to someone on an iPad or iPhone and I don't want to wait 3 years for a market share miracle to make it a reality. I'd be willing to bet most of the rest of us don't either.

    Microsoft needs to allow non-Trident based browsers on Windows Phone and Windows RT and let nature take it's course.

    In my opinion, they are delivering a sub par end-user experience by locking us into IE, not to mention a damn hard-coded Bing button.

    I love Windows Phone, but I'm not so much of a zealot that I want to endure a browser that's out of sync with 20% of the internet so Microsoft can try to win the browser wars once again. I'm not so much of a zealot that I am kidding myself into thinking that Windows Phone and RT are going to tip the mobile world on its axis and have iPhone or Android like market share. If that were to happen, it will take years and Microsoft would have to do far more than they are right now.

    I just want to have real choices when it comes to browsers. I don't think it's an unreasonable request.
    Last edited by socialcarpet; 12-30-2012 at 08:33 PM.
  23. philxor's Avatar
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    #23  
    I think the chance of a decent browser other than IE on WP8 is somewhere between 0 and .001%. :). We might see Opera but not a web kit browser.

    It's not just WP8 and RT which are affected. As said it affects normal Windows 8 when touch is being used. The deluge of new touch enabled Windows 8 laptops and desktops dwarf the amount of RT and WP8 devices being sold. Now those devices have mouses which can be used but that defeats the point.

    The fix in a touch enabled world is to eliminate mouse over actions on tablet and mobile devices which do not have mouses... Like has been said webkit fakes it and treats your finger as a pointer which hasn't clicked yet. MS has created some new standards based ways to handle the events but it does require redesign work. Also too many websites use Webkit proprietary extensions for mobile sites.
  24. wingcutter's Avatar
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    #24  
    Just getting back to this conversation.... Some good points are being made here. MS needs to deliver today on user experience. I shouldn't have to put down my shiny new 920 and dust off and fire up my old iPhone 3g so I can view web pages with simplistic drop down menus that have been around for over a decade. Its a freaking joke.

    Its all good for WalMart to keep up with browser compatibility, but do we know how many small business websites will never address the issue?


    Too many.
  25. Jastow's Avatar
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    #25  
    Not sure where you guys rank Metro Browser, but the drop down menus worked for me on WalMart.com. You touch and hold the menu for .5 sec, then the drop down appears which allows you select the subcategory. Only issue is that if you zoomed in enough to not see the whole menu when it pops up, trying to scroll around will cause the submenu to go away. No excuse, IE should do this.
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