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  1. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #1  
    Now, let me start with this. I own a Lumia 810, and i love the phone for the most part. I've owned the following devices as well: HTC Mozart (upgraded the memory myself too), Samsung Focus S, HTC Titan. Needless to say, I know what I'm getting into when it comes to WP. But, here are some gripes I have on a few issues that I think are playing into why WP8 has been solid, but not the BANG! needed at launch with all that hype built up over the summer.

    Firstly, I cannot blame Android and iOS users for pointing out flaws if they're coming from apps that are easier to use. Yes, the OS design and philosophy may be different, but I'm sure that the same ease of use can be built into an app for some things to keep the user experience consistent across all platforms. For example, Board Express kills me in that the Android version I can save drafts but the WP version I cannot. WTF?

    Secondly, MSFT still has to answer these questions, which quite frankly they should have answered with WP8 at launch. Where is the improved audio drivers for WP8 that allow mic + volume control on more headsets? Where is the create a playlist on the go option? NFC isn't fully utilized yet, where are the apps that use that? What about adding another arrow on the resizable live tiles to prevent me from cycling through one way to find the size tile I like? What about making settings a mini hub with the toggles for wifi, bluetooth, battery percentage, airplane mode in one panel and the other options as a scrollable list in the other? How about making all photo apps Lenses compatible? Better yet, putting the option in settings to allow us pick a certain # of photo apps to be displayed in Lenses so that it doesn't feel like another long scrolling list?

    This is the sort of polish that MSFT needs to add in ASAP. Personally, they should have gone to the missing apps and say " let us make a WP version to put in the marketplace. If people use it alot, you get to take it back and develop it. If people don't use it, we pull it".

    The good thing I can say is that Android pushes hardware, so MSFT will always have good tech to pick from. Until demand picks up, and the OS becomes more flexible, there is no way Samsung and HTC will produce a WP8 and Android variant of the same phone simultaneously or use a completely unique hardware set for WP.

    MSFT has direct control over the Surface. This should be used like Google's Nexus line to push the new updates and show off the OS. They better not put out a Surface phone next year if they're not planning to do this seriously or it will flop. I want WP to be successful, but not through blind fanboyism. I'm not ditching my Lumia 810 by any means, but I still SMH as to why these things are missing in WP8.
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  2. Optimus82's Avatar
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    #2  
    You want another arrow so that you dont have to cycle through 3 tile sizes?! Quit being a pansy!
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  3. BokiV's Avatar
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    #3  
    I am sure that these nitpicks are not the reason people don't buy more windows phones...any already established market is hard for new comers. MS is doing right with pushing marketing, because this is how you gain market share. Most smartphone users don't even know what those things you wrote mean..they don't read gadget blogs, and they don't have a 2 paper list of features to check...they go in the store and buy what they are familiar with
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  4. crystal_planet's Avatar
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    #4  
    As opposed to Android, which is fully polished? Get outta here with that weak sauce, " MSFTisMIA". Nice handle by the way.
    My next phone...
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  5. fardream's Avatar
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    #5  
    Some valid points.
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  6. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus82 View Post
    You want another arrow so that you dont have to cycle through 3 tile sizes?! Quit being a pansy!
    I had to bust out laughing when I saw this! So if I take you seriously, is it really THAT much harder for MSFT to add that arrow in? Perhaps you're right...maybe I should wait for that, and all the other things I asked for in WP9.
  7. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by crystal_planet View Post
    As opposed to Android, which is fully polished? Get outta here with that weak sauce, " MSFTisMIA". Nice handle by the way.
    In all seriousness though, how much harder would it be for MSFT to add those things in year 3 of WP? Wouldn't it put them AHEAD of where Android and iOS were at the same point in their OS cycle? Lol, like I said, I know what I'm getting into, but it would be stupid to give MSFT a pass on not adding these things at WP8 launch to help make the OS more appealing. Remember they have the luxury of hindsight and being able to not have to poll users to see "if these are features people might want".
  8. iamtim's Avatar
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    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSFTisMIA View Post
    Board Express kills me in that the Android version I can save drafts but the WP version I cannot. ... NFC isn't fully utilized yet, where are the apps that use that? ... How about making all photo apps Lenses compatible?
    The first is not a Microsoft product, the second and third sound like jobs for third-party developers. So... you want Microsoft to fix third-party apps and tell third-party developers what type of apps and functionality to develop?

    The rest are nothing but personal preference... I think griping about having to cycle through tile sizes is laughable and I like the settings right where they are (although I will say I'd like the settings list to be alphabetized, but that's just my preference.)

    I love how people think Microsoft has infinite resources with which to just snap their fingers and release a perfect OS with 100% complete third-party app support. The more I read these forums and #WP8 Tweets and Nokia blog comments and the like, the more I realize that there are a lot of nasty, whinging, self-centered WP users out there.
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  9. bigkevbosky's Avatar
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    #9  
    I love how everyone on the internet gets to be the smartphone expert when it comes to designing UIs and such. "Is it that much harder for Microsoft to add that arrow in?" No, its not. They don't want to, or they would have.

    Microsoft pays millions for the research and implementation of all their products, but some dude with 4 posts on WP Central knows better.

    You tell them, some dude. Ballmer should hire you to run the whole Windows Phone team!
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    #10  
    Everyday I read a post on these forums that exemplifies part of the problem with society in 2012. Yesterday it was someones irrational sense of importance and today this. Dude, its not all about you. You don't get everything you want, just like you want it, when you want it. That's not how the world works. Now put on your big boy britches, quit your whining and get out there and be productive. Geez!
    Sent from my Blue AT&T 8x using Board Xpress
  11. gsquared's Avatar
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    #11  
    To the OP.

    So you were basically looking for a 100% perfect OS at launch? Most businesses do not work that way. Most seem to use the 80% rule. Under this philosphy you shoot for an initial 80% of your plan. You then return and shoot for 80% of the remaining 20% that did not get covered in the first run. That puts you at 96% overall completion of your goal. You can make a third run again shooting for 80% of the remaining 4%. This gets you to 99.2% of your intended goal. Most do not do that thrid run as you hit a point of diminishing returns in regards to cost of hitting that 99.2 percentile.
    Support your third-party developers. There just about all we have...
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  12. gmlongo's Avatar
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    #12  
    I don't think you understand which parts MS is responsible for, and which are application developers. Much of what your wrote has nothing to do with MS, and are just issues you have with applications. Also, do not confuse YOUR personal preference with lack of polish.
  13. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by BokiV View Post
    I am sure that these nitpicks are not the reason people don't buy more windows phones...any already established market is hard for new comers. MS is doing right with pushing marketing, because this is how you gain market share. Most smartphone users don't even know what those things you wrote mean..they don't read gadget blogs, and they don't have a 2 paper list of features to check...they go in the store and buy what they are familiar with
    Perhaps. While I do like how MSFT has marketed WP8, I can argue that because devs got the SDK late, there weren't more WP8 ready apps at launch.

    For the record, everyone can identify with not being able to make a playlist on the go. Its not like people have Zune anymore to do that, and the sync issues here are WELL documented. Everyone can identify with not finding more headphones that allow volume control and MIC. Not everyone wants to buy Nokia Purity headphones.
  14. DJfriede's Avatar
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    #14  
    Some things I hoped to be fixed in WP8 compared to WP7:

    - Fast forwarding in music tracks and especially longer podcasts by holding the forward button still is ridiculous.
    - Trying to get the cursor to a certain position in messages longer than 3 or 4 lines is a mess. Just try it for yourself: It will near always end up "pushing" the cursor to the first or last lines but not the one you wanted.

    This might sound like nitpicking but it makes me feel like nothing much has changed for me as a WP7 user.

    Right now I still own a Lumia 800. I was planning on buying a Lumia 920. But after I tried out the device with special regard to the aforementioned (and other) issues, I cannot help but feel like MSFT "wasted" a year with those under the hood changes. And I mean "wasted" in the strict sense of not delivering a significantly better experience for existing WP users in the short run. However I still believe that changing the kernel and whatnot will result in a better system overall. Maybe not until in three or six months. That's why I'm keeping my Lumia 800.
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  15. vedichymn's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by gsquared View Post
    To the OP.

    So you were basically looking for a 100% perfect OS at launch? Most businesses do not work that way. Most seem to use the 80% rule. Under this philosphy you shoot for an initial 80% of your plan. You then return and shoot for 80% of the remaining 20% that did not get covered in the first run. That puts you at 96% overall completion of your goal. You can make a third run again shooting for 80% of the remaining 4%. This gets you to 99.2% of your intended goal. Most do not do that thrid run as you hit a point of diminishing returns in regards to cost of hitting that 99.2 percentile.
    I think most people were expecting a more polished experience (me included), because it's not like this is the first mobile operating system Microsoft has ever done. I realize that there was the big kernel rewrite for Windows Phone 8, and I realize why it was needed, but starting over every few years isn't sustainable. Hopefully for WP8 Microsoft has the people and processes in place to get updates out the door quicker and we don't have to wait 6-8 months.
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  16. StevesBalls's Avatar
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    #16  
    So you came to have a healthy discussion about the weak points and improvements of WP8 and the fanboys told you how wrong you are? How shocking...
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  17. iamtim's Avatar
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    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSFTisMIA View Post
    For the record, everyone can identify with not being able to make a playlist on the go. Its not like people have Zune anymore to do that, and the sync issues here are WELL documented. Everyone can identify with not finding more headphones that allow volume control and MIC.
    For the record, no, not everyone can identify with those issues. I see no need to make a playlist "on the go", I have NO problems syncing, and I don't use headphones. And I'm not the only one - people not having those issues are also WELL documented. Quit assuming that your issues, wants, and needs are everyone's issues, wants, and needs.
  18. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #18  
    Gsquared, all valid. All I'm saying is that this is year 3 in the OS cycle of WP, the first true update from the initial launch of the OS. While WP is ahead of both iOS and Android in many respects, WP is behind because it has to play catch up. In no way I said that the OS is bad, but if you've seen what the competition has and where they implemented certain things during the OS maturation, you should be looking to add some of those things earlier wherever possible.

    All these things are correctable if MSFT plans to add more updates to the OS more frequently. The apps is a bit tricky because of the chicken vs egg cycle of demand and supply.

    GMlongo, so the playlist issue and headphone support is NOT a OS issue? Since when?
  19. iamtim's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by StevesBalls View Post
    So you came to have a healthy discussion about the weak points and improvements of WP8 and the fanboys told you how wrong you are? How shocking...
    It is shocking that there would be fans on the WINDOWS PHONE CENTRAL forums. That's almost like finding Android fans on the Android Central forums. Unbelievable.

    Look, there's nothing wrong with discussion about weak points and improvements... just keep it in perspective. Like... having to cycle through a whopping three tile sizes is "making adoption harder"? ...really?
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  20. bigkevbosky's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by StevesBalls View Post
    So you came to have a healthy discussion about the weak points and improvements of WP8 and the fanboys told you how wrong you are? How shocking...
    We have FIFTY F*CKING THREADS like this already. There's been plenty of discussion about it.

    I've read a LOT of your posts, and it seems like you're just here to troll. What's your problem? If you don't like WP8, ok. Nobody really cares. Nobody on this forum designs the WP8 UI or manufactures the hardware, so all you're doing is arguing with FANS of the platform.

    Life is too short for this, go do what makes you happy - if WP8 isn't it, find another OS. Or is it more fun to keep antagonizing people?
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  21. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #21  
    Tim, have you ever looked at the emerging markets MSFT is trying to get into? There are alot more people out there who can relate to the stuff I've mentioned than you may realize. Again, these aren't crazy broad generalizations here, just simple small options MSFT could have put in but haven't done so yet. ****, people have been giving them suggestions from WP7's launch. No one expected them to put on EVERYTHING at WP8 launch, but the overall point is that there are ways to close the gaps they haven't starting using yet.

    For the record, people want choice. It is better you have the option and not choose to use it, than to not have the option at all.
  22. bigkevbosky's Avatar
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSFTisMIA View Post
    For the record, people want choice. It is better you have the option and not choose to use it, than to not have the option at all.
    For the record, you have THREE operating systems to choose from, four if you want to count whatever crap RIM is putting out these days.

    ONE of those four should do most of what you want it to do. Pick that one. It seems like you want a lot of features Android ALREADY has. Go there.
  23. iamtim's Avatar
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    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSFTisMIA View Post
    No one expected them to put on EVERYTHING at WP8 launch, but the overall point is that there are ways to close the gaps they haven't starting using yet.
    WP7 let you have, what, two tile sizes? People complained, they listened, now on WP8 you have three tile sizes. Here's the deal, though, and why I think your "suggestion" is laughable: no other phone OS has resizable tiles on the home screen at all. You can resize widgets on Android, and create groups on iPhone, but if you want your "Email" app on either to be the size of four regular icons, you're SOL. And you complain because *clutches pearls* you have to cycle through three sizes to find the one you want?

    ...really, dude? I mean, come on, you can't be serious.
  24. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
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       #24  
    You know why there are 50 similar threads? Because many people have submitted stuff to MSFT directly and haven't been satisfied by what how their responses have been handled. And I tell you what, if people didn't ***** and moan, no product would have moved forward and improved.

    As I said initially to all the people who actually read the post, I've used a WP handset at every launch. If I didn't like the OS, I'd still be using my Galaxy Nexus as my primary. To all the Sherlocks out there who like to tout the "if you don't like it, go someplace else argument", learn to tell the difference between a ***** fest and some productive user feedback. I agree that I've seen some trolls here, but this ain't one of them.

    No one said the resizing tile option was the SOLE reason why WP8 adoption was slow. Get a grip and actually read for a change.
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  25. gmlongo's Avatar
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    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSFTisMIA View Post

    GMlongo, so the playlist issue and headphone support is NOT a OS issue? Since when?
    That's why I mentioned that "much of what you wrote" is not OS related. Your title was about WP8 "lack of polish", but you went on and mentioned a handful of app issues. The separate volume and playlists are certainly valid issues, although those are certainly minor and by no means are indicative of an overall lack of polish.
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