- 01-29-2013, 01:50 PM #27
Foremost, the assertion that the operating system has a notable influence on a display's visual quality, or that WP may not be designed to do 720p properly, is simply false. In fact, as far as the visual quality of your display is concerned, the operating system is entirely irrelevant!
All operating systems, whether it be WP, iOS or Android all end up writing the results of graphical operations to their devices video buffers. These are nothing more than numbers (representing colors) in a designated portion of video memory. That is the end of it. That is to say, an operating systems interaction with a devices display ends there. It goes no further. In other words, the reach of operating system code doesn't go far enough to influence display quality in any way, shape or form.
The only entities that can influence display quality via "software" are the hardware manufacturers. They do so by determining how the contents of those display buffers are mapped to the physical display. At this point they can setup various profiles that specify gamma curves, maximum brightness, display brightness as a function of ambient light and so forth. Although one might argue that this is where software is involved, it really is more about configuring the hardware. That is why this is the hardware manufacturers job and not the OS developers, not to mention that everything done at this stage is dependent on the make and model of the display being incorporated into the device.
So, you are correct that there is more to it than just the make and model of the display, but these differences aren't really software and most certainly not OS related.
- 01-29-2013, 01:52 PM #28
720p and 480p and lower is noticeable on 4.3" screens and above but 720p vs 1080p isn't really noticeable until over 32". Is 480x800 adequate for a smartphone? Sure it is but there are areas where at least 720p is needed especially if you want the same experience you get at home when on the go. This being said I don't think I would buy an 800x480 phone again due to the process of evolution (new phone must be the same specs or better).
- 01-29-2013, 04:50 PM #31
My point is that this isn't a black & white issue. Some people, likely far fewer than one in a hundred, will reap real benefits from a 1080p display at 5". Like I said, I can make out differences in sharpness between the Lumia 920 and the DNA, but only when reading high contrast text and I need to shove each device up one nostril to do so. In terms of day to day usage, I find that improvement irrelevant, but others might be more sensitive to sharpness than I am.
My point is that I don't think this is comparable to the monster cable phenomenon, where electrical measurements leave no basis on which to claim superiority. Displays at 450 PPI are technically superior to displays at 300 PPI, but for most people it just won't be a difference that matters.
Consequentially, I don't think 1080p displays should be ignored entirely. I just don't think they should be a major priority on WP's development plan. At this point we have other OS features that are far more pressing. If we get 1080p support in WP9, while simultaneously discontinuing support for two of the three current resolutions (I would vote to keep 1280x720), I'll be a happy camper.
01-29-2013, 05:18 PM #32
- 439 Posts
I have the 810 and I've had a lot of hands on time with the 8x. Everything is a trade, in this case battery life for resolution. Give me the battery life, because the much touted specs on screens simply don't make much difference, if any, in real life. In other words, I agree with you 100%.
01-29-2013, 05:20 PM #33
- 249 Posts
I wonder why HTC and MS was so lazy with the 8x screen though, the One X shouldn't have the superior screen, it should be the other way around. Although now that I think about it, the coating on the LCD could play a part too. Or a filter like the clear black filter Nokia uses.
- 01-29-2013, 07:15 PM #34
Whatever the differences are, I'm sure their existence has nothing to do with laziness. I'm also quite sure that MS had no role to play in any of it, as HTC is perfectly capable of doing this without Microsoft's involvement.
- 01-29-2013, 11:43 PM #35
All of these people talking about how ridiculous anything over 720p is, will be the exact same people loving their 1080p or higher res screen on their next phone. 😋
Remember folks. You can't compare a tv's res to something you hold just inches from your face. Higher ppi in mobile is needed to produce the same perceived quality as an HD tv.
01-30-2013, 03:20 AM #37
- 190 Posts
My last WM6.5 Phone the LG IQ was 480p 3.2" display and now I have the Samsung ATIV S 720p 4.8" I would not go back ever!
I don't see what you people are taking about? As far as saying 1080p HDTV is sharp it's not! 1080p is only 2 Mega Pixel...
Go look at the new 2160p UHDTV side by side with 1080p then you will see!
More is always better don't kid yourself. 😎ATIV S is LIFE
01-30-2013, 04:07 AM #38
- 231 Posts
- 01-30-2013, 10:01 AM #39
- 01-30-2013, 10:47 AM #40
You have quite low standards from what you want from a screen. For me at least I prefer an IPS display with at least 300 PPI. I didn't pull that number out of my ***, it's based on phones I've used and how they moved from ~200-250 to >300PPI.
01-30-2013, 12:58 PM #41
- 257 Posts
I disagree with OP, I was playing with my brothers lumia 920 and I have a focus S and you can definitely tell the difference in the screen resolution. Now between 1080 and 720 on a phone, I don't think it will be that much of a difference but between 800 x 480 and 1366 x 768, its about 2x the resolution, definitely noticeable.
- 01-30-2013, 01:27 PM #42
But seriously, I have gone from a 360 x 480 @ 188ppi to 480 x 640 @ 250ppi and am now on a 768 x 1280 @ 334ppi phone and have noticed huge differences each time, but I honestly think that I have reached the limit of what I would be able to detect. At a normal viewing distance, my phone display looks clearer than my 1080p TV playing HD content. I could see 1080p being worth it on a tablet, but certainly not on a phone that still fits in your pocket.
01-30-2013, 10:00 PM #43
- 190 Posts
I love my ATIV S Super AMOLED 4.8" 720p with 306 PPI 😎 but knowing that Samsung has a new Super AMOLED 5" 1080p @441 PPI coming...can you say Galaxy S4 & ATIV S2 can you say insane!
Imagine the move from 306PPI to 441PPI is stunning!
Guys trying to justify 4" 480p less than 300PPI display's that's crazy.
The human eye can see up to around 425PPI is the limits of the human eye level.
Samsung new Super AMOLED 5" 1080p 441PPI display has more than 100 pixels per inch more than the iPhone 5 326PPI and stretched beyond the limits of the human eye level.
Now that's innovation!ATIV S is LIFE
01-30-2013, 11:42 PM #44
- 1,221 Posts
as much as I hate apple, i have to give them the nod in the display and graphics departments.
they have figured out the best compromise for ppi.
for smartphones, ppi in the low 300s is optimal.
for tablets, ppi in the mid 200s is optimal.
going higher or lower and you sacrifice more than you gain.
listen to apple on this, guys. they are the ones who made "retina" after all
- 01-31-2013, 12:13 AM #45
Edit: It isn't entirely useless, but it should be called nerd-focused marketing, not innovation.
Ophthalmologists do not agree on the amount of detail the human eye can resolve. The experimental approach (asking people to sort images from low to high PPI) suggests the practical limit is around 600 PPI (some say the brain can subconsciously resolve higher PPI but that is somewhat esoteric). However, that really is the best case scenario, implying:
- perfect eyesight
- perfect prints (on ridiculously expensive paper, not on a digital display)
- under perfect lighting combining all the wavelengths of light which are most helpful to the human eye
- allowing people to get up as close as they want (certainly way below normal reading distance)
- allowing a lot of time to scrutinize
Barely anybody has perfect eyesight. Smartphone displays are nowhere close to replicating a high quality print (contrast, reflected instead of emitted light, etc.). In day to day life we don't get perfect lighting. Normal people tend to maintain half an arms length reading distance, and unless you have some kind of pixel fetish, you won't be spending significant amounts of time attempting to discern individual pixels. All that reduces what we are practically able to resolve on a smartphone display, which is why most people don't perceive a benefit beyond 300 PPI.
I think some would actually look a lot less silly by admitting to enjoying spec sheet pissing contests.
Last edited by a5cent; 01-31-2013 at 12:49 AM. Reason: see edit
- 01-31-2013, 01:47 AM #47
People who actually understand hardware and software technology (professionally involved in development, as opposed to just being interested), are very often less interested in specs sheets, as they recognize them for what they really are (mostly marketing material). They tend to prefer measurements. Tell an IC engineer that you know you've got the fastest smartphone because it contains an 8-core CPU clocked at 2GHz and you will just get laughed at. This has already been debated back and forth a million times, so I'll leave it at that.
You might also want to take a look at this, which suggests specs may not be quite as important as many think:
- 01-31-2013, 08:51 AM #49
Consumers love big numbers. Cars tout horsepower as a selling point (but you never hear of power to weight). digital camera's tout high megapixel counts (but you rarely hear them talk about the sensor size that is incredibly small). Tv makers tout the contrast ratio as a bazillion to 1 (when in reality there is no standard, so these numbers are rarely accurate).
Point is, consumers want HIGHER and BIGGER numbers, because they think its always better. That is most often not the case.
- 01-31-2013, 09:02 AM #50
Analyst Challenges Apple's iPhone 4 'Retina Display' Claims | News & Opinion | PCMag.com
Stop buying into the marketing crap. It was a nice display for the time. There are many on the market now that smoke it. Like my Lumia 920.
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