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03-03-2014 09:07 AM
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  1. Reflexx's Avatar
    I'm being entirely accurate. I'm regurgitating the bs I've been told these past few days.
    So, talking BS is now considered accurate?

    It does not matter if you are tied into the ecosystem using the Microsoft services with the x simply because you can continue the same experience with an an android phone....lmao people still casually always downplay that.
    ...and you miss the point here. Weird, since you will kind of see the point in the next sentence. So I don't know why you keep making this same argument that isn't really even the point.

    I see the reasoning behind the x to prevent them from going to be locked in with Google but I wish the pro Nokia x crowd will stop with the "this will help windows phone in the long term" bs because that just sounds willfully ignorant to me.
    You know why it would be good to prevent them from going to Google services? I'm not sure you do because your immediate statement after that contradicts it.

    Are you saying that it would NOT benefit WP to not have these customers tied to Google services when it's time to upgrade?

    Are you worried that some will still choose an Android phone? Nobody claimed that wouldn't be the case.

    However, remember that these are people that ALREADY chose Android. These are people that didn't want a Windows Phone to begin with.

    If MS/Nokia could at least win some of them over later when they upgrade and the app disparity is smaller, then that's a win for WP. It's MUCH better than having these people who already were not going to choose WP becoming locked into Google services.

    You might be skeptical about how many of then could actually be converted. That's fine. But there is no willful ignorance in seeing the real potential of the move.
    02-26-2014 02:57 PM
  2. Boris Lozac's Avatar

    However, remember that these are people that ALREADY chose Android. These are people that didn't want a Windows Phone to begin with..
    Nope, these are the people that would've bought L520 or cheaper WP8 as long as it's Nokia and has that build quality unlike other options, they don't care about the OS, these are the people that are fans of Nokia brand and wanted to try a WP8 just because of it, wanted an integrated navigation app, a great camera etc.. now they have no reason to go down that route.
    02-26-2014 03:48 PM
  3. Reflexx's Avatar
    Nope, these are the people that would've bought L520 or cheaper WP8 as long as it's Nokia and has that build quality unlike other options, they don't care about the OS, these are the people that are fans of Nokia brand and wanted to try a WP8 just because of it, wanted an integrated navigation app, a great camera etc.. now they have no reason to go down that route.

    No reason? Do you think that they'll suddenly stop promoting their Lumia devices?

    If they want a superior experience (as will be evident based on where they are ranked in the product line) then they'll choose a low end Lumia.

    If they can't afford that, then they'll get the X. But if they couldn't afford the Lumia, they would otherwise have been lost to a different Android selling vendor.
    02-26-2014 04:01 PM
  4. theefman's Avatar
    Microsoft just demonstrated today why the Nokia x strategy will fail. Bing rewards is offering 100GB storage for 100 reward points but as usual, US only. Is this the kind of experience users in emerging markets are going to have when they choose these devices, all the best of MS services are provided only to the US while they get sloppy seconds? I can just see the stampede to dump those devices and run to google and all their apps and services that work in these countries. Terrible idea, no question.
    Nogitsune Micah likes this.
    02-26-2014 04:52 PM
  5. Boris Lozac's Avatar
    No reason? Do you think that they'll suddenly stop promoting their Lumia devices? .
    I meant people will have no reason to buy a cheap Nokia with windows instead of cheap Nokia with Android.. It's more popular, all of their friends have Android. People are acting like these phones are 10$? They cost the same as 520/525, how are they "below" Lumia in the 'hiearchy'?
    02-26-2014 05:00 PM
  6. Reflexx's Avatar
    Microsoft just demonstrated today why the Nokia x strategy will fail. Bing rewards is offering 100GB storage for 100 reward points but as usual, US only. Is this the kind of experience users in emerging markets are going to have when they choose these devices, all the best of MS services are provided only to the US while they get sloppy seconds? I can just see the stampede to dump those devices and run to google and all their apps and services that work in these countries. Terrible idea, no question.

    So that they can use "google rewards"?

    The main key service is going to be OneDrive vs Google Drive.

    That is where the storage of personal files may prevent someone from switching to something else.
    02-26-2014 05:50 PM
  7. Reflexx's Avatar
    I meant people will have no reason to buy a cheap Nokia with windows instead of cheap Nokia with Android.. It's more popular, all of their friends have Android. People are acting like these phones are 10$? They cost the same as 520/525, how are they "below" Lumia in the 'hiearchy'?
    ​Nokia should make it clear that the benefit of getting the Lumia is superior performance.
    02-26-2014 05:51 PM
  8. ohgood's Avatar
    So that they can use "google rewards"?

    The main key service is going to be OneDrive vs Google Drive.

    That is where the storage of personal files may prevent someone from switching to something else.



    huh ? it's a bucket you put stuff in. do people really care if it's from microsoft, amazon, google, or homedepot, when their files upload ?

    (google drive, skydr... oops, one-week-drive, mega, idrive, udrive, russianhackerdrive, thumbdrive, all work just fine for me, no matter the platform i dump stuff from)
    02-26-2014 07:15 PM
  9. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    ​Nokia should make it clear that the benefit of getting the Lumia is superior performance.
    Why would a company do that? It's self-sabotaging their own product....Our X line is not known for it's performance but sure let's go ahead and sell you a Lumia...so then what would be the point of the X line then?

    That's like Samsung saying.... "OUr ativ line is great though lacks some apps...so check out our Galaxy Brand....>"
    02-26-2014 07:43 PM
  10. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    Reflexx,

    FIrst of all....onedrive vs google drive

    The difficulty is not that hard. It's much harder for a Pure Android user invested in Google drive to move to WIndows phone? Why? Because there is no Google Drive.

    Onedrive is available on Android, IOS and Windows phone...so there is no "locking them" in? You guys keep saying this is about using their services to lock them into Microsoft instead of Google...except in order to actually lock in they'd have to remove their services from Android in the first place...not provided an arguably stronger version of their services on the platform(Example: Look at Skype).

    I wish people would stop saying anything about how this benefits Windows Phone? Nobody has given a compelling reason as to how this even remotely benefits Windows Phone. Plain and simple this promotes services like skype, Outlook, Onedrive, etc etc....the "this benefits windows phone in the long term" is just utter BS. I'm sorry

    People preach about the long term.....In the Short term, I am curious as to what Microsoft has planned for WIndows Phone...What happens after windows phone 8.1?
    I am curious about their long term plans for WIndows phone?

    The same people supporting this crap idea of Nokia X are the same people who support the idea of an Android Emulator on windows phone running Android apps like Bluestacks or whatever it is called because "We need the market share" and they believe that will somehow encourage developer's to make native apps for windows phone.

    Working great for blackberry, their apps and their marketshare isn't it?
    So that they can use "google rewards"?

    The main key service is going to be OneDrive vs Google Drive.

    That is where the storage of personal files may prevent someone from switching to something else.
    So, talking BS is now considered accurate?



    ...and you miss the point here. Weird, since you will kind of see the point in the next sentence. So I don't know why you keep making this same argument that isn't really even the point.



    You know why it would be good to prevent them from going to Google services? I'm not sure you do because your immediate statement after that contradicts it.

    Are you saying that it would NOT benefit WP to not have these customers tied to Google services when it's time to upgrade?

    Are you worried that some will still choose an Android phone? Nobody claimed that wouldn't be the case.

    However, remember that these are people that ALREADY chose Android. These are people that didn't want a Windows Phone to begin with.

    If MS/Nokia could at least win some of them over later when they upgrade and the app disparity is smaller, then that's a win for WP. It's MUCH better than having these people who already were not going to choose WP becoming locked into Google services.

    You might be skeptical about how many of then could actually be converted. That's fine. But there is no willful ignorance in seeing the real potential of the move.
    Boris Lozac and ohgood like this.
    02-26-2014 07:52 PM
  11. theefman's Avatar
    So that they can use "google rewards"?

    The main key service is going to be OneDrive vs Google Drive.

    That is where the storage of personal files may prevent someone from switching to something else.

    That's the beauty of it, Microsoft has already created a dedicated way for android users to earn Bing rewards so yes, they will still get bung rewards on a google device. :)

    Now lets turn to skype. Skype on Nokia x will be able to do file transfers as its the android app (Microsoft themselves proudly proclaimed it) while the WP version lacks it. How is that Microsoft service providing an incentive to move to WP?
    02-26-2014 11:11 PM
  12. Reflexx's Avatar
    huh ? it's a bucket you put stuff in. do people really care if it's from microsoft, amazon, google, or homedepot, when their files upload ?

    (google drive, skydr... oops, one-week-drive, mega, idrive, udrive, russianhackerdrive, thumbdrive, all work just fine for me, no matter the platform i dump stuff from)
    People don't care...

    ...until they have all their stuff in it already. Then they do care.
    02-26-2014 11:41 PM
  13. Reflexx's Avatar
    Why would a company do that? It's self-sabotaging their own product....Our X line is not known for it's performance but sure let's go ahead and sell you a Lumia...so then what would be the point of the X line then?

    That's like Samsung saying.... "OUr ativ line is great though lacks some apps...so check out our Galaxy Brand....>"
    Nope.

    These are budget devices. People buying them know that they are making trade-offs due to price.

    X series = more apps
    Lumia 5xx = snappier and more reliable performance

    When WP catches up on apps in a few years then the trade-offs for choosing a Lumia will be close to non-existent compared to the X.
    02-26-2014 11:43 PM
  14. Reflexx's Avatar
    Reflexx,

    FIrst of all....onedrive vs google drive

    The difficulty is not that hard. It's much harder for a Pure Android user invested in Google drive to move to WIndows phone? Why? Because there is no Google Drive.

    Onedrive is available on Android, IOS and Windows phone...so there is no "locking them" in? You guys keep saying this is about using their services to lock them into Microsoft instead of Google...except in order to actually lock in they'd have to remove their services from Android in the first place...not provided an arguably stronger version of their services on the platform(Example: Look at Skype).
    That is not what I said.

    Using MS services will not lock them into WP.

    However, Google's services WILL lock them into Android.

    Therefore, it's better to have them using MS services.

    I wish people would stop saying anything about how this benefits Windows Phone? Nobody has given a compelling reason as to how this even remotely benefits Windows Phone. Plain and simple this promotes services like skype, Outlook, Onedrive, etc etc....the "this benefits windows phone in the long term" is just utter BS. I'm sorry
    You're just not understanding what people are saying. You keep thinking it's about using MS services to lock people in. It is not. Not even close. It's about making sure that consumers still have a choice by not being locked in.

    People preach about the long term.....In the Short term, I am curious as to what Microsoft has planned for WIndows Phone...What happens after windows phone 8.1?
    I am curious about their long term plans for WIndows phone?
    You do realize that this is a Nokia strategy, not an MS strategy, right?

    This is Nokia's strategy in emerging markets to hold over consumers so that they can hopefully win them over with Lumia when they are more open to WP. When the app disparity is not there anymore.

    It is not Microsoft's strategy. You're confusing the two.

    They did not work together to develop this strategy.

    The same people supporting this crap idea of Nokia X are the same people who support the idea of an Android Emulator on windows phone running Android apps like Bluestacks or whatever it is called because "We need the market share" and they believe that will somehow encourage developer's to make native apps for windows phone.

    Working great for blackberry, their apps and their marketshare isn't it?
    I don't want an Android app emulator. However, I wouldn't be surprised if there was one that ran low-end apps. I wouldn't pretend that there aren't benefits.

    The apps that require any amount of horsepower would still need to be natively developed for WP. A good experience would still require native WP development.

    You act as if the supporting of Android apps is what has hurt Blackberry. You're looking at each thing in a vaccuum instead of a larger strategy.

    02-26-2014 11:51 PM
  15. Reflexx's Avatar
    That's the beauty of it, Microsoft has already created a dedicated way for android users to earn Bing rewards so yes, they will still get bung rewards on a google device. :)

    Now lets turn to skype. Skype on Nokia x will be able to do file transfers as its the android app (Microsoft themselves proudly proclaimed it) while the WP version lacks it. How is that Microsoft service providing an incentive to move to WP?
    Well, I'm not happy about MS's crappy support for their own services on WP. I can only hope that will improve.

    But this whole X thing isn't an MS thing. It's a Nokia thing. It's their strategy.

    They might feel that WP isn't a complete enough experience to win over everyone yet... so they need something to keep these customers from becoming fully invested in Google's ecosystem while MS gets their act together.
    02-26-2014 11:53 PM
  16. ohgood's Avatar
    People don't care...

    ...until they have all their stuff in it already. Then they do care.
    bah humbug.

    it takes all of one night to push several GB of files from one server to another. I've pushed from goodrive to mega to skydrive... oops this week we're calling it one drive, just to see if there were any differences, none were found.

    dumb buckets attached to fat pipes. I'd hardly call that "services" or whatever the buzz word is thus month.

    occasijnaly a ui change in the onlinr browser version looks neato, then it fades back into 'whatever, I'm just pushing files'
    Boris Lozac likes this.
    02-27-2014 03:36 AM
  17. Reflexx's Avatar
    bah humbug.

    it takes all of one night to push several GB of files from one server to another. I've pushed from goodrive to mega to skydrive... oops this week we're calling it one drive, just to see if there were any differences, none were found.

    dumb buckets attached to fat pipes. I'd hardly call that "services" or whatever the buzz word is thus month.

    occasijnaly a ui change in the onlinr browser version looks neato, then it fades back into 'whatever, I'm just pushing files'
    You're not a beginning smartphone with a limited knowledge of technology user in a 3rd world country.
    Last edited by Reflexx; 02-27-2014 at 06:37 AM.
    02-27-2014 05:34 AM
  18. Roderick Aspiras's Avatar
    Will this run Windows app?
    02-27-2014 07:01 AM
  19. ohgood's Avatar
    You're not a beginning smartphone with a limited knowledge of technology user in a 3rd world country.

    excellent point. hadn't thought of that. how long will the naive last, once they have a 4" portal to the internet in hand ?
    02-27-2014 07:16 AM
  20. theefman's Avatar
    You're not a beginning smartphone with a limited knowledge of technology user in a 3rd world country.
    You might be doing users in 3rd world countries a disservice, they may be more tech savvy than you think and just lack the means to acquire better tech. I don't think anyone would argue the iphone hype hasn't reached such countries, they just can't afford to buy them. Yet.
    02-27-2014 08:43 AM
  21. Reflexx's Avatar
    You might be doing users in 3rd world countries a disservice, they may be more tech savvy than you think and just lack the means to acquire better tech. I don't think anyone would argue the iphone hype hasn't reached such countries, they just can't afford to buy them. Yet.
    You misunderstand me.

    I'm not saying 3rd world countries don't have tech savvy users.
    I'm saying that this is not targeted at them. The ecosystem issues are not about them.
    02-27-2014 09:04 AM
  22. Reflexx's Avatar
    excellent point. hadn't thought of that. how long will the naive last, once they have a 4" portal to the internet in hand ?
    It's not about being naive necessarily. Many people just aren't into tech. They're being moved into the smartphone era almost by necessity.
    02-27-2014 09:06 AM
  23. theefman's Avatar
    Aaaaaaand already the great Nokia x is rooted and running.......google services! http://wmpoweruser.com/rooted-nokia-...ferentiate-on/. That's the whole premise of these devices down the toilet, the FIRST thing they did was remove those "popular" MS services. Which they can still get now they have access to the google store. So is anyone still of the belief that this will help introduce users to MS services or lead them to WP?
    02-28-2014 06:28 PM
  24. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    Aaaaaaand already the great Nokia x is rooted and running.......google services! http://wmpoweruser.com/rooted-nokia-...ferentiate-on/. That's the whole premise of these devices down the toilet, the FIRST thing they did was remove those "popular" MS services. Which they can still get now they have access to the google store. So is anyone still of the belief that this will help introduce users to MS services or lead them to WP?
    But wait the Nokia x fans and wpcentral will tell us that "this is expected but people in emerging countries won't root"

    You know because apparently these people must be dumb in emerging countries /s
    theefman and Boris Lozac like this.
    02-28-2014 06:39 PM
  25. theefman's Avatar
    But wait the Nokia x fans and wpcentral will tell us that "this is expected but people in emerging countries won't root"

    You know because apparently these people must be dumb in emerging countries /s
    Maybe Microsoft can work with the NSA to track the rooted phones and revert them? :)
    Nogitsune Micah likes this.
    02-28-2014 06:43 PM
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