05-20-2018 06:09 PM
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  1. bobsentell's Avatar
    MSFT is up almost 100% since his arrival. He's not going anywhere.
    aluti likes this.
    11-16-2017 12:42 PM
  2. rollindice's Avatar

    I don't think people realize how huge a mistake their absence in mobile is. These are short term gains that will turn into future failure. It will be the end of Windows. MS as a consumer company will be nearly non existent at some point. People simply don't care about Windows and kids growing up now won't even be exposed to it. They use IPads, Chromebooks and iPhones. Schools use them and then they go home and their parents are using them.
    Even those of us on here will be using them as we will have no choice.

    People don't understand, Mobile is all that matters and a 10 inch tablet that makes calls doesn't count anymore than a 17" laptop does, they're only mobile by definition. Mobile is where it's at and where it will be and MS will not be there. That alone proves he's not fit to be the CEO of what was the only company that mattered in computing. It is also the reason why MS finds themselves scrambling to try and reinvent themselves. Doesn't matter what they do at this point. They will end up irrelevant to 90% of consumers in the next 5 years. They left the biggest market in computing, they won't recover from that.
    The biggest country in the world is the mobile connected world, more than ever and it will stay so for quite some time to come. It's amazing Nadella said he doesn't understand why the world needed a third ecosystem given that the company has been focusing on OneCore which is a modern ui framework to work across all devices for Windows yet he's same guy that gave the Mobile First, Cloud First Press Briefing : https://news.microsoft.com/2014/03/2...ress-briefing/
    Aden Rossinni likes this.
    11-16-2017 12:48 PM
  3. nlsclint's Avatar
    He has completely missed the boat here and it is frustrating. They could have still made the migration to Andromeda with a smooth transition from W10M. Poor guy has vision for what needs to be but no accountability for how to get there while increasing the W10M market share.
    Aden Rossinni likes this.
    11-16-2017 01:01 PM
  4. TechFreak1's Avatar
    There are multiple facets to this argument and if you are stock holder looking for short term gains then Satya Nadella has been the right man for the job.

    But in terms of long term vision, sadly everything I have seen does not look well at all.

    Why?

    It's the transitional phase that has been an absolute and diabolical mess.

    The enterprise growth will plataue and that is evident with android being the most interacted o/s now, this is just the first step.

    By reinforcing users into their competitors ecosystem, Microsoft has pretty much conceded everything a silver platter.

    Why?

    The transitional phase of computing is absolutely dependent on Smartphones and where did the major cuts focus on? - The mobile division.

    Historically there has always been a transitional form of media for work, consumption and communication


    Consumption
    Newspapers <-> radio <-> tv <-> portable media players <-> smartphones -> UWP

    Work
    Typewriters <-> Typewriters for binary input + mainframe esque analogue computers <-> mainframe esque analogue / digital computers with printers <-> digital mainframe esque computers <-> desktop computer with command line <-> desktop computer with UX <-> portable digital assitant (PDAs) <-> Smartphones -> UWP

    Communication
    Telegram <-> rotary phones + operators <-> rotary phones <-> touch tone phones <-> brief case esque phones <-> still brief case esque but more portable phones <-> portable touch tone phones <-> monophonic phones with monochrome screens <-> colour screen phones & polyphonic tones <-> colour screen + mp3 + wap <-> colour screen phones with extensibility (propriatery stores for apps and games) <-> merge with pdas = phones with productivity capabilities (still no cohesive store) <-> smartphones -> UWP

    {Quantum computin could go so many ways for instance China has launched a quantum based sattelite last year}.

    This is the overly simplified flow of transitional technologies and this is why as long Microsoft foregoes the consumer space they will lose everything. Fortunately for them they have xbox and that under Phil Spencer + co has done phenomenally well after the initial xbox one launch.

    Needless to say Xbox under Don Matrick also did extremely well but his tenure was sadly marred by the xbox one launch fiasco (I personallly thought he was far too combative at times about the launch but his tenure is the topic of debate).

    If any company was doing the same thing as Microsoft was doing, they would have folded - I know it's a cliche but look at IBM, who at one point was a dominant player in alot of spaces.


    As you can see the universal windows platfrom was the logical merge of technologies as from there it can branch exponentially.

    But UWP has since been disparaged in favour of the competitor platforms therefore the Windows Store now the Microsoft store lays pretty much barren a years later.

    Microsoft needed smartphones to push growth of Windows 10 along with UWP and where did that axe fall?

    The mobile division.

    As you can see at this point's a circular argument and a rather exhausting one as without UWP any windows based platform will struggle.

    Microsoft will not be able to restart over and if they did they will completely look like morons for wasting 42 years of progress to obtain the "3 screens and a cloud vision". Which is more like really one screen and the cloud, which is why to keep that vision alive they are embedding users in their competition and trying to leverage that userbase (continue on PC integration)

    If Microsoft continues to disparage the UWP platform - focusing on web apps is not the answer. Rebuilding the bridges and trust that Microsoft has burned pretty much everywhere is the answer.

    The only reason OEM's are working on Products is because their entire existence was at one point dependent on PC (windows) sales and still makes up a large chunk of the market - the fact there are countless number of Win32 applications out there (that in my opinion has been the saving grace for Windows). Which is why you see almost all OEM's have diverse portfolios spanning multiple sectors.

    If OEMs could cut off windows and make chromebooks, they happily will - numbers talk and in this case it's the userbase - Windows holds the largest userbase around the world. Android is the most interacted o/s due to it's insane number of permutations shipped in very cheap devices.

    All Google and Apple have to do is polish up their productivity offerings, combine their operating systems into a unified core, create a robust enterprise infrastructure and Microsoft won't have a leg to stand on. Because they have been throwing users in the direction of Apple and Google.

    But that's presuming Microsoft is just going to stand there doing nothing but it's apparent that focusing on infrastructure is their "plan b" or rather their 'plan a'.

    Which is why despite having all the pieces of the puzzle, Microsoft absolutely refuses take risks under Satya Nadella. Under Bill Gates and Ballmer, sure they were aggressive and at points monopolistic but no one can argue they weren't daring or wanting to take risks in disrupting the technology bubble:

    • Xp tablets
    • the initial surface table
    • the spot smartwatch


    Just to name a notable few.

    Under Satya Nadella there has been positive changes and biggest one I would say or two is the elimination of stack racking and collaboration between departments whereas previously each department ran compartmentalised - almost as small company.

    This shows, if you look at the initial xbox one and the practicallity of the engineering - solve the RROD issue?
    Let's chuck a vacuum sized fan ontop of the CPU.

    the Xbox one X looks incredibly sleek and completely disguises the insane computational power it has compared to the PS4 Pro.

    But from me that's where the positives end in regards to Satya Nadella's tenure, I was in the camp of waiting and see what it does. But it's apparent he is absolutely risk averse.

    Everything that has come to fruition and profitable suchas the Surface, Office 365, Hololens, Xbox, Azure were all conceived and made profitable (except Hololens as it's not commercially avaialble) under the tenure of Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer. Furthermore the elimination of stack racking and departmental co-existence Started with Steve Ballmer as well so yeah.

    All Satya Nadella in my opinion has done is increase the stock price by reducing the wage bill and made safe bets. Even there they have disparaged their own UWP platform - there is still no LinkedIn UWP - the Store app as of 16th Nov 2017 - is a Web wrapper... a WEB WRAPPER! eash.

    Mixer I can sort of see the logic there but it's widely known a UWP app (as of 16th Nov 2017) is not even on the ROADMAP!

    Yet they expect developers to pick up on UWP development?

    (Not to the insane number of limitations and API issues with UWP but that that will resolve over time - organic growth as you either focus on security {slow} or you have an open season {fast} i.e android)

    When Microsoft themselves with big brand acquisitions has not even bothered to push out a UWP app - what sort of message does that give out?

    There has been no risk taking involved, admittedly when I saw his first open letter to the employees that Microsoft would focus on it's strengths.

    I kept an open mind as the story goes he was opposed to the Nokia d & s acquisition then latter came round to the idea thus he was hired because he would be focusing on mobile along with everything else and Ballmer didn't want repeat what happened in the past

    But it's obvious that Satya Nadella never did.

    I imagine the board held a closed door meeting, excluded Steve Ballmer and outlined how they will undo it all. One may class me as cynical in considering that taking place, what else is there.

    Think about it - The entire consumer focused pathway set by Steve Ballmer is nulified then Microsoft later announces it's foregoing the consumer market completely?

    If Windows on ARM does not take off due to the lack of UWP apps because what Microsoft did in regards to Smartphones again, then yes Satya Nadella must go along with the those who made the decision to focus solely on ios and android only. Because a CEO must see beyond just numbers and all i'm seeing so far, is a CEO that is focused on short term numbers. (I understand the pressure from activist investers but at the end of the day, it's the CEO and SLT's decisions that create new markets and growth points therefore the investers don't run the company persay).

    I personally wish Windows on Arm does take off and Satya Nadella doesn't have to step down because there are so many other factors in play suchas the current political climate.

    But that is another topic for another day.
    Last edited by TechFreak1; 11-16-2017 at 01:19 PM.
    11-16-2017 01:05 PM
  5. Pairadyce's Avatar
    Drop? No... but I think they need to re-evaluate their offerings of enterprise and consumer. The enterprise kind of sells itself because they are entrenched but their inaction on the consumer front is poor. I feel like they want to be strictly software then they have an idea their OEMS haven't delivered so they create a product just to get the idea out in the software. But the downside is, they don't champion many ideas long-term and give up.

    I've always said, I don't expect Microsoft to sell millions of phones. That would be like expecting every car manufacturer to do the same even though there are many brands that do fine in their own way. I get the feeling that because they are Microsoft, they feel that if they must compete, it must appear to be competitive with market leaders. You don't need to outsell Samsung, Apple, HTC, Fitbit, Garmin, Spotify, etc to be profitable. They have poor scaling strategy because they are used to being the top dog. I think the CEO needs better advisors and a better Marketing and Product Roadmap team. As a CEO, he is doing what is best and executing. I would blame the other hundreds of hands that are associated with the many failings because I have seen the same thing occur at a couple of companies I've worked for. The CEO is like the presidency in the US, he's a face of strategy, has many says in the decisions but there are many other people actually impacting the work being done. If those people are ineffective in communicating the importance of their projects, then it will not be a priority to the CEO- that's just how business works.
    11-16-2017 01:22 PM
  6. zr2s10's Avatar
    11-16-2017 01:32 PM
  7. Garry Terry's Avatar
    Microsoft stock up, good. But how much would it had cost the company to outsource production of a couple of new phones, IF FOR NO OTHER REASON, TO KEEP ITS LOYAL CUSTOMERS/SUPPORTERS HAPPY and to remain in M/S ecosystem. We're the ones who buy Office 365, etc and promote it and other M/S products to friends.
    I'm so ticked with the company now, that I'm not really sure what I'm going to do regarding my tech needs. I wish there was a good alternative: maybe it is, but I haven't found it. They have lost a lot of goodwill and a dwindling mobile presence will affect their bottom line. Eventually, a decent alternative will arrive and Microsoft stock will suffer. A good alternative phone OS with a trusted ecosystem will sink it.
    Nadella is wrong in his thinking that there's not a market for a third mobile OS. His shortsighted vision disqualifies his ability to lead the company. Probably a brilliant guy, but he's wrong on phone. Just because he doesn't think there shouldn't be a Windows Phone, look at all the folks on here who do. The smart phone is not going away. The cool devices purportedly being developed sound good, but they should have kept W10M alive until they had a blockbuster and then continue support for older models. But instead, we've seen the CEO of a major corporation LIE to its most devoted followers. How do you overcome that? And, where are the new devices?
    Yes, he should step down as CEO. He has played into the hands of companies that will overshadow Microsoft. I haven't noticed Samsung or Google or Apple do much to promote Microsoft, except offer a link. I trusted Microsoft and will never trust a droid or iOS phone. And at this point, it's getting very hard to trust Microsoft. What a bunch of foolish decisions it has made. Maybe he thinks enterprise will make it all the money it needs: I don't think so. Those who do not like W10M don't have to buy it. But for those of us who aren't interested in a ton of apps that may not even be safe, W10M works pretty doggone good on a phone.
    Aden Rossinni likes this.
    11-16-2017 01:37 PM
  8. Corey Brundige's Avatar
    It's just amazing that Many W10M users are forced to migrate to another platform , am I the only person that thinks Nadella should've put more effort into mobile and uwp? How can your OS be relevant without a mobile platform, the numbers are growing daily about mobile usage , it's how world is connected and how it will be for quite sometime.
    Windows on mobile has been a failure since before Nadella came along. This is well documented and, quite frankly, is a tired topic by now.

    There's only so much investment you can make in an ecosystem that hasn't seen success. You can throw dollars at marketing, at developers and at retailers. But if your product isn't fully realized, at what point do you rethink? There's no allure to anyone but us, the fans. It's functional, yes. Exciting? Not in this state.

    They'll make an ultra mobile device when it's ready to be worthy of the Surface brand - - category defining and aspirational. But it has to be all-in this time. Microsoft knows that their Surface line has potential to excite customers the way Apple used to.

    The public forgets quickly. So once W10Mobile is forgotten, they'll likely launch a device that challenges the smartphone market with Andromeda.

    And that's only if it's ready. If not, they'll develop for other platforms and use their software ecosystem to reach users as best as they can with compelling experiences that will drive interest for hardware like hololens or a foldable tablet.

    Remember, Microsoft is the king of hybrid. Therein lies their likely move: a tablet that can replace your smartphone. We're going to see radical changes in the industry soon anyway.

    Azure will power any headless devices that may appear in the next 5-10 years. So anyone who complains about his investment there is incredibly short-sighted. It's a well of untapped money just waiting to be used to fund the things that get you really excited.

    It is ridiculous: calling for Nadella to be fired. I'm not a fan of every decision, but making a culture shift, driving significant revenues and bringing many different collaborative partnerships with tech giants and vendors is no small feat.

    Partnerships are good, especially when they agree to develop for Centennial.. Like Apple, Adobe and Spotify.

    His predecessors were late to the game and no amount of enthusiasm can fix a lame attempt to follow the market. Microsoft has seen success in their Surface and Xbox devices, even games like Minecraft that will increase consumer mind-share.

    It's too soon to tell what will happen, especially when pivoting a gigantic corporation largely bound by the legacy code and old ways of thinking. Everyone here seems to want to fixate on one tiny aspect of a business without any consideration of how many plans and people are involved in changing a company's culture alone.

    If there's not a mobile development two years from now, then we can talk about him failing us.

    Typed on my phone, so sorry for any errors and generally ****ty proofreading. RIP thumbs.
    Charis Ntouroutlis likes this.
    11-16-2017 01:42 PM
  9. Francisco De Jesus's Avatar
    I agree mobile is the only platform to be all in, we are in the mists of a total change in how we interact with the world and each other. IoT of things are the future and mobile is the only way to connect. Microsoft had so many chances of getting in the game. I feel if they create a full mobile computing device such as ARM on Windows so many will jump on.
    11-16-2017 01:51 PM
  10. Musa Siddiqui's Avatar
    I just did the same a week ago, I really miss the live tiles and Hey Cortana, especially in my car. Reading text, opening apps with Cortana don't work. Somethings are better some are not. If I could get W10M with all the Android apps it would be a no brainer W10M decision hands down.
    11-16-2017 01:58 PM
  11. Vivio vrvly's Avatar
    It came without pen, win32 support - therefore sentenced to failure.
    There is however bigger failure: Groove, they should bring it back, as soon as they can.
    And I don't care about device name or type, surface phone or HoloLens... just bring next gen. so we have new device.
    Iot, watches, action cameras, only with AI interaction - centered devices, or other smart devices, useful, small-mobile... thats the last inch to people.
    11-16-2017 02:01 PM
  12. Awhispersecho's Avatar
    Looking at the things he's done, it's actually hard to believe he's not being paid by Google and Apple to hand over the consumer space. I mean, think about what you would ask someone to do if you hired them to bring down a competitor. He's doing this stuff for them for free. (or is he :))

    I will say this. I am shocked that Apple and Google haven't jumped on this. Google has started. They already own mobile and are starting to make some serious moves on the computing side with Chromebooks and apps. Apple as usual is clueless. All that has to happen is Chromebooks get just a few more capabilities and Apple release a line of cheaper laptop/ultrabooks in the 500-800 dollar range and Ms is done on the consumer side. PC gamers will be all that's left and trust me, they are all dying for an alternative to windows. I know as I'm part of a couple big gaming communities and every single person wants to get away from Windows.
    11-16-2017 02:34 PM
  13. rollindice's Avatar

    If Windows on ARM does not take off due to the lack of UWP apps because what Microsoft did in regards to Smartphones again, then yes Satya Nadella must go along with the those who made the decision to focus solely on ios and android only. Because a CEO must see beyond just numbers and all i'm seeing so far, is a CEO that is focused on short term numbers. (I understand the pressure from activist investers but at the end of the day, it's the CEO and SLT's decisions that create new markets and growth points therefore the investers don't run the company persay).

    I personally wish Windows on Arm does take off and Satya Nadella doesn't have to step down because there are so many other factors in play suchas the current political climate.

    But that is another topic for another day.
    agreed with everything you've said but why is it in migrating towards this Andromeda Windows OS, you have to drop W10M completely? dropping in markets that you had many loyal and even newly loved users, after release of 950/XL Microsoft should've used all efforts into making W10M polished and creating fully unique experiences not putting all exclusives on other platforms. I've converted about 100 people to W10M and most are frustrated but are so in love with the UI in comparison to Google and iOS.
    11-16-2017 02:37 PM
  14. Awhispersecho's Avatar
    Remember when Nadella said they were going to release 6 phones a year? Well, we got 3 phones and then it was over. I converted about off people as well. These are people, family and friends, that have relief on me for tech support and tech guidance for years and now they are stuck, stranded, and pissed. At the same time, it makes me look bad.

    The constant lies from Nadella, the abandonment of services, the treatment of their fans who waited for years to keep supporting their platform and the current vision which is something I don't believe in are just some of the reasons I have already moved on to an Android and am looking to lessen my Windows usage in other ways as well. (I love my Note 8, I hate Android and crippled Cortana on Android) . Though these are just some of the reasons I and those I converted are leaving, all of these reasons are due to Nadella.
    Aden Rossinni and zr2s10 like this.
    11-16-2017 03:10 PM
  15. newnews's Avatar
    although the stock market is good for MS, but Apple and Google has better results than MS. many companies started to have options for their employees to choose Mac.
    Aden Rossinni likes this.
    11-16-2017 03:38 PM
  16. Aden Rossinni's Avatar
    Definitely, 100% get rid of that guy.
    11-16-2017 06:45 PM
  17. fiveaces01's Avatar
    Anyone that thinks they can stay competitive at any level without something that people are carrying around with them is a complete fool. Mobile is how people access nearly everything they do. From emails and texts to phone calls and most certainly the internet. Eventually people are going to switch what they use at home to the same OS as what they have in their pocket. Might not happen right away but it will happen. Then what Satya??? And what a complete lie when he made his opening briefing...remember this? Mobile First, Cloud First
    Old_Mil likes this.
    11-16-2017 07:16 PM
  18. R0bR's Avatar
    Not true. When WP7 was released Android had just over 100,000 apps and iPhone was dominating global marketshare. The difference is that Android was maturing quickly as Microsoft spent the next 8 months getting WP7 to a useable state with the mango release. I do agree with your assessment that Microsoft sat on their laurels and development was incredibly slow.
    11-16-2017 07:18 PM
  19. tgp's Avatar
    Anyone that thinks they can stay competitive at any level without something that people are carrying around with them is a complete fool.
    IDK, I work for a tech company and we develop our own software, among other things. We don't have a mobile OS, and we're doing OK. I think we'll make it.
    11-16-2017 07:28 PM
  20. naddy6969's Avatar
    “Time to stop being emotionally invested in a faceless corporation and let them do what they will.”

    Exactly.

    Microsoft is making money. Stock has been going up for over 5 years. That is not “short term”. How many more billions of dollars do you want them to lose on Windows phones?
    11-16-2017 07:41 PM
  21. Guytronic's Avatar
    11-16-2017 07:57 PM
  22. tgp's Avatar
    “Time to stop being emotionally invested in a faceless corporation and let them do what they will.”

    Exactly.

    Microsoft is making money. Stock has been going up for over 5 years. That is not “short term”. How many more billions of dollars do you want them to lose on Windows phones?
    Looking at it objectively, I think we're just emotionally invested in the mobile situation because it was a product for which we had high hopes. Put a product in its place that we don't care about, and we'd probably say "Good riddance!"
    11-16-2017 09:09 PM
  23. woreyeoe's Avatar
    There's no guarantee that Andromeda is an actual OS. Some of the latest news from May-Jo Foley is that it may simply be some next-gen, high-end device. While it may be great and ground breaking, it won't be for the masses. So there's nothing, at this point, to suggest MS is cooking up something that will appeal to the masses. I'm with you thought. No mobile platform from top to bottom means Windows is simply on a slow death to irrelevance.
    11-16-2017 09:26 PM
  24. woreyeoe's Avatar
    The direction of breaking down the silos and going heavy into the cloud space were both products of Ballmer. Nadella was the beneficiary of this. Now, he's totally abandoned a vertical smartphone ecosystem which in no way can be good for MS long-term. Windows is now, most assuredly, on a slow death towards irrelevance. I'm not saying that he's going to be fired, but I do think his decision to abandon smartphone hardware will be shown to be an enormous miscalculation.
    TechFreak1 and Old_Mil like this.
    11-16-2017 09:32 PM
  25. covfefe's Avatar
    Satya is simply riding on the organic growth of cloud.
    Last edited by Guytronic; 11-16-2017 at 11:55 PM.
    Saeglopur89 likes this.
    11-16-2017 10:58 PM
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