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  1. Rupert Holmes's Avatar
    All I wanted was a faster 1020. I have yet to find a phone with a camera that meets my needs better than the 1020.
    12-08-2017 08:34 AM
  2. anonius's Avatar
    Saving Windows Phone was necessary from the moment the new tiled interface was introduced, but not because of the lack of user, from itself! Interface is what we see first and this what has to be improved in that pretty, but mainly disfunctional user interface, which I personally struggle with it till this moment. I wrote this already many times on different Windows Central posts, first time years ago, after using it for a few weeks on first HTC windows phone with tiled interface. Here we go again in point by point MUST DO list:
    1) Every tile has to have name below or on the tile!!!! This names should be editable by user, just like shortcuts on Windows Desktop.
    2) One should be able to use dark font color when background color is light, eg. it is impossible right now to see what is on the screen when background is yellow and font is by default white.
    3) The tiles have to many sizes and at some point it is counterproductive to attach more of them. This creates long display difficult to scroll downward and remember where the tile was. Introduce "pages" of tiles, like Android and Apple have, they may be changed by scrolling down or sideways, but this mechanism must be built into interface.
    4) The whole interface moves to easily and is too sensitive to the touch. Accidental touch in my hand or even my pocket moves tiles around. "repairing" the original position may take long time and sometimes, for less skilfull user, is simply impossible. The interface must be "dummy" safe, by introducing eg. a "lock" application, which immobilizes position of tiles untill "unlocking" it. his does not mean we need a password to do it. It is only to lock in place the whole damned thing called tiles.
    5) Getting things done with Settings is too complicated. Mostly because there is too many things which we need to search for not knowing what they are. A very difficult task even with Bing/Cortana help. Someone has to create a simple logical list of things which need to have an easy access to every user. I understand it, it is Windows 10 on cell phone and all Settings are there, but cell phone is still not a desktop computer and can have two kinds of settings apps, those easy ones for everyday users and those for people who want to dablle more inside the system.
    6) Applications. I never missed them, but I understand why are they missed by so many people. They are an easy entrance to achieve something on the web in much simplified way. So, these is a valid point, but, if Edge browser had a cousin? See next
    7) Make a browser which is really able to display web info correctly and transparently on the small phone screen. A browser which scales pages to the screen size first of all. Not like the present one. Then the need for thousands of web serving applications will disappear. Every "favorite" could be made as a tile and saved to the list of applications and/or to the screen tile.
    8) Make window phones available in phone stores. Many times I entered TMob store to look at windows phone and salesmen didn't even know what is Windows Phone at the time when promotion was going on for Alcatel phone. It is insane. Same ATT stores. I do not talk here about smaller vendors who depend on Android only.

    Every time a new updated comes to my Lumia 950 I am fearing that some nice features will disappear, like live photos did, and now my friends with iPhones show live photos which I used to have for the past 2 years and don't have anymore, why?

    Too many whys, too many question marks, specially, why does it take so much effort to built a reliable phone (not like my Lumia 950 or 950XL), more like Lumia 1020, and it is possible to build Surface tablet or XBOX One X? Cost return? Please, illuminate me.
    12-08-2017 09:05 AM
  3. ucyimDa_Ruler's Avatar
    So many different answers that won't help. So many folks are keen on creating a "Me too" platform which from the get-go Windows Phone was not. I believe insiders ruined the WP experience by always comparing it to those other platforms which inturn started that fast descent.

    Here's what we never got from Microsoft.

    1. Commitment. Never has Microsoft openly committed to pushing and supporting the platform. Without this, developers will not hop on board. They recently openly committed to pushing the XBOX platform which will bring in more Indie developers and more publishers. Great! Should have done this with WP.
    2. Priority. This means stop releasing applications for other platforms first.
    3. Roadmap. I've never seen one, except a general one where it was a line part of a bigger picture. This was the only product line that didn't have an exclusive road map. Sure it was part of Windows. But let's see integration points or unique experiences tailored strictly for WP.
    4. UWP. Not sure where to start but this is a big problem.
    aximtreo likes this.
    12-08-2017 09:24 AM
  4. the_moesiah's Avatar
    Everyone suggests a W10m phone running android, what about developing W10M as an android app which launches with all the Microsoft apps included?
    You're basically describing a W10M launcher. There are several that already, and most are absolute garbage. There are a few that are okay, but none are a great substitution. I would love to see an official W10M launcher from Microsoft.
    12-08-2017 10:13 AM
  5. final_fantasy781's Avatar
    I disagree with your statement "Relying on android is not the way to go, if ever."

    The thing is, everybody is jumping the "Android Bandwagon. And by everybody I mean developers. There doesn't seem to be enough developers to developer for Android + iOS + Windows 10 (UWA). If any other company wants to make a new device, they can only chose to make Android. Maybe Microsoft will re-enter the device game later, but for now its only Android.

    Something HAS to change. Right now, if you don't fork Android and get popular apps like YouTube, Gmail, your device won't go anywhere. That is way too much power to say whether a new device or OS should live or die. That has to change and soon. That's what Microsoft should focus on

    So, if you don't go Android, you're already dead in the water.
    12-08-2017 10:59 AM
  6. markeboyle's Avatar
    hardware: start getting phones out....big and small. software:get everyone (Google starts & others will follow) to release progressive web apps so that we're on app parity with Android.
    12-08-2017 12:40 PM
  7. Joseph Sekula's Avatar
    I think the way to save the Windows phone is to, for now, forget about using it as its own operating system or device at this time. I would hire a design team to create an app or download that would make the Live Tiles view the screen you view when turning on another cell phone. It would be an overlay, much as other hardwear companies do for their own creation. It can have a simple Live Tile to exit the Screen to take you back to the native home screen view.

    This would serve two purposes. One, it would ameliorate the need to constantly build and develop an operating system that you believe probably would be obsolete in 10 years. Two, it would keep people familiar with the Windows experience while the next mobile experience evolves.

    As a marketing to your followers point, it would also keep us who actually enjoy the WIndows phone experience happy. Otherwise Microsoft is going to end up like the cable companies - they have ruined their reputations so much that no one likes them, no matter what the product or value.
    12-08-2017 05:05 PM
  8. anonius's Avatar
    Saving Windows Phone was necessary from the moment the new tiled interface was introduced, but not because of the lack of user, from itself! Interface is what we see first and this has to be modified to be acceptable by the average day user. It is definitely pretty, but mainly dysfunctional user interface, which I personally struggle with till this moment. I tried to voice this already many times on different Windows Central posts, first time years ago, after few weeks using of first HTC windows phone with tiled interface. Here we go again in point by point my MUST DO list:
    1) Every tile has to have name below or on the tile! Names should be editable by user, just like names of shortcuts on Windows Desktop are, mostly because of cryptic names of many apps.
    2) One should be able to use dark font color when background color is light. It is impossible right now to see what is on the Start screen when background is set for bright color and font is by default white.
    3) The tiles have too many sizes and very fast it is counterproductive to attach more of them to the Start. This creates long display difficult to scroll downward and remember where the tile was. Please, introduce "pages" of tiles, like Android and Apple have, they may be changed by scrolling down or sideways, but this mechanism must be built into interface.
    4) The whole interface moves to easily and is too sensitive to the touch. Accidental by hand or even in the pocket moves tiles around. "Repairing" to the original position may take long time and sometimes, for less skilfull user, is simply impossible. The interface must be "dummy" safe, by introducing eg. a "lock" application, which immobilizes position of tiles until "unlocking" it. It does not mean we need a password to do it. It is only to lock in place the whole set of Start tiles.
    5) Getting things done with Settings is too complicated. Mostly because there is too many things which we need to search for not knowing what they are. A very difficult task even with Bing/Cortana help. One has to create a simple logical list of things easily accessible to every user. I understand it, it is Windows 10 on cell phone and all Settings are there, but cell phone is still not a desktop computer and can have two kinds of settings apps, those easy ones for anyone and those for people who want to dabble more inside the system.
    6) Applications. I never missed them, but I understand why are they missed by so many people. They are an easy entrance to achieve something on the web in much simplified way. So, these is a valid point, but, if Edge browser had a easy going brother?
    7) A browser which is really able to display web info correctly and transparently on the small phone screen. A browser which, first of all, scales pages to the screen size. Not like the present one. Then the need for thousands of simple web based applications will disappear. Every "favorite" could be made as a tile and saved to the list of applications and/or to the Start screen tile.
    8) Make window phones available in phone stores. There were times, when entering TMobile store to look at windows phone salesmen didn't even know what is Windows Phone! It was at time when TMobile promotion was going on for Alcatel phone and many similar occasions like that. It is insane. Same ATT stores. I do not talk here about smaller vendors who depend on Android only.

    Every time a new updated comes to my Lumia 950 I am fearing that some nice features will disappear, like live photos did, and now my friends with iPhones show live photos which I used to have for the past 2 years and don't have anymore, why?
    Too many whys, too many question marks, specially, why does it take so much effort to build a reliable phone (not like Lumia 950 or 950XL) and it is possible to build Surface tablet or XBOX One X? Cost return? Please, illuminate me.
    12-08-2017 07:37 PM
  9. Brewer James's Avatar
    Fix the browser, even on strong Wi-Fi my lumia 530 would crash constantly. Also the inability to play videos was maddening, that stupid code error. If they would've fixed that they'd still be selling phones.
    12-09-2017 05:44 PM
  10. Kevin Rush's Avatar
    Add more live tile features. More data updating on the various size tiles.
    12-09-2017 07:21 PM
  11. Ryujingt3's Avatar
    Bring back the design ethos of Nokia. Some of their Windows phone designs were superb. The Windows Lumia phone designs were not a patch on Nokia's. The 950 was appalling. Drop the name Windows too. Failing that sell the UI design to another company in order the keep this element out their.
    Microsoft have already started dropping the use of 'Windows' such as in the Store. But even if they make a Surface phone it will still be running Windows of some kind.
    12-10-2017 04:03 AM
  12. Hirox K's Avatar
    Make a Android phone and call it Windows Phone... how will that benefit MS? It won't help win10PC, xbox, IOT, AR, MR, Windows as a whole either.
    WP lack users and no users means no apps / devs support, no apps / devs support means no users. Chicken & Egg.
    Paying devs won't work. What if my app on Android can make my studio millions or billions a month? How much you gonna pay me? How long you wanna keep feeding my programmers and designers? How many companies you gonna pay each month?

    The 3 biggest OS we have right now are iOS, Android and Win10 (standard PC and S), there's just no room for a 4th OS (or 3rd mobile OS).
    Older PC will perish and win10 will eventually dominate the PC space... till one day, when phone CPU is fast enough and someone start porting traditional productivity applications from Windows. There'll be dominos and majority will leave Windows. Steam won't be able to help because not everyone's a dedicate gamer or PC gamer.
    The only way to prevent this from happening... is through Windows Store and UWP. You need a platform for people to invest, the more people spend on a platform, the harder for them to jump ship.
    Sure, a portable device is necessary, but a WP runs only WP app will never work imo (because of chicken & egg). It needs to merge with win10PC, act fast, use the advantage before it's too late. Which is why I think win10arm is a good start. But notebooks are not phones? How hard could it be for OEM to produce a 6" ARM device?

    They should also push XPA harder.
    Sure, we need casual games for mass majority but traditional games can def jump start win10arm sales, especially when 5" or 6" is available on the market.
    As a xbox owner, a) Android b) a device that can run what win10PC runs + indie XPA games... I think this is an easy pick.
    Plus, you can have pen support, OneDrive On Demand, syncs and other nice features.
    Last edited by Hirox K; 12-12-2017 at 06:47 AM.
    vEEP pEEP likes this.
    12-10-2017 12:24 PM
  13. Chaos2000's Avatar
    I Think Microsoft should go open source like Android. New hardware is needed and a better OS, there is no need for MS to compete against Google & Apple because MS got all the tools they just need to give consumers for what they been looking for, for example if MS can make win32 files into xap files for phone users than it can be a real game changer. MS can save their phones if the put a little effort into it, their OEM partners will also follow the new strategy. MS can make a pocket pc cellular it is not that hard that is what consumers need, so windows mobile can be save a phone that operates like a pc better than a Samsung Note device, can it happen... yes it can if MS decides to stop fooling around and make windows 10 Andromeda a reality in 2018, we must wait and see what will come out next year.
    vEEP pEEP likes this.
    12-10-2017 04:48 PM
  14. vEEP pEEP's Avatar
    I'd hope a company like HP would take it ok. They did a great job ok the HP Elite x3, they know computers, and i trust them to follow through....


    I Think Microsoft should go open source like Android. New hardware is needed and a better OS, there is no need for MS to compete against Google & Apple because MS got all the tools they just need to give consumers for what they been looking for, for example if MS can make win32 files into xap files for phone users than it can be a real game changer. MS can save their phones if the put a little effort into it, their OEM partners will also follow the new strategy. MS can make a pocket pc cellular it is not that hard that is what consumers need, so windows mobile can be save a phone that operates like a pc better than a Samsung Note device, can it happen... yes it can if MS decides to stop fooling around and make windows 10 Andromeda a reality in 2018, we must wait and see what will come out next year.
    12-14-2017 08:20 PM
  15. fatclue_98's Avatar
    I Think Microsoft should go open source like Android. New hardware is needed and a better OS, there is no need for MS to compete against Google & Apple because MS got all the tools they just need to give consumers for what they been looking for, for example if MS can make win32 files into xap files for phone users than it can be a real game changer. MS can save their phones if the put a little effort into it, their OEM partners will also follow the new strategy. MS can make a pocket pc cellular it is not that hard that is what consumers need, so windows mobile can be save a phone that operates like a pc better than a Samsung Note device, can it happen... yes it can if MS decides to stop fooling around and make windows 10 Andromeda a reality in 2018, we must wait and see what will come out next year.
    What possible good could another Android OEM bring? HTC, LG, Sony, Nokia and BlackBerry are marquee brands and are all struggling to post serious sales numbers. Save for BlackBerry, profits are not exactly pouring in either. Any one of these companies are capable of building a handset that is head and shoulders above anything Samsung could put out in terms of features and/or UI. What'll that get them? Critical acclaim and garbage sales.

    Sent from my Idol 4S on mTalk
    aximtreo and TgeekB like this.
    12-15-2017 11:13 AM
  16. TgeekB's Avatar
    What possible good could another Android OEM bring? HTC, LG, Sony, Nokia and BlackBerry are marquee brands and are all struggling to post serious sales numbers. Save for BlackBerry, profits are not exactly pouring in either. Any one of these companies are capable of building a handset that is head and shoulders above anything Samsung could put out in terms of features and/or UI. What'll that get them? Critical acclaim and garbage sales.

    Sent from my Idol 4S on mTalk
    Agree. Just like there doesn’t appear to be demand for a 3rd mobile OS, there certainly isn’t room for another Android OEM.
    fatclue_98 and aximtreo like this.
    12-15-2017 03:22 PM
  17. toshibasz's Avatar
    Tiles, metro design is the biggest problem. Totally useless within desktop too. Before you kill it for good, redesign it, and make it simmilar to other 2. Dock icons....
    12-16-2017 05:53 AM
  18. Kevin Rush's Avatar
    Tiles, metro design is the biggest problem. Totally useless within desktop too. Before you kill it for good, redesign it, and make it simmilar to other 2. Dock icons....
    I'm tired of the "Windows XP" graphic icon look of apple and android, even if they have updated the graphic design of the grid of icon buttons.

    I like all the information sources presented on my Windows tiles. It vaguely reminds me of the great information presented on the Bloomberg terminals (lots of information) with the ability to sprinkle in "dumb" little icons on the start screen of my design.

    Best Wishes
    12-16-2017 09:46 PM
  19. Ryujingt3's Avatar
    We can all agree that if MS allowed apps like Firefox in the Store (a long time ago they thought about it) and Google could bring their services and apps to Windows Phone (which would never happen) then Windows Phone could look very different today. Does anyone else remember, a few years back, that Snapchat was supposed to be coming to Windows Phone? The Snapchat CEO doesn't like Microsoft anyway so that app would never have made it to a Microsoft device.

    Why is it that MS is being open and making sure their services and apps are now available on iPhone and Android but, back in the glory days of Windows Phone as an eco-system, the other vendors failed to do the same?
    12-17-2017 04:50 AM
  20. TgeekB's Avatar
    I'm tired of the "Windows XP" graphic icon look of apple and android, even if they have updated the graphic design of the grid of icon buttons.

    I like all the information sources presented on my Windows tiles. It vaguely reminds me of the great information presented on the Bloomberg terminals (lots of information) with the ability to sprinkle in "dumb" little icons on the start screen of my design.

    Best Wishes
    I find the Windows tiles make the home page too busy looking. I would like something more in the middle, a few tiles and the rest blank. I think I did play around with blank tiles at one time to try to get that effect. Anyway, it’s nice to have choices which is why I’m bummed it didn’t catch on.
    Guytronic and aximtreo like this.
    12-17-2017 07:04 AM
  21. Guytronic's Avatar
    I find the Windows tiles make the home page too busy looking. I’m bummed it didn’t catch on.
    Agreed...
    Consistently readjusting the homescreen turned into a self induced chore.
    The busy look of flipping flopping tiles and under-powered phones killed it for me.

    I do wish things had turned around for WP.
    aximtreo likes this.
    12-17-2017 07:14 AM
  22. TgeekB's Avatar
    Agreed...
    Consistently readjusting the homescreen turned into a self induced chore.
    The tiles and under-powered phones killed it for me.
    That’s what killed Android for me. I was constantly tweaking things, which I felt was a positive thing at first, but got tired of it after a while. I know some people call the iPhone boring, but I’m enjoying being bored right now. It just works the way it’s supposed to and the rest of the time I don’t worry about it.

    There’s no perfect OS (I’ve said this a million times for people who are going to say I’m hating on Windows phone) so it comes down to finding the one that works best for you. Live tiles probably show the most information on the home screen for those who enjoy that.
    Guytronic likes this.
    12-17-2017 07:21 AM
  23. anon(7929613)'s Avatar
    That’s what killed Android for me. I was constantly tweaking things, which I felt was a positive thing at first, but got tired of it after a while. I know some people call the iPhone boring, but I’m enjoying being bored right now. It just works the way it’s supposed to and the rest of the time I don’t worry about it.

    There’s no perfect OS (I’ve said this a million times for people who are going to say I’m hating on Windows phone) so it comes down to finding the one that works best for you. Live tiles probably show the most information on the home screen for those who enjoy that.
    Well, the UI is just a small part of an OS. Other things is more important like security and memory management. I think iOS is very smart in handling memory and hence iPhones runs so well even on lesser RAM.
    12-17-2017 07:33 AM
  24. Guytronic's Avatar
    That’s what killed Android for me.
    I used to move things around a lot on Android also. Not so much anymore.
    An occasional spurt of customizing here and there. I stay very lean on the phones now.
    Took me a while to settle down.
    TgeekB likes this.
    12-17-2017 07:34 AM
  25. TgeekB's Avatar
    Well, the UI is just a small part of an OS. Other things is more important like security and memory management. I think iOS is very smart in handling memory and hence iPhones runs so well even on lesser RAM.
    Very true, thanks for pointing that out.
    Security, etc. should be amongst the main reasons for choosing an OS.
    12-17-2017 07:35 AM
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