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09-18-2018 02:36 PM
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  1. Hirox K's Avatar
    With current VR, when you sit, your neck is the limitation, therefore left analog controls character's movement and right analog + headset rotation offset determines character's facing.
    When you stand, your room is the limitation. You can certainly design your game to rely no right analog for rotation and let user walk around freely in the environment. But, you will hit the wall eventually, forcing you to keep coming back to the center.

    Best game we can make outta these limitations are arcade rail shooters or racers (and tbh, racers and rail shooters are very much alike, in terms of programming).

    WMR?
    There's no MR yet. Without spatial mapping (e.g. Project Kinect for Azure), current WMRs are just VRs.
    Without spatial mapping (the one we use for HoloLens), you cannot replace your real world table with a 3d table, replace a coke can with a cylinder or replace someone standing next to you with an avatar.
    * MS had a video about "what is MR".
    * The only difference between current WMR and VRs are the position tracking mechanism. One's from headset, one's from cameras around the room.

    In order for VR to thrive, we need cordless (WoA? small, less power consumption), we need spatial mapping (Kinect for Azure?).
    Ultimately, we need body signal hijacking or... next level, brain wave reader & writer.

    If MS wants to push AR for gaming... AR can do well in average living room environment.
    But for now, it's for business.

    We have VR experiment team in the studio. I believe VR can do well in amusement park so someone can stand next to it, to care and to hand out hygiene masks.

    * Current VR hype comes from businessmen and enthusiasts.
    Last edited by Hirox K; 09-06-2018 at 11:44 AM.
    rodneyej likes this.
    09-06-2018 11:23 AM
  2. rodneyej's Avatar
    This is my thinking,, exactly
    Originally posted by L0n3N1nja
    I think the hype has died down some because it's no longer new and exciting tech, but I don't think its gonna go away.

    Personally I want to get more into VR, but it's a bit expensive and I've got more important things than to spend hundreds on a new toy. I don't have the PS4, and my PC isn't powerful enough, so it makes it a bit spendy.
    09-06-2018 03:25 PM
  3. rodneyej's Avatar
    I'm also thinking this. The initial hype may be slowing down a bit.
    Originally posted by Scienceguy Labs
    I have the Lenovo MR headset. During the first few weeks of owning it, I was really into it, but it's been almost three months since I've last used it. It's an incredible piece of technology. I just don't have a practical user for it yet.
    Scienceguy Labs likes this.
    09-06-2018 03:27 PM
  4. rodneyej's Avatar
    Interesting. Thanks.
    Originally posted by Hirox K
    With current VR, when you sit, your neck is the limitation, therefore left analog controls character's movement and right analog + headset rotation offset determines character's facing.
    When you stand, your room is the limitation. You can certainly design your game to rely no right analog for rotation and let user walk around freely in the environment. But, you will hit the wall eventually, forcing you to keep coming back to the center.

    Best game we can make outta these limitations are arcade rail shooters or racers (and tbh, racers and rail shooters are very much alike, in terms of programming).

    WMR?
    There's no MR yet. Without spatial mapping (e.g. Project Kinect for Azure), current WMRs are just VRs.
    Without spatial mapping (the one we use for HoloLens), you cannot replace your real world table with a 3d table, replace a coke can with a cylinder or replace someone standing next to you with an avatar.
    * MS had a video about "what is MR".
    * The only difference between current WMR and VRs are the position tracking mechanism. One's from headset, one's from cameras around the room.

    In order for VR to thrive, we need cordless (WoA? small, less power consumption), we need spatial mapping (Kinect for Azure?).
    Ultimately, we need body signal hijacking or... next level, brain wave reader & writer.

    If MS wants to push AR for gaming... AR can do well in average living room environment.
    But for now, it's for business.

    We have VR experiment team in the studio. I believe VR can do well in amusement park so someone can stand next to it, to care and to hand out hygiene masks.

    * Current VR hype comes from businessmen and enthusiasts.
    09-06-2018 03:29 PM
  5. Andres Zuccarino's Avatar
    Hi, I'm from Argentina. My experience was incredible, considering the beginnings of VR in the 80's we are a great breakthrough. Now the big question is whether it is enough and if it will fail again or not. The first problem is the cost, the good thing is that it is going down, but even more must go down. The other problem is the compatibility of the games and applications between the different platforms, so that this becomes massive has to have a bigger store. It should also be more comfortable. However the progress is amazing, the potential that VR has is incredible and not only for the games, for example when you see a huge Netflix screen you realize that it could even be the future of the cinema, you could acquire the virtual ticket to see a premiere of a movie, and you would not have problems with the location with respect to the screen, what if you could see a recital live in 360 ?. But going back to the present I think it is close, it will not be massified yet, but it will continue to grow little by little if the costs go down and they become more comfortable. It also occurred to me that it would be easier to grow if you create shops or venues to play VR and AR, which can not initially acquire their own VR could occasionally go to play with friends in place where this is offered experience. We already know that in several countries there are places where you can participate in AR games championships, if this expands along with VR and the games adapt to this, it could be a big boost.
    09-10-2018 07:11 AM
  6. GraniteStateColin's Avatar
    There is not a good comparison. 3D TV was pretty much useless on home TVs and didn't make much difference in viewing (except for Avatar) so you ended wearing ridiculous glasses for no good reason. VR is a massive difference to the experience. The difference between looking at game on a screen in front of you or immersing yourself into the environment and game like you're there.
    Mythos13, I believe that's true for some, just like 3D was exciting for some. For others, both 3D and VR are nothing more than a gimmick. For 3D, you could get every IMAX and other 3D screened movie in BluRay 3D, far more than just Avatar. But people weren't willing to deal with the hardware hassle. The market reaction was effectively, "watching TV should not require special glasses." I see the same reaction from VR users -- there are a bunch of excited early adopters, a few others who think "Oh that's mildly interesting" and the rest, the majority, who just shrug and say, "Seems like a lot of money and hassle for nothing."

    Keep in mind 3D TV was effectively FREE and it still didn't catch on because it required a different way of doing things people were already use do to doing (sitting on the couch and watching TV). VR has a smaller target market (gamers are a much smaller segment of the market than TV watchers), but it's probably more willing to change if it dramatically improves gaming (to your point).

    So is there anything more gaming-related we could look at in recent history? Yes, we have 2 recent hardware changes that are somewhat similar: the Nintendo Wii and it's motion controllers and Microsoft's Kinect. Motion controllers on the Wii succeeded, in part because of good games that specifically took advantage of that system and because it was cheaper than the other game systems without them (PS3 and Xbox 360). Kinect did not succeed (though started off good with the original 360 version based on a wave of hope for what it could do), probably ultimately failing because there weren't many hit games that only made sense with the Kinect, even though it was also included free originally with the Xbox One.

    Based on that history, I'd say that VR will succeed only if there emerge great games that only make sense when played using VR gear. It's hard to imagine a game that needs that kind of gear to work beyond some niche experiences, not a AAA game. Therefore, I conclude VR will probably not gain mainstream acceptance, at least not in anything resembling its current form, but I wouldn't bet my life on that conclusion. There's certainly room for someone clever to come up with a great game that requires VR and surprise us. If that happens, I'll be the first in line to buy the latest VR gear.
    09-12-2018 01:05 PM
  7. Luuthian's Avatar
    I don’t think it’s an afterthought so much as it grew as quick as it could, given the cost and complexity of it, and now it’s hit the plateau of its potential until other factors change dramatically.

    Unless costs are reduced and people buy hardware capable of handling VR it’s not going anywhere fast. AR still has far more potential in the long term, IMO, but it faces the same problems.
    rodneyej likes this.
    09-18-2018 02:36 PM
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