04-06-2014 09:11 PM
64 123
tools
  1. John20212's Avatar
    Calm down John. I could have invested more time and offered a better explanation, but you might also have put more effort into understanding (or asking a follow up question) before falling off your rocker. None of these are bogus excuses.

    At the end of the day, it all comes down to money. The costs associated with each service varies from region to region, country to country. The things I mentioned are the primary reasons why that is so, although the exact details differ from service to service (likely excluding Cortana which I don't yet know enough about) .

    For every region, MS must decide if the benefits of offering any particular service justifies the expenses. Due to the differing cost structures, MS doesn't always reach the same conclusion. That is why MS' services aren't universally available.

    This doesn't at all explain why Apple has little difficulty rolling out their own services world wide, but it was never intended to. Most of that is easily explained by the financial realities. Apple pulls in almost $400 of pure profits per iOS device sold. MS nets less than $10 per WP device sold (now reduced to $0).

    Really, I'm not trying to excuse anything. I find the situation extremely unsatisfying and WP will pay a price for it. I'm just explaining why things are the way they are.

    Thanks for the reasoned calm response; I do tend voice my opinions rather strongly, but it's nothing personal, I've been told I come of rather bullish sometimes ;) .
    I do however still disagree with your opinion on this; and I really do hope MS fixes this if they really want to compete on the global stage with their 'devices and services'.
    a5cent, piff2222 and Laura Knotek like this.
    04-04-2014 11:07 AM
  2. Karthik Naik's Avatar
    Your idea is right, but your a bit off the mark.

    Cortana in terms of rollout, is going to be very similiar to Siri from what I can tell.

    When Siri came to iPhones, it was rolled out to all countries, but I remember that Australia had very limited functionality with what it could do.

    My best guess is, Microsoft doesn't want that. It wants the same experience across all regions and countries. So, they are rolling it out slowly with close to full functionality - hence the Beta in US.
    totally agree with you!!
    im from india and siri still doesnt understand our accents here
    windows phone 8's voice command thingy which is brought up by pressing and holding the windows button on the other hand understands our accents perfectly
    in india there are multiple accents(none sound like the stereotypical one as such :D ) but wp8 catches all when set on uk/us(except for a few words which are pronounced differently such as granite) but when set to English(India) its very very accurate
    i feel cortana will have the same accuracy and will be a great working product unlike siri which at the end of the day(atleast for india) was a marketing gimmick
    hopefully microsoft will get this right and will obviously need to master english(us and uk) before worldwide! :)
    04-04-2014 11:27 AM
  3. a5cent's Avatar
    Your post hinged on the thesis that since MS makes ~$10 per WP device, they are not in a position to extend Bing services (and therefore Cortana and other features) from a purely financial viewpoint.
    No. You are still reading between the lines and imagining statements to exist that I never made. Nowhere did I say MS is financially not in a position to do so. I said it's a cost/benefit analysis that sways MS in one direction or another. It's not a question of "can" or "can't". It's a fuzzy question with fuzzy answers, involving estimates of what MS expects to gain in comparison to the money and time they expect to invest. Of course that is always weighed against the things that could be achieved by investing those resources elsewhere.

    I will again stress that all this is in regard to MS' existing services, not Cortana. In regard to Cortana all I can say is that Bing is an issue, but I have no explanation as to why that couldn't be solved in time as to facilitate a more global Cortana role out.

    I completely understand everything you are saying. Despite you probably believing otherwise, I actually agree with most of it (or even all, at least to a degree). Again. It's just not relevant to my point, because in contrast to you, I'm not trying to explain what MS should or should not be doing, or even if what they are doing makes sense or not.
    04-04-2014 12:17 PM
  4. a5cent's Avatar
    If it is about profit per region, then surely the US would be last on the list due to there being about 20 WP8 customers in total in that country? If they're hitting US first then they should just release Cortana on iOS and stop there. Doesn't add up as an explanation, sorry.
    Out of the many countries that enjoy access to all of MS' services, the U.S. is consistently the first. Whatever the reason for that may be, it's irrelevant, because it has absolutely nothing to do with anything I'm discussing here. I may not be explaining things well (I wouldn't be surprised), but you are not understanding well either.

    I'm not explaining why one country gets access to MS services before another country does. I'm explaining why some countries don't get access to some services at all, while others do. Those are two entirely different topics.

    Finally, it's not about profits per region. That should be obvious, as profits don't exist for MS in the smartphone space. As I said above, it's about costs per region, weighed against the projected benefits. The part about "projected" benefits is important. The U.S. and China being the two largest smartphone markets, is likely reason enough to prioritize them over more successful WP markets, possibly also explaining why China will be one of the first countries after the U.S. where Cortana is received, despite being a country with almost zero WP market share.
    Last edited by a5cent; 04-04-2014 at 12:56 PM. Reason: Spelling
    04-04-2014 12:17 PM
  5. ven07's Avatar
    This is only a rumour but I have heard that Microsoft are aiming to launch Cortana in Q2 this year in the UK and China.
    Actually that rumor has been verified by wpcentral :)
    04-04-2014 06:25 PM
  6. neo158's Avatar
    Actually that rumor has been verified by wpcentral :)
    Really, which article was it?
    04-04-2014 07:51 PM
  7. colinkiama's Avatar
    Well when you change the browser and search language to US, bing becomes useful and it won't affect the store.
    04-05-2014 03:55 AM
  8. Foma Kiniaev's Avatar
    Well when you change the browser and search language to US, bing becomes useful and it won't affect the store.
    You cannot sell product expecting ppl worldwide doing this
    piff2222 likes this.
    04-05-2014 06:03 AM
  9. boovish's Avatar
    Your idea is right, but your a bit off the mark.

    Cortana in terms of rollout, is going to be very similiar to Siri from what I can tell.

    When Siri came to iPhones, it was rolled out to all countries, but I remember that Australia had very limited functionality with what it could do.

    My best guess is, Microsoft doesn't want that. It wants the same experience across all regions and countries. So, they are rolling it out slowly with close to full functionality - hence the Beta in US.
    Australia always has problems with new tech. Their LTE is not completely functional
    04-05-2014 08:10 AM
  10. Chris Sandiford's Avatar
    Really, which article was it?
    Joey Bravo said it in the 8.1 keynote speech.
    04-05-2014 08:25 AM
  11. Jazmac's Avatar
    Please stop being an MS apologist.

    This is not some twopenny startup we are talking about. This is frakkin' Microsoft. They have enough money stashed in tax havens outside the USA to make Bing work properly across the entire world and not even notice the expense.

    Every other major company uses revenue from just one or two major streams to finance other projects. These may never make a penny directly, but are important to the future of the company in some way.

    Google uses ads to pay for Search, Android, Glass and self-driving cars. Amazon uses profit from e-commerce ops to finance things like the Kindle and delivery drones.

    MS pulls in more than 70% profit on Office and Windows alone. If they are not pouring that profit into catching up with the competition, I can't help but feel they're still treating this whole mobile thing as a game.

    They say many parts of the world may not see Cortana until 2015. When I read that I was like "What's Nadella smoking?!". I now predict that the legalisation of marijuana in Washington State (i.e. MS HQ) will herald the doom of MS.
    Money is one of the primary reasons MS is slower to move in other countries. The company has to follow stricter guidelines than Apple or Samsung. MS was hit with a major fine by the EU and it won't take much for them to send in the dogs again. So they have to move slower and unfortunately for many outside the US, you have to wait on a longer approval process. That is fact.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    04-05-2014 08:55 AM
  12. prasath1234's Avatar
    Please leave Corttana.lets enjoy the great live tile os wp8

    Sent from my C2305 using WPCentral Forums mobile app
    04-05-2014 09:11 AM
  13. Markham Ranja's Avatar
    Money is one of the primary reasons MS is slower to move in other countries. The company has to follow stricter guidelines than Apple or Samsung. MS was hit with a major fine by the EU and it won't take much for them to send in the dogs again. So they have to move slower and unfortunately for many outside the US, you have to wait on a longer approval process. That is fact.
    Please provide a citation wherein it specifies exactly how a 7-year old case about browser bundling affects rollout of new features and services like Cortana on WP.

    Also, note that WP doesn't enjoy any significant market share anywhere, much less a monopoly - therefore antitrust issues are not relevant at all. The EU does not and will not care what MS does in the mobile market until they enjoy a non-trivial marketshare.

    Finally, adding "That is fact" to vacuous statements without providing statements doesn't make one look cool. In fact, when called out, one might end up looking rather foolish...

    edit: Your post starts off with money being the reason why MS doesn't provide services on time (or at all) outside the USA and then jumps to talking about antitrust issues. Please explain this internal inconsistency as well.
    anony_mouse and piff2222 like this.
    04-05-2014 10:42 AM
  14. savagelizards's Avatar
    No, it isn't. SD card slots on most operating systems introduce more problems than they solve, at least for the novice users. The only flagships on the market with an SD slot are the Galaxy S series. And they don't sell because of those, IMHO. (don't ask why they do sell, I have no idea).
    They sell because the same phones are available on all carriers. A G4 is a G4 is a G4, regardless if you have Verizon or ATT or Sprint.
    04-05-2014 01:02 PM
  15. Jazmac's Avatar
    Please provide a citation wherein it specifies exactly how a 7-year old case about browser bundling affects rollout of new features and services like Cortana on WP.

    Also, note that WP doesn't enjoy any significant market share anywhere, much less a monopoly - therefore antitrust issues are not relevant at all. The EU does not and will not care what MS does in the mobile market until they enjoy a non-trivial marketshare.

    Finally, adding "That is fact" to vacuous statements without providing statements doesn't make one look cool. In fact, when called out, one might end up looking rather foolish...

    edit: Your post starts off with money being the reason why MS doesn't provide services on time (or at all) outside the USA and then jumps to talking about antitrust issues. Please explain this internal inconsistency as well.
    Pump your brakes Longshanks, its not about looking cool. I'm not one of those kids you xbox with. Let me try to break down my language to you. It costs MONEY to litigate a case. It costs MS money when the EU tells MS you better watch your tacos when you do business over here otherwise, we are taking you back to court. Just because a case is 7 years old son, has no bearing on the letter of the law. At least not in the EU it doesn't. They wanted to NAIL MS to the cross because of an accidental, (at least MS called it accidental) disregard of giving Windows users a browser choice when Windows 8 dropped. This is why MS takes its time in some countries than others. It costs them real money. I don't know if it is any clearer to you based on your point of reference, but from my read of history and this case, there isn't any other conclusion to draw from it.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    04-05-2014 01:14 PM
  16. colinkiama's Avatar
    Pump your brakes Longshanks, its not about looking cool. I'm not one of those kids you xbox with. Let me try to break down my language to you. It costs MONEY to litigate a case. It costs MS money when the EU tells MS you better watch your tacos when you do business over here otherwise, we are taking you back to court. Just because a case is 7 years old son, has no bearing on the letter of the law. At least not in the EU it doesn't. They wanted to NAIL MS to the cross because of an accidental, (at least MS called it accidental) disregard of giving Windows users a browser choice when Windows 8 dropped. This is why MS takes its time in some countries than others. It costs them real money. I don't know if it is any clearer to you based on your point of reference, but from my read of history and this case, there isn't any other conclusion to draw from it.
    exactly, that's why they are SLOWLY rolling it out. To make sure there are no mistakes so EU can't pin them down again.
    Jazmac and Laura Knotek like this.
    04-05-2014 03:39 PM
  17. Markham Ranja's Avatar
    Pump your brakes Longshanks, its not about looking cool. I'm not one of those kids you xbox with. Let me try to break down my language to you. It costs MONEY to litigate a case. It costs MS money when the EU tells MS you better watch your tacos when you do business over here otherwise, we are taking you back to court. Just because a case is 7 years old son, has no bearing on the letter of the law. At least not in the EU it doesn't. They wanted to NAIL MS to the cross because of an accidental, (at least MS called it accidental) disregard of giving Windows users a browser choice when Windows 8 dropped. This is why MS takes its time in some countries than others. It costs them real money. I don't know if it is any clearer to you based on your point of reference, but from my read of history and this case, there isn't any other conclusion to draw from it.
    Again, that is Windows which enjoys a majority of the marketshare. WP doesn't, therefore there is no question of antitrust, therefore the EU Competition Commission doesn't care.

    If MS is really doing this, when every other company like Apple and Google seem to be able to release everything everywhere (for the most part), it just doesn't look good.
    04-06-2014 02:41 AM
  18. colinkiama's Avatar
    Again, that is Windows which enjoys a majority of the marketshare. WP doesn't, therefore there is no question of antitrust, therefore the EU Competition Commission doesn't care.

    If MS is really doing this, when every other company like Apple and Google seem to be able to release everything everywhere (for the most part), it just doesn't look good.
    Siri started as a beta that was only in the US so why are you complaining, it will come to you.
    04-06-2014 02:52 AM
  19. anony_mouse's Avatar
    Siri started as a beta that was only in the US so why are you complaining, it will come to you.
    To the majority of the world, it looks like an insult, and it clearly shows where Microsoft's priorities lie. We take that into account when we decide what products to buy.
    John20212 likes this.
    04-06-2014 04:50 AM
  20. paulsalter's Avatar
    So is it not an insult to the rest of the world when google don't bring all features of Google Now to the world at the same time?

    Not sure on Siri, but is the experience on this the same everywhere in the world?
    04-06-2014 05:03 AM
  21. prasath1234's Avatar
    Ya this indifferent attitudes by Ms towards rest of the world is going to cost for the Ms.

    Sent from my C2305 using WPCentral Forums mobile app
    04-06-2014 05:14 AM
  22. HarkAtYou's Avatar
    Just a thought. But lots of people have said you can change your regional settings to activate Cortana. I wonder if this will be like activating siri on an iphone 4?.

    Many people were angry that when siri came out it was only available on the iphone 4s and newer. Essentially the reason for this was that apple wanted everyone to upgrade, and there was no other reason to, they were basically the same phone.

    People with jailbroken phones were able to quite merrily install siri and it worked perfectly well showing that there was no physical reason not to allow it.

    However whilst siri the app worked perfectly well (as it has when it was a downloadable app in the store, made by someone else), apple had blocked access to the severs to anyone without an iphone 4s or iPad 3, so on an iphone 4 it would just fail to find results.

    So i wonder if Cortana would be the same, she would be there but just ignore you?

    By the way, even though siri went global at launch, she was only available if you spent another 500 upgrading early, Cortana may be delayed to all countries, but at least she's free for all, even existing wp8 handsets (ignoring ofcourse wp7, but they are very old, made differently and have a low share these days).

    Oh and not only that, but apple also stopped anyone who had previously purchased the siri app from the developer from being able to use it anymore. They all still got over it and bought a new phone. Lol
    colinkiama likes this.
    04-06-2014 05:22 AM
  23. Foma Kiniaev's Avatar
    Just a thought. But lots of people have said you can change your regional settings to activate Cortana. I wonder if this will be like activating siri on an iphone 4?.

    Many people were angry that when siri came out it was only available on the iphone 4s and newer. Essentially the reason for this was that apple wanted everyone to upgrade, and there was no other reason to, they were basically the same phone.

    People with jailbroken phones were able to quite merrily install siri and it worked perfectly well showing that there was no physical reason not to allow it.

    However whilst siri the app worked perfectly well (as it has when it was a downloadable app in the store, made by someone else), apple had blocked access to the severs to anyone without an iphone 4s or iPad 3, so on an iphone 4 it would just fail to find results.

    So i wonder if Cortana would be the same, she would be there but just ignore you?

    By the way, even though siri went global at launch, she was only available if you spent another 500 upgrading early, Cortana may be delayed to all countries, but at least she's free for all, even existing wp8 handsets (ignoring ofcourse wp7, but they are very old, made differently and have a low share these days).

    Oh and not only that, but apple also stopped anyone who had previously purchased the siri app from the developer from being able to use it anymore. They all still got over it and bought a new phone. Lol
    100% agree! Even the cheapest 520 will get this feature for free and well polished when arribes to your regin.
    04-06-2014 05:36 AM
  24. prasath1234's Avatar
    But Apple are world leaders in smartphone they can afford to do such things but if ms does the same thing it will be doom for them.that's just my opinion

    Sent from my C2305 using WPCentral Forums mobile app
    04-06-2014 05:39 AM
  25. neo158's Avatar
    But Apple are world leaders in smartphone they can afford to do such things but if ms does the same thing it will be doom for them.that's just my opinion

    Sent from my C2305 using WPCentral Forums mobile app
    According to who, Apple. As far as I can tell it's Android that's the leader now.
    04-06-2014 06:51 AM
64 123

Similar Threads

  1. Cortana companion in Halo
    By Devmer11 in forum Cortana
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 04-05-2014, 04:02 PM
  2. @Cortana Twitter Handle
    By Indistinguishable in forum Cortana
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 04-04-2014, 04:56 PM
  3. Does Cortana work in the WP 8.1 RC SDK?
    By husam2277 in forum Windows Phone 8.1
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 04-04-2014, 02:19 AM
  4. The Nokia Lumia 930 does not have Glance, heres why
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 04-03-2014, 04:30 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD