10-08-2015 10:02 PM
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  1. zkyevolved's Avatar
    They need to look at BlackBerry, and learn from it. It didn't work when you priced your phone the same or higher than iPhone, and Android. You are trying to catch up, so you have to spend money to close the distance.
    I don't know when the Blackberry Priv will be launched, but I'm going to be fairly certain and say that it's not going to sell for less than 600 euros; Blackberry never learns. They've been struggling for years. I would have picked up a Blackberry Passport, but 1 year later today (actually, 16 months later) it STILL Costs over 600 euros! It's a dead platform which is converging to Android and they are STILL holding on to their silly price tag! Why on EARTH Would I pick a Blackberry Passport which has a worse camera than most Android devices, strange form factor (which I actually like), 0 apps, and no future over, for example, my LG G4 which costs less than 450 euros which DOES Have a future and updates, higher resolution screen, better camera, etc etc.

    I know NO company wants to deflate their own products, but come one... If I make a product X and I sell it for 200 bucks. Another company makes a better device Y, and they sell it for 150 and it's way more popular... I would have to, logically and strategically, get it into people's hands by lowering the price and marketing the hell out of out!!!

    Please Microsoft, make your premier flagship device 500 euros and let me buy it flat out :)
    10-04-2015 02:22 AM
  2. Aldrich Uyliong's Avatar
    Have you seen The Martian? I saw its premiere last night here in the Philippines. I'm happy to report seeing quite a few Surface Pro 3s.
    HeyCori and Kjetil Stokke like this.
    10-04-2015 02:32 AM
  3. Tien-Lin Chang's Avatar
    Microsoft already is selling Lumia devices at a loss. Apple is the only OS maker in the mobile space that actually make money on hardware but I know what you mean. And I think undercutting on price is a bad idea. It flies for upstarts but if an established company like Microsoft did that, it sends the wrong message to consumers.

    Specifically, it comes across as lack of confidence and lack of interest to support the product from the company. Remember that fire sales usually precede the closing of businesses.
    I don't think MS was selling at any loss ever, the lost was due to unable to sell and the unsold stock sit dead in the warehouse - the same reason how blackberry lose money on their BB10 device selling.

    The pricing-SPEC cruve across lumia product line after 2013 is a joke compare to android, the permium inside blah is totally BS unless you get the BOM and prove they really get better parts compare to other OEMs. MS is always profit-driven so the price-tag they put on lumia devices in asia area is Crazy. They didn't even mention if 950/XL will get PDAF and I really hope they don't just put a reworked 1520/930 sensor on their newest flagship.

    For those naive people believing the "MS is not interesting in market share" BS, to me the real reason if they put a sky high price tag on 950/XL line will be "since we couldn't get more outsider on board, we better rip those hardcore redneck harder to gain some profit".
    10-04-2015 06:16 AM
  4. Joni Sin's Avatar
    "Should New Lumia Devices be sold at a a loss ?"

    No need, it wont matter much.
    better if Winmo 10 could run android apks directly, that will better way attract more users
    10-04-2015 07:20 AM
  5. amcluesent's Avatar
    950 will be the Sony Betamax of mobis. Fact.
    10-04-2015 07:33 AM
  6. neo158's Avatar
    The problem is that failed for BlackBerry. Adding the Android runtime destroyed native BlackBerry app development and failed to improve market share. Now BlackBerry is releasing an Android device.

    If that succeeds, then BlackBerry 10 is dead. If that fails, then BlackBerry will most likely exit the handset market completely.
    I don't think so, the problem is that Blackberry killed native app development for consumers, so the ONLY apps consumers could use were Android apps. Microsoft have taken a different path, keep native app development for universal apps while offering Project Astoria and Islandwood as alternatives NOT replacements.
    a5cent, libra89 and HeyCori like this.
    10-04-2015 08:22 AM
  7. neo158's Avatar
    950 will be the Sony Betamax of mobis. Fact.
    Ah, you mean superior?
    a5cent and 920Walker like this.
    10-04-2015 08:23 AM
  8. ks_yeoh's Avatar
    Well, the price is just one part of the whole marketing strategy. Most consumer will first look at the appeal of Windows 10 and most only know Windows as something they use on a PC (desktop/laptop). Surface is doing a decent job at exposing Windows as a tablet though mostly as a light & ultra-portable 2-in-1. Lumia on the other hand started of pretty good at introducing the world to Windows Phone. But, we all know what happened and users are looking away. So, Microsoft really needs to sell the appeal of Window 10 mobile together with the Lumia hardware (including accessories) as one. Then, only at the final stage, we talk about pricing, plans and bundling of accessories if needed. So, what I'm trying to say is price is important but it should be the last thing on Microsoft's mind. Get the marketing right and the phone will sell itself at any reasonable price.
    Kjetil Stokke likes this.
    10-04-2015 09:19 AM
  9. sheldon cohn's Avatar
    Windows 10 phone is no where near able to get the market share, I have a Nokia 900 running Windows 7 and so far the Windows 10 is closer to it then Windows 8.1.
    Seems like the techs tried building from Windows 7 instead of 8.1. I been an insider with both the phone then the PC, but gave up on my Windows 10 phone and went back to 8.1.
    The techs couldn't create a new build that would install (10514 and 10536) without the user having to do a hard reset the phone.. That is no way to create a build, it must install without going through hard reset. There are many that now own the phone, that are technically challenged. The Microsoft techs creating the build needs to keep it in mind, those people deserve a phone that works for them too. There are a lot of sales that come by word of
    mouth, and those people can hurt sales.

    I once again point out there are so many apps that are being created that won't work on the phone, which is to me, the Windows phone should cost less, to get part of the market share. Charging a higher amount for a phone that is not capable to do a lot of things other phones can do isn't being to smart.
    zkyevolved likes this.
    10-04-2015 10:03 AM
  10. vicky geth's Avatar
    If MSFT reduce the price of the so called Flagships, then consumers who want to give w10m a try will surely go for Lumia brand. Yes!! This may increase the sale volume of w10m phones. But this may affect their another goal- 'Promoting other phone manufactures to enter windows market' (Assuming that win10m won't pick up immediately. Nevertheless they'll enter windows world If it attain huge success within a year from release). So one goal affects the other. MS guys need to look up on all 4 directions before making any step.
    920Walker and Robinator like this.
    10-04-2015 12:49 PM
  11. someone2639's Avatar
    I don't think that's how it should work. Sure, discount it, but only after you find a cheaper part (like the $70 price drop on the 3DS). Then people who didn't like the first price can easily jump on with the second wave.
    libra89 likes this.
    10-04-2015 01:33 PM
  12. Bloobed's Avatar
    There is also another route MS could take: have a launch discount, but raise the price after 2 weeks or a month or so, and then keep the new pricing until next release; this would increase the perceived value of the devices and early adopters would feel like they got a deal.
    Kjetil Stokke likes this.
    10-04-2015 01:39 PM
  13. sanien's Avatar
    They should sell it a few$ above production cost. You can't count in R&D and marketing when they have so low market% otherwise selling the phone at 1000$ wouldn't cut it. Cut the prices like One plus 2. 700-800$ seems a little step taken their market position.
    10-04-2015 02:05 PM
  14. sanien's Avatar
    I am not entirely sure what you mean but previews isn't meant for people that are technically challenged. WP10 isn't supposed to be your daily drive either, I too gave up on it on my L640 and L1520.
    920Walker and Kjetil Stokke like this.
    10-04-2015 02:09 PM
  15. hagjohn's Avatar
    They should sell them close to cost, so they can gain market share quicker.
    10-04-2015 02:13 PM
  16. newnews's Avatar
    it is too late. If they can exchange wp7 devices to WP8 with some small payments when they announced to kill WP7, things will not so bad.
    10-04-2015 02:37 PM
  17. sanien's Avatar
    This is what really bothers me..
    There are several cases where native Windows Phone apps look worse and are worse on Windows Phone than on Android and iOS. Skype for example.. I haven't used it in a while on Windows Phone, but less than a year ago it was horrible on Windows Phone when compared to for example Android.

    If someone can explain why Microsoft release and maintain their own apps better on other systems, then please do. 'Cause i really want to know..........

    I'll tell you. Sure it sucks but thats how it is and has to be now. Android ans IOS are rolling and MS needs to be there with their best. They do not invest too much in WP 8 as it is set to be replaced by WP 10 imminent. They have said that they will focus on WP first then IOS and Android after WP10 is launched..... we'll just have to wait and see if they really mean it.
    10-04-2015 03:28 PM
  18. sanien's Avatar
    No, selling the phones at a loss would not solve the long-term issue. What MS needs to do is market the unique features that the phone has to offer to the markets that can best use them, respectively. That means they will need to have commercials and other advertisements that focus on this. We all know the app situation and that alone will not keep those who decide to try WP from going back over to Android iOS. Many consider WP half-backed and that, IMO, is far from the truth at this point. It does what most phones need to do and then some. However, what MS has to focus on is implementing these features and making them smooth and quick. This is what early adopters of WP have come to love about it and have lost faith that MS bring this back to WP. What people also fail to realize is that most of this bias at this point about Windows 10 Mobile is based on a TP OS, not a finished product. The TP program has been a blessing and curse, but at the end of the day, I think it will pay off.

    Key word "MARKET". Since when have MS been good at marketing their excellent products? MS is good at making stuff but really bad at marketing them. Google is mostly opposit but getting better very fast - MS should worry.
    10-04-2015 03:36 PM
  19. ajj3085's Avatar
    What do you think they've been doing? The 520/630/640/etc phones are as cheap, or cheaper, than any android phones of equivalent quality. The thing is, selling a lot of cheap phones doesn't help the app situation, because people who buy cheap phones don't buy apps. Apple's app store revenue is actually higher than Google's despite a much smaller market share.
    And yet there are tons of apps in the play store.
    10-04-2015 04:02 PM
  20. luxnws's Avatar
    And yet there are tons of apps in the play store.
    But not apps people want to buy. Compare the most downloaded apps and most purchased apps in the Apple store to available apps in the Windows store.

    Example: ad blocking apps; none in Windows store.
    libra89 likes this.
    10-04-2015 04:31 PM
  21. jlangner's Avatar
    I feel that unless these devices are sold at lower price points they will not sell.

    If Microsoft prices these devices comparable to the iPhone 6s/6s+ or the Samsung Galaxy S6/S6 Edge/Note 5, then they will be DOA.
    Well even more than selling cheaper, they need to have at all wireless providers, maybe easier said than done, but having at at&t only, howmany they going to lose that way? I am on my 4th windows phone now, however with T-Mobile and on jump, if T-Mobile doesn't get one, sadly guess back to android. I will never switch providers just for a phone, besides would have to pay $300 to T-Mobile plus new phone, even if bought at ms store...screw that.
    10-04-2015 05:44 PM
  22. ajj3085's Avatar
    But not apps people want to buy. Compare the most downloaded apps and most purchased apps in the Apple store to available apps in the Windows store.

    Example: ad blocking apps; none in Windows store.
    I'm not talking about the Window store, I'm talking about the Play store. Google doesn't care if people buy apps, the store is so people use Android and thus Google services. My point is that while people don't buy apps in the Play store, developers still need to put their apps there because of Androids market share. How many things do you buy that can work with an app but only Apples?
    10-04-2015 06:10 PM
  23. luxnws's Avatar
    It would be shocking if the 950/950 XL were carrier specific. My bet is that they will sell the unlocked phones in the Microsoft Store too.

    The only reasons why people buy phones through carriers nowadays is financing (they can't afford to buy it with one payment) and upgrade convenience. What most people don't seem realize is that they are paying extra for both.
    Kjetil Stokke and libra89 like this.
    10-04-2015 06:12 PM
  24. luxnws's Avatar
    I'm not talking about the Window store, I'm talking about the Play store. Google doesn't care if people buy apps, the store is so people use Android and thus Google services. My point is that while people don't buy apps in the Play store, developers still need to put their apps there because of Androids market share. How many things do you buy that can work with an app but only Apples?

    You are correct about iOS apps generating more revenue than Google Play apps. One big reason might be piracy. See the 5% reference in the second article.

    Google Play vs. Apple App Store - Business Insider
    Android Piracy Problem - Business Insider

    Does that apply to Windows Phone apps? I wouldn't think so given the small market share but WP app developers would be a better source for that information.
    10-04-2015 06:22 PM
  25. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Obviously, MS does want a bigger part of the mobile pie. As far as I'm concerned though, W10M is now on the reserve bench. It's just there. MS' UWP vision just isn't viable without a low-cost, small form factor, touch device capability, so MS has no choice but to keep W10M moving along, and they will do that for as long as they remain in the personal computing business. Rather than pushing W10M, MS will instead be pushing UWP, which may or may not relate to phones. If the fruits of those efforts at some point trickle down to W10M, then all the better for it... if that trickle at some point becomes a stream, then MS can eventually bring W10M back into the game... until then... reserve bench. That's where this notion of "not being interested in market share" comes from.

    That's how I see it.
    And you have a right to see it that way, and you make some very good points. Let's just say on some aspects, we can agree to disagree.

    If they are saying they "don't care" about market share, how ever it's worded, in all and all, that would be 100% BS. Sure there is no point to "chase" iOS or Android but, to be successful, they NEED to gain a larger part of that pie, sitting at 2-4%, as it's a nice achievement (for a new phone) but, after 5-7 years now, it's a disappointment and does not do much for their bottom line.

    Anything about it, Windows 10 to Windows 10 Phone, NEEDS to be successful or I honestly don't think we will see a Next version. Referring to Windows 10 phone only, Windows 10 on desktop will be successful, as something like 90-95% of the computers in the world run Windows, it cant fail but, Windows 10 phone can.
    zkyevolved likes this.
    10-04-2015 06:57 PM
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