1. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    The arm windows ecosystem is bad . Really bad. ARM doesn't offer any advantages over x86 for Microsoft in fact it offers major disadvantages. So what is the point of pushing out these arm versions of windows when the arm version really isn't bringing a major benefit to the company
    01-17-2016 02:32 PM
  2. ekapratama93's Avatar
    Just imagine bringing full desktop OS in your pocket, that would be nice. Arm risc architecture do use less energy than normal x86.
    01-17-2016 02:53 PM
  3. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    I understand the advantage arm offers in power savings , but quick charging and replaceable batteries really make power saving a moot point
    01-17-2016 03:22 PM
  4. travisel's Avatar
    - Both graphics support for DirectX 12.1 & OpenGL EX 3.2

    - Both are 64-bit! (Intel 64 & ARMv8)

    2016 14nm Intel Atom & 14nm Qualcomm Snapdragon are both 2 Watts processor's!

    10nm generation should be 1 Watts design.
    01-17-2016 03:43 PM
  5. etphoto's Avatar
    Yeah, I'm predicting Arm isn't going to be around this time next year. At least not on the newer phones.
    01-17-2016 04:34 PM
  6. xandros9's Avatar
    because ARM is dominant on mobile and x86 isn't going to inherently fix Microsoft's mobile woes anyway.
    01-17-2016 04:48 PM
  7. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    Microsoft has no advantage sticking with arm. X86 applications written for windows dwarf arm apps . Build a phone mode into windows 10 be done with it
    01-17-2016 08:45 PM
  8. xandros9's Avatar
    Microsoft has no advantage sticking with arm. X86 applications written for windows dwarf arm apps . Build a phone mode into windows 10 be done with it
    But would you be able to use those x86 applications on a 5 inch display? No.

    They have less advantage putting full Windows on a phone than it may seem. With Continuum, it becomes better, but still its not the big bandage that compensates for actual phone applications.
    01-17-2016 09:56 PM
  9. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    You can resize the window and font to your hearts desire on x86 windows. I don't see the big difference running windows on a 8 inch tablet or a six inch phone less than six I see your point , but that's where a phone mode would come into play . No not every legacy program would work great but it's much better than what we have now
    01-19-2016 09:36 AM
  10. xandros9's Avatar
    You can resize the window and font to your hearts desire on x86 windows. I don't see the big difference running windows on a 8 inch tablet or a six inch phone less than six I see your point , but that's where a phone mode would come into play . No not every legacy program would work great but it's much better than what we have now
    OK, so we got a phone mode. We're back to square one, its not any better off than W10M. Legacy programs aren't going to work, and if they do, they'll be nigh unusable (combined with the portrait orientation too) and the phone might inherit the negatives of desktop Windows too.

    But say it does work well and we can't tell it apart from W10M in use. It does virtually nothing for the app gap. It might help band-aid it, but things that people do on phones may not be on x86 Windows and vice versa.

    Turn-by-turn navigation? Not really.
    Social apps like Snapchat, Yik Yak, Facebook Messenger, etc? They won't work any better. (in fact, many would just continue ignoring the platform as it was before - Snapchat doesn't even make a tablet version for iOS.)
    But sure, I think if they can cram a full PC or even a full Windows RT experience into Continuum, it'll be a big plus in my eyes.
    But I fear not for most people. I fear Microsoft is out of silver bullets.
    theefman likes this.
    01-19-2016 10:35 AM
  11. Dick S O-Rosary's Avatar
    The rumor is that regular win32 programs will run on ARM. Haha. Take that OP!
    01-20-2016 04:40 AM
  12. mandong's Avatar
    OK, so we got a phone mode. We're back to square one, its not any better off than W10M. Legacy programs aren't going to work, and if they do, they'll be nigh unusable (combined with the portrait orientation too) and the phone might inherit the negatives of desktop Windows too.
    Why won't legacy programs work? I can use an external display with mouse and keyboard, can't I?

    But say it does work well and we can't tell it apart from W10M in use. It does virtually nothing for the app gap. It might help band-aid it, but things that people do on phones may not be on x86 Windows and vice versa.
    I can use Bluestacks or DuOS to run all the apps I'll ever need, no?
    01-31-2016 01:32 AM
  13. xandros9's Avatar
    Why won't legacy programs work? I can use an external display with mouse and keyboard, can't I?
    You can't use an external display and keyboard on the subway can you? When someone's on the go, you know, part of the big reason a phone is portable, they won't have access to the benefits of those programs so it'll be not much better off than W10M is right now.

    I can use Bluestacks or DuOS to run all the apps I'll ever need, no?
    If you can get:

    1. Those things working properly (Bluestacks had a weird orientation issue on an 8" tablet I used)
    2. Performing well and not acting like a bolted on workaround.
    3. Google Play Services running.

    Blackberry 10 had an Android runtime and it hasn't exactly taken off you know.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    01-31-2016 08:18 PM
  14. mandong's Avatar
    You can't use an external display and keyboard on the subway can you? When someone's on the go, you know, part of the big reason a phone is portable, they won't have access to the benefits of those programs so it'll be not much better off than W10M is right now.
    No, don't go there mate. That's an overused, worn-out argument used by people who don't get it. Of course you won't be using legacy programs on a 5" screen. Legacy programs are meant to be used on at least a 10" screen (maybe 8" but for me no). And on an x86 Windows phone you would be using Continuum to drive an external display with a keyboard and a mouse - on a desktop not on the subway. Are you saying Continuum won't work because you can't use a keyboard and an external display on the subway?

    When you want to use legacy apps, use Continuum. When you're on the move, use mobile apps. And when the app you want is not on Windows Store, then use Bluestacks or DuOS to install from Play Store. DuOS works very well of my daughter's Venue 8 Pro and I'm sure newer Atoms that will be in an x86 phone will run it better than the DV8.
    02-01-2016 08:30 AM
  15. xandros9's Avatar
    No, don't go there mate. That's an overused, worn-out argument used by people who don't get it. Of course you won't be using legacy programs on a 5" screen. Legacy programs are meant to be used on at least a 10" screen (maybe 8" but for me no). And on an x86 Windows phone you would be using Continuum to drive an external display with a keyboard and a mouse - on a desktop not on the subway. Are you saying Continuum won't work because you can't use a keyboard and an external display on the subway?

    When you want to use legacy apps, use Continuum. When you're on the move, use mobile apps. And when the app you want is not on Windows Store, then use Bluestacks or DuOS to install from Play Store. DuOS works very well of my daughter's Venue 8 Pro and I'm sure newer Atoms that will be in an x86 phone will run it better than the DV8.
    And Android layers or emulation is also something used by people who also don't quite get it 100% either.

    I'm saying that while Continuum can be a huge benefit to the package as a whole, it doesn't do anything to improve the experience on the phone side of things when you're away from a desk, which is how most phones are used.
    But yea I can see fully-functional Continuum being a sizable plus.

    And I saw you can install GApps on DuOS, so there's one of my concerns put aside, but I'm still worried about the workaround nature and the dissonance.
    It still rubs me the wrong way as running Android applications is a short-term benefit. (see Blackberry 10 and its app development cliff as well as the OS/2 Windows compatibility thing before my time.)
    libra89 likes this.
    02-01-2016 12:13 PM
  16. mandong's Avatar
    And Android layers or emulation is also something used by people who also don't quite get it 100% either.
    What do you think Dalvik was until ART?

    I'm saying that while Continuum can be a huge benefit to the package as a whole, it doesn't do anything to improve the experience on the phone side of things when you're away from a desk, which is how most phones are used.
    But yea I can see fully-functional Continuum being a sizable plus.
    But that's the thing, MS seems to have conceded defeat in this battle (mobile phones) but they're choosing the grounds for the next one which could be the age of a new type of 2-in-1 devices (Surface phone, the phone that can replace your tablet?) - foldable/rollable displays aided by Continuum.

    It still rubs me the wrong way as running Android applications is a short-term benefit. (see Blackberry 10 and its app development cliff as well as the OS/2 Windows compatibility thing before my time.)
    MS already has the long term plan for the app gap in UWP so what's wrong with a backup short-term solution?
    02-01-2016 05:44 PM
  17. skstrials's Avatar
    I understand the advantage arm offers in power savings , but quick charging and replaceable batteries really make power saving a moot point
    You cannot dismiss power savings like that.

    Smart phones are, first and foremost, portable phones. So being able stay off the charger is the most important feature in a modern smartphone.

    Also, quick charging cannot substitute for a long battery life. If you are charging the phone, you cannot be portable, thus defeating the whole purpose of a "portable" phone.

    It is just nice to have a long battery life. Right now, maximizing battery life should be the biggest goal of all smartphone manufacturers. The current internals are fast enough.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for BlackBerry 10
    RumoredNow and xandros9 like this.
    02-06-2016 12:15 AM
  18. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    You act like x86 just burns through batteries I can tell you owning a zenfone 2 that isn't the case . The battery life on that phone is comparable to the iPhone 6s and galaxy s6 . The battery savings arm might give are minute .
    02-07-2016 07:54 AM

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