03-30-2016 03:05 AM
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  1. JoeyIsACoolKid's Avatar
    Honestly, I had to get an LG G4 for school since my college apps aren't available on Windows 10, and I really regret it. This phone freezes quite a bit, and I really enjoyed Windows 10 Mobile, even though I was always talked down for my phone. The only thing I missed was having Snapchat, but that's easy to do without. I hope they keep going and launch a phone on Verizon so I can get back on it once my 2 years is up.
    01-22-2016 08:09 PM
  2. Jean Claude Lopez's Avatar
    Ironically MS isn't giving up, but customer that just pick up and leave for another platform. And the thing is that I wouldn't just leave in order to use Snapchat or other app that doesn't care about working hard for customers. They just release on iOS and expect everybody to drop their phones and come running to them.
    01-22-2016 09:40 PM
  3. Jeff Erson's Avatar
    I don't think MS is giving up. I think WM will be there for quite some time. I think we, WM users, were just not MS' top priority. I know MS hears us, our problems with WM, but they just act less. WM is being developed for quite some time already. We reported bugs, problems, suggestions, but I don't think they're quick enough to solve those problems, to fix those bugs, or provide us with significant features. With MS' resources, I know they could do better. I know they have great people working there, brilliant engineers, devs, but they're just busy with working on something else (i.e. W10 for PC, Hololens, Surface, apps for other platforms, etc.). I think only few of those great minds are working on WM. That's why were mostly getting "minor updates" and mostly unnoticeable changes. But I'm not giving up yet. I'll still be using WM for a little while. Big updates, significant updates, massive bug fixes and great features will eventually come, soon. Yeah, soon. Soon.
    01-22-2016 10:38 PM
  4. Greg Wenzler's Avatar
    So, how many are leaving? No one knows. The sampling of people here is miniscule. Even with Microsoft's small market share, the number of people on this site is statistically insignificant compared to the total number of users. Most people using products of any brand don't frequent forums like this. The other issue to keep in mind is that forums like this end up overstating the negative because that's the group that posts the most because they're having problems or they hate the platform and want to berate it. Either way, you generally get a skewed view.
    If you'd take a look at WP marketshare over the last couple of years, you'd have your answer. No skewed numbers, just depressing results.

    I stuck with WP from Windows Mobile 5 until December when I bailed and went Android. I still stick my SIM in my WP every couple of weeks. And I'm thoroughly convinced that it's all about apps. I'd rather build my app library on that platform, then waste money on a platform that I feel will be abandoned within a year or two.

    And it kinda makes me sick. I truly enjoyed WP. Microsoft has bungled what should have been a very solid ecosystem.
    Laura Knotek and theefman like this.
    01-23-2016 03:58 AM
  5. Loco5150's Avatar
    I had many WP users around me after Nokia got on board. One by one people have moved away. People got frustrated with lack of function and tired of waiting. Many I saw were really puzzled "why I cant do this or that, my friend can do it with he's/her iPhone/Samsung".

    After about 10 WP's I moved away too, havent regret it once. I got an L930 yesterday (again), but I wont even try W10M. No need because I know what it is; its something that's not quite there. Lack of apps is a big thing. Insode that, lack off app functionality an equally bad thing.

    Bottom line: Microsoft dropped the ball. They moved too slow and to make things even worst, they back and forth too many times (poor management). All those re-starts were very damaging. Things weren't moving forward, or if they did, they moved back soon. also if you are behind, you need to move double speed to catch up, Microsoft couldnt (poor management again).

    "Surface Phone" wont change anything. even though Im sure it will (or would) be an amazing device. It wont change anything however, because its not about the specs or flashyness of the devices. Its about the OS and that LACKS and with that about APPS that lack heavily too.

    Its lights out for WP, WM or whatever its called today. Last one turns the lights off ok?
    theefman likes this.
    01-23-2016 04:57 AM
  6. Peppermint-Lemon's Avatar
    Crazy how many issues I read about on here and I never see on my phone...
    Same here
    01-23-2016 05:00 AM
  7. Peppermint-Lemon's Avatar
    I had many WP users around me after Nokia got on board. One by one people have moved away. People got frustrated with lack of function and tired of waiting. Many I saw were really puzzled "why I cant do this or that, my friend can do it with he's/her iPhone/Samsung".

    After about 10 WP's I moved away too, havent regret it once. I got an L930 yesterday (again), but I wont even try W10M. No need because I know what it is; its something that's not quite there. Lack of apps is a big thing. Insode that, lack off app functionality an equally bad thing.

    Bottom line: Microsoft dropped the ball. They moved too slow and to make things even worst, they back and forth too many times (poor management). All those re-starts were very damaging. Things weren't moving forward, or if they did, they moved back soon. also if you are behind, you need to move double speed to catch up, Microsoft couldnt (poor management again).

    "Surface Phone" wont change anything. even though Im sure it will (or would) be an amazing device. It wont change anything however, because its not about the specs or flashyness of the devices. Its about the OS and that LACKS and with that about APPS that lack heavily too.

    Its lights out for WP, WM or whatever its called today. Last one turns the lights off ok?
    Lol that's overly dramatic. W10M is already far better than 8.1. TBH 8.1 on my wifes phone infuriates me with lack of features that 10 has. I had 10 on my 930 & it was solid. 10 on my 950XL is even better.
    HeyCori likes this.
    01-23-2016 05:04 AM
  8. Greg Wenzler's Avatar
    Lol that's overly dramatic. W10M is already far better than 8.1. TBH 8.1 on my wifes phone infuriates me with lack of features that 10 has. I had 10 on my 930 & it was solid. 10 on my 950XL is even better.
    I don't know. I don't think it's overly dramatic.

    I loved my 1320 and 640. You dig your 950XL. But MS has lost how many billions of dollars so far on WP? The answer to the OP's question "is MS giving up?" can probably be traced directly to that. The employees might not be giving up, but there isn't a whole lotta time before the shareholders say "uh, yeah, that phone thing? Time to be done with that."
    01-23-2016 05:26 AM
  9. David Steadson's Avatar
    I don't know. I don't think it's overly dramatic.

    I loved my 1320 and 640. You dig your 950XL. But MS has lost how many billions of dollars so far on WP? The answer to the OP's question "is MS giving up?" can probably be traced directly to that. The employees might not be giving up, but there isn't a whole lotta time before the shareholders say "uh, yeah, that phone thing? Time to be done with that."
    Except that makes no sense. "done with that" - done with what? W10 works across all screen sizes. Do they suddenly say "oh, we're going to actively stop it working under a certain size, or if it has a sim card?" Are they going to not support tablets with LTE?

    They can't "be done" with W10M without being "done" with their entire strategy.

    I happen to think it's the right strategy. Android has between 1.5 and 2 billion active users globally. iOS probably has no more than 6-700 million active users.

    W10 already has over 200 million active users. Microsoft's stated goal is to have W10 on a billion devices within 2-3 years. That will put the OS at least on par with iOS, probably exceeding it. Why do you think they're pushing so hard to get people to upgrade? Every XP, 7, 8 user who upgrades is now using the same OS as a Lumia or a Surface or a Yoga.

    W10 gives MS competitive user share with Android and iOS - and that's without having to convince a single iOS or Android user to switch. The only question is whether developers remain focused only on small screens. Given the way many iOS and Android apps are crap on even 7" tablets, that may indeed be the point of failure on this strategy, but I for one hope not.
    libra89, HeyCori, editguy and 2 others like this.
    01-23-2016 09:09 AM
  10. Schnuffi's Avatar
    So far I love win 10 mobile and it can only get better. Having said I am not a big app person I have whatsapp and FB and just one or two other apps.
    01-23-2016 09:38 AM
  11. editguy's Avatar
    If you'd take a look at WP marketshare over the last couple of years, you'd have your answer. No skewed numbers, just depressing results.

    I stuck with WP from Windows Mobile 5 until December when I bailed and went Android. I still stick my SIM in my WP every couple of weeks. And I'm thoroughly convinced that it's all about apps. I'd rather build my app library on that platform, then waste money on a platform that I feel will be abandoned within a year or two.

    And it kinda makes me sick. I truly enjoyed WP. Microsoft has bungled what should have been a very solid ecosystem.
    I wasn't talking about what's happened over the last couple of years. That's well known and some of the reasons for it (like no new flagship releases during that time period). I was speaking of what is happening currently, and none of us knows.
    I'm enjoying W10M on two phones currently. I guess it all depends on what you perceive that your "needs" are. It meets mine.
    RumoredNow and Schnuffi like this.
    01-23-2016 12:35 PM
  12. thetruth1960's Avatar
    That's the part that is sometimes hard to figure out. If you look at some of the people bashing (not people who are trying to get help with problems) you will see that some of them have hundreds of posts and in their entirety they do nothing but bash MS. I'm definitely not speaking about you, but I've searched some of the frequent bashing posters and have come to the conclusion that they're just here for that purpose.
    Here's what I think is possible. A few years ago many people were bashing T-Mobile and saying that they would be gone by the end of the year. There was even an organization that makes predictions at the end of every year predicting which companies would be gone by the end of the next year, and one of them was T-mo. As we all know, T-mobile is still here and have become somewhat of a mover and shaker amongst carriers (whether they will be a few years from now, who knows?). My point is that none of us really know what MS will do or what they have planned for W10M. Everything that is said is just conjecture and opinion. I don't believe it's demise is imminent, but who knows a few years from now if nothing changes? I'm willing to wait and see because I'm enjoying my WP's, and the past couple years have gotten me excited about the future of MS and it's products, something that hadn't been the case for a very long time.
    As I said before, I'm an MS fan-boy. MS indirectly pays my bills since developing in the MS platform is how I've made my living for the past 25+ years.
    You are right. We don't know where it is going. I hope it is actually going up. For me, just like I have used the MS platform to pay my bills, my clients are asking for apps in the other platforms. I have to go that route to continue to satisfy my customers. So with the app gap, and the fact that for a business reason, I have to start developing for Android and iOS, it makes sense to move.
    However, just guess what the development environment is going to be to develop for those platforms. Yes, you guessed it correctly, it will be a Windows 10 Surface 2 (still haven't updated to 4) running Visual Studio 2015. Using Telerik NativeScript, I don't even need an Apple Mac to develop for iOS.
    So no, I'm not leaving MS, I'm just changing my phone. And if you look around MS itself, you will see that many employees use other platforms for their phones and development. Many use Macs.
    And I'm sure you read my posts where I pointed out that not all of MS's apps are better in Android.
    However, I am not a fan of Satya and what he has done. As you can also read in my previous posts.
    01-23-2016 08:52 PM
  13. Mindi B's Avatar
    Maybe I just got up on the right side of the bed this morning. But I feel optimistic I think that MS will slowly turn it around this year.
    Not without properly addressing the main problem: THE ECOSYSTEM, chiefly, lack of apps and services. Without addressing that, there's nowhere for MS's mobile strategy to go. A new handset is not enough to generate momentum - the market demands apps.
    01-23-2016 10:00 PM
  14. ajayden's Avatar
    As I said before, I'm an MS fan-boy. MS indirectly pays my bills since developing in the MS platform is how I've made my living for the past 25+ years.
    You are right. We don't know where it is going. I hope it is actually going up. For me, just like I have used the MS platform to pay my bills, my clients are asking for apps in the other platforms. I have to go that route to continue to satisfy my customers. So with the app gap, and the fact that for a business reason, I have to start developing for Android and iOS, it makes sense to move.
    However, just guess what the development environment is going to be to develop for those platforms. Yes, you guessed it correctly, it will be a Windows 10 Surface 2 (still haven't updated to 4) running Visual Studio 2015. Using Telerik NativeScript, I don't even need an Apple Mac to develop for iOS.
    So no, I'm not leaving MS, I'm just changing my phone. And if you look around MS itself, you will see that many employees use other platforms for their phones and development. Many use Macs.
    And I'm sure you read my posts where I pointed out that not all of MS's apps are better in Android.
    However, I am not a fan of Satya and what he has done. As you can also read in my previous posts.
    Actually, I see it as a positive event, that you are moving to iOS and Android development. If your clients want to develop for those environments, you must develop to earn your living but the positive part comes where you can impress upon your client that after development of the iOS and Android apps, you can develop a Windows Universal App without much effort using islandwood.
    01-23-2016 10:34 PM
  15. ajayden's Avatar
    Not without properly addressing the main problem: THE ECOSYSTEM, chiefly, lack of apps and services. Without addressing that, there's nowhere for MS's mobile strategy to go. A new handset is not enough to generate momentum - the market demands apps.
    Well, I see it in a different light. First of all, the mobile ship for Windows has already left the port and they don't have a ticket anymore.
    However having said that, they still will have to keep mobiles in the market just to show their presence. Therefore, this apps on mobile is not something of real priority.

    You are right that a new handset will never solve the issue because the issue lies somewhere else. Mobile is not the issue.

    Priority is where their strength lies and their strength lies in the PC/Tablet market. They should focus on developing that market and improve the apps over there. Rest will fall in place by itself. Here is a picture that depicts what I said.
    windows-market.png
    libra89 and HeyCori like this.
    01-23-2016 10:44 PM
  16. Schnuffi's Avatar
    Another thing I think with win 10 If you do write a good app for windows 10 mobile you can be a big fish in a small pond. Whereas with IOS you just another little fish in a very big pond. But I do hope they do fix the IOS bridge to import apps and get more onboard so everyone stops whining. We all what the problem is so let's fix it.
    ajayden, slimchap and soil2oil like this.
    01-23-2016 11:04 PM
  17. slimchap's Avatar
    Another thing I think with win 10 If you do write a good app for windows 10 mobile you can be a big fish in a small pond. Whereas with IOS you just another little fish in a very big pond. But I do hope they do fix the IOS bridge to import apps and get more onboard so everyone stops whining. We all what the problem is so let's fix it.
    And this is why i want to learn how to develop apps for Windows 10 Mobile.
    soil2oil likes this.
    01-23-2016 11:57 PM
  18. Loco5150's Avatar
    Lol that's overly dramatic. W10M is already far better than 8.1. TBH 8.1 on my wifes phone infuriates me with lack of features that 10 has. I had 10 on my 930 & it was solid. 10 on my 950XL is even better.
    I seriously doubt what you are saying. MS has Pushed back the release of W10M again, now to February. Not ready enough. WP8.1 should have been matured way more and the same goes to the 10, its another re-start. Joe Belfiore should be fired no question about that. No matter how brilliant mind he is as a developer, but this mess should cast a very dark shadow over him.

    Im sure even the web browser is still lacking on WP. IE just isnt good enough, wasnt on 8.1 and isnt on desktop either. I used it recently for a year also on desktop because I like to sync my history between my devices (wohoo smartphone). Edge is not ready (trend of Microsoft, not ready yet). After moving to Android and of course blocking Chrome, I installed Mozilla back to my desktop and to my phone, whohooo it works! Best mobile browsing experience I have had in years.

    As to the original question are they giving up? Yes Im sure they will. Or if they take the Surface route and make one or 2 devices a year with not much expectations on sales, but can it work here? Because the apps the apps the apps. When you are on WP you are like a second class citizen. Things just dont work and if they do, they work barely.

    Oh man the scanner app that I got now just works. I love scanning documents now with my phone. I remember on WP how it could be done, but adding / deleting pages, forwarding the scan with email or some other thing was just problematic and not quite there. Giving this example out of many to reflect the app situation beyond the obvious big apps missing or functions the big apps lack.

    I dont think they will waste anymore money on this project. Its sad, I would have rather used WP than Android by Google which I dont like too much, but at least with Android I have been able to kill basically all google's apps and installed others that I rather use. Navigation for example Im using HERE. And you know that works too, clicking links from webpages etc open HERE automatically! A smartphone... By the way, on Android all the HERE apps are in one app, weird that they had separate apps on WP.

    When Nokia got on board, on the edge of WP7>8, that was Microsoft's chance, the time to shine and make things happen. they just couldnt do it, they blew it. They would have needed to keep the same momentum that started then, keep pushing fast forward and steadily gain market share as they were doing. Keeping this up, would have one by one got developers to put more attention to the platform and little by little it would have been battle won.

    How would any serious developer be really interested on the platform, if you look back now? Seriously, and dont bring up Rudy Huyn who Im sure is getting paid by Microsoft from under the table. Damn, without Rudy and 6tag there wouldnt even be decent Instagram on WP, hahaha, crazy. Which by the way is better than the official Instagram app on Android.

    And Im from Finland, we had naturally a very high adaptation to WP after Nokia got on board. Now the amount users here has just plummeted. And yes while selling the devices to MS is something people took notice, its not the ultimate reason. The ultimate reason is, that the devices they had werent working as good as they expected, they were lacking in functionality, in the OS and in the APPS.
    01-24-2016 02:21 AM
  19. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    Yawn. Even in2016,the doom and gloom and the forum psychics ade redundant.
    Geddeeee and HeyCori like this.
    01-24-2016 03:13 AM
  20. Loco5150's Avatar
    Even the dumb phones Nokia forced MS to buy are doing horrible. http://www.mediapost.com/publication....html?edition= Wow Nokia really sold so much useful plants and infra to Microsoft its amazing. 7 billion? I love the board of Nokia. And besidess Ballmer, Elop was fired also naturally. Forgot to mention that above.

    Facts are facts. Fanboy bs is fanboy bs. Business is business.

    Im not expecting MS to be pulling any rabits out of their hat anymore. I was a believer still a year ago, but facts are facts, they will bury this project.

    BTW. Continuum at this moment is a joke. Sure, if more progress in technology comes and this idea is refined, it probably will be the way how everything works, but now? I will have my mobile phone, keyboard/mouse and the dock with me, so I can connect my phone to the hotels television and do my emails and whatnot sitting on the small table? Or the next day at presentation break all this out and use the projector with this setup...

    Sorry folks, I will just have my Lenovo Carbon x1 and do my stuff on the hotel bed and plug that in to the projector for the presentation. Nice bonus is that I can actually use the device when there isnt extra tv around, like in the airplane and use real programs, wohooo its a computer.
    Last edited by Loco5150; 01-24-2016 at 04:18 AM.
    HinoMusouka and sarsau like this.
    01-24-2016 03:45 AM
  21. M7H's Avatar
    Oh man the scanner app that I got now just works. I love scanning documents now with my phone. I remember on WP how it could be done, but adding / deleting pages, forwarding the scan with email or some other thing was just problematic and not quite there. Giving this example out of many to reflect the app situation beyond the obvious big apps missing or functions the big apps lack.
    You are talking about office lens?
    I think it works great!
    Scanning and automatically converting to a word document, PDF file, or PowerPoint.
    Automatic upload to your OneDrive and OneNote, so you can acces it from any devices, how can you call that problematic?
    barnyr likes this.
    01-24-2016 04:57 AM
  22. Loco5150's Avatar
    That and other apps in the store. The functionality just wasnt there 6 months ago. always when trying to do something, it wasn't possible. Like sending the scan as attachment. Or maybe when you scanned a document you wasnt able to add a page in between. Depending on app and situation, always something stopping you. Many things all around the apps and the OS where you just needed a workaround, always doing something simple wasn't straight forward.

    Sure, WP is the new kid on the block, but not anymore.

    I moved to Android that I so hate(d), things just work. Like the scanner app, I read about 15 minutes of reviews and bought one thats been working like a charm since. Anything I come up with and want to do, it just works. Scanned 6 pages and realized I want to delete one from the middle, not a problem, scan again a page, rearrange order, upload somewhere or better yet email attachments; not a problem... When I was on WP I bought about 150-200? apps, BOUGHT. I bought apps just to support the developers, like Timber I bought on release and never even used it or logged in. Same goes for everything else, there just isnt options to find the app that does what you want. Also many things seem to be limited by OS restrictions, secure OS? Great, but if I want to send an attachment from somewhere, or write/edit to calendar from an app and there is an obstacle, its a problem. Oh man I remember now, a function important to me TASKS. There is/was like 3-4 apps in the store to sync with my O365 (MS service) and have them displayed on my today... horrible, horrible experience. few better than others but all lacking somehow or had bugs. Latest updates a long time ago in most of them.

    Like I wrote, this is ok after the release, after 1-2-3 years sure, making progress. But not anymore, its a joke it really is. The MS people in charge know this. They know the mistakes the failures the problems. They have to cut their losses and kill this project. Like I also wrote, they might be looking to take the Surface road, which in theory I guess could in time work, but the app gap. If there comes 2 WP's from MS and 8 small company generic devices a year, is it enough for the developers to make the apps? I doubt that, and great about the tools to convert iOS apps, but its not only about writing the apps, its about the support and other infrastructure for the customers. Would that be enough users / devices to make it worth for the developers? I seriously doubt it and I think many developers voiced their doubts when MS released the idea of the tools. Its not only about making the app, a lot more to it.

    All above, makes more and more sure the project will be killed.
    Greg Wenzler and CraigCole like this.
    01-24-2016 06:23 AM
  23. Loco5150's Avatar
    Yawn. Even in2016,the doom and gloom and the forum psychics ade redundant.
    I suggest that on their deal Nokia took Microsoft forcefully and not even payed for dinner. The main points where that I know what you are saying, but actually doom and gloom has been right since. It looks worse to WP now than it did 2 years ago. Even less users, more time gone and money spent. I was a believer also year or so ago, but not anymore.
    Last edited by RumoredNow; 01-24-2016 at 05:08 PM. Reason: cleanup on aisle 5
    01-24-2016 06:41 AM
  24. M7H's Avatar
    But also on android you needed to buy a separate app for that. It was not build into stock android. So again, it is related to the app gap.

    Anyhow, I have faith they are going to close a good part of this gap, and really think that stock W10, has a lot of features build in.
    01-24-2016 06:48 AM
  25. koffiejunk's Avatar
    MS doesn't have to give up because windows phone users are giving up.. After my 520,720 and now 735 I am also giving up on Windows phones..soon there will only be some die hard loyalists left the rest has moved on.
    Greg Wenzler likes this.
    01-24-2016 07:38 AM
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