10-14-2016 11:47 AM
29 12
tools
  1. DaQuantumFro's Avatar
    You know I was going to talk about how Microsoft is doing what it has to for Windows Mobile given the failure of Windows Phone, but it ran too long. Truth is many people here have their opinion and I don't care about the level of evil Nadella supposedly is.

    The reality is Microsoft isn't player in mobile beyond the software it's offers on iOS and Android; and the economically reasonable thing would be to just focus on that. And let's be honest no one here wants Microsoft out of mobile; we want them more invested. So to that end I want to discuss where I think Windows Mobile should head.

    First, it should focus on where it has best chance of growth. I know this means Redmond pushing enterprise over consumer. Enterprise is and backend compatibility is a strength and should be lead when trying to sell devices. If the apps were there it would be different, but their not so push the business angle.

    Second, have some type of consumer story. One of the biggest flaws in current strategy is there seems to be no consumer side to Nadella's productivity vision. Windows Mobile might look good on paper compared to iOS but iPhones are in the workplace. So this platform needs to get back to People first.

    Third, be true to the product at hand. Windows Mobile IS Windows. It doesn't run x86 but it runs the things most associated with Microsoft by most people: Office and Outlook. Continuum provides flexibility not seen on other platforms. This is the Pocket PC reimaged and that should be the truth of the product.

    Fourth, make Continuum and Windows Ink the new foundations. Microsoft needs something to blunt the effect of the app gap. The reality of apps in 2016 is they come and they go. Continuum allows Windows Mobile to move beyond the idea of a phone and Inking pushes the devices closer to tablets.

    Fifth, move Windows forward. The two biggest hindrances for Windows is the over-reliance on x-86 and the constant restarts of Windows Phone. UWP and the thin client/ Chrome OS nature of Continuum allows for something new to be pushed out.

    These are my ideas. They may work, they might not.
    pedmar007 likes this.
    10-04-2016 03:25 PM
  2. ven07's Avatar
    One of the biggest flaws imo was that they decided not to invest in the foreign markets that showed promise! Instead all effort was focused on the US. Not that I'm anti-US or anything lol, just saying that I would've pushed for sales in countries where my numbers were actually improving instead of focusing on places where my numbers are dwindling.

    Once the other markets were secured or as secure as it could get, I'd move back in to try and claim the other markets, because at that point you have a solid userbase/decent devs/decent devices/decent sales...

    Or maybe I'm just wrong lol

    Back to topic.. Not sure if the enterprise push is the best idea, but it is the best way to sell in bulk so there's that lol
    10-04-2016 05:55 PM
  3. HeyCori's Avatar
    Second, have some type of consumer story. One of the biggest flaws in current strategy is there seems to be no consumer side to Nadella's productivity vision. Windows Mobile might look good on paper compared to iOS but iPhones are in the workplace. So this platform needs to get back to People first.
    I think you make a great point. Microsoft doesn't seem interested in the "people" aspect of using a phone. Windows Phone was built upon the premise that using a smartphone should be easier, faster, and you should be able to quickly do everything you need without a multitude of different apps. The People Hub kept you up to date with social media. Local Scout showcased events happening around town. And lesser phones were getting smoked by Ben "The PC Guy".

    Some things went away, sometimes because they had to. Microsoft couldn't have the People Hub be at the mercy of Facebook or Twitter. Local Scout disappeared. Heck, even Kid's Corner was let go. And with all the features that needed to be jam packed into an app, the Metro design language was becoming a bigger problem. (though I'm aware there's much debate as to whether or not W10 fixed that problem)

    So Windows Phone became a little bit more standard and a little less unique. A little less focused on the end user and a lot more focused on being like everyone else. And it feels like it was at that point that W10 just stopped.

    Microsoft isn't concerned with "people" anymore. Live Tiles are great, they look cool, I like them, but they're long overdue for an overhaul. Surely Microsoft can think of something to do with them. The live tiles have barely changed since Windows Phone 7. In the early days of the W10 Preview, Microsoft introduced new tile sizes. Where are they now? So there's no 3D touch but why can't a long press on a tile bring up new options like "open article in browser" or something along those lines? Are we ever going to get music controls added to the Groove live tile? And so on, and so on, because I'm sure people have already come up with a thousand different things to do with the tiles.

    Windows Phones needs something that sets itself apart from other platforms. At one time it was the live tiles, it was People Hub, it was Local Scout. But Microsoft didn't find a way to build upon those ideas. Instead, they simply dropped them. Microsoft needs to let their smartphone be smarter. Don't simply evolve the platform, reinvent it. People want new ways to interact with their device. Give it to them.
    10-04-2016 06:21 PM
  4. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Who uses Office? Students and business folk. The Surface line takes care of these people because let's face it, how many of us have ever composed a lengthy Word or Excel document on our phones? Light editing? Tons of it, but that's the effective scope of Office on phones...regardless of OS. The majority of consumers are far removed from this type of usage scenario so they stick with their iPhones and Galaxies because they're used to them and invested in their respective ecosystems.

    Enterprise/Government/Healthcare needs are quite different they do use phones more than students or office types. One only needs to see the vast numbers of EDAs (Enterprise Digital Assistants) being bought and used by companies that are STILL running Windows Mobile 6.5.3! Microsoft needs to get these companies out of the technological Stone Ages and Windows 10 Mobile is that avenue. Enterprise Mobility customers do not rely on the typical workstation and Continuum would be a huge benefit since employees can use their phones as their databases and not have to lug around additional equipment like laptops, etc.

    Use it or lose it, Nadella.
    Last edited by fatclue_98; 10-04-2016 at 07:19 PM. Reason: Grammar
    10-04-2016 06:28 PM
  5. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Don't simply evolve the platform, reinvent it.
    For God's sake, again?
    10-04-2016 06:32 PM
  6. HeyCori's Avatar
    Always again!!!
    ven07, techiez, libra89 and 3 others like this.
    10-04-2016 06:33 PM
  7. DaQuantumFro's Avatar
    One thing I'd point out is certain features, like interactive tiles, were not given features; wanted but not given. In my opinion the UI aspects are always up for change because of company direction and consumer tastes.
    10-04-2016 07:21 PM
  8. DaQuantumFro's Avatar
    Agreed; I've seen plenty of medical workers and people in the field for which Windows Mobile would be a better fit than Win7/XP tablets or outdated WinMo 6.5 devices. Also I'm hoping to see Continuum lapdocks which make as much sense for light work as Chromebooks.
    ven07 and Laura Knotek like this.
    10-04-2016 07:24 PM
  9. sd4f's Avatar
    I think the number one problem MS is going to have with the enterprise sector is that MS staff themselves don't use windows mobiles.

    If you're offering an enterprise device, but don't use it yourself (after all, MS is a large enterprise), it really shows how much confidence you have in that device...

    So, I'm starting to think that MS is just trying to save face, and not throw their clients under a bus by abandoning the platform yet, and probably just hoping that they'll change of their own accord. This way, they'll be able to pull the plug when no one really cares at all. I don't know whether that's the case, but it seems that way to me.
    10-05-2016 12:36 AM
  10. ven07's Avatar
    I think the number one problem MS is going to have with the enterprise sector is that MS staff themselves don't use windows mobiles
    Correction.. don't use them as daily drivers :p I can fully imagine that they have one sitting somewhere that only serves for testing purposes.

    That's basically what enterprise will give us. (Maybe, if it hits off) a ton of people using w10m but probably only as long as they're on the workfloor.

    If they happen to like what they see, they might pick one up for personal use
    Last edited by ven07; 10-09-2016 at 10:52 AM. Reason: Grammar
    10-05-2016 06:52 PM
  11. Chintan Gohel's Avatar
    One of the biggest flaws imo was that they decided not to invest in the foreign markets that showed promise! Instead all effort was focused on the US. Not that I'm anti-US or anything lol, just saying that I would've pushed for sales in countries where my numbers were actually improving instead of focusing on places where my numbers are dwindling.

    Once the other markets were secured or as secure as it could get, I'd move back in to try and claim the other markets, because at that point you have a solid userbase/decent devs/decent devices/decent sales...

    Or maybe I'm just wrong lol

    Back to topic.. Not sure if the enterprise push is the best idea, but it is the best way to sell in bulk so there's that lol
    I can't agree more on this and finally someone believes as I do on the need to push for international markets and forget US for the time being

    I sincerely believe the windows mobile market was growing steadily in Europe, South America, Asia and Africa. Especially Africa - devices are still being sold and no one locally has mentioned that they can't find any model.

    The best thing about international markets was that as the share increased like in Europe or Africa, the app problem became smaller.

    The apps leaving the platform now - those apps are mainly American and American user focused. For us in the world, we didn't care about Bank of America app or ebay - we don't have those so if they go, they go
    10-06-2016 07:37 AM
  12. DaQuantumFro's Avatar
    The problem with concentrating on international markets is that would entail pushing for volume and ignoring an important developer market.
    10-06-2016 08:05 AM
  13. techiez's Avatar
    The problem with concentrating on international markets is that would entail pushing for volume and ignoring an important developer market.
    Well once they establish a steady marketshare, developers will take a note of the phones/OS. if I'm not wrong, GS3 took this route.

    All they had to do was take of some 10% out of Android's marketshare and devs and rest of the tech bloggers would have taken WP seriously.

    It certainly didnt help MS keeping mum and slowly killing of WP marketshare on behest of retrenchment.
    if WP dies, it would be due to death by 1000 cuts by MS.
    Last edited by techiez; 10-06-2016 at 09:56 AM.
    10-06-2016 09:42 AM
  14. fatclue_98's Avatar
    It certainly didnt help MS keeping mum and slowly killing of WP marketshare on behest of retrenchment.
    if WP dies, it would be due to death by 1000 cuts by MS.
    Sorry, the marketshare isn't big enough to warrant the full 1000 cuts. Maybe 50.
    a5cent, techiez, Guytronic and 3 others like this.
    10-06-2016 10:44 AM
  15. Krystianpants's Avatar
    I think you make a great point. Microsoft doesn't seem interested in the "people" aspect of using a phone. Windows Phone was built upon the premise that using a smartphone should be easier, faster, and you should be able to quickly do everything you need without a multitude of different apps. The People Hub kept you up to date with social media. Local Scout showcased events happening around town. And lesser phones were getting smoked by Ben "The PC Guy".

    .
    I think the People hub could still be created. If Facebook wants ads they could go about it multiple ways. First of all you would have to have the app installed. Second of all there could be limitations like if you have 5 new posts by a person it will only show latest 1 or 2. Clicking on it would bring you to it in the app and let you navigate any further info you need. And they can display their ads or whatever they do.. Microsoft could offer hooks that can be used without having the facebook app, but facebook would be able to display their ads in that area too. Not sure what the limitation is to be honest, I never really used this feature.
    ven07 and HeyCori like this.
    10-06-2016 03:09 PM
  16. HeyCori's Avatar
    I think the People hub could still be created. If Facebook wants ads they could go about it multiple ways. First of all you would have to have the app installed. Second of all there could be limitations like if you have 5 new posts by a person it will only show latest 1 or 2. Clicking on it would bring you to it in the app and let you navigate any further info you need. And they can display their ads or whatever they do.. Microsoft could offer hooks that can be used without having the facebook app, but facebook would be able to display their ads in that area too. Not sure what the limitation is to be honest, I never really used this feature.
    The People Hub doesn't even have to be in the People app. Imagine if you could swipe right from the home screen and that brought up the People Hub. Or maybe the People Hub was a double wide tile on your home screen. All the Hub would need to do is feed in data from social media apps. Heck, HTC already does this with Blinkfeed.
    10-06-2016 03:17 PM
  17. Great deal's Avatar
    Few factors to consider, Apple are a company of very few devices and services, they have shaped the whole company around those things, they have deep pockets to throw mega bucks at Marketing, fair play and I take my hat off to them (as does everyone else in the tech industry) for accomplishing what they have done. Issue with them is lack of innovation and the more 'sameness' well why fix something that isnt broke, the question is user fatigue and boredom. Google have many manufacturers and are in my opinion the sort of 'open source' type of manufacturer, the issue Google has is that of trust outside of thier devoted fans.

    In both camps exist people fed up but not so mush as to jump ship to the other side and its here I believe an opportunity exists for a product and company that can demonstrate a true alternative.

    Microsofts problem...well it goes back in time, massive errors of judgement in operating system launches, as recent as Windows 8 (Start button..hello!!!) They have are much more varied offering encompassing massive IP, services and hardware branches. They cant throw everything behind any one thing like Apple can. I think there comes a time to make a decision based on metrics, trends and future pipeline, that is unfortunately something we will never get to see. Have they done the right thing in mobile, I believe yes, Nokia was a sinking ship before MS got to them, the IP is extrmemly valuable and had MS not purchased them you can bet your life that one of the others would have done so, the fate of Nokia devices IMO was sealed the moment of the sale, the reason is all development halted as the sale went through after which a time of assimilation took place.

    MS have a strong brand in the Surface, do they make thier first phone or continue to push average hardware with thier name on it while losing market share? Tough one and I think that as MS make a lot more money from enterprise in all of the other offerings and have access to that market in a way Apple and Google can only dream about, it makes absolute sense to at least try to leverage that market.

    Microsoft have also done something uniquem something amazing that has taken many years and the result (not today but at some point) is simply incredible...Onecore.. Make an app for PC or XBOX or Hololens or Mobile and without too much effort can work on all of the others!!....As far as mobile is concerned, today, its at 1% no point fighting in the consumer space, they will fight in the enterprise space without much competition and the hope is that it spills over to the consumer side like Blackberry did. As long as they have incredible devices I see no reason that cannot happen.

    Time will tell :)
    HeyCori likes this.
    10-06-2016 03:29 PM
  18. ven07's Avatar
    Issue with them is lack of innovation and the more 'sameness' well why fix something that isnt broke, the question is user fatigue and boredom.
    Tbh I call bull on this.. Sure the design can be bland, but users will stick to what works and those phones simply work. Combine that with dev support and you have a winner. I honestly think most people that are standing on rooftops screaming that the design is mostly the same, are platform rivals. Even from our side lol

    Microsoft have also done something uniquem something amazing that has taken many years and the result (not today but at some point) is simply incredible...Onecore.. Make an app for PC or XBOX or Hololens or Mobile and without too much effort can work on all of the others!!
    The downside and upside to this is the time factor. MS has a lead when it comes to this, so if they do it right, things could end up being great for the platform, but if they make mistakes and allow the competition to catch up... Well...

    Others will and are catching onto the whole one core idea.
    10-06-2016 03:48 PM
  19. Dusteater's Avatar
    For me W10M works pretty well. The biggest thing though is that I can't use the phone in the car. Microsoft is a core member of the CCC, so why MirrorLink isn't on the roadmap is really confusing to me. Particularly because of their push for Cortana and Continuum. This would be the perfect use case.

    And before anyone says the new focus in enterprise, I am a Network Engineer and visit customers across the Pacific Northwest. I can spend up to 10 hours in the car in one day. Bluetooth audio simply doesn't cut it these days. I need to have navigation and access to messages and calls from the road. Windows 10 Mobile simply doesn't work for road warriors. It is the worst platform available, and Microsoft just doesn't care.
    Laura Knotek, ven07 and libra89 like this.
    10-06-2016 03:50 PM
  20. fatclue_98's Avatar
    The downside and upside to this is the time factor. MS has a lead when it comes to this, so if they do it right, things could end up being great for the platform, but if they make mistakes and allow the competition to catch up... Well...
    Remember the HP iPaq H6300 from '04? It was the first phone with a 3.5" screen and no keyboard. There was an add-on thumb keyboard but it was a pain. Everybody within earshot of a T-Mobile store blasted it. Fast forward 3 years and voila! The iPhone and its 3.5" display. The rest as they say, was history.
    Guytronic and ven07 like this.
    10-06-2016 03:58 PM
  21. ven07's Avatar
    Remember the HP iPaq H6300 from '04? It was the first phone with a 3.5" screen and no keyboard. There was an add-on thumb keyboard but it was a pain. Everybody within earshot of a T-Mobile store blasted it. Fast forward 3 years and voila! The iPhone and its 3.5" display. The rest as they say, was history.
    Lol unfortunately I don't have a counter for this :p
    Guytronic likes this.
    10-06-2016 04:25 PM
  22. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Lol unfortunately I don't have a counter for this :p
    There isn't supposed to be one. I was just re-affirming your previous post regarding Microsoft's ability to let good things go if the market is not ready.
    ven07 likes this.
    10-06-2016 05:34 PM
  23. glossywhite's Avatar
    Microsoft couldn't organise an excessive consumption of alcohol event in a brewery, which is why they keep blundering onward with no real direction. Just the "customer service" experience I had to endure this last fortnight, is enough to actively dissuade people to abandon Microsoft ANYTHING, that's before they'd even had a chance to delve deeper or experience the MS ineptitude in all its fantastic varieties of fail and cluelessness, spidering outward across ALL their many departments and employees.
    10-06-2016 07:50 PM
  24. pedmar007's Avatar
    A pity this couldn't be sent directly to Nadella or Dona and EVERY single MS DEV exec.
    10-08-2016 10:04 AM
  25. pedmar007's Avatar
    Correction.. don't use them as daily drivers :p I can fully imagine that they have one sitting somewhere that only serves for testing purposes.

    That's basically what enterprise will give us. (Maybe, if it hits off) a ton of people using w10m but probably only as long as their on the workfloor.

    If they happen to like what they see, they might pick one up for personal use
    Think MS understands that reality???
    10-08-2016 10:30 AM
29 12

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 18
    Last Post: 10-06-2016, 11:40 AM
  2. How to take ownership of files on Windows 10 with a right-click
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-04-2016, 02:11 PM
  3. Old windows phone account linking to new windows phone
    By Windows Central Question in forum Ask a Question
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-04-2016, 12:42 PM
  4. WhartonBrooks Part II: CEO Greg Murphy on his upstart Windows Mobile company [Exclusive]
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-04-2016, 11:11 AM
  5. Hilton HHonors Windows Phone app to say 'Goodbye' soon
    By WindowsCentral.com in forum Windows Central News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-04-2016, 10:30 AM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD