08-28-2017 01:42 PM
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  1. Scanspeak's Avatar
    Hi there,

    I`ve been using a WP8.1 for years and side by side with an Asus Zenfone running Android, I much prefer it. Problem is - I notice many providers are removing their apps from the Windows Store. Bloomberg, Ebay, Caledos and others which I use almost daily, are either not there or left unupdated and some don`t work well.

    So, does it make sense to purchase another such phone in a shrinking app store and what appears to be a silent desire by Microsoft to shut off WP? Do you think its all rumours about them looking to kill the mobile version?

    I am in a shaky boat - I like iOS as an OS very much. The devices work flawlessly and are very easy to use, apps are millions. But I don`t like the constant need to use iTunes and Apple`s support and policies. Its like buying a product from a company I don`t like for their values, not for their devices. I`m not going back to Android even if I`m threatened with a gun to my forehead.
    nick popplewell likes this.
    07-07-2017 03:21 AM
  2. Drael646464's Avatar
    So far as I can see, apps are coming into the store, faster than they are leaving.
    But if you depend on the apps, from makers of old Silverlight apps, rather than makers of the new UWP apps, yeah, that would be a problem for you.

    I don't know exactly what MSFT has planned for the small screen, but I find it very hard to believe they'll give up on their one OS company vision, and I see them spending money on updates that they don't have to be, creating software behind the scenes for the OS, that must be intended for some use or other.

    Nobody can answer that question regarding the unknown future of win10m.

    In fact that question is almost like a mirror into a persons soul, all you see when someone answers it, is the person answering.

    But from where I am sitting, "killing the mobile version" is a speculation based on emotion and not reason. The evidence more or less, seems to point the other way, that they have some form of continued ambition in the arena.

    For me, I usually buy a new phone every 3-4 years. It tends to still do its job during that period. Maybe some apps come or go. Its not a marriage contract.

    I don't much like apple or googles attitude towards consumers either. You need to just balance that with how often you buy phones, and whether that or those apps you love are more or less important. Like weighing something in both hands.
    07-07-2017 05:26 AM
  3. realwarder's Avatar
    There have been no new Windows Mobile phones from anyone on the last year. If you are happy buying or staying with an old phone, do it. I'm still using my 950xl and like it. Still has the best camera to me. But an average user will want apps not available on Windows Mobile. They'll want their bank app, Snapchat etc. So I would not recommend it to anyone at the moment... To all intents it appears dead. If it isn't then Microsoft had better show the world something new pretty soon else even long time Windows Mobile fans will move on if they haven't already.
    07-07-2017 08:04 AM
  4. tdavi82's Avatar
    I love my Lumia 950, but I made the switch to a Galaxy S8. In the current state, I cannot recommend switching to a Windows Mobile device.
    07-07-2017 10:22 AM
  5. xandros9's Avatar
    You don't need to use iOS with iTunes. The only reason to use iTunes for me is to manage my music, which it does well. But you can easily use an iPhone without every plugging it into a computer like my mother.
    07-07-2017 11:58 AM
  6. hyperleaf's Avatar
    I've been using my Lumia 630 since 2014, (yes it's still alive and running) and I still enjoy the reliability of Geofencing with every reminder I set in it with Cortana. By now, it's a pretty underwhelming handset, but it gets my location accurately without needing to connect the internet, unlike most Android handsets I've owned.
    Nate W likes this.
    07-08-2017 01:25 PM
  7. Zachary Boddy's Avatar
    Well, I'm enjoying my Windows 10 Mobile device, and as far as I can go we are getting more apps coming in then leaving. Windows Phone 8.1 has been abandoned for good and is never coming back, but Windows 10 Mobile is actually in a really good shape right now. It can stand toe-to-toe with Android and iOS and come out on top in most areas except, of course, the app store. The only question we have is if we're going to have continued support. Microsoft hasn't told us anything, and even though we are certain that they are in fact working on something behind the scenes, we have no idea if any of us will reap the benefits or if it will require another pointless reboot and us spending more money on buying a new device that may or may not be supported in the future.

    I love my Lumia 950/XL. But I don't know if I can really recommend a Windows 10 Mobile device to anyone without being able to tell them for sure if they're going to be supported. It's an important question and we really don't have any answers right now.
    07-08-2017 06:01 PM
  8. Drael646464's Avatar
    Well, I'm enjoying my Windows 10 Mobile device, and as far as I can go we are getting more apps coming in then leaving. Windows Phone 8.1 has been abandoned for good and is never coming back, but Windows 10 Mobile is actually in a really good shape right now. It can stand toe-to-toe with Android and iOS and come out on top in most areas except, of course, the app store. The only question we have is if we're going to have continued support. Microsoft hasn't told us anything, and even though we are certain that they are in fact working on something behind the scenes, we have no idea if any of us will reap the benefits or if it will require another pointless reboot and us spending more money on buying a new device that may or may not be supported in the future.

    I love my Lumia 950/XL. But I don't know if I can really recommend a Windows 10 Mobile device to anyone without being able to tell them for sure if they're going to be supported. It's an important question and we really don't have any answers right now.
    Well being supported doesn't mean your phone stops working.

    It just means you don't get more features. The only real reason people suspect a "reboot" is a combination of wild speculation and negative past experiences.

    Are things a little uncertain there, in some fashion? Absolutely. MSFT could move fully onto new devices, or similar.

    But this reboot thing, I don't really see the sense in it. Windows 10 isn't changing. Its the same version, forever.

    Each new feature or functionality addition or subtraction is still considered the same thing, windows 10. I don't see why mobile would be any different.

    Maybe they'd add something, change something, or stop supporting certain phones, but I can't really see any sudden major change that would justify the term 'reboot' on the horizon. Myself I just don't see it. I don't see the reason for those radical changes, nor what they would be.

    Whether things are a little unknown or not, that's just how I see it.

    Take cshell for example. Cshell is coming to every SKU. When it comes to win10 pro, will they call that "a reboot"? I don't think they will. Windows on arm runs win32 under emulation, but its not considered even a separate SKU.

    Not trying to argue, or debate, just saying from my POV, whilst we don't know the road msft has planned, I think some of the speculation doesn't really make sense. People throw this work reboot around, but I don't really get how that would look, or why msft would do it.

    So far as I can see windows 10 is windows 10, windows 10m is windows 10m. One day they may all merge. But I can't see any sign of that now, seems more like MSFTs roadmap is a slow, piece by piece affair. Like someone building a house.


    If someone was super keen for new features, they might like to avoid win10m, in case their phone isn't supported in the future - that we don't know. But UWP seems to be bubbling along, I'm confident MSFT intends to grow full UWP apps, and if you were happy with win10m, AS IT IS, for a few years, I don't see why one wouldn't do the thing, that one wants to do.

    I guess the one caveat there, is rumours are abound that Silverlight might be dropped. So if one depended on now defunct Silverlight apps, and wanted to use existing legacy software, yeah that would be a horrible disappointment. Maybe they'll go on and make UWP versions, but maybe not. It's profitable clearly for big titles games to do so, but likely not for everyone at least right now.

    Also agree that more is coming than going, the insider bugfixes are LONG overdue, and as an experience, win10 is pretty tight right now. Upvote for that :P
    .
    07-09-2017 12:14 AM
  9. mrsatellite's Avatar
    I'm in the same situation as "scanspeak". My lumia 1020 finally lost skype . So went to the windows store in the mall and they had no windows phones
    WHAT THE HECK
    They wrere selling Samsung Google powered phones in a windows store . Sure you can't go to a apple store to buy a wp.
    Salesman says surface might be coming out with a phone but no idea of release date
    I'm leaning to the fact that wp is a dying phone. Which is too bad. I like my wp
    Was told the 950xl is already discontinued .Should I wait for surface phone or buy a 950 or alcatel, Or go andoid. Its sad but I need skype back
    07-09-2017 12:17 AM
  10. princeegli's Avatar
    I just got me another used Windows phone,and put win 10 mobile on it....and Skype....this is what ill do,till new win phone
    Kot Prada likes this.
    07-09-2017 12:54 AM
  11. Zachary Boddy's Avatar
    Well being supported doesn't mean your phone stops working.

    It just means you don't get more features. The only real reason people suspect a "reboot" is a combination of wild speculation and negative past experiences.

    Are things a little uncertain there, in some fashion? Absolutely. MSFT could move fully onto new devices, or similar.

    But this reboot thing, I don't really see the sense in it. Windows 10 isn't changing. Its the same version, forever.

    Each new feature or functionality addition or subtraction is still considered the same thing, windows 10. I don't see why mobile would be any different.

    Maybe they'd add something, change something, or stop supporting certain phones, but I can't really see any sudden major change that would justify the term 'reboot' on the horizon. Myself I just don't see it. I don't see the reason for those radical changes, nor what they would be.

    Whether things are a little unknown or not, that's just how I see it.

    Take cshell for example. Cshell is coming to every SKU. When it comes to win10 pro, will they call that "a reboot"? I don't think they will. Windows on arm runs win32 under emulation, but its not considered even a separate SKU.

    Not trying to argue, or debate, just saying from my POV, whilst we don't know the road msft has planned, I think some of the speculation doesn't really make sense. People throw this work reboot around, but I don't really get how that would look, or why msft would do it.

    So far as I can see windows 10 is windows 10, windows 10m is windows 10m. One day they may all merge. But I can't see any sign of that now, seems more like MSFTs roadmap is a slow, piece by piece affair. Like someone building a house.


    If someone was super keen for new features, they might like to avoid win10m, in case their phone isn't supported in the future - that we don't know. But UWP seems to be bubbling along, I'm confident MSFT intends to grow full UWP apps, and if you were happy with win10m, AS IT IS, for a few years, I don't see why one wouldn't do the thing, that one wants to do.

    I guess the one caveat there, is rumours are abound that Silverlight might be dropped. So if one depended on now defunct Silverlight apps, and wanted to use existing legacy software, yeah that would be a horrible disappointment. Maybe they'll go on and make UWP versions, but maybe not. It's profitable clearly for big titles games to do so, but likely not for everyone at least right now.

    Also agree that more is coming than going, the insider bugfixes are LONG overdue, and as an experience, win10 is pretty tight right now. Upvote for that :P
    .
    I'm not saying any of the rumors are true, or that Microsoft really is planning another reboot. Honestly, I fervently hope those speculations are wrong, because I actually really like Windows 10 Mobile where it is right now and only want to see it brought more in line with Windows 10. You know, updates actually being the same across the board, 64bit support, stuff like that. But I do believe that, because of the nature of the silence and the way updates are currently going, I'm not entirely comfortable recommending a new Windows 10 Mobile device to someone who isn't already enamored with Windows phones. I just don't think it's fair to hope that Microsoft has bigger plans for Mobile beyond maintenance and then screw someone over because they spent hard earned money on a device that will become outdated and unsecure far faster than other devices on other operating systems. My phone is running great right now, but that doesn't mean problems won't pop up in the future if Microsoft makes some internal changes but doesn't reflect those changes in Mobile. I just urge caution for everyone if they're considering a Windows 10 Mobile device. Unless you truly want that unique, slick UI experience and all the neat features of Windows 10 Mobile, I might wait until we know more about our future.

    I know I'm perfectly content where I am, but that doesn't necessarily mean everyone else will be. The rumors may or may not be true, but I'm not going to be the one that assumes all will be fine and then find out they're not.
    NYCMetsPDX and mattiasnyc like this.
    07-09-2017 12:37 PM
  12. Drael646464's Avatar
    Well personally I'm not one to spend a lot on phones or worry about new features. If the apps are okay, I'm okay. I say if your happy with uwp over Silverlight, you like Windows Mobile and aren't spending a bundle knock yourself out. If you depend on specialized apps don't. If you expect and need anything beyond security patches, it might be a risk. And if you don't have pockets flowing with excess cash one may want to hedge ones bets and get a cheap 650/950. Equally if all that puts you off get an iPhone se and wait till the plans cement till your return. I don't reckon spending a lot on short lived devices makes a lot of sense either way

    It's just a phone. At the end of the day it either matches your needs or not. You'll have something else in three years anyway, so if its nice or annoying now, chances are that'll be you're experience for a portion of that time. Uwp will grow but Silverlight will die, so apps will default be a revolving door. For some that's fun, for others a nightmare.
    Last edited by Guytronic; 07-09-2017 at 08:38 PM.
    07-09-2017 12:48 PM
  13. PerfectReign's Avatar
    FWIW, I switched my beautiful young bride from Android to WM10 when her Galaxy S4 finally died. While she has missed a few apps she's good with her 640. I bought it for $100 last year on eBay. She doesn't use many apps and is happy.

    I was only frustrated with it last month. She was in England with our younger son. I tried repeatedly to Skype with her and was not able. I was only successful when my son and I used FaceTime.

    #FirstWorldProblems
    Nate W and Jim Roscovius like this.
    07-09-2017 01:20 PM
  14. midnightfrolic's Avatar
    OP. IMO not worth the limitations and reliability to get any Windows Mobile at this point in time, nor in the next year or two. No apps. Still buggy.

    I'm on 950XL production build and it's still buggy. Still has all the same issues since day one. Same on Insider builds. Edge crashing, resuming hangs and crashes, phone reboots randomly. Cortana doesn't respond, but perks up randomly even when not invoked. Lack of apps still due to low market share. Doesn't wake up sometimes. Double tap to wake doesn't work reliably. Freezes on waking up sometimes.

    Do yourself a favor and get an iPhone or Galaxy S8+
    07-09-2017 08:09 PM
  15. Drael646464's Avatar
    OP. IMO not worth the limitations and reliability to get any Windows Mobile at this point in time, nor in the next year or two. No apps. Still buggy.

    I'm on 950XL production build and it's still buggy. Still has all the same issues since day one. Same on Insider builds. Edge crashing, resuming hangs and crashes, phone reboots randomly. Cortana doesn't respond, but perks up randomly even when not invoked. Lack of apps still due to low market share. Doesn't wake up sometimes. Double tap to wake doesn't work reliably. Freezes on waking up sometimes.

    Do yourself a favor and get an iPhone or Galaxy S8+
    Not saying there isn't slightly more bugs in win10m than the other two, because there is, and hence why the recent focus on bugfixes is long overdue, and to me, most welcome, but if you phone is freezing up entirely (ie you have to reset it, to use it), or rebooting, I don't think that's typical.

    Or its not my experience of the lumias.

    Most I really get is the odd resume bug on some particular apps, and tap to wake isn't always 100 percent. But then I've never owned any device that responds 100 percent reliably when waking from sleep (sometimes waking to a blank screen, or taking a long time, or need to press the button more than once), and I've had particular apps in android hang and not run too, with reasonable frequency. Slightly less often admittedly, and I am sure that can be improved.

    Rebooting as I understand it, is a removeable battery issue, rather than an OS issue. Its something connected to the pins and the contact pads. I've had such issues with a blackberry device, and that OS is super solid. Flawless actually compared to android.

    You may find a new battery fixes that issue, or that's pretty much what everyone who has rebooting issues seems to in the end, find.

    Also recommend insider preview and slow ring. Some of the recent bugfixes, such as to Bluetooth, make for a better experience. Perhaps they will resolve your odd edge crashing issue too?

    Well actually that and yes, Cortana can be a little unresponsive at times but so can google assistant. Dunno what siri is like there, but I have heard ios has its issues too. Mostly I just use Cortana for appointments and using in the car, so that's never bothered me personally.

    I've heard some people say their Cortana or google assistant reacts perfectly, so I am not really sure whats going on there. Perhaps its related to the way of speaking, or maybe they are talking out of a hole in their glutius region.
    Last edited by Guytronic; 07-09-2017 at 11:24 PM.
    07-09-2017 10:24 PM
  16. Kot Prada's Avatar
    Hi there,

    I`ve been using a WP8.1 for years and side by side with an Asus Zenfone running Android, I much prefer it. Problem is - I notice many providers are removing their apps from the Windows Store. Bloomberg, Ebay, Caledos and others which I use almost daily, are either not there or left unupdated and some don`t work well.

    So, does it make sense to purchase another such phone in a shrinking app store and what appears to be a silent desire by Microsoft to shut off WP? Do you think its all rumours about them looking to kill the mobile version?

    I am in a shaky boat - I like iOS as an OS very much. The devices work flawlessly and are very easy to use, apps are millions. But I don`t like the constant need to use iTunes and Apple`s support and policies. Its like buying a product from a company I don`t like for their values, not for their devices. I`m not going back to Android even if I`m threatened with a gun to my forehead.
    I got mine 950 XL ~ 2 months ago. Will use it with pleasure until next MS device.

    Didn't read the part about iOS and Android... because I don't want even to hear about them

    You don't need to use iOS with iTunes. The only reason to use iTunes for me is to manage my music, which it does well. But you can easily use an iPhone without every plugging it into a computer like my mother.
    1. How to change ringtone without iTunes?
    2. How to transfer photos from iPhone to Windows PC?
    3. How to get mp3 music on iPhone from PC without iTunes?
    Last edited by Guytronic; 07-11-2017 at 12:51 PM.
    raycpl and Drael646464 like this.
    07-10-2017 08:50 AM
  17. xandros9's Avatar
    1. How to change ringtone without iTunes?
    2. How to transfer photos from iPhone to Windows PC?
    3. How to get mp3 music on iPhone from PC without iTunes?
    2. Plug-in-play here for copying photos from the phone.

    As for 1 and 3, we can argue about the importance of those to kingdom come. They're (talking about local music and custom ringtones) very important to me, but I see most people who don't care.

    People can use iCloud for photos as well as iTunes on the phone for music. Not ideal for me, but if you just use Apple Music or Spotify, you can get by.

    Of course you need iTunes for some features, but those aren't likely to be dealbreakers for a solid chunk of people other than us.
    07-10-2017 07:36 PM
  18. Kot Prada's Avatar
    2. Plug-in-play here for copying photos from the phone.

    As for 1 and 3, we can argue about the importance of those to kingdom come. They're (talking about local music and custom ringtones) very important to me, but I see most people who don't care.

    People can use iCloud for photos as well as iTunes on the phone for music. Not ideal for me, but if you just use Apple Music or Spotify, you can get by.

    Of course you need iTunes for some features, but those aren't likely to be dealbreakers for a solid chunk of people other than us.
    It's like to say: "You don't need internet on smartphone. You can make calls and write sms without internet".
    Or, "You don't need wheels on car. You can listen to music in car even without wheels".

    For sure, You DO need iTunes even for basic smartphone functionality. That's Apple's strategy to hardly integrate all their services and to restrict it's customers. It's obvious. And there is no need to argue about that. Someone can like this strategy, someone don't... but it's fact.
    Drael646464 likes this.
    07-11-2017 07:52 AM
  19. mattiasnyc's Avatar
    OP. IMO not worth the limitations and reliability to get any Windows Mobile at this point in time, nor in the next year or two. No apps. Still buggy.

    I'm on 950XL production build and it's still buggy. Still has all the same issues since day one. Same on Insider builds. Edge crashing, resuming hangs and crashes, phone reboots randomly. Cortana doesn't respond, but perks up randomly even when not invoked. Lack of apps still due to low market share. Doesn't wake up sometimes. Double tap to wake doesn't work reliably. Freezes on waking up sometimes.

    Do yourself a favor and get an iPhone or Galaxy S8+
    Try a different battery. It's likely not the OS that's the problem.
    Drael646464 likes this.
    07-11-2017 09:28 AM
  20. xandros9's Avatar
    It's like to say: "You don't need internet on smartphone. You can make calls and write sms without internet".
    Or, "You don't need wheels on car. You can listen to music in car even without wheels".

    For sure, You DO need iTunes even for basic smartphone functionality. That's Apple's strategy to hardly integrate all their services and to restrict it's customers. It's obvious. And there is no need to argue about that. Someone can like this strategy, someone don't... but it's fact.
    That's a bizarre absolute you took my post to. The whole thing is a continuum between "you don't need a front-facing flash on a smartphone" or "you don't need a spoiler on your car" to "you don't need a battery in a smartphone" or "you don't need a steering wheel in a car". There's a world of difference between those.

    But are what you mentioned "basic functionality"? You can get music from iTunes on the phone/Apple Music/Spotify/Pandora, etc. (I have a 100% local music collection so I know that's not exactly a replacement) And I remembered you can get ringtones from iTunes on the phone itself as well.
    libra89, TgeekB and Guytronic like this.
    07-11-2017 10:50 AM
  21. Drael646464's Avatar
    That's a bizarre absolute you took my post to. The whole thing is a continuum between "you don't need a front-facing flash on a smartphone" or "you don't need a spoiler on your car" to "you don't need a battery in a smartphone" or "you don't need a steering wheel in a car". There's a world of difference between those.

    But are what you mentioned "basic functionality"? You can get music from iTunes on the phone/Apple Music/Spotify/Pandora, etc. (I have a 100% local music collection so I know that's not exactly a replacement) And I remembered you can get ringtones from iTunes on the phone itself as well.
    I think, it could potentially be argued, that local music is a basic functionality of smartphones. All smartphones can do it, and its fairly commonly used. Even those who stream, aren't always connected to LTE. And streaming services are comparatively new next to historically locally stored music. I don't think they can be regarded as the "same feature".

    And its possible to use any application or service for playing local music on bb10, android and win10m. So this might be considered a fair complaint of iphones.
    Kot Prada likes this.
    07-11-2017 11:37 AM
  22. Kot Prada's Avatar
    That's a bizarre absolute you took my post to. The whole thing is a continuum between "you don't need a front-facing flash on a smartphone" or "you don't need a spoiler on your car" to "you don't need a battery in a smartphone" or "you don't need a steering wheel in a car". There's a world of difference between those.

    But are what you mentioned "basic functionality"? You can get music from iTunes on the phone/Apple Music/Spotify/Pandora, etc. (I have a 100% local music collection so I know that's not exactly a replacement) And I remembered you can get ringtones from iTunes on the phone itself as well.
    I agree about bizarre... because You started nonsense "you don't need..." discussion. That's why I showed You how far and dumb it can go.

    I think, it could potentially be argued, that local music is a basic functionality of smartphones. All smartphones can do it, and its fairly commonly used. Even those who stream, aren't always connected to LTE. And streaming services are comparatively new next to historically locally stored music. I don't think they can be regarded as the "same feature".

    And its possible to use any application or service for playing local music on bb10, android and win10m. So this might be considered a fair complaint of iphones.
    And what about setting any custom ringtone? Isn't that "feature" available in Nokia 6230 or Siemens S65?

    Anyway, not sure iTunes is the main problem here, since even iTunes will not help You to use Bluetooth on iPhone, to change notifications for different applications or to change battery.

    Please, note: that "features" above are still available in incredible (comparing to iPhone) Nokia 6230 and Siemens S65

    OK, I'll better stop... talking about Apple "devices" just makes me laughing all the time.
    07-11-2017 12:43 PM
  23. TgeekB's Avatar
    It's funny we're even having this argument about the iPhone, which is clearly still alive and Windows Phone, which is on life support. Custom ringtones clearly hasn't helped much.
    tgp, Guytronic, libra89 and 2 others like this.
    07-11-2017 09:05 PM
  24. Kot Prada's Avatar
    It's funny we're even having this argument about the iPhone, which is clearly still alive and Windows Phone, which is on life support. Custom ringtones clearly hasn't helped much.
    Dumb customers and awesome marketing... same point for BB10, which beats iOS and Android all together as well, but is dead.

    And it's not funny. It's sad.
    07-12-2017 09:55 AM
  25. TgeekB's Avatar
    Unsubstantiated excuses = custom ringtones
    libra89 and Guytronic like this.
    07-12-2017 03:21 PM
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