1. psustudent21's Avatar
    HP Elite x3 (QuickSpecs/c05193008.pdf)

    According to the spec sheet above, the HP Elite X3 will not support cdma bands meaning Verizon and Sprint users won't have access to this phone.

    Why does Microsoft/HW Partners continue to not make phones with Universal bands? This doesn't make any sense. The phone isn't even being sold in customer retail stores and they still can't pick up support.

    I am not sure how good this phone can do leaving a large business market without an option.
    07-03-2016 04:53 PM
  2. g808's Avatar
    Seems like dealing with big red is too much of a PITA. You'd think HP and Microsoft has the resources for it though.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    RumoredNow likes this.
    07-03-2016 06:24 PM
  3. xandros9's Avatar
    Well the only two major CDMA carriers need to approve the phone and all that jazz, so if they don't want to support the phone, then that's the end of it. I get the feeling VZW and Sprint just don't want to play ball.
    07-03-2016 07:06 PM
  4. tgp's Avatar
    Seems like dealing with big red is too much of a PITA. You'd think HP and Microsoft has the resources for it though.
    A number of other manufacturers are producing unlocked models supporting CDMA. Samsung just released a factory unlocked S7/Edge that supports Verizon and Sprint, even though they already have models specific for those carriers. I'm guessing there's another reason that Microsoft and HP aren't doing it. Who knows what it is?

    For the record, I do not wish to infer that the situation with CDMA carriers is ideal. It is not. However, that's the way it is currently, and the manufacturers must accomodate if they wish to participate.
    libra89 likes this.
    07-03-2016 07:20 PM
  5. psustudent21's Avatar
    According to Verizon, they don't have a choice on whether to support the phone on their network. Also, the FCC has a law against this as well. Honestly who knows who's at fault but I find it sad that it isn't worked out so all business customers can use this phone.
    07-03-2016 08:28 PM
  6. RumoredNow's Avatar
    I think it goes to the way Vzw treats OEMs.

    If your device has a proven track record of customer demand you get a free pass. If not, Verizon wants exclusives, changes to firmware and conditions met. They often demand weird things that handicap a device, especially exclusive US issue.

    I don't think HP wants to go down that road with their first smart phone since 2011. They want to succeed with their vision, not hamper it with the demands of another corporation that really has no stake in whether the Elite X3 sinks or swims.

    If you look at the history of Vzw and Windows phone, there is nothing there to inspire confidence for a W10M OEM to want to place a device with Vzw, especially adding in the cost of CDMA certification, the Vzw testing process and who knows what conditions Vzw demands to allow the placement.


    Let me add this reprint of a post I made regarding carrier sizes in the US.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...vice_providers



    I don't think Big Red is as far out front as many people believe they are.

    11 million over AT&T is a gap, granted. However a Factory Unlocked GSM model can potentially reach AT&T + T-Mobile + a great number of mvno's running off of their towers including Straight Talk, Cricket, Walmart Family Mobile, H2O, Ting, GoPhone, Consumer Cellular, Metro PCS, Net 10, Simple mobile, TracFone, etc. A substantial number when totaled together.

    Sure Verizon has a lot of subscribers and yes, it is more than any other single entity (although ATT + Cricket = close... The figures are hard to come by, but they appear to hover around 5M on Cricket). But for Verizon to be able to leverage any company they come in contact with to dictate terms is probably not realistic. Is it a benefit to have access to that market? Sure. Is it imperative? Probably not.

    Once more I'll go to my favorite pie chart on this topic. Who supports Windows Phone through subscriptions? Hands down ATT + Cricket at 50%, followed by T-Mo + Metro PCS with Vzw a distant 3rd in Windows Phone subscribers... This is from last September. I'm dying for AD Duplex to update this stat. I have a feeling Vzw & the T-Mo/Metro block will lose more share in this to ATT/Cricket.

    Attachment 127251
    Last edited by RumoredNow; 07-04-2016 at 10:42 AM.
    07-03-2016 10:33 PM
  7. Krystianpants's Avatar
    Verizon is phasing out their CDMA network. They actually have VoLTE in a lot of areas now and can support it. However, the manufacturer would have to pass a cert process for cmda and/or Volte. So they won't allow any devices without the cert. But HP may have plans to release a verizon specific version. At this point all they need to do is maybe meet some firmware requirements but OS updates will still occur through MS.
    07-04-2016 09:57 AM
  8. Lumious's Avatar
    lol...of course..

    still not regretting switching from Verizon to AT&T and my wallet isn't either..
    Last edited by Lumious; 07-04-2016 at 12:53 PM. Reason: typos
    07-04-2016 12:53 PM
  9. Alexander Long's Avatar
    Outside US, not a lot of Carrier in the world still care about old CDMA any more, most of them had switch to HSPA and LTE, and about to shut down CDMA network.
    and also CDMA network normarlly can't let users to just get a phone and put a "Sim" like IDSN card in the phone, user have to go the carrier and ask them to register the phone on to their network. which just got very inconvenient for manufatories. so phones work on CDMA normally would be specific modified or designed for the carrier.
    07-04-2016 01:04 PM
  10. Tom Westrick's Avatar
    Android manufacturers such as Google and Motorola have released unlocked phones in the past two years that work with Verizon and Sprint out of the box. Pop in your SIM, and it'll connect to the network just like it would AT&T or T-Mobile. So there's no technical reason it can't be done.

    It comes down to licensing fees. Even though Snapdragon processors allow for support for every antenna band under the sun, manufacturers still have to pay additional fees to be able to use those bands. There are also additional costs regarding testing which would add up over the life of the phone.

    If HP/Microsoft don't believe a sufficient number of customers will use their devices on Verizon or Sprint to make the extra costs worth it, they're not going to include support for those networks.

    Edit: to clarify, the Android phones I mentioned weren't sold in Verizon stores, so they didn't have any bloatware and weren't on a different update track. They just worked on Verizon's network if you already have a SIM.
    07-04-2016 04:20 PM
  11. Tom Westrick's Avatar
    Verizon is phasing out their CDMA network. They actually have VoLTE in a lot of areas now and can support it. However, the manufacturer would have to pass a cert process for cmda and/or Volte. So they won't allow any devices without the cert. But HP may have plans to release a verizon specific version. At this point all they need to do is maybe meet some firmware requirements but OS updates will still occur through MS.
    Verizon IS phasing out their CDMA network, but not until 2021. So if an OEM wants users on Verizon's network, they'll still need to support CDMA for quite some time. Source: http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/...021/2012-10-10
    07-04-2016 04:26 PM
  12. Krystianpants's Avatar
    Verizon IS phasing out their CDMA network, but not until 2021. So if an OEM wants users on Verizon's network, they'll still need to support CDMA for quite some time. Source: Updated: Verizon Wireless to sunset 2G and 3G CDMA networks by 2021 - FierceWireless
    Yes look at the date of the article. They already have millions of customers using VoLTE. It's opt-in right now but will become the standard. They have a huge coverage area and the transition will be last in smaller areas where there is less population.

    A quick search shows a newer article: Verizon Aggressively Working on VoLTE Transition | Light Reading
    07-04-2016 04:38 PM
  13. Tom Westrick's Avatar
    VOLTE is great for the users that can use it, but again, there are places in the US that only have Verizon for coverage. People are still going to need 2G and 3G for coverage when 4G is congested or unavailable.
    07-04-2016 05:03 PM
  14. SL2's Avatar
    "Actual formatted capacity is less. Up to 24 GB is reserved for system recovery software."
    24 GB? New record?
    07-04-2016 05:43 PM
  15. JM_Thomas's Avatar
    "Actual formatted capacity is less. Up to 24 GB is reserved for system recovery software."
    24 GB? New record?
    I think that may be due to the system rollback function HP is building into it. Plus all their business-oriented and security software it will be loaded with will eat up quote a bit of the on-board storage. Doubtful it will be uninstallable either.

    Good thing it has an micro-SD card slot. Going to need it.
    07-04-2016 06:32 PM
  16. SL2's Avatar
    I think that may be due to the system rollback function HP is building into it. Plus all their business-oriented and security software it will be loaded with will eat up quote a bit of the on-board storage. Doubtful it will be uninstallable either.
    Yeah, but it's still three times the size of a Windows 10 64-bit installation.

    12 GB would have been a lot, 24 GB is crazy.
    07-04-2016 06:49 PM
  17. tgp's Avatar
    I think it goes to the way Vzw treats OEMs.

    If your device has a proven track record of customer demand you get a free pass. If not, Verizon wants exclusives, changes to firmware and conditions met. They often demand weird things that handicap a device, especially exclusive US issue.

    I don't think HP wants to go down that road with their first smart phone since 2011. They want to succeed with their vision, not hamper it with the demands of another corporation that really has no stake in whether the Elite X3 sinks or swims.

    If you look at the history of Vzw and Windows phone, there is nothing there to inspire confidence for a W10M OEM to want to place a device with Vzw, especially adding in the cost of CDMA certification, the Vzw testing process and who knows what conditions Vzw demands to allow the placement.


    Let me add this reprint of a post I made regarding carrier sizes in the US.
    You are correct about the support of Windows Phones. AT&T is the only US carrier that even pretends to care about it. The problem is that with WP's extremely low exposure and market share, this matters to virtually nobody. It is a statistical difference that is probably less than a rounding error. It is not a good situation, but that's the way it is.

    The same goes with Verizon's use of CDMA technology which limits compatibility. Many of the complaints about it that I see are by the Windows Phone users who have few other options. iPhone and Android users can either bring factory unlocked phones to Verizon or get Verizon versions of the phones they want. WP users cannot. Again, it is a matter of so relatively few users that it is scarcely noticeable.

    In five years or so this will be a non issue. Verizon's technology will be like everyone else's. What are they supposed to do about it in the meantime? Ironically, Verizon uses CDMA because at the time, they were ahead of their competitors. CDMA was the best technology when they were building out their network. (It still does have some advantages such as range and soft handoffs). Later, when most of the rest of the world's carriers were building their networks, GSM's technology was being developed and became dominant.

    CDMA has worked well for Verizon over the years, and it has helped them gain a reputation for the best overall coverage in the US. A few people complaining about not being able to bring their rare phones to Verizon isn't reason enough to change.

    US carriers have challenges not seen in other parts of the world.The US is a tough place to cover. It is sparsely populated, with the population spread out over most of its land area. Even those areas need covered. Countries like Canada and Australia are also sparsely populated, but their population is mostly consolidated in cities or along the coasts. The average cell phone tower in the US has one fourth of the population within its range as one in Europe.
    07-04-2016 09:45 PM
  18. to_be_announced's Avatar
    Sweet. Guess I gotta continue to hang onto my old Lumia 928 even longer.
    07-05-2016 03:07 PM

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