Would you buy the new Lumia 950 XL Flagship , even if they had outdated hardware?

[Steve Adams]

Its not as important as software. I have been involved with professional DSLRs for many years. And how the software processes is much more important than the processor itself.

 

[a5cent]

You need a better process for fast processing of high quality images at more than 20MP. A fast processor is also required in burst mode.

No you really don't.

Spec geeks that understand nothing about technology (except bigger spec numbers = better) will tell you the iPhone sports what is basically a low end SoC (dual core, 1.3GHz clock, etc), yet it's one of the fastest shooters around. How does it do that despite completely contradicting your point about specs?

The proof is everywhere that 99% of people have zero understanding how specs do or do not translate into perceivable performance benefits. That's just not what people are interested in learning. It's too complicated, because it involves the intangibilities of software.

MS would be wise to order a custom SoC from Qualcomm and then rebrand it as the X10 SoC, release a few benchmarks showing how capable it is at running directX or processing large images, but not publish any of the traditional specs like cores or clocks. That would take them out of the specs contest, just like Apple.

It's high time.

 

[Mikegwald]

My 640xl performance is the same as my nexus 6 . Specs are nothing but wool for the sheeps.

 

[maverick786us]

No you really don't.

Spec geeks that understand nothing about technology (except bigger spec numbers = better) will tell you the iPhone sports what is basically a low end SoC (dual core, 1.3GHz clock, etc), yet it's one of the fastest shooters around. How does it do that despite completely contradicting your point about specs?

iPhone shoots 8MP images at burst mode. Can it shoot 20MP images with the same speed maintaining the same quality and details? Nokia 808 has a separate image processor, that's why it is able made even current generation Galaxy S6 and Optimus G4 a run for money.

Yes software matters for the optimization. iOS is very much optimized compared to Android, therefore at low SoC it outperforms in benchmark as well as image quality. Android is developed in JAVA therefore it requires more memory for garbage collection, thus requires higher specs and RAM. iOS is purely LINUX and the overall OS is very much optimized.

But if you have better software, that doesn't mean that you should ignore the specs have use low specs with the flagship devices, compared to its competitors.

 

[a5cent]

But if you have better software, that doesn't mean that you should ignore the specs have use low specs with the flagship devices, compared to its competitors.

No. You can almost always safely ignore the specs. What you should not ignore is performance. Those just aren't the same things...

My whole point is that specs rarely translate directly into performance. 90% of the time you're not getting the performance listed on high-end SoC's spec sheets anyway, since clocks are throttled down to less than half of their paper based specs.

iPhone shoots 8MP images at burst mode. Can it shoot 20MP images with the same speed maintaining the same quality?

It's obvious that Apple's current SoC can't handle a 20MP image just as quickly as an 8MP image. More work at the same speed means longer processing times. That's just completely missing the point.

The better question is if a future SoC from Apple with the same dual-core 1.3GHz specs could handle a 20MP image just as fast as their current SoC can handle 8MP images? To that question the answer is definitely YES! Why? Because it's NOT the CPU that does that image processing, but other parts of the SoC for which nobody lists specs. Nothing on the spec sheet tells you anything about DSP and GPU based image processing performance.

That's actually a great example of how consumers don't understand how specs do or do not translate into perceivable performance gains.

 

[kokola]

MS should just use Snapdragon S4 for all their future devices...apparently spec does not matter with wp.
Oh...and be prepared to pay the same price as other flagship phone.

 

[a5cent]

MS should just use Snapdragon S4 for all their future devices...apparently spec does not matter with wp.
Oh...and be prepared to pay the same price as other flagship phone.

It really shouldn't be that hard of a concept to grasp:

Specs don't matter... performance does... not the same thing.

 

[fatclue_98]

It really shouldn't be that hard of a concept to grasp:



Specs don't matter... performance does... not the same thing.

There's an old adage a former racer taught me when I was getting in the game - Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races.

 

[camstreet1]

It's pretty hard to get excited about the upcoming 'flagships'. Nokia/MS hasn't made a phone with genuinely impressive hardware since the Pureview/1030, and it sounds like the camera on these phones is even inferior to those sensors. 6-12 months late to the party, once more...

 

[Steve Adams]

The 20mp pureview is an amazing sensor. Being optimized it will be better than any camera on a phone that is built at that time. I can assure you. apple, LG , samesong, and HTC will all be behind the 950 in image quality.

 

[neo158]

The 20mp pureview is an amazing sensor. Being optimized it will be better than any camera on a phone that is built at that time. I can assure you. apple, LG , samesong, and HTC will all be behind the 950 in image quality.

I have a feeling that 20MP Pureview Sensor will be the same as the one in the 930 and it really is an amazing sensor as you say.

 

[tgp]

Here's my novice thoughts on optimization vs. specs: I agree that optimization is just as important as specs, if not more important. However, take the same optimized software, and put it in a device with higher specs. In other words, everything is exactly the same except for specs. Won't the higher spec'd device perform better?

Why do we need to choose one or the other? Why can't we have both? Is it any more difficult to optimize software for a higher spec'd device?

 

[Blacklac]

The 808 and 810 are the most recent top tier SoC's, so no, I don't see the anger. The 810 is basically a disaster. I'd love it to have the 820, but do you really want to wait more for them to test it? I'm sure 2nd Gen W10 flagship will have the 820. Well, I can't be sure, but I'd bet on it.

Posted via the Windows Central App for Android

 

[camstreet1]

You may well be right, although no doubt they'll release a 'flagship' with the 820 12 months after everyone else, as per usual...

 

[jsooney]

Is there a rumored release date for this thing? This year, next year? My 1520 is on its last legs and I'm wondering whether to try and hang on or get something else to tide me over.

 

[Blacklac]

Is there a rumored release date for this thing? This year, next year? My 1520 is on its last legs and I'm wondering whether to try and hang on or get something else to tide me over.

Fall/Q4

Posted via the Windows Central App for Android

 

[Marko Marjanovic]

To much fanboing over this and that..who really care about numbers, for god's sake. Did you ever watch terminator, or play halo..or even concider how scary technology come so far. I'm in same time thriled and scared about things like holo lens, cortana and cpus so small that can be implated in ppls hand and make invalids or war veterans walk even see if they never have a gift of sight.
I've read about head transplatation (yes, it's almost like frankestain) and 3d printers and phone you can talk to them and nlt even touch devi..oh..i just type on one of that devices and with ,,hey cortana" i feel like on edge of future...and phone is 2yrs old.
And there are people who want 820 not 810 and some of them want 850cpus..and not care about else.
Did you ever stop for a moment and think how thrining and in same time scaring ,,future" is, how today's high end tmorrow is high, next week low end..how ,,we" constantly evolve?

What's next, finger scaning and iris scani..
...
..oh wait?!

 

[MDMcAtee]

Wanting the latest processor isn't a bad thing, especially when they are capable of doing more, more efficiently. The 820 will be surplanted by something else, just as that chipset will...it's getting the latest technology to have the best experience.

Along with the latest processors comes a multitude of new things it will be capable of doing, better wifi better battery management, better cell and GPS....it's not all about speed, just for speeds sake,even though speed is very important to gaming, camera processing and such.

I too would want the absolute best hardware in the top flagship phones, this is what is supposed to be in it. Getting less than the best is a turn off to me if I am paying premium for something.

Posted via the Windows Central App for Android

 

[fatclue_98]

Here's my novice thoughts on optimization vs. specs: I agree that optimization is just as important as specs, if not more important. However, take the same optimized software, and put it in a device with higher specs. In other words, everything is exactly the same except for specs. Won't the higher spec'd device perform better?

Why do we need to choose one or the other? Why can't we have both? Is it any more difficult to optimize software for a higher spec'd device?

There's an engineering term called "the point of diminishing returns" that could answer your query. Too much of a good thing can sometimes be detrimental.

Sent from my LG G3 via Tapatalk

 

[tgp]

There's an engineering term called "the point of diminishing returns" that could answer your query. Too much of a good thing can sometimes be detrimental.

Yes I know. I've been involved in production and manufacturing in the past. I was just trying to look at it objectively! :winktongue:

I don't think "the point of diminishing returns" applies in this case. It is commonly accepted here that WP doesn't need specs to run smoothly, unlike Android. However, this has never been proven. In fact, a recent benchmark test from Anandtech would suggest otherwise, at least in the low end. (The Lumia 640 and the Moto G in this review have the same Snapdragon 400). Are there any other benchmark reviews like this? If so, I'd like to see how they compare.

I personally think it's just an excuse from fans as to why WPs don't seem to get the latest hardware. I've never seen any explanation as to why WPs don't get the latest hardware except from fan sites such as this one. Even if WP does run well on lower hardware, it would certainly benefit from better specs.