12-14-2015 10:04 AM
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  1. 66stang351's Avatar
    If you get a subsidized phone on AT&T you pay $25 a month more for your plan...for 2 years...that is $600. So basically whatever down payment the phone requires plus $600 is what you pay.
    07-25-2015 11:34 PM
  2. Skamath's Avatar
    I personally would go for a unlocked phone instead of a "subsidized" phone specifically if it has got a handset installment per month above the plan. I would have to be desperate to go for the latter. I rather go for a outright phone with a prepaid plan which is much more value for money. In the long run it saves you heaps
    07-26-2015 12:51 AM
  3. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    The 930 never got Bands for the US because of that exclusivity Vzw had on the Icon. Exclusivity deals really cripple consumer choice and is a part of the old model that Microsoft most especially needs to avoid. Look what happened:
    Verizon gets an exclusive on the 930 in the US. Update? What update? Oh that update! (Narrowly avoids pitchfork toting mob of their own customers.) Sure the SIM tray is unlocked. Good luck getting MMS anywhere off Vzw after they finally added their own touch to the firmware they pushed late. Another nice flag trampled in the mud.
    Wasn't the Icon really a 929 though? I'm not sure that a carrier exclusivity deal would prevent international phones from working on US bands; my understanding is that it prevented another US carrier from carrying the same model phone, at least for a specified amount of time. Once Verizon stopped selling the phone, it should have allowed it to be given to other carriers. It may be more likely that other carriers did not want it.

    AT&T gets an exclusive for the 1520 and hamstrings it by yanking Qi and shoving PMA in. Then they rub salt in the wound by halving internal storage. Bye Bye nice flag in the US.
    Agreed, although there was a 32 GB version available online for a short period of time; I happen to have one. Your point is still valid though.


    They got you buffaloed Maaz. Please, for your own sake, do some research. The 1520.3 - yep it works on AT&T and ATT mvno, ditto T-Mo + mvno. And if you unlock an AT&T 1520 you can enable the 1700 MHz band on 3G and take that puppy walking over to T-Mo no problem.

    There are plenty of Factory Unlocked phones that work perfectly fine on AT&T including LTE.
    I don't need to re-quote all the details. I get your point but how many people are going to research and order an international version of a phone once they confirm full compatibility? Many people don't have the technical knowledge to even properly figure it out. Furthermore, the cost of unlocked phones is often higher than what the carrier is offering if you buy the phone outright from them (no contract) or go on a 0% interest payment plan. And to top it off, there are also concerns about import taxes and such. Lastly, you also lose the 1 year carrier warranty and have to go through the hassle of having an international warranty honored.

    That said, the phones you mentioned either have an AT&T version or another model that would meet the requirements. Back to the topic of the 950XL, if AT&T does not carry it, how many people are really going to go through the hassle and risk of obtaining an international version? Some of us diehard fans might do so but very few others will. If you truly want to bypass the carriers, the phone would have to be widely available in the US elsewhere and advertised as being fully compatible with AT&T and other carriers such as T-Mobile.

    I would like a 950XL but depending on price, compatibility, and warranty, I might have to settle for a 950. Or I can wait for the Intel processor phone if it appears the wait won't be too much longer by then.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    07-26-2015 05:35 AM
  4. psudotechzealot's Avatar
    Microsoft Cityman (Lumia 950 XL) for T-mobile? No problem with that.
    Jazmac and Kevin Rush like this.
    07-26-2015 05:45 AM
  5. RumoredNow's Avatar
    Wasn't the Icon really a 929 though? I'm not sure that a carrier exclusivity deal would prevent international phones from working on US bands; my understanding is that it prevented another US carrier from carrying the same model phone, at least for a specified amount of time. Once Verizon stopped selling the phone, it should have allowed it to be given to other carriers. It may be more likely that other carriers did not want it.
    Nokia Lumia Icon vs. Nokia Lumia 930 - GSMArena.com

    Other than the radio, they are identical. After Vzw was done mucking about with it, then Microsoft was buying up Nokia and that was about the end of that. They just cleared off the drawing boards of designs too far along to really cancel. Point is, since only Vzw could have it in the states they had to design with a more global radio on the 930 and that lets out the US for LTE. By the time any US Unlocked variant could have been offered it was a moot point.

    Notice though, if you please, how Verizon had the HSDPA max speed halved so anyone using the unlocked SIM tray would not show up their EV-Do too bad. LOLOLOLOL. This is the kind of shenanigans that carriers perpetrate. HSPA 21.1/5.76 Mbps on a 2014 flagship. Puh-hu-leaze. Could they try any harder to mess over, you, the phone buying public?
    07-26-2015 11:30 AM
  6. nukez's Avatar
    Hey there,
    funny to see that many other talk about the carrier availability versus the unlocked version that msft might sell by thier own.
    i've created a thread in Windows Phone Uservoices that suggest to have financing option to gain market share by doing something that no other constructor do.

    if you want to check out ( sorry i can't post link.... ) : it's name is "Gaining market traction by offering financing option" on windowsphone dot uservoice dot com
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    07-26-2015 11:39 AM
  7. RumoredNow's Avatar
    sorry i can't post link....
    [Solved] https://windowsphone.uservoice.com/f...ncing%20option
    07-26-2015 11:56 AM
  8. Reflexx's Avatar
    If you get a subsidized phone on AT&T you pay $25 a month more for your plan...for 2 years...that is $600. So basically whatever down payment the phone requires plus $600 is what you pay.
    Unfortunately, I have an old grandfathered Unlimited data plan.

    I may finally have to give that up I guess.
    07-26-2015 12:03 PM
  9. nukez's Avatar
    Thanks RumoredNow ;)
    RumoredNow likes this.
    07-26-2015 12:07 PM
  10. Tyler Swindell's Avatar
    Has anybody considered the reason they are not carrying the 950 XL is because it has Qi charging integrated while the regular 950 needs a case for this functionality?
    Big Papa Smurf likes this.
    07-26-2015 01:31 PM
  11. Big Papa Smurf's Avatar
    Has anybody considered the reason they are not carrying the 950 XL is because it has Qi charging integrated while the regular 950 needs a case for this functionality?
    Thinking outside the box. Gold star for you!

    They might. Or they may just wanna see how the 950 sells instead of stocking multiple phones that wont sell.
    07-26-2015 01:47 PM
  12. Tyler Swindell's Avatar
    Yea but don't they sell both the 640 and 640 XL? The only reason I could think of is perhaps Microsoft didn't want to build a special edition of the 950 XL just for at&t, and basically came to an agreement they would not include this functionality in the regular 950 and just give them that.

    Maybe they didn't like the idea of certain models of phones having functionality that others didn't. The 1520 had Qi but that didn't mean mine did. Maybe this caused a lot of headaches Microsoft didn't want to have to put up with again so this time around they designed one around what carriers would take and one that they could add more to that the carriers couldn't restrict.
    Big Papa Smurf likes this.
    07-26-2015 02:17 PM
  13. mary beth hale's Avatar
    Hey there,
    funny to see that many other talk about the carrier availability versus the unlocked version that msft might sell by thier own.
    i've created a thread in Windows Phone Uservoices that suggest to have financing option to gain market share by doing something that no other constructor do.

    if you want to check out ( sorry i can't post link.... ) : it's name is "Gaining market traction by offering financing option" on windowsphone dot uservoice dot com
    Voted and thank you
    RumoredNow, Laura Knotek and nukez like this.
    07-26-2015 02:37 PM
  14. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    Hey there,
    funny to see that many other talk about the carrier availability versus the unlocked version that msft might sell by thier own.
    i've created a thread in Windows Phone Uservoices that suggest to have financing option to gain market share by doing something that no other constructor do.

    if you want to check out ( sorry i can't post link.... ) : it's name is "Gaining market traction by offering financing option" on windowsphone dot uservoice dot com
    I also voted.

    Sent from my rooted Nexus 7 (2013) using Tapatalk
    07-26-2015 02:58 PM
  15. Mike Semblance's Avatar
    Cricket has lots of microsoft phones, plans and pamphlets
    07-26-2015 06:24 PM
  16. Gorsky's Avatar
    I'm cautiously optimistic, and I believe Microsoft is taking the long view with their own phones.

    I'm optimistic because I believe Microsoft will be adopting the Surface (or Apple) style of strategy from now on. Different market I know, but let's look at the Surface. It took a while for it to get popular, and since the Surface Pro 3 came out, the Surface line has had a small, but strong and very loyal group of fans. Does that remind you of anything else in the tech world? I'll answer that for you; Apple computers. Apple for decades has had a low marketshare in the computer market, yet they have always had a very loyal fan following. The Surface is almost in a similar situation with tablets at this early stage. Small marketshare yes, but highly praised devices and a very loyal following of fans. This group of loyal fans has become influential enough, that AT&T and T-Mobile are about to start selling the Surface 3 LTE (in addition to all the regular places you can get Surface devices from). So that is an example of organic growth. That means Microsoft was in no rush and had zero desperation to sell Surface devices. Purely through the merits and strengths of the Surface devices themselves, and marketing, Microsoft was able to reach this point. A strong enough point, that in this case it's highly likely carriers approached Microsoft to work out a deal to sell the Surface. Also as far as we know, other than being locked to AT&T or whatever, the surface devices that some of the carriers will soon be selling are otherwise identical to the fully unlocked Surface devices you can buy direct from Microsoft. Does that remind you of anything else? It should, as that's exactly the same strategy and approach Apple has used with the iPad.

    Now for those of you familiar with the smartphone market, you'll remember that many years ago when the iPhone first came out, it was only initially available on one carrier in the US (AT&T), and that was the case for a couple of years, until more carriers agreed to carry it. So during the first couple of years on the market, why did other US carriers refuse to carry the iPhone? Simple, because Steve Jobs and Apple had high demands for any carrier wanting the iPhone. They could not muck up the phone with any bloatware, or otherwise make any modifications to the phone. They also had to sell the phone at pre-determined prices from Apple, and were not allowed to modify prices outside of Apple's permission. Finally, they had to buy a guaranteed number of iPhones from Apple, before Apple would even allow that carrier to carry the iPhone. So initially most carriers balked at these demands. Soon though, it became obvious that iPhone's small, yet strongly loyal following was becoming too influential for other carriers to ignore. So other US carriers ended up with no choice but to accept Apple's demands.

    Now let me come back to Microsoft's situation. The word is that Verizon will be dropped as a partner carrier by Microsoft. Now imagine if ONLY AT&T carries the new Microsoft flagships in the US, or only one of the two flagships. Yes, it will be bad in the short term, BUT it's a good thing LONG TERM. If Microsoft with their future phones is able to establish a strong, loyal following like the Surface line, and right now completely void any existing US carrier relationships that are not beneficial, then they would be in a good long-term position. Then that would mean eventually the strong following of Lumia or "Surface phones" would become too influential to ignore. Then instead of Microsoft caving in to carrier's demands, the carriers would have no choice but to accept Microsoft's demands, were they to want to carry the devices.

    As some of you mentioned, Microsoft has other options, like offering 3rd-party financing at their stores. Or they could bundle their phones with the Surface tablets, as sort of special packages at certain points of the year, to help sales.

    My main point is, iPhone sales originally started small, and grew organically, without any forced pressure, until it became impossible for other US carriers to ignore the iPhone.

    My main hope/belief is that Microsoft will follow this strategy.
    07-26-2015 07:29 PM
  17. Joe Acerbic's Avatar
    Now imagine if ONLY AT&T carries the new Microsoft flagships in the US
    Why on earth would you need to imagine that? That's exactly how it has been with Lumias in USA and you only need to remember how well that has worked.
    07-26-2015 09:20 PM
  18. Gorsky's Avatar
    Why on earth would you need to imagine that? That's exactly how it has been with Lumias in USA and you only need to remember how well that has worked.
    Not exactly true. Verizon, however poorly, did carry some Lumias, as did T-Mobile.

    Sprint had a historical issue with Nokia, one major reason they never carried any Lumias.

    You're disregarding everything else in my post. That's not what I meant.

    In this case, Microsoft is going with a different strategy than in the past, and what Nokia tried in the past. Instead of catering to carriers, Microsoft is simply going with a more "take it or leave it" approach with US carriers. In the past neither Microsoft nor Nokia did that. That's why the Verizon relationship is being cut, and I wouldn't be surprised if the AT&T relationship changes, or AT&T further reduces their Lumia lineup or support.

    Microsoft themselves however will sell the phones fully unlocked with fully functioning worldwide radios, without any limited functionality. Just like the 640 and 640XL that you can buy right now, they have worldwide radio and bands support, allowing use on a wide variety of carriers, including various US carriers. On that note, despite limited carrier support for the 640 and 640XL in the US so far, these devices have proven to be popular. More popular than expected in fact. This too is part of the new approach. No more having a dozen variants of the same Lumia model, just to appease the "exclusivity" of specific US carriers. I fully predict that from now on, all future Microsoft smartphones will have one variant, one model, with worldwide radios and modems supporting a huge range of bands and frequencies. They will keep it simple and easy to understand like Apple.

    Getting back to my main point, here's the simplest way to look at it. Microsoft now controls the software and hardware of their phones, top to bottom. They are changing or cutting carrier relationships, so that they will have almost 100% control of updates and bloat/modifications on their phones. In other words, they will no longer cater to, or allow silly carrier modifications on their phones. Nor will US carriers be able to control so much of the phone update process any longer. This therefore leads to almost 100% control of the user experience on the phones, as well as the marketing. This will lead to more satisfied owners, and a stronger loyal following. It will even influence the anti-Microsoft tech media bias in a positive way.

    With Nadella, Microsoft understands the need for short-term pain, in order to achieve in the longer-term, a healthy and stable Windows Phone ecosystem, even if it means a small one.
    07-26-2015 09:56 PM
  19. Jazmac's Avatar
    I'm cautiously optimistic, and I believe Microsoft is taking the long view with their own phones.

    I'm optimistic because I believe Microsoft will be adopting the Surface (or Apple) style of strategy from now on. Different market I know, but let's look at the Surface. It took a while for it to get popular, and since the Surface Pro 3 came out, the Surface line has had a small, but strong and very loyal group of fans. Does that remind you of anything else in the tech world? I'll answer that for you; Apple computers. Apple for decades has had a low marketshare in the computer market, yet they have always had a very loyal fan following. The Surface is almost in a similar situation with tablets at this early stage. Small marketshare yes, but highly praised devices and a very loyal following of fans. This group of loyal fans has become influential enough, that AT&T and T-Mobile are about to start selling the Surface 3 LTE (in addition to all the regular places you can get Surface devices from). So that is an example of organic growth. That means Microsoft was in no rush and had zero desperation to sell Surface devices. Purely through the merits and strengths of the Surface devices themselves, and marketing, Microsoft was able to reach this point. A strong enough point, that in this case it's highly likely carriers approached Microsoft to work out a deal to sell the Surface. Also as far as we know, other than being locked to AT&T or whatever, the surface devices that some of the carriers will soon be selling are otherwise identical to the fully unlocked Surface devices you can buy direct from Microsoft. Does that remind you of anything else? It should, as that's exactly the same strategy and approach Apple has used with the iPad.

    Now for those of you familiar with the smartphone market, you'll remember that many years ago when the iPhone first came out, it was only initially available on one carrier in the US (AT&T), and that was the case for a couple of years, until more carriers agreed to carry it. So during the first couple of years on the market, why did other US carriers refuse to carry the iPhone? Simple, because Steve Jobs and Apple had high demands for any carrier wanting the iPhone. They could not muck up the phone with any bloatware, or otherwise make any modifications to the phone. They also had to sell the phone at pre-determined prices from Apple, and were not allowed to modify prices outside of Apple's permission. Finally, they had to buy a guaranteed number of iPhones from Apple, before Apple would even allow that carrier to carry the iPhone. So initially most carriers balked at these demands. Soon though, it became obvious that iPhone's small, yet strongly loyal following was becoming too influential for other carriers to ignore. So other US carriers ended up with no choice but to accept Apple's demands.

    Now let me come back to Microsoft's situation. The word is that Verizon will be dropped as a partner carrier by Microsoft. Now imagine if ONLY AT&T carries the new Microsoft flagships in the US, or only one of the two flagships. Yes, it will be bad in the short term, BUT it's a good thing LONG TERM. If Microsoft with their future phones is able to establish a strong, loyal following like the Surface line, and right now completely void any existing US carrier relationships that are not beneficial, then they would be in a good long-term position. Then that would mean eventually the strong following of Lumia or "Surface phones" would become too influential to ignore. Then instead of Microsoft caving in to carrier's demands, the carriers would have no choice but to accept Microsoft's demands, were they to want to carry the devices.

    As some of you mentioned, Microsoft has other options, like offering 3rd-party financing at their stores. Or they could bundle their phones with the Surface tablets, as sort of special packages at certain points of the year, to help sales.

    My main point is, iPhone sales originally started small, and grew organically, without any forced pressure, until it became impossible for other US carriers to ignore the iPhone.

    My main hope/belief is that Microsoft will follow this strategy.
    Attached Thumbnails colin-powell-not-reading-1.jpg  
    RumoredNow and libra89 like this.
    07-26-2015 10:10 PM
  20. RumoredNow's Avatar
    Microsoft themselves however will sell the phones fully unlocked with fully functioning worldwide radios, without any limited functionality. Just like the 640 and 640XL that you can buy right now, they have worldwide radio and bands support, allowing use on a wide variety of carriers, including various US carriers. On that note, despite limited carrier support for the 640 and 640XL in the US so far, these devices have proven to be popular. More popular than expected in fact. This too is part of the new approach. No more having a dozen variants of the same Lumia model, just to appease the "exclusivity" of specific US carriers. I fully predict that from now on, all future Microsoft smartphones will have one variant, one model, with worldwide radios and modems supporting a huge range of bands and frequencies. They will keep it simple and easy to understand like Apple.

    Getting back to my main point, here's the simplest way to look at it. Microsoft now controls the software and hardware of their phones, top to bottom. They are changing or cutting carrier relationships, so that they will have almost 100% control of updates and bloat/modifications on their phones. In other words, they will no longer cater to, or allow silly carrier modifications on their phones. Nor will US carriers be able to control so much of the phone update process any longer. This therefore leads to almost 100% control of the user experience on the phones, as well as the marketing. This will lead to more satisfied owners, and a stronger loyal following. It will even influence the anti-Microsoft tech media bias in a positive way.
    This. ^^^

    For all those that think Microsoft Mobile will curl up and die without kissing the ring of US carriers, think again. It's Microsoft, not your Uncle Ed and Aunt Wendy's mom and pop soda store. As much as Nokia was a name in phones, that quickly faded after the Apple/Android duopoly got established. Nokia had to play carrier games with Windows Phone which Microsoft does not have to tolerate.

    For those of you who are thinking about your Next, your Edge, your Jump... It's not Microsoft's responsibility. Their responsibility is to building a place for themselves in mobile. It has got to happen and they have to make bold choices to get there. Look beyond yourself and your next phone, please. Look toward what makes the platform viable. Carrier games do not do that. Anyone who believes the old carrier way is in the best interest of the platform or YOU the consumer is not, IMHO, being realistic and rational.

    Change is scary, but change can usher in progress if handled correctly.

    No one (at least that I've seen) is saying, "Unh Unh, no way should a Windows Phone ever appear inside a carrier shop." Quite the opposite. Microsoft needs to forge a new way forward. The carriers are free to join in or sit it out. I believe they will, in large part, sit it out at first. But this could have more momentum than you are giving the change credit for.

    Let go of the stale past and look toward a fresh future.
    07-26-2015 10:45 PM
  21. Pathum Wijayasooriya's Avatar
    This is probably true, the only problem is that most people buy their phones from the carrier. I have never met anyone who has gone out of their way to buy an unlocked phone. Especially with the phone subsidies from carriers. I would love to have the 950XL, but unless MSFT has some sort of payment plan similar to Next, I will probably be stuck with the 950.
    This is not applicable to third world countries such as Sri Lanka where I live in. We, almost ALWAYS buy our phones retail and unlocked...
    RumoredNow and a5cent like this.
    07-27-2015 07:13 AM
  22. JPDVM2014's Avatar
    This is not applicable to third world countries such as Sri Lanka where I live in. We, almost ALWAYS buy our phones retail and unlocked...
    It is like that in most other places in the world, just not here in the US for the most part. I originally was just going to get whichever phone AT&T gets, but I'm thinking now I'll buy it outright. There are a lot of good points being made in this thread that are making me rethink my plan. I might just have to wait a couple months before getting it so I can save up the cash. Unless MSFT offers some 0% financing, which I am not counting on.
    07-27-2015 08:35 AM
  23. ODwyerPW's Avatar
    Hi, my name is ODwyerPW. I have not purchased a phone on contract since 2003. I always go out of my way to purchase my own phones and add them to my selected carrier.

    I do this on AT&T and TelCel.
    07-27-2015 11:10 AM
  24. Stormdrunk's Avatar
    In Canada you can truly own your phone by paying off what you owe for the subsidy and pay a fee to the carrier to have it unlocked. Then you can move your number and service to a new carrier.
    07-27-2015 11:13 AM
  25. Chris Stevens1's Avatar
    On T-Mobile you pay sales tax, then for the[horn itself interest free over time. Interest free is much lower than credit card interest rate. Note: Some credit cards provide 2 or 3 year warranty.
    07-27-2015 01:06 PM
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