12-02-2015 11:33 PM
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  1. MikeSo's Avatar
    Microsoft Store has new ones in stock: Buy Nokia Lumia Icon for Verizon - Microsoft Store
    Nice. For $250, that is still a very good deal!
    10-13-2015 12:06 PM
  2. garak0410's Avatar
    Nice. For $250, that is still a very good deal!
    Yep...picked up a spare...and will ride out the next 6-9 months to see what happens on Verizon...
    MikeSo likes this.
    10-13-2015 12:09 PM
  3. loki993's Avatar
    I get it it sucks but I don't know that Im suprised. Plenty of other phones have 810s and dont do CDMA, Any of the new Xperias, one plus 2, probably the one plus x that's coming at some point, probably any of the huawei phones or just about any other unlocked phones you can buy..pretty much none of them support CDMA. Phones always had to be specifically made for Verizon which is why we always got the short end of the stick when it came to phone selection.
    10-13-2015 12:42 PM
  4. mjperry51's Avatar
    Just like CDMA support on the 950XL, sure the CPU could support it but, if the phone does not have the Attenna or other part of the chipset, enabling it via firmware will do nothing.
    CDMA ( protocol) does not require a specific antenna; the frequencies Verizon uses for the CDMA radios do require an antenna designed to operate on the specific frequencies.

    The frequency bands available in any phone indicate the operable radios in that phone. Has nothing to do with CDMA, GSM or anything else. It's just RF. . .
    920Walker likes this.
    10-13-2015 12:46 PM
  5. Caeric's Avatar
    My call to Verizon led to a request for a survey. I gave the rep a good review because he was friendly and tried to be helpful, but I gave Verizon itself a very middle-of-the-road review. This apparently initiated a return call from a Verizon Customer Manager (or some such, can't remember the official title), with whom I discussed many of the issues raised in this thread. During this call I let her know that I was very disappointed in Verizon's noticeable lack of support for Windows Phone and advised that unless I saw a significant change in Verizon's stance and an improved relationship with Microsoft between now and my end of contract date (in June of 2016) I would be moving to AT&T.

    She seemed sympathetic and said that everything we discussed would be forwarded. I'm not holding my breath, but I hope to see that change. If not, I will move to AT&T (who has good coverage in my area too), and will let Verizon know why at that time as well.

    I hope that everyone in this thread who holds these concerns would do the same - instead of just discussing it here actually make contact with Verizon. It's the only way to really make it clear to them.
    Last edited by Caeric; 10-13-2015 at 01:42 PM.
    10-13-2015 01:07 PM
  6. garak0410's Avatar
    Take it for what it is worth, on WHAT THE TECH, Paul Thurrott said Windows Phone (Lumia's I assume) are all DEAD on Verizon and that we need to get over it. I am guessing we may have hope 7 months down the line or so but at launch, we are out of luck.
    10-13-2015 01:15 PM
  7. DavidinCT's Avatar
    CDMA ( protocol) does not require a specific antenna; the frequencies Verizon uses for the CDMA radios do require an antenna designed to operate on the specific frequencies.

    The frequency bands available in any phone indicate the operable radios in that phone. Has nothing to do with CDMA, GSM or anything else. It's just RF. . .
    OK, here we go again...

    OK, let's play this game a little. So the ICON and the 930 are the same phone, specs, size, design features but, One is CDMA for Verizon and ONE is GSM only.

    Let's find some complete disasemblly of these 2 phones, compared side to side, chip to chip, cables, adapters on the board and I will be proven wrong.

    Last a read a few years ago, sure the CPU needed to support it but, there is other hardware that is needed for CDMA to work. As every here seems to say "IT'S ONLY THE CPU" then prove it.

    Let's compare the ICON and the 930, 100%...I am sure there is more between these 2 phones than a firmware update...and anyone who knows these devices know, they are the EXACT phone as far as the eye can see....


    STILL, that most people just wont get.... The Phone is in it's current form, GSM only, NO SUPPORT FOR CDMA. Microsoft is showing the phone on the shelf like this, meaning the 950 will NOT support CDMA. Then we have Microsoft clearly saying, and may I add, NAMED directly that they wont work with Verizon and Microsoft changing their mind it's not something I see happening.

    Right now, it's still a 100% pipe dream, no matter what everyone here wants to believe....
    Zippier and libra89 like this.
    10-13-2015 01:40 PM
  8. Terrigno's Avatar
    Point blank. If the Phone is unlocked and works on GSM networks and is normally sold for GSM networks, it WILL NOT work on a CDMA network. You can do it the other way around but this phone WILL NOT work on VERIZON UNLOCKED. They don't normally make Unlocked GSM phones with CDMA radios in them. Although one can be made for Verizon that can be a version that is CDMA UNLOCKED to work on GSM networks.
    10-13-2015 01:59 PM
  9. GreenScrew's Avatar
    No, that's not if you "look long and hard enough". Those are the specs you get if you go to Microsoft's site and look at them. They are the official 735 specs published by Microsoft. You already saw the link. The same site, using the same search method, gives the 950XL specs, without the CDMA. That's all we have to go by.
    Well, if you navigate the store as a normal consumer would (microsoftstore.com):
    Microsoft Online Store > Microsoft Lumia > Lumia 735 > Tech Specs... you'll not find any CDMA listings.
    If you go to the Online Store, and search for Lumia 735 Specs... you'll not find any CDMA listings.
    It seems if you search the generic Microsoft site, you can find the CDMA listings for the 735.
    I can't find such specs for the 950/950xl, the tech specs all seem to be hosted in the store site where it is my argument that they may be "watered down". That's all. Regardless, its a legitimate argument that just because its not listed on the specs doesn't mean its not capable. And further discussion seems to agree that at least the hardware is present and can be enabled via firmware which after all is said and done is the premise of this entire thread.
    10-13-2015 03:21 PM
  10. slick5150's Avatar
    Point blank. If the Phone is unlocked and works on GSM networks and is normally sold for GSM networks, it WILL NOT work on a CDMA network. You can do it the other way around but this phone WILL NOT work on VERIZON UNLOCKED. They don't normally make Unlocked GSM phones with CDMA radios in them. Although one can be made for Verizon that can be a version that is CDMA UNLOCKED to work on GSM networks.
    The Moto X Pure, which is sold as an unlocked phone, works on Verizon.

    Not saying that applies to others, but point being that manufacturers are looking to move into the "one size fits all" model for their phones rather than specific phones for specific carriers.
    10-13-2015 03:30 PM
  11. Reebs Reebs's Avatar
    Also the new Nexus phones...
    10-13-2015 03:36 PM
  12. d3ac0n's Avatar
    Guys get over it. Verizon wanted to dictate updates. Microsoft said to them to **** of and the story ends there.
    If Verizin agrees to let updates be controled by microsoft they will get a phone.

    Its microsoft's way or the high way

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    10-13-2015 05:04 PM
  13. mjperry51's Avatar
    OK, here we go again...

    OK, let's play this game a little. So the ICON and the 930 are the same phone, specs, size, design features but, One is CDMA for Verizon and ONE is GSM only.

    Let's find some complete disasemblly of these 2 phones, compared side to side, chip to chip, cables, adapters on the board and I will be proven wrong.

    Last a read a few years ago, sure the CPU needed to support it but, there is other hardware that is needed for CDMA to work. As every here seems to say "IT'S ONLY THE CPU" then prove it.

    Let's compare the ICON and the 930, 100%...I am sure there is more between these 2 phones than a firmware update...and anyone who knows these devices know, they are the EXACT phone as far as the eye can see....


    STILL, that most people just wont get.... The Phone is in it's current form, GSM only, NO SUPPORT FOR CDMA. Microsoft is showing the phone on the shelf like this, meaning the 950 will NOT support CDMA. Then we have Microsoft clearly saying, and may I add, NAMED directly that they wont work with Verizon and Microsoft changing their mind it's not something I see happening.

    Right now, it's still a 100% pipe dream, no matter what everyone here wants to believe....
    Look -- we're talking past each other.

    All I'm saying is there are several separate systems in a phone -- baseband audio (microphone, speaker, and signal processing/routing for each), CODECs (convert audio to digital/ digital to audio, digital signals are GSM, CDMA, etc.), control systems (CPU/Firmware/Software), I/O (touchscreen in smartphone), and radios. Antennas are only specific to the radio systems, and are specific to the frequency band in use.. That's it -- the radio doesn't care whether the signal used to modulate it is CDMA, GSM, analog audio, whatever. There is no CDMA antenna that won't work on GSM, or the other way around.

    My post has NOTHING TO DO with whether the 950XL is or is not compatible with Verizon's networks. I'm speaking to the inaccurate application of technology terminology that continue to permeate this thread.
    920Walker and TexasLabRat like this.
    10-13-2015 07:57 PM
  14. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Take it for what it is worth, on WHAT THE TECH, Paul Thurrott said Windows Phone (Lumia's I assume) are all DEAD on Verizon and that we need to get over it. I am guessing we may have hope 7 months down the line or so but at launch, we are out of luck.
    Finally someone who actually gets it..(I saw it too and posted a few pages back about it). But, Verizon DOES carry a 735, that is Not a Nokia labeled phone, it IS a Microsoft labeled phone. So 100% dead, who knows...

    And 7-8 months from now ? There will be a far better phone than the 950XL by then... In 5-6 months, it's OLD NEWS.

    There was also another post (not sure if this was on WC) that Microsoft will NOT be controlling updates on Windows Phone 10(carriers will have a say on them), as they were fighting Verizon this, from what reviewers said.

    Maybe this changes things here ?

    Look -- we're talking past each other.

    All I'm saying is there are several separate systems in a phone -- baseband audio (microphone, speaker, and signal processing/routing for each), CODECs (convert audio to digital/ digital to audio, digital signals are GSM, CDMA, etc.), control systems (CPU/Firmware/Software), I/O (touchscreen in smartphone), and radios. Antennas are only specific to the radio systems, and are specific to the frequency band in use.. That's it -- the radio doesn't care whether the signal used to modulate it is CDMA, GSM, analog audio, whatever. There is no CDMA antenna that won't work on GSM, or the other way around.

    My post has NOTHING TO DO with whether the 950XL is or is not compatible with Verizon's networks. I'm speaking to the inaccurate application of technology terminology that continue to permeate this thread.
    I hear ya but, you and everyone here seems to be 100% that it's just a firmware that could unlock CDMA. When I am saying it's not. So this is why I said, get internal images of a 929(CDMA) and a 930 (GSM) and we will clear this up 100%. There is more hardware than just a CPU that does CDMA, as I understand.

    How ever at this point, the odds of this phone (or the 950) coming to Verizon is very slim... if even possible at this point due to how Verizon took on WIndows Phone in the past and how they handle updates.

    It will be interesting if Verizon changes their tune but, for a phone that holds about 3% of the marketplace, I would not get hopes up too high.
    Last edited by DavidinCT; 10-13-2015 at 08:17 PM.
    10-13-2015 08:04 PM
  15. MMissionary's Avatar
    Finally someone who actually gets it..(I saw it too and posted a few pages back about it). But, Verizon DOES carry a 735, that is Not a Nokia labeled phone, it IS a Microsoft labeled phone. So 100% dead, who knows...



    I hear ya but, you and everyone here seems to be 100% that it's just a firmware that could unlock CDMA. When I am saying it's not. So this is why I said, get internal images of a 929(CDMA) and a 930 (GSM) and we will clear this up 100%. There is more hardware than just a CPU that does CDMA, as I understand.

    How ever at this point, the odds of this phone (or the 950) coming to Verizon is very slim... if even possible at this point due to how Verizon took on WIndows Phone in the past and how they handle updates.

    It will be interesting if Verizon changes their tune but, for a phone that holds about 3% of the marketplace, I would not get hopes up too high.
    I've seen ads for the 735 recently but I don't think it's high on their priority list. Could get an HTC windows phone.
    10-13-2015 08:09 PM
  16. dksf42's Avatar
    It anyone else but me tired of reading about "low market share"??? There are MILLIONS of Windows Phone users IN the US MARKET! I am a "person", living in these great United States of America and I refuse to be lumped into the "only 3.5%"! So, what exactly is the US Windows Phone USERS population in the US? Yes, of course Apple and Android will be far greater but, I don't care, as I am a customer of Verizon and I want to "join a revolution of users to get my voice heard on Verizon"!!!

    Does anyone here know the following:
    1) Total estimate of smartphones in the US?
    2) Total number of Windows Phones in the US market (to date)?
    3) Total number of Verizon smartphones?
    4) Estimated total number of Windows Phones on Verizon?

    United we stand, divided we fall = let's TRY to create some MORE NOISE to "convince Microsoft to UNLOCK Band 13 and CDMA" - OR - FORCE Microsoft and Verizon to "officially says" the truth!

    Perhaps, MOST IMPORTANTLY, I am a business user and "what the heck are Enterprise users in this BYOD world" going to "miss" with all of the NEW Work productivity features that the 950XL contains ... but, are ON VERIZON???
    COME "anyone and everyone" that WILL LEAVE Verizon - or consider to leave - BECAUSE of the 950XL "UNLOCKED" ***NOT WORKING*** on Verizon either in the next several weeks or "SOON"!!!

    ALL OF YOU that say "NO WAY" = why don't you politely "bow out" and go find something else to occupy your time!

    THIS THREAD = a "REBELLION" - I started it - to Verizon's "GESTAPO TACTICS"!!! Sorry, to invoke that level ... but, THIS IS the United States of AMERICA - and - I do NOT giving a flying SxxT about Verizon and "whatever THEY WANT" !!!

    It IS ABOUT "WHAT WE WANT" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    SO ... PLEASE answer the questions above !

    PS Dear Satya Nadella = FIX THIS and give us MILLIONS of "Verizon USERS" the 950XL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    to_be_announced likes this.
    10-13-2015 08:25 PM
  17. lupinesithlord's Avatar
    Actually I believe that the Icon has unlocked gsm radios in it. Something that verizon doesnt scream to the mountain tops.... I could be wrong, but dont think I am. The 928 could be used unlocked on gsm I think Icon too.
    10-13-2015 08:29 PM
  18. Lumious's Avatar
    Question: If i leave Verizon for the 950/950XL will my Icon and Lumia 822 be toast?
    10-13-2015 08:46 PM
  19. 920Walker's Avatar
    'murica!
    10-13-2015 08:54 PM
  20. Schnuffi's Avatar
    We should all tweet we hate Verizon has anyone got their twitter handle.
    10-13-2015 09:41 PM
  21. createdforsuccess's Avatar
    We should all tweet we hate Verizon has anyone got their twitter handle.
    I tweeted them asking questions about the phone and had another friend retweet it.
    10-13-2015 09:45 PM
  22. falconrap's Avatar
    I hear ya but, you and everyone here seems to be 100% that it's just a firmware that could unlock CDMA. When I am saying it's not. So this is why I said, get internal images of a 929(CDMA) and a 930 (GSM) and we will clear this up 100%. There is more hardware than just a CPU that does CDMA, as I understand.

    How ever at this point, the odds of this phone (or the 950) coming to Verizon is very slim... if even possible at this point due to how Verizon took on WIndows Phone in the past and how they handle updates.

    It will be interesting if Verizon changes their tune but, for a phone that holds about 3% of the marketplace, I would not get hopes up too high.

    DavdinCT, as an Electronics Engineer, let me tell you that you are incorrect. Period. I don't have the Qualcomm 810 datasheet, but they do have their logic diagrams out and I've reviewed exactly how their system works. The antennas have to be shaped to pull in the frequencies in question. They are, as WCDMA has bands 2 and 5 operating in about the same range. These antennas will pull in the signal regardless of the modulation that is in the wave. The signal is then presented to the RF360 front end transceiver which electrically shapes the antennas and amplifies the signals via mosfets. The amplified signal goes to the X10 modem which separates the modulated signal from the base signal, presenting the data/voice stream to the Hexagon V56 DSP (Digital Signal Processor) which then decodes the signal and transfers the data/voice to the appropriate modules in the 810. All of these components, save the antennas, are integrated into the 810. They are inseparable from the device, and Qualcomm doesn't have a model with CDMA BC0/BC1 bands, nor LTE Band 13, disabled. What determines whether a band can be used is whether or not the firmware allows the particular modulation to be decoded or not. If this is not enabled, then the signal is just white noise.

    I'm not claiming that the 950/950XL's will be enabled to use CDMA & LTE Band 13. Any band and cellular protocol that MS wants these phones to be able to use most be certified for EMI and SAR ratings in each of those modes via the FCC. Testing these bands, then sending them for certification by the FCC, costs money. MS might choose not to do so to save costs on the phones and headaches with customers trying to enable their phones on unfriendly networks; i.e. Verizon (Sprint can lock phones out since they aren't beholden to an FCC agreement for spectrum like Verizon is). When someone can produce the FCC cellular certifications, we'll know if MS could allow the devices on VZW, whether unlocked or via a later firmware update should Verizon cave and give MS what they want. If they didn't certify them, then they'll need to go back and do so, which would likely mean another model, due to the ramifications with phones already sold (assuming this occurred after phones started selling). The 929 and 930 were certified with different sets of bands and protocols enabled, which was probably a demand from Verizon at the time. In fact the 929 was certified with only Verizon's LTE bands, and with slower WCDMA modem capability (probably a slower modem revision of the Snapdragon 800 - they do have various models that have improved modem speeds as well as CPU speeds).

    In a nutshell, if MS wants these phones to work on VZW's bands, they could enable and certify them. Only money, certification, and customer support costs are in the way. I don't think they will have the bands enabled, but you never know until the phones actually hit. MS could be ginning up desire for the phone and backlash against VZW to get the phones on their network under MS's conditions. Or MS could truly be done with VZW, middle finger style. In any case, barring a sudden announcement in the next month or so, AT&T it is, and VZW WILL hear from me.
    10-13-2015 10:26 PM
  23. Generalheed's Avatar
    Bottom line is, the Lumia 950 and 950 XL are physically compatible with Verizon. The Qualcomm chipset supports CDMA as well as Verizon's LTE bands and the radio antenna is tuned to receive the same frequencies as Verizon. There's no physical reason why these phones won't support Verizon.

    I don't know if it'll make a difference, but perhaps a petition is in order? Try this?
    Last edited by Generalheed; 10-13-2015 at 11:44 PM.
    10-13-2015 11:31 PM
  24. NOLATechy's Avatar
    And given the p155-poor treatment Microsoft got from Verizon with the previous Windows phones, I don't blame Microsoft one bit! Verizon treated the Lumia Icon like 5h1t. Not only did they not support it, but I actually witnessed Verizon salesman trying to sway people away from Windows phones. When I went to trade in my Lumia 928 for my Lumia Icon, I was told by the salesperson, "You should really try the iPhone, it's so much better than the Windows phone." My response to him won't be repeated here. So, in short, Microsoft had no choice but to go this route because carriers (especially Verizon) were trying to destroy Windows phones. Personally, I believe payoffs were happening from Google and Apple, but have no proof of this.
    10-14-2015 07:06 AM
  25. mjperry51's Avatar
    I hear ya but, you and everyone here seems to be 100% that it's just a firmware that could unlock CDMA. When I am saying it's not. So this is why I said, get internal images of a 929(CDMA) and a 930 (GSM) and we will clear this up 100%. There is more hardware than just a CPU that does CDMA, as I understand.
    Never said it, and agree. What I don't appreciate is having my very specific comments being "lumped in" with a group of statements that have little direct connection with what I'm saying. . .
    920Walker likes this.
    10-14-2015 07:13 AM
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