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11-07-2015 03:00 PM
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  1. scottmac 1's Avatar
    agree
    10-13-2015 07:23 PM
  2. colinkiama's Avatar
    The only thing wrong with these phones is their physical appearance. Make it look like a Galaxy 6 Edge and I would buy it.
    You can change the design yourself you know ;)
    libra89 likes this.
    10-13-2015 09:23 PM
  3. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    The Lumia 950XL is without a doubt the best Windows-based phone ever made, and the 950 is a very close second. I am really tired of hearing complaints.

    "It's not a flagship because it's not metal."
    Really? You can get a replacement back cover with metal trim. Or leather. Or any number of things to change its appearance.

    "It's not a flagship because not unibody, removable back, removable battery, etc."
    Really? To me a flagship has more features, not less. I do not consider a phone more valuable because it can't accept an SD card and has to be professionally repaired if the battery goes bad.

    I consider it an honor to live in a time when I am able to buy such an advanced device. As MikeSo eloquently said, "it's like Microsoft checked off a Windows Central forum wishlist." It literally has every feature I wanted, and several I never expected to see on a device sold in the United States where carrier devices abound, stripped of any feature that a carrier thinks might affect their bottom line somehow. Unlocked, unbranded, dual-sim, LTE that works worldwide and even in North America, QI, SD, removable battery, replaceable covers. Fantastic!
    libra89, JohnStrk, MikeSo and 11 others like this.
    10-13-2015 09:42 PM
  4. Karen LePage's Avatar
    Agreed .... This phone is perfect.
    10-13-2015 09:47 PM
  5. d33pth0u9ht's Avatar
    Curious... what features were left out in your opinion? I have held one at the Microsoft Store and the 950xl is superb. The camera was fast and amazing. I saw a post comparing a 1020 and the 950xl in the store and the improvement was shocking. The store sample was running a pre-release OS and was still quick. This will only get better with refinement. The employee I was speaking with demonstrated Hello and it worked flawlessly. No other phone can match an iris scanner. I think MS also is getting it right with providing a plain plastic back and allowing the customer to decide on what back cover style they want. If MS would have designed a non-replaceable black leather back, half of the customers would not have liked it. Same can be said for a metal back. Tastes are unique to the individual and having a partner, like Mozo (mozoaccessories.com), will provide a number of back cover options that look incredible.

    I am just having a difficult time finding fault with the feature set of these phones. They appear to have everything anyone could want and more than most of the smartphone market has.
    10-13-2015 11:39 PM
  6. d33pth0u9ht's Avatar
    I have been questioning the reaction to these phones, not only by Daniel, but also by other for a while now. Especially the opinion that they are a Nokia holdover and an afterthought.

    1) First phones with W10M. The development has been costly and time intensive for MS. This amount of effort is not the behavior of a company that does not want to be in the mobile market.
    2) Packing an iris scanner into the phone, something nobody else has, took significant effort.
    3) These phones are using the top processors (Same as s6).
    4) The display is equivalent (2560x1440) to S6 and much higher than i6s (1920x1080)
    5) Wireless charging (not available on s6 or i6s)
    6) Continuum (not available on s6 or i6s)
    7) 20MP camera (12MP on s6 and i6s) with Optical Image Stabilization
    8) Removable battery
    9) SD card slot (not available on s6 and i6s)

    The point is that MS put significant effort into a phone that is at the top of the market right now. The phone (XL) will sell for $100 less than the base i6s with only 16GB of ram vs. 32GB for the 950XL.

    This phone is anything but an afterthought. As fans of the platform, we have arguably the best phone on the market. We should start acting like it...
    10-14-2015 12:02 AM
  7. missionsparta's Avatar
    I have been questioning the reaction to these phones, not only by Daniel, but also by other for a while now. Especially the opinion that they are a Nokia holdover and an afterthought.

    1) First phones with W10M. The development has been costly and time intensive for MS. This amount of effort is not the behavior of a company that does not want to be in the mobile market.
    2) Packing an iris scanner into the phone, something nobody else has, took significant effort.
    3) These phones are using the top processors (Same as s6).
    4) The display is equivalent (2560x1440) to S6 and much higher than i6s (1920x1080)
    5) Wireless charging (not available on s6 or i6s)
    6) Continuum (not available on s6 or i6s)
    7) 20MP camera (12MP on s6 and i6s) with Optical Image Stabilization
    8) Removable battery
    9) SD card slot (not available on s6 and i6s)

    The point is that MS put significant effort into a phone that is at the top of the market right now. The phone (XL) will sell for $100 less than the base i6s with only 16GB of ram vs. 32GB for the 950XL.

    This phone is anything but an afterthought. As fans of the platform, we have arguably the best phone on the market. We should start acting like it...
    16GB of ram? That is amazing...
    colinkiama and Justin Engel like this.
    10-14-2015 12:15 AM
  8. colinkiama's Avatar
    I have been questioning the reaction to these phones, not only by Daniel, but also by other for a while now. Especially the opinion that they are a Nokia holdover and an afterthought.

    1) First phones with W10M. The development has been costly and time intensive for MS. This amount of effort is not the behavior of a company that does not want to be in the mobile market.
    2) Packing an iris scanner into the phone, something nobody else has, took significant effort.
    3) These phones are using the top processors (Same as s6).
    4) The display is equivalent (2560x1440) to S6 and much higher than i6s (1920x1080)
    5) Wireless charging (not available on s6 or i6s)
    6) Continuum (not available on s6 or i6s)
    7) 20MP camera (12MP on s6 and i6s) with Optical Image Stabilization
    8) Removable battery
    9) SD card slot (not available on s6 and i6s)

    The point is that MS put significant effort into a phone that is at the top of the market right now. The phone (XL) will sell for $100 less than the base i6s with only 16GB of ram vs. 32GB for the 950XL.

    This phone is anything but an afterthought. As fans of the platform, we have arguably the best phone on the market. We should start acting like it...
    the S6 has a 16MP camera and it does have built in wireless charging.
    10-14-2015 03:23 AM
  9. hemanlive's Avatar
    In reply to Reading between the lines: What Panos was telegraphing about those new Lumias | Windows Central

    Daniel, I disagree with you. Are you telling me Microsoft had no input and that these are Nokia leftovers? That's ridiculous because it would mean we are talking about tech that is more than a year old. That is not the case. Nokia ended long ago. It would mean there was no development for over a year. This phone is largely developed by Microsoft! Of course they used leftovers from Nokia, who wouldn't? They had great tech. Microsoft has had over a year to have had a large input on these devices. And you can see it. You are all interpreting it wrong.

    The reason why not much attention was paid to the phones was because:
    A. We already knew everything about them.
    B. Windows mobile is not ready, too risky to show stuff.
    C. Nobody except windows phone fans are interested in their phones, it doesn't matter how great they are. Ther are not going to sell. So why waste time on presenting them? Read: Microsoft Lumia 950 and 950 XL: Power has never been so light People who use iPhones or Galaxies won't jump ship. But people do jump ship for a surface. Why? Because windows 10 has a mature ecosystem and because Surfaces are kind of revolutionary. Windows 10 mobile has the app problem and phones allow for no more revolutions for a while to come. The reason why they don't pay much attention to phones is because they want to grow the phone business in a later stage. They take a reverse path to finally, in the end lead people to using their windows phones. Maybe in 4-5 years. Until then they will focus on apps everywhere and on surfaces because that is a hole in the market and businesses have demand for them.

    This all stands apart from the Lumia 950 and 950XL being top flagship premium phones. They are! They have almost everything you could wish for. Except no metal housing. Are you kidding me? Metal sucks. Specwise they beat every other phone out their. The camera is supposed to be better than the 1020! It has glance, wireless charging, everything in 1 phone. In the past there have always been sacrifices. It's even very light, not heavy. And now that's suddenly a problem because it doesn't feel premium? What a nonsense. The 920 had so many complaints it was too heavy. Another website says "Power has never been so light" Microsoft Lumia 950 and 950 XL: Power has never been so light

    You are talking this phone down for no reason. Because of articles like these even fans won't buy these phones and Microsoft will have another reason to invest less in these kind of phones. I really don't understand why you would write articles like this. Even anti-MS sites like The Verge and Cnet are interested in these phones. Maybe these phones come unusual to us because of the non-mindblowing design, but that is just a Windows-phone-fan thing. Android users (over 80%) don't care much about design. They all use ugly phones and an ugly Android software.

    Wait until you get these phones with a more polished w10m. They will blow your mind. And the best thing is, these phones will improve over time like no other phone before at insane speed. Windows 10 and its apps will develop over time to make the phones even better.

    You fans out there better buy one of these because I promise you, the 'surface' phones are not going to supersede these flagships. They are not what you should wait for. They will fit a different category. They will sacrifice on camera quality and several other things. Yes they might look better, but might also be metal and break/damage more easily. People will regret not getting a 950 when they find out. By that time if you still decide to buy a 950/950xl they will be old and not feel so cool anymore. At that point you will have to wait another year for something to come or have a less satisfying purchase of a 950/950XL.

    Relax, these phones are worth it, they are really underestimated.
    Common Mate. I think you completely missed the point that Dan made in his article. Nowhere did he say that these are not good or just average phones. He did mention that he likes the Windows mobile OS much more than Android and the phones will give the best experience. His reference to short time spent on Lumias and the fact that Panos has been there only since July, by when the phones were ready, was to show that he did not have time to make something as drastic as the Surface book with the Lumias. By the 'Nokia DNA' the reference was not about medicore phones at all. But Nokia had a design philosophy and even after the acquisition, the philosophy continues. We can see it in design of the Lumias now vs. the first Lumias that were launched by Nokia. Panos has a very radical view of hardware and all that Dan said was that he would transform the way Microsoft phones look as of now. That is not to say that these phones are bad, but to say that these could be improved a lot, which is likely to happen by next year.
    10-14-2015 04:19 AM
  10. a5cent's Avatar
    Daniel, I disagree with you. Are you telling me Microsoft had no input and that these are Nokia leftovers? That's ridiculous because it would mean we are talking about tech that is more than a year old. That is not the case. Nokia ended long ago. It would mean there was no development for over a year. This phone is largely developed by Microsoft!
    On average, it takes an OEM around 12 to 18 months to bring a smartphone to market from scratch. You do the math.

    Given those lead times, the folks in Redmond will not have had much (if any) say, at the time the most important decisions for these devices were being made. Once design objectives are set and work has commenced, you can't change things around without throwing the schedule overboard. If MS had, we'd now still be months away from a high end WM device.

    My point: That idea that Redmond had little to no input on these hardware designs is not as ridiculous as you think it is. It's very likely 100% accurate.

    On the other hand, calling these devices "leftovers" is probably a poor choice of words, as that implies they were unused designs that are only now being "served". That's not a good way of expressing that these products were just the latest additions to Nokia's development pipeline at the time MS took over.

    Implying that the ex-Nokia team requires help from Redmond to develop good hardware also seems a bit galling to me. Hardware is the one area where almost everyone agrees (including WP critics) that WP devices were very good (read the Verge's original review of the L900). IMHO the Nokia hardware guys always made the most out of the software and ecosystem capabilities that were given to them... it's the OS and the ecosystem which has been tripping WP up. Not the hardware. If anybody needs help, it's the mobile OS group in Redmond.

    Anyway, I agree. The 950/XL are underestimated. They are great successors to the 1520 and 930.
    Last edited by a5cent; 10-14-2015 at 09:12 AM. Reason: formatting only
    10-14-2015 05:54 AM
  11. ksj1's Avatar
    The point is that MS put significant effort into a phone that is at the top of the market right now. The phone (XL) will sell for $100 less than the base i6s with only 16GB of ram vs. 32GB for the 950XL.
    Not to be negative, but let's not forget that W10M is going to take up a significant portion of that 32Gb. Regardless, you'll still end up with more than 16Gb and with the SD slot you can get a 64Gb SDXC (UHS-II/U3) card for $60 or less. I can't wait for mine to arrive.
    10-14-2015 09:49 AM
  12. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    Every OS, iOS included, also takes up a significant portion of storage, I don't see an issue.
    Hoekie, horseybob and WesleyBPeres like this.
    10-14-2015 10:35 AM
  13. ALpHa.Q.RoUgH's Avatar
    The only thing I wondered since it wasn't really shown at the Oct. 6th event and is disabled at the stores. Will the Iris scanner be faster or just as fast as fingerprint scanners? I kind of like how on the iPhone and on the LG phone that if you have your finger in the right spot,which most people do anyways, your phone could already be unlocked and ready to go by the time you look at it.
    10-14-2015 10:47 AM
  14. MikeSo's Avatar
    On average, it takes an OEM around 12 to 18 months to bring a smartphone to market from scratch. You do the math.

    Given those lead times, the folks in Redmond will not have had much (if any) say, at the time the most important decisions for these devices were being made. Once design objectives are set and work has commenced, you can't change things around without throwing the schedule overboard. If MS had, we'd now still be months away from a high end WM device.

    My point: That idea that Redmond had little to no input on these hardware designs is not as ridiculous as you think it is. It's very likely 100% accurate.

    On the other hand, calling these devices "leftovers" is probably a poor choice of words, as that implies they were unused designs that are only now being "served". That's not a good way of expressing that these products were just the latest additions to Nokia's development pipeline at the time MS took over.

    Implying that the ex-Nokia team requires help from Redmond to develop good hardware also seems a bit galling to me. Hardware is the one area where almost everyone agrees (including WP critics) that WP devices were very good (read the Verge's original review of the L900). IMHO the Nokia hardware guys always made the most out of the software and ecosystem capabilities that were given to them... it's the OS and the ecosystem which has been tripping WP up. Not the hardware. If anybody needs help, it's the mobile OS group in Redmond.

    Anyway, I agree. The 950/XL are underestimated. They are great successors to the 1520 and 930.
    Exactly. The stumbling block for these new phones isn't the hardware. Sure, could the phone have had a more cutting edge design? Probably. But these phones have solid hardware features, in a great package. Very few people have had anything bad to say about the PHONES themselves so far. The only question mark is Windows 10 Mobile. And that's all on Microsoft.
    a5cent likes this.
    10-14-2015 10:51 AM
  15. Krystianpants's Avatar
    Panos is a designer. Designers are really proud about their work and they want to be associated with their work. I know a designer, trust me. All Panos wants to make clear is that it's not his work, he probably had a lot of work on the internals and possibly modified them to look better but it's not his work. And he does not want people to associate that as his work. It's really simple. Why would he? It's not his full work. The surface book and surface 4 are his work and he's proud of it. It has nothing to do with whether he thinks the phones are great or not. If you go to a job interview as a designer you show off your own work, what you do as a designer not what others did. What makes you unique. So he's not going to say "hey this is my design". And that's completely understandable. It's really the wording of the article that is coming out wrong. Just like Johnny Ive designed the iphone 6. That is his work and he's proud of it.
    horseybob likes this.
    10-14-2015 12:05 PM
  16. a5cent's Avatar
    Panos is a designer. Designers are really proud about their work and they want to be associated with their work. I know a designer, trust me. All Panos wants to make clear is that it's not his work.
    I don't think that's it. Panos Panay is not really a designer. He is a high level executive with the job of a program manager. That means he's responsible for laying out the vision and the overall direction of Microsoft's hardware division, which includes MS' mice, keyboards, and the Surface and Lumia product lines. He has a bachelor of science and an MBA.

    He'll have multiple group managers reporting to him. Those are the people who oversee the actual engineering and design processes in each of the hardware groups. The people below them are the actual designers. Mr. Panay is more of a strategy guy. The people who actually design this stuff don't get up on stage.

    He could still very well feel that these Lumia devices are not his products, but if so, it will be because they don't jive with his strategic vision.
    10-14-2015 01:16 PM
  17. Justin Engel's Avatar
    No, because we wanted a metal phone with Qi, 64gb of storage, Micro SD slot, 41MP camera, fingerprint scanner & Iris, replaceable back, 12MP FFC, notification light, snapdragon 820 and the ability to be able to use it with a selfie stick. :-)
    Hey now, we windows phone users wanted a lot more than just that. We also wanted it $100 cheaper, sold at a loss. We wanted more apps ... snapchat seems to be mentioned a lot. Wanted the ability to run x86 programs on a full desktop screen. Continuum Dock connector to be miracast.

    We also get full office for free, but that was assumed.
    Last edited by Justin Engel; 10-20-2015 at 01:06 PM.
    WesleyBPeres likes this.
    10-14-2015 08:41 PM
  18. anon(5383410)'s Avatar
    I love the way people here talk about the Surface Phone like it's a real thing. Some of you are actually waiting for them to announce a release date for something you're not even sure is being developed.
    10-14-2015 09:44 PM
  19. christenmartin's Avatar
    I love the way people here talk about the Surface Phone like it's a real thing. Some of you are actually waiting for them to announce a release date for something you're not even sure is being developed.
    I've heard this since I started with smart phones. There something always coming out as soon as the revel is over. I figure out a long time ago with computers buy what you like now. If you don't like anything wait until you do but don't hold out for the next best thing, it always "coming soon".
    libra89, tuxedo323 and Jikangire like this.
    10-14-2015 10:29 PM
  20. ayejay0601's Avatar
    Thats true and that will be helpful...but you cant change the curvature of the screen. That Samsung Galaxy Edge 6 is really a work of art. I mean its too bad the OS sucks, but if get a chance to look at it in the store, do it, That screen really did impress in these days when very little impresses me.
    10-15-2015 10:23 AM
  21. StevoPhilo's Avatar
    I'm fine with the hardware. I don't think that's the problem for me. My issue is the future of W10M.

    We have the TP that gives us an idea, but it's still buggy as hell and it honestly doesn't seem like it does anything much better than Win 8.1. It's more of a different interface with new email clients and office. The enterprise users will probably love it, but from a regular consumer stand point it doesn't do much. As soon as app porting takes off it'll be the dream device for me and for all other phone users. As of right now it does seem like a bone to throw until they decide to release the ideas of a "Surface" phone.
    10-15-2015 02:17 PM
  22. alanjg86's Avatar
    I was Wondering weather this New lineup of Lumia Phones support GIF in app and in browser.
    10-19-2015 04:45 AM
  23. robertre's Avatar
    I am in the camp that the 950XL has every feature I dreamed up and more. I could care less about what the cover is made up, When you put a protective case on them, as almost all smartphone uses do, they only look as good as the protective cover. Metal can scratch, glass can breath, and on the 950's, you can replace the back cover if it gets damaged or you want a different look. I for one will be buying a 950XL because of what is inside, and not what on the outside, and because of the great specs and features. And to me, in person it actually looks pretty nice.
    10-19-2015 09:19 PM
  24. FXi2's Avatar
    For this being a weaker design than the surface pro 4, I find it amusing that the 950 has USB-C. A surface phone would probably not have a removable battery so be careful what you wish for. Given that these flagship phones only come every 2 years or so, this is what you have. I only laugh because it means Verizon will be waiting another two years to figure out how to be a part of the team.
    11-07-2015 03:00 PM
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