950 - AT&T or unlocked, what's the difference

[HoosierDaddy]

Does whether or not one buys a "factory" unlocked phone, or an AT&T branded phone (paid in full) that gets unlocked with a code from AT&T, affect the availability of the updates?

Historically, YES there is a difference. And there is nothing that says its not going to be that way going forward. I'm sure its going to be better but how much is anyone's guess. If the carrier was not still involved, Microsoft would be slapping that on billboards.

When you get a carrier phone unlocked, all it means is you can put a SIM from another carrier in it. You still won't get updates until the original carrier pushed them out.

And to add to the confusion there is something called a SIM lock which just keeps someone from stealing your SIM and using it in another phone if they don't know the stolen phone's lock screen security..

 

[pankaj981]

First, a phone can't become factory unlocked unless you are talking about flashing the phone with some 3rd party flashing program with what's in a phone that was factory unlocked in the first place. Maybe you are talking about carrier unlocked rather than factory unlocked. There are way too many kinds of locks to keep straight.

But my point is that factory unlocked phones (i.e. were NEVER tied to a carrier) will NOT start getting updates from the carriers unless you are talking about updates from the phone or OS maker that happen to come over what ever carrier airways you may be using at the time which is no more related to the carrier than music you stream is. The US is about the only place on earth where there are carrier locked phones and the carriers have any involvement with updates. MS has proclaimed that is a problem for them and is certainly the reason you can't buy a 950 from Verizon. MS is not about to make a change that makes the whole rest of the world (and unlocked US phone users) subject to those problems.

When I say factory unlocked I mean factory unlocked, and I am ware of what's the difference between a factory unlocked v/s carrier unlocked device. The RM-985 variant was sold unlocked directly from Microsoft in physical stores and online and it still hasn't received Update 2. The issue here is Microsoft does not provide the same level of support in the US as compared to other countries where it actually does better (no surprises there).

 

[Skyway]

What they want isn't necessarily what they can get. And they aren't likely to be shouting their failures from the rooftops. Hence the focus on that they want. They are probably making inroads which explains why AT&T gets the 950s and Verizon doesn't (yet), but I'll eat my hat if they are there yet. Darn! second time I've said that in a week. I've got to get a hat or lose all credibility [/cheap shot opening you can drive a truck through]

I hear ya, and I know you're probably right, but that doesn't mean I want to believe it! I would love it if Microsoft just took control of of everything, which might explain why it's only being released on AT&T? None of the other carriers would play ball, so sell it unlocked themselves and through AT&T? I dunno, just guessing.

All I know is that I will be getting the 950 on AT&T with Next as soon as it comes out and I really hope it's going to be a good phone. I'm making a pretty big leap here moving from Android to Windows, but the reality is I really don't use a whole lot of apps and Google services. There are some that I'm going to miss like Chromecast (I have 3 of them) and Navy Federal, but my girlfriend has a V10 and she can access those if need be. I also have my old M7 and an iPad mini that could probably fill in the gaps, so it's not like I would be completely without my critical apps. I just hope I'm not making a mistake by switching to Windows.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I hear ya, and I know you're probably right, but that doesn't mean I want to believe it! I would love it if Microsoft just took control of of everything, which might explain why it's only being released on AT&T? None of the other carriers would play ball, so sell it unlocked themselves and through AT&T? I dunno, just guessing.

I hope MS wins and eventually any Windows Phones (or at least the brands of Windows phones I buy) get updates straight from MS.

But I think its more likely that Verizon wouldn't budge off the old ways and AT&T budged some - like maybe capping the amount of time they can delay an update. But it could be anywhere between the old way and no delays. My philosophy is: take risks commensurate with the rewards. Since I can get a factory unlocked phone, and the risk with a carrier phone can not be determined, there is no point in ME getting anything but a factory unlocked phone.

 

[Tom Snyder]

I hope MS wins and eventually any Windows Phones (or at least the brands of Windows phones I buy) get updates straight from MS. AT&T budged some - like maybe capping the amount of time they can delay an update. But it could be anywhere between the old way and no delays. My philosophy is: take risks commensurate with the rewards. Since I can get a factory unlocked phone, and the risk with a carrier phone can not be determined, there is no point in ME getting anything but a factory unlocked phone.

AT&T still has not released the Denim update to many of it's WP phone, even though it would not bring all the features Denim it's still a update. And I think AT&T is the only US carrier which has done this. I notice all the Canadian WP received the Denim update except for some really older WP models.

 

[TechFreak1]

To those who are still confused about the updates:

The simplest way to look at it is if there is a carrier logo on the phone then that carrier has a say in the update schedule, no logo?
Then it will be either shipped by the OEM or Microsoft.

The only exception to this rule is a 2nd hand+ phone where the seller has flashed a different carrier's or country variant ROM. If you flash the ROM yourself then there is a good chance you know what you're doing otherwise you wouldn't be flashing the ROM in the first place, right? :winktongue:.

In regards to buying out right as opposed to through the carrier, I would say buy unlocked and go for many of the MVNO's as it appears from posters on Windows central you're actually better off.

The fact Verizon is actively blocking the new phones (950 + 950 XL), should really be ringing alarm bells or is that just me?

 

[HoosierDaddy]

To those who are still confused about the updates:

The simplest way to look at it is if there is a carrier logo on the phone then that carrier has a say in the update schedule, no logo?
Then it will be either shipped by the OEM or Microsoft.

Logo where? If you mean on the phone exterior, not a sure thing. I know T-Mobile 640s didn't have any external logos and I'm pretty sure some of the later 521s didn't either because I recall people in this forum bummed out because their earlier 521s did.

I don't recall any carrier phone that didn't have a logo on a boot screen though. But I guess that doesn't prove all of them do but based on my experience, I'd use that as a test if I didn't know a better one.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

The fact Verizon is actively blocking the new phones (950 + 950 XL), should really be ringing alarm bells or is that just me?

I'm not alarmed if a carrier wants to cut off its nose to spite its face. I figure it will work itself out. They will eventually sell WM10 phones or run out of features to cut off.

 

[TechFreak1]

Logo where? If you mean on the phone exterior, not a sure thing. I know T-Mobile 640s didn't have any external logos and I'm pretty sure some of the later 521s didn't either because I recall people in this forum bummed out because their earlier 521s did.

I don't recall any carrier phone that didn't have a logo on a boot screen though. But I guess that doesn't prove all of them do but based on my experience, I'd use that as a test if I didn't know a better one.

Interesting, have there been any other models where this is also true?

Genuinely curious.

I'm not alarmed if a carrier wants to cut off its nose to spite its face. I figure it will work itself out. They will eventually sell WM10 phones or run out of features to cut off.

As long people keep giving them money, it won't happen any time soon lol.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

As long people keep giving them money, it won't happen any time soon lol.

The thing about money is: more is better than less. So unless Verizon would lose more money by foregoing their meddling, they will come around. They don't have 950s because they bluffed and lost. But each shuffle and deal is a new ball game. I love mixed metaphors.

 

[RTGent]

With respect to which, and especially where I'll be buying, holiday return dates may play a role. I hope Microsoft sets the pace here. I remember buying my first RT in early November and having until Jan 31st to return it. I believe bestbuy is Jan 15th, but excludes phones; while B&H is Feb 1, and does not. I could see myself trying the XL for 60 days, and down-sizing if I want. Or, trying both and returning one in one to several weeks.

 

[RumoredNow]

With respect to which, and especially where I'll be buying, holiday return dates may play a role. I hope Microsoft sets the pace here. I remember buying my first RT in early November and having until Jan 31st to return it. I believe bestbuy is Jan 15th, but excludes phones; while B&H is Feb 1, and does not. I could see myself trying the XL for 60 days, and down-sizing if I want. Or, trying both and returning one in one to several weeks.

Or keep both and have a killer backup. Sell off the old kit.

 

[smf98aggie]

But, what you're forgetting is that your $15/month data fee then jumps to $40/month if you're on a shared plan.

Yes that is exactly what you will be doing on AT&T Next. For example, I just picked up the 640 XL on the Next 18 plan. For an additional $10.42/month I'll be paying for the 640 XL with the option of upgrading in 18 months.

On my paperwork, it clearly stated that I'll be paying off the $249.99 retail price in 24 monthly installments. The good thing about the next program is that you can pay it off early without and penalties for paying it of early. I plan on paying it off next month when I get my end of the year bonus from my job.

 

[Skyway]

But, what you're forgetting is that your $15/month data fee then jumps to $40/month if you're on a shared plan.

We've been over this. $40/line is only for on contract phones, then when the contract ends, it drops back down to $15/line

Posted via the Windows Central App for Android

 

[ssapre]

First, a phone can't become factory unlocked ........

When I say factory unlocked I mean factory unlocked, and I am ware of what's the difference between a factory unlocked v/s carrier unlocked device. The RM-985 variant was sold unlocked directly from Microsoft in physical stores and online and it still hasn't received Update 2. The issue here is Microsoft does not provide the same level of support in the US as compared to other countries where it actually does better (no surprises there).

I would agree to what Pankaj said. I had same with unlocked 1020 which I bought from MS. Being factory unlocked from MS doesnt mean that you would get the update when they declare it, sometimes you will have to wait even more than locked phones...

 

[RumoredNow]

I would agree to what Pankaj said. I had same with unlocked 1020 which I bought from MS. Being factory unlocked from MS doesnt mean that you would get the update when they declare it, sometimes you will have to wait even more than locked phones...

My 1520.3 came late to the Denim party and some country variants of 1520 still only have Cyan...

But Factory Unlocked is a better indicator than carrier branded for support by and large.

 

[pankaj981]

My 1520.3 came late to the Denim party and some country variants of 1520 still only have Cyan...

But Factory Unlocked is a better indicator than carrier branded for support by and large.

Well I agree, unlocked is hands down better than a carrier variant. I meant an unlocked US country variant is not necessarily as better as other country variants. Your 1520.3 was mostly an LTA MX variant.

 

[PepperdotNet]

By the way, the myAT&T app was updated today and now works on Win10M. Maybe release of the AT&T-branded 950 is imminent?

 

[jmajid]

By the way, the myAT&T app was updated today and now works on Win10M. Maybe release of the AT&T-branded 950 is imminent?

interesting my lumia 520 GoPhone that i use (unlocked) never had that app and doesnt have it now either...

 

[smf98aggie]

True, but with the added monthly phone payment added to it, it ends up being around that same amount anyway. Besides, AT&T likes to "price adjust" in their favor to offset the costs that you "think" you're saving, so you probably end up getting screwed either way. I'm sure most everyone on here would agree that AT&T (or any other phone company), couldn't give two sh!ts whether the consumer is getting a good deal or not. All they want is their money, and they're not real worried about hiding that notion from us anymore. I just don't trust those NEXT plans, but I did see that you said you were going to be getting the 950 on the NEXT plan when they came out. I'd definitely be interested to see how that goes for you, and what actual fees they tack on to your bill. I want to get one too, and I definitely don't want to pay $550 for one (especially this close to Xmas), but from my research, it seems like the best way to go....for me at least. Please keep us posted after you get it.

We've been over this. $40/line is only for on contract phones, then when the contract ends, it drops back down to $15/line

Posted via the Windows Central App for Android