03-22-2016 04:19 PM
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  1. HeyCori's Avatar
    No phone is an investment, they are just an electronic gadget. Were transistor radios an investment? Were Walkman's an investment? Were boom boxes an investment? No to all of them. They were just the latest and greatest electronic gadget at the time. That is all the 950/950XL is at this time, until the next latest and greatest gadget shows up.
    Yes gadgets can be an investment. Anyone that invested in HD-DVD, betamax, the Virtualboy, a Dreamcast, WebOS, or one of many failed devices knows what's it's like when that investment goes sour. It's reasonable to question whether a $600 purchase will still be supported in a year.

    Now, we know that Microsoft isn't dropping Windows 10 ever, and (as far as we know) Microsoft has more devices planned for 2016. I would say it's safe to assume that Microsoft isn't going to surprise drop Windows Phone.
    01-06-2016 11:35 PM
  2. JaimitoFrog's Avatar
    Yes gadgets can be an investment. Anyone that invested in HD-DVD, betamax, the Virtualboy, a Dreamcast, WebOS, or one of many failed devices knows what's it's like when that investment goes sour. It's reasonable to question whether a $600 purchase will still be supported in a year.

    Now, we know that Microsoft isn't dropping Windows 10 ever, and (as far as we know) Microsoft has more devices planned for 2016. I would say it's safe to assume that Microsoft isn't going to surprise drop Windows Phone.
    Gadgets are not investments, unless you keep them for over 20yrs more, and if lucky someone will pay for your junk.
    editguy likes this.
    01-07-2016 12:10 AM
  3. ninny1176's Avatar
    "I would say it's safe to assume that Microsoft isn't going to surprise drop Windows Phone."

    I wouldn't be surprised one bit - even this year, especially in the US market.
    01-07-2016 07:52 AM
  4. Eddie_Lomax's Avatar
    Two points, if you are planning to get rich then buying gadgets is not the route. Even a iphone is going to be more or less worthless eventually and the worst thing anyone can do is buy the latest model every year, guaranteed maximized losses.

    So the real question is, will this gadget do what I want for at least 2 years, for me I think the 950 will do just that, it has great components such as a powerful CPU, lots of ram and a world class camera that can take good quality photos in low light.

    For me I'm not too bothered by apps, and what it supports now is enough so that will do.

    As for the future though, I'm not optimistic, people criticize Ballmer, but he was bullish on whatever he went into and supported windows phone properly trying to tread a line between being another Apple and Microsofts traditional business model

    In comparison Nadella is turning Microsoft into a "me too" company, unfortunately going for the Google option of pursuing advertising revenue rather than the Apple one of bespoke devices. I fear that for this reason we will see windows phone languish in the dolldrums at best, Microsoft's best hope now is to extend the PC down to the phone and produce phones that are powerful PC's, that takes vision (and a lot of financial risk that only Microsoft can afford), not sitting around waiting for a third party to pick it up.
    jlabelle likes this.
    01-07-2016 08:41 AM
  5. anon(9709784)'s Avatar
    Am I wrong as basis of long term investment (as I, like many of you, keep my devices active for a long time) to buy into the new Lumia series given Mr. Nadella's recent statements describing WM "unsustainable" and his stronger efforts for an agnostic (OS-wise) presence on other mobile platforms? Do you think these devices will enjoy the lifespan that the 1520 enjoyed?
    The 1520 had no choice but to have the lifespan it had because Microsoft did not offer an LTE "flagship" until the 950/950XL, which, in my opinion, is not a good investment for hardware that creaks out of the box. Microsoft is selling a beta operating system to the public, whether enthusiast or layman. Continuum is a hassle that is immediately impeached with the presence of a Surface 3 offering greater productivity for slightly more than the Continuum dock and peripherals.
    01-07-2016 10:58 AM
  6. NHUK's Avatar
    Onedrive/Office can auto sync on iOS and Android as well. I get it you're happy with your new WP and that's awesome, but the ecosystem of Windows is equally available on all mobile platforms aside for Cortana.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    Its a bit of a hack though, I dont like the fact that you have to open the onedrive app on IOS to sync photos, on win 10 it just syncs as soon as it detects a wifi network, no need to remember to open the app. Onedrive on win 10 is less clunky also. Bizarrely, however, the microsoft health app synchronises much faster with the band 2 on IOS than it does on a 950XL....go figure....
    01-07-2016 11:07 AM
  7. cracgor's Avatar
    Its a bit of a hack though, I dont like the fact that you have to open the onedrive app on IOS to sync photos, on win 10 it just syncs as soon as it detects a wifi network, no need to remember to open the app. Onedrive on win 10 is less clunky also. Bizarrely, however, the microsoft health app synchronises much faster with the band 2 on IOS than it does on a 950XL....go figure....
    Although on windows phone you have to keep downloading screens up for things like maps or games since they don't run in the background. Always a tradeoff.

    I also don't understand how people miss the point on this topic about being a good investment. Sure the phone will depreciate in value, but I think OP wants to know if this will be another windows 6 or 7 type device that gets no updates and no apps. Only time will tell, but the track record is poor.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    01-07-2016 01:47 PM
  8. xandros9's Avatar
    Its a bit of a hack though, I dont like the fact that you have to open the onedrive app on IOS to sync photos, on win 10 it just syncs as soon as it detects a wifi network, no need to remember to open the app. Onedrive on win 10 is less clunky also. Bizarrely, however, the microsoft health app synchronises much faster with the band 2 on IOS than it does on a 950XL....go figure....
    Pretty sure if you grant it Always location access, OneDrive can upload live in the background on iOS.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    01-07-2016 10:54 PM
  9. jlabelle's Avatar
    Although on windows phone you have to keep downloading screens up for things like maps or games since they don't run in the background. Always a tradeoff.
    How often do you download offline map compared to taking a picture on an iOS device ?
    Oh, my bad, of course this is not an issue because you can NOT download offline map on iOS anyway...

    I also don't understand how people miss the point on this topic about being a good investment. Sure the phone will depreciate in value, but I think OP wants to know if this will be another windows 6 or 7 type device that gets no updates and no apps. Only time will tell, but the track record is poor.
    Common please. The Lumia 900 was released at the time of the iPhone 4S. Did you try running iOS9 on the 4S ? Even iOS8 ?
    All the mobile phones released by Nokia since 3,5 years have ALL been able to upgrade and will upgrade to W10 (but obviously the one with not enough storage like 4Gb very low end one).
    This is quite impressive considering that Apple has stripped down every older phones of feature that the hardware could run. For instance, why only the iPhone 6S has Live Images ?

    And let's not speak of Android phones upgrade support ...

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    01-08-2016 03:33 AM
  10. jlabelle's Avatar
    Yes I do miss some features of of windows phone but I rather have apps I need ( banks , transit )..
    I am always puzzled by this. Who are the people that needs ABSOLUTELY their bank application on their phone and cannot use the website for urgency situation or wait having access to a tablet or computer to manage finance more comfortably ?

    Also, what transit services is missing on Windows mobile ? I am asking because here in Europe, the coverage is excellent.
    editguy likes this.
    01-08-2016 03:35 AM
  11. jlabelle's Avatar
    Pretty sure if you grant it Always location access, OneDrive can upload live in the background on iOS.
    No.
    Plus, you loose the Live images synchronization because Apple user a JPEG + a MOV for the animation separated.
    On the Lumia, this is embedded in the JPEG so you share it to anyone. If they open it with a W10 PC (the Photo app) they will see the animation. Even they use DropBox or Google Drive or simply send by email. Much more clever.
    01-08-2016 03:38 AM
  12. Mindi B's Avatar
    There is one main reason that consumers completely miss that means that Windows 10 mobile will be here and supported for a long time: Business. In business Microsoft give 150%. Business customers are slowly moving to use Microsoft mobile phones, and in business, Microsoft provides long term commitments. This is an important part of the vision and one they are selling hard in the corporate world.

    In the consumer space they are committed to Windows 10 and supporting developers in writing Universal Apps which will run on anything. That will benefit the phones too as UWP apps are easily made phone friendly.
    At the risk of coming across rather bluntly, are you just making this up to express your optimism for the platform? I hate to break it to you, but you couldn't be further from the truth.

    To the vast majority of businesses and corporations, WP doesn't exist, period. They don't write apps to support it, and their major support is for iOS over Android due to easier administration and better security.

    On top of that, iOS has great MS apps for it already, there's no need for anyone to even move over to WP, and universal apps aren't even discussed in the industry in regards to W10 let alone W10M.

    A few years ago, businesses and corporations found WP "interesting" but that was the extent of where any momentum went. Since then it has faded into obscurity and now is barely acknowledged by anyone in those sectors. The only people left paying genuine attention to it are the fans - like people here. Outside of that, it's pretty much nothing I'm sad to say.
    01-08-2016 07:12 AM
  13. cracgor's Avatar
    Common please. The Lumia 900 was released at the time of the iPhone 4S. Did you try running iOS9 on the 4S ? Even iOS8 ?
    All the mobile phones released by Nokia since 3,5 years have ALL been able to upgrade and will upgrade to W10 (but obviously the one with not enough storage like 4Gb very low end one).
    This is quite impressive considering that Apple has stripped down every older phones of feature that the hardware could run. For instance, why only the iPhone 6S has Live Images ?

    And let's not speak of Android phones upgrade support ...

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    Not being able to upgrade to a new OS is also different than having the app incompatibility. If you are stuck on an older phone, if it has app access it doesn't really matter as much.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    01-08-2016 08:50 AM
  14. NHUK's Avatar
    Although on windows phone you have to keep downloading screens up for things like maps or games since they don't run in the background. Always a tradeoff.

    I also don't understand how people miss the point on this topic about being a good investment. Sure the phone will depreciate in value, but I think OP wants to know if this will be another windows 6 or 7 type device that gets no updates and no apps. Only time will tell, but the track record is poor.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    Totally agree on the annoyance of having to keep screens open to download, does seem a weird limitation.
    01-08-2016 08:59 AM
  15. cracgor's Avatar
    Happens with things other than maps. Podcasts and OneNote are two others that I could not update in the background.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    01-08-2016 09:01 AM
  16. jlabelle's Avatar
    Not being able to upgrade to a new OS is also different than having the app incompatibility. If you are stuck on an older phone, if it has app access it doesn't really matter as much.
    Well, I tried to install Procreate on the iPad 2 of my son and I had to upgrade to the very latest iOS9 upgrade in order to be able to use it otherwise, it refused to launch.
    So much for your example !

    Beside, it starts to be a little bit old to take always this example of 4 years ago, don't you think ?
    All people having purchased their Windows phones since the last 3,5 years can use the very latest OS and very latest apps. And the best of it is that it is not running slower (compared to iOS upgrade) and you get all the benefit if the hardware support it (slow motion, Rich Capture, USB OTG...)
    editguy likes this.
    01-08-2016 09:03 AM
  17. jlabelle's Avatar
    Totally agree on the annoyance of having to keep screens open to download, does seem a weird limitation.
    It is, like iOS, an disadvantage and an advantage. iOS very tight control is creating a lot of limitations but is preventing of having your phone like Android that start to crawl like crazy after a few weeks / months and many applications installed because they can all run in the background, when they want, without limitation and you have "manage" constantly your phone, close opened application, use tools app to clean and optimize constantly the OS like the old PCs of our parents.

    Windows Phone and mobile is sitting in the middle of iOS and Android opposite extreme. I am glad that Microsoft choose to keep this middle ground and that they do the same with W10 that can be use with modern app that you do not need to manage, cannot install virus, are sandboxed, can be uninstall cleanly and so on.

    What you see as a "annoyance" is a strength of the OS for other users. If you want the "far west" OS, Android is here.
    01-08-2016 09:07 AM
  18. NHUK's Avatar
    Mindi B - I would address a few of the points you make, first and foremost, you are entirely right that WP hardly registers anymore in the business world. A shame since, with the old WP7 and QTEK 2020 I remember when they were the norm... The app gap is partly to blame, but more so is the existing mass of android and ios devices already in consumer hands. People know what they like, and dont want change. Couple that reluctance with top notch marketing from Apple, not bad effort from driod based phones and a dire performance from MS and you're pretty much screwed - I would take issue with the comment about easier admin and security, though. IOS and droid are a pain in the arse.

    I also agree that MS seem to make a better job of their apps on other mobile platforms than their own, which just defies understanding....

    However, and it's a big however, I DO think that continuum will be the game changer when it comes to corporate take up, if MS can get it right - at the moment its a gimmick and not really all its advertised to be.

    Our mobile workforce (who I am resposible to kit out) all shout how they need an iphone, but they also want a tablet, but they need a laptop.... If I can provide one device in the future that gives them mobile and tablet functionality, whilst a dock will then give them a full, genuine windows environment (and not just a carefully selected set of scaled mobile apps) then we have a winner in my view. I'm hoping that they nail it with the surface phone and move on fairly swiftly from the 950 (which I believe seems ok) and the 950XL, which I just returned due to too many defects.
    editguy likes this.
    01-08-2016 09:08 AM
  19. NHUK's Avatar

    What you see as a "annoyance" is a strength of the OS for other users. If you want the "far west" OS, Android is here.
    Steady, I only said it was an annoyance, I'm not about to jump OS's just because of that!
    01-08-2016 09:12 AM
  20. libra89's Avatar
    I am always puzzled by this. Who are the people that needs ABSOLUTELY their bank application on their phone and cannot use the website for urgency situation or wait having access to a tablet or computer to manage finance more comfortably ?
    I don't think it's fair to criticize each other's needs. Different people have different reasons. Having a bank app on a phone is convenient.

    In fact, I have a great example of this. My credit union has apps for iOS and Android, but none for WP. Why is it that when I go to the website on my WP, it asks me if I want the full site or the mobile site? You would think that it would detect that I am using a phone, so of course I would want the mobile site. I find this to be weird but I don't access my account via mobile so it doesn't bother me much.

    My example aside, a good number of people need one to deposit checks. You never know if it could be for business, personal, or a mix of both. You can't do that through the website, only through an app usually.
    HeyCori and RumoredNow like this.
    01-08-2016 09:12 AM
  21. cracgor's Avatar
    Well, I tried to install Procreate on the iPad 2 of my son and I had to upgrade to the very latest iOS9 upgrade in order to be able to use it otherwise, it refused to launch.
    So much for your example !

    Beside, it starts to be a little bit old to take always this example of 4 years ago, don't you think ?
    All people having purchased their Windows phones since the last 3,5 years can use the very latest OS and very latest apps. And the best of it is that it is not running slower (compared to iOS upgrade) and you get all the benefit if the hardware support it (slow motion, Rich Capture, USB OTG...)
    So when windows phone decides to start using x86 processors exclusively in the fall and older processors get as much love as the RT gets. It isn't just one example 4 years ago with no possibility for repeat. When Microsoft drops support for something, they do not lose sleep over it.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    01-08-2016 09:13 AM
  22. Gunbust3r's Avatar
    So when windows phone decides to start using x86 processors exclusively in the fall and older processors get as much love as the RT gets. It isn't just one example 4 years ago with no possibility for repeat. When Microsoft drops support for something, they do not lose sleep over it.
    I doubt they will do a 100% conversion to X86. Remember the whole RT debacle was to throw some weight around in the face of Intel. On the flip-side just look how hamstrung being 100% reliant on sloppy seconds and defective 810 Qualcomm chips had been working out...
    editguy likes this.
    01-08-2016 01:14 PM
  23. editguy's Avatar
    So when windows phone decides to start using x86 processors exclusively in the fall and older processors get as much love as the RT gets. It isn't just one example 4 years ago with no possibility for repeat. When Microsoft drops support for something, they do not lose sleep over it.

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    And what company does? They all drop support in one way or another as time goes by.
    01-08-2016 08:51 PM
  24. Mindi B's Avatar
    Mindi B - I would address a few of the points you make, first and foremost, you are entirely right that WP hardly registers anymore in the business world. A shame since, with the old WP7 and QTEK 2020 I remember when they were the norm... The app gap is partly to blame, but more so is the existing mass of android and ios devices already in consumer hands. People know what they like, and dont want change. Couple that reluctance with top notch marketing from Apple, not bad effort from driod based phones and a dire performance from MS and you're pretty much screwed - I would take issue with the comment about easier admin and security, though. IOS and droid are a pain in the arse.

    I also agree that MS seem to make a better job of their apps on other mobile platforms than their own, which just defies understanding....

    However, and it's a big however, I DO think that continuum will be the game changer when it comes to corporate take up, if MS can get it right - at the moment its a gimmick and not really all its advertised to be.

    Our mobile workforce (who I am resposible to kit out) all shout how they need an iphone, but they also want a tablet, but they need a laptop.... If I can provide one device in the future that gives them mobile and tablet functionality, whilst a dock will then give them a full, genuine windows environment (and not just a carefully selected set of scaled mobile apps) then we have a winner in my view. I'm hoping that they nail it with the surface phone and move on fairly swiftly from the 950 (which I believe seems ok) and the 950XL, which I just returned due to too many defects.
    I wasn't talking about Android in terms of business and corporate adoption - it's iOS that has that foothold. Everyone knows Android isn't secure and therefore not a real option for business.

    Again, I hate to break it to you - but no one out there cares. Continuum IS a great idea, but nobody actually needs it or even talks about it. No one is talking about WP, and no one is certainly paying attention to Continuum beyond "oh, that looks nice", and then they move on - that's IF they even took any notice. On top of that, a lot of those users are rocking iPads, and most recently, Surface Pro 4's with their iPhones. No one has any interest in how Surface Pro works with WP. It's not even on their radar.

    The other thing you need to realise is that while YOU might think WP is a perfect solution, it's got to work with the setups of other partners and vendors that businesses do work with. They're all using iOS, and they're all using VPN's and things like Mobileiron for security. The maruity of iOS now delivers exactly what business and corporate needs. So the users have what they need, they're not interested in exploring WP and certainly not intrigued by Continuum.

    It's good that you're optimistic about the platform - but it doesn't reflect the reality of what's going on out there.
    01-09-2016 12:32 AM
  25. NHUK's Avatar
    Mindi, check your tone, please, I am trying to have a reasonable discussion and talking down to me without any knowledge of my experience or background is somewhat condescending.

    You don't need to break anything to me, and you don't speak for anyone but yourself - it's all about opinions here, no more than that.

    What you perhaps need to consider is that statistically I can't be the only one who is looking at continuum with optimism - if my professional assessments were so off, I wouldn't be where I am, and users in my company do care, and are interested in WP, evidenced by the number of enquiries my team gets about the devices on the Helpdesk....

    Please don't feel compelled to try an 'educate' me simply because we disagree.
    augustin25, Kevin Rush and editguy like this.
    01-09-2016 02:27 AM
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