How many chances can Steve Ballmer have?

[jabtano]

As a share holder, yes, not good. I do not think that is what interests the OP though. I'm uncertain others could have done much better, as MS made a lot of concessions to avoid being split up, which neither google nor apple had to wrestle with, but we will never know. I think, under the circumstances, MS did alright. The company grew, they created more good paying jobs, and they survived the heyday of Linux and OSS incredibly well. Is Ballmer really a complete failure, just because shareholders aren't MS' top priority?

What Ballmer mainly lacks is a grand vision... but I think that is improving.

Your right, what Ballmer lacks is vision, Of course as an investor you want to see your investment grow. Yes Microsoft has been handcuffed while Google and Apple grew to be even bigger than the one that got handcuffed.

A good CEO knows what his or her strengths are. Getting up on stage is not one of them for this guy. He has made some good moves and he has made some really big zingers. his best move was a deal with Nokia. his worst move was not buying it. Leaving it Nokia running pure windows tablets and phones. The man has no vision! As for the stock for me it hovers between $26.00- $29.00 per share. Is it undervalued in some ways yes. Then it's not so much the price of the stock but the dividends that stock pays.

 

[Reflexx]

MS is almost completely redefining who they are. They're making some pretty radical changes. I think it's a huge stretch to claim he doesn't have vision.

He may make different decisions than you would. Sure. But that doesn't mean he doesn't have vision.

 

[brmiller1976]

This is true BUT there is a lot of websites that uses flash and until it's dead Microsoft should allow it in its browser to stay competitive... but who am I to talk, right?

Flash doesn't work on iOS. Flash doesn't work on Windows Phone. And Flash development has been discontinued on Android (and doesn't work reliably as of Android 4.1).

On the major smartphone platforms, Flash is dead.

Flash doesn't work well on Windows 8. It doesn't work at all on Windows RT or the iPad. And it has been discontinued on the Android tablet platform (and doesn't work reliably as of Android 4.1).

On the major tablet platforms, Flash is dead.

On the Mac, Flash isn't included, and runs poorly. On Windows 8 and Windows 7 PCs, Flash isn't included (and is often banned by IT departments due to its security risks).

On the major PC platforms, Flash is dead.

The two major smartphone platforms that pushed Flash compatibility were Palm webOS and BlackBerry Playbook.

Palm and Playbook are dead.

I could keep going, but I think you get the idea.

And HTML5 on IE 10 scored lower than Chrome which is enough for most people to say "IE 10 does not worth crap"

No, it's enough for propellerheads to have a spec to shout about. For standard HTML5 apps, IE10 works great (and will continue to).

Incidentally, IE10 on Windows Phone 8 outscores Android 4.0 for HTML5 compatibility and performance.

also you have to switch from the Metro-IE10 to the desktop version to see a video that is based on flash player... how annoying is that...

I don't use websites that require Flash anymore. Fortunately, most updated their codecs to H.264 and HTML 5 years ago -- thanks to Microsoft and Apple pushing HTML5 in modern browsing.

For legacy sites that haven't updated to HTML5 because the content isn't being updated anymore, there are legacy viewers on all major platforms (including WP) to "translate" the sites.

The switch from Flash to HTML5 will not be done by tomorrow

It's done already. YouTube, the largest video site, has switched. So have most other sites.

Flash is as relevant as BlackBerry 7... a legacy technology that most developers can ignore without a lot of risk. Even Adobe has abandoned development of the client on most platforms, and repositioned itself as a company focused on delivering HTML5 solutions.

 

[Laura Knotek]

As brmiller said, Adobe Flash (and other Adobe products) comprise the majority of the top 10 programs with security vulnerabilities per Kaspersky's latest report.

IT Threat Evolution: Q3 2012 - Securelist

The Top 10 vulnerabilities are listed in the table below.

№	Secunia ID – Unique vulnerability number	Vulnerability name and link to description	What the vulnerability lets malicious users do	Percentage of users on whose computers the vulnerability was detected*	Date of latest change	Rating
1	SA 49472	Oracle Java Multiple Vulnerabilities	DoS-attack Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges Cross-Site Scripting Gain access to sensitive data Manipulate data	35,00%	20.08.2012	Highly Critical
2	SA 50133	Oracle Java Three Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges	21,70%	31.08.2012	Extremely Critical
3	SA 50354	Adobe Flash Player Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges Gain access to sensitive data	19,00%	25.09.2012	Highly Critical
4	SA 49388	Adobe Flash Player Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges Bypass security systems	18,80%	18.06.2012	Highly Critical
5	SA 47133	Adobe Reader/Acrobat Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges	14,70%	11.01.2012	Extremely Critical
6	SA 47447	Apple QuickTime Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges	13,80%	23.08.2012	Highly Critical
7	SA 49489	Apple iTunes Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges	11,70%	10.07.2012	Highly Critical
8	SA 46624	Winamp AVI / IT File Processing Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges	10,90%	03.08.2012	Highly Critical
9	SA 50283	Adobe Shockwave Player Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges	10,80%	14.08.2012	Highly Critical
10	SA 41917	Adobe Flash Player Multiple Vulnerabilities	Gain access to a system and execute arbitrary code with local user privileges Bypass security systems Gain access to sensitive data	9,70%	09.11.2010	Extremely Critical

 

[brmiller1976]

If smooth Flash performance is the most important thing for smartphone success, I recommend the Pre 3.

 

[stmav]

Though you can get flash to work on Windows 8 RT. I unchecked the download compatability list and then added the sites I wanted flash on in the iecompatdata file on my Surface.

 

[HeyCori]

So much misinformation and FUD in this thread. I don't even...

*leaves*

 

[cckgz4]

This op grinds my gears with his misinformed rants

And what's really funny is that so many of my friends, that didn't know about windows phone 7, are talking all about windows 8 and windows phone 8


Sent from something uhmayzing using my pinkie

 

[Simon Tupper]

This op grinds my gears with his misinformed rants

And what's really funny is that so many of my friends, that didn't know about windows phone 7, are talking all about windows 8 and windows phone 8


Sent from something uhmayzing using my pinkie

We certainly don't have the same kind of friends. Most people I know hate Microsoft and despise the new Windows 8... a lot of them call it "childish" or "unprofessional".

And regarding Windows phone 8... all they do is point out what WP8 can't do that Android and iOS can do.

 

[Reflexx]

We certainly don't have the same kind of friends. Most people I know hate Microsoft and despise the new Windows 8... a lot of them call it "childish" or "unprofessional".

And regarding Windows phone 8... all they do is point out what WP8 can't do that Android and iOS can do.

No wonder you're such a grump here. You hang out with other grumps.

 

[Simon Tupper]

I use Windows 8 and WP8 and I love both of them, but as far as sales go and the people's perception towards Microsoft... it's just not there

 

[tk-093]

I use Windows 8 and WP8 and I love both of them, but as far as sales go and the people's perception towards Microsoft... it's just not there

I'm not even sure I believe this. Just about every topic you've ever started here is negative, negative, negative. You'd be much happier somewhere else.

 

[Laura Knotek]

We certainly don't have the same kind of friends. Most people I know hate Microsoft and despise the new Windows 8... a lot of them call it "childish" or "unprofessional".

I don't know about your friends, but I only have two friends who own Macs (and the one Mac owner also runs Windows 8 in BootCamp). Everyone else runs Windows. Even my friends in the two Linux User Groups I belong to also run Windows. The folks in the one Linux User Group mentioned that they liked Windows 8 at the meeting I attended last week.

And regarding Windows phone 8... all they do is point out what WP8 can't do that Android and iOS can do.

My friends typically do not discuss what their smartphones can do when we get together. We talk about a lot of things, but not about smartphones.

 

[a5cent]

Microsoft takes some of the blame in the Vista debacle too. It was not just the hardware vendors' responsibility.
<snipped>

Hey Laura, yes, Microsoft wasn't blameless. The "Vista Ready" sticker and the UAC issues are examples of mistakes Microsoft made.

It's just that IMHO, many people still think Vista was a terrible OS, nobody but Microsoft was to blame, and Windows 7 was infinitely superior. I'm just trying to change that sentiment, which is why I tend to stand on the other side of the argument.

I place most of the blame for the Vista debacle on a failed business model... a PC OS business model that requires Microsoft, hundreds of PC makers, and thousands of hardware developers across the globe to work together, flawlessly, and on time. It has never worked. It never will work. It has repeatedly prevented Microsoft from innovating in the OS space, at least on anything that goes beyond desktop background colors and icon images, as Microsoft knows full well they will take the blame, should any on of those thousands of participants not be involving themselves to the degree consumers expect. The Vista debacle was the result of Microsoft realizing that many low-level changes could be postponed no longer, if Microsoft was to stick around for the long haul.

BTW: Interestingly, Android has a very similar OS business model (although on a smaller scale), while Windows RT is Microsoft's first step in attempt to free themselves from those shackles.

MS is almost completely redefining who they are. They're making some pretty radical changes. I think it's a huge stretch to claim he [Steven Ballmer] doesn't have vision.
He may make different decisions than you would. Sure. But that doesn't mean he doesn't have vision.

Hey Winning Guy, as far as I am aware:

- Windows 8 and Windows RT were primarily Sinofsky's vision, not Ballmer's.
- Ballmer wasn't a fan of the metro UI and initially campaigned against it.
- the biggest innovations at Microsoft were developed entirely from the bottom-up (by individual engineers, creative-directors and lead-designers).

All of that is hearsay, but I'm hearing a lot of it and little to the contrary. I have yet to hear of anything visionary directly attributed to Mr. Ballmer himself. That is why I don't feel it is a huge stretch to claim Ballmer doesn't have a vision, but lets face it, most people (including managers) aren't visionaries. I suspect Ballmer has a vision that relates to corporate structure and management styles, but I doubt he has a vision that relates directly to their products and ecosystem. I suspect Ballmer is perfectly fine letting others develop that vision for him. Despite this, I still feel Ballmer has done rather well.

We certainly don't have the same kind of friends. Most people I know hate Microsoft and despise the new Windows 8... a lot of them call it "childish" or "unprofessional".

And regarding Windows phone 8... all they do is point out what WP8 can't do that Android and iOS can do.

Could it be that your friends are the source of many of your "facts"? Could it be that you are mistaking your friends views of Microsoft and their products as the predominant world view?

Either way, you really need to stop interpreting my challenges to your "facts" as personal attacks on you. You can say whatever you want, but when you are wrong, your statements aren't worth two cents, they are worth nothing, and you should rejoice in standing corrected. Apparently my writing style doesn't suite everyone, but it isn't my intent to offend. All in all, the community is better off when inaccuracies are challenged, right?

 

[Simon Tupper]

I'm not even sure I believe this. Just about every topic you've ever started here is negative, negative, negative. You'd be much happier somewhere else.

Not really, I want it to succeed, I want it to be better. This WP8 is great, but W8 is flawed, I believe there will be several updates to come.

 

[Simon Tupper]

All in all, the community is better off when inaccuracies are challenged, right?

Of course, but when I look around, nobody has a WP8, nor they have W8. There are several articles from theverge, cnet, zdnet or even BBC that are talking about the exact same flaws that I mentioned. So either every article is false and the community of WPcentral knows better or the enthusiasm that you have towards your platform is somehow blinding you.

When I make a thread it's not to be harsh on anyone, but I am pointing out things that I have read, heard or seen. Every OS has flaws, but really when every journal has articles on major problems with Windows powered devices... you can't say that it's a successful launch...

 

[brmiller1976]

When Apple announced that it had sold 4.5 million Macs in a quarter (a new record), the tech press hailed the announcement as "the beginning of the end for Windows," which sold about 120 million PCs in the same quarter.

When Microsoft sells 5 million Windows 8 upgrades and new licenses in a single weekend, the tech press declares that Microsoft is dead and Apple is destined to rule.

It's all rather silly. Outside of the Bay Area and New York enclaves, Macintosh is insignificant. And iOS is merely one of several players. People need to step outside of the Apple bubble and think carefully about what makes sense for the majority of users.

Users in a terrible economy aren't going to spend thousands of dollars to switch to an incompatible, more expensive Apple product. That alone means that Microsoft will continue to dominate. And as new Metro apps come online for Windows 8, the pressure to upgrade will grow more significant.

Windows 8 (and Phone 8) is a paradigm shift, which is why most of the industry doesn't get it. It's as big and bold a change in UI as Apple's move to switch from CLIs to GUIs was in the early 1980s. And the industry's reaction to W8 today is identical to the reaction to the Mac and "that weird mouse thingy and toy-like interface not made for real work." In fact, John C. Dvorak is still around to explain to us why a touch-friendly, information-centric UI is vastly inferior to the obsolete WIMP paradigm... just as he said "The Macintosh uses an experimental pointing device called a 'mouse'. There is no evidence that people want to use these things" back in January of 1984.

 

[Laura Knotek]

:

- Windows 8 and Windows RT were primarily Sinofsky's vision, not Ballmer's.
- Ballmer wasn't a fan of the metro UI and initially campaigned against it.
- the biggest innovations at Microsoft were developed entirely from the bottom-up (by individual engineers, creative-directors and lead-designers).

All of that is hearsay, but I'm hearing a lot of it and little to the contrary. I have yet to hear of anything visionary directly attributed to Mr. Ballmer himself. That is why I don't feel it is a huge stretch to claim Ballmer doesn't have a vision, but lets face it, most people (including managers) aren't visionaries. I suspect Ballmer has a vision that relates to corporate structure and management styles, but I doubt he has a vision that relates directly to their products and ecosystem. I suspect Ballmer is perfectly fine letting others develop that vision for him. Despite this, I still feel Ballmer has done rather well.

I agree. Ballmer is a businessman, not an engineer or a programmer. He probably doesn't even know what a "kernel" does or what's the difference between C++ and C#.

 

[mlm1950]

Of course, but when I look around, nobody has a WP8, nor they have W8. There are several articles from theverge, cnet, zdnet or even BBC that are talking about the exact same flaws that I mentioned. So either every article is false and the community of WPcentral knows better or the enthusiasm that you have towards your platform is somehow blinding you.

When I make a thread it's not to be harsh on anyone, but I am pointing out things that I have read, heard or seen. Every OS has flaws, but really when every journal has articles on major problems with Windows powered devices... you can't say that it's a successful launch...

Good grief, give them a little time. A lot of people have enthusiasm for what Windows 8 and WP8 represents, and what is can become, but if they thought that success was going to happen overnight, they were mistaken

 

[a5cent]

When I make a thread it's not to be harsh on anyone, but I am pointing out things that I have read, heard or seen. Every OS has flaws, but really when every journal has articles on major problems with Windows powered devices... you can't say that it's a successful launch...

I have no problem with that whatsoever. I don't think every point you raised has been disputed either, as some issues relating to the W8 and WP8 surely could have been handled better. What I (and I assume others) don't appreciate is that you fail to acknowledge any of the points people have taken their time to make. Instead you bounce around from argument to argument.

> "The company is slowly losing profits year after year"

I think the financials show this isn't true. You ignore it.

> "IE 10, which is supposed to be awesome since it's brand new, is still behind Google Chrome for the HTML5"

None of the sites you listed go beyond comparing the simple numbers spit out by HTML5 compatibility-test-sites which are, by themselves, completely meaningless. What truly would be unacceptable is if IE10 failed to support the overwhelming majority of what is considered the "stable" HTML5 spec. But that isn't the case. Attempting to explain why it makes sense for IE10 not to support all of the incomplete HTML5 spec goes far beyond what the average consumer is willing to pay attention to. That is why you will never read anything of the sort on consumer oriented website. It is with good reason IE10 is the way it is, and it has been explained to a large degree. Yet you ignore it.

> "Really I don't know why so many people are behind that guy who just keeps dragging the company down..."

Yes, Ballmer isn't perfect, but he certainly deserves the chance he is getting now and people have explained why they think so. You seem to happily ignore every point brought to your attention.

Why should anyone converse with you, if you don't intend to engage in any real discussion? It makes the impression you are all about the negativity and not interested in learning.

There are several articles from theverge, cnet, zdnet or even BBC that are talking about the exact same flaws that I mentioned. So either every article is false and the community of WPcentral knows better or the enthusiasm that you have towards your platform is somehow blinding you.

Yes, many of the people who took the time to make a point are more knowledgeable in the areas they chose to comment on, weather you believe it or not.

The people who work at theverge, cnet, etc aren't experts in any sense of the word. Anyone with some enthusiasm for technology could get a job there. They have a very one sided and shallow consumer oriented view of the world, which isn't a view Microsoft can afford to share. In contrast to Apple, Microsoft (and the Linux community) isn't exclusively in the business of developing toys (okay, that is somewhat overstated for effect). As a result, Microsoft must cater to two markets simultaneously. So, if someone isn't telling you the entire truth, are they lying? That is basically what all of those sites you listed are doing. You only get the consumer perspective. Even if that is the only perspective you care about, I still think it isn't correct to criticized someone before walking a mile in their shoes. Understanding Microsoft obviously takes a lot more effort than ridiculing them, and it will get those sites less page hits, so why bother?