03-24-2013 09:44 PM
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  1. travisel's Avatar
    Did you see this?

    http://www.theverge.com/2013/2/19/40...nt-version-6-3

    It better be a rumor!....
    02-26-2013 04:50 PM
  2. sparksy's Avatar
    Yep, they might do one, or they might not. It might work better, or it might not... I've never noticed problems with the bits from Google. It the OEM's that stink.
    .been with windows phone for nearly two year, was looking forward to getting 920 in may and probably still will. but 7.8 has been so long coming my phone is now sluggish, problems with live tiles so disappointing. My worry is 18 months into new contract same thing will happen with windows9
    02-26-2013 05:02 PM
  3. a5cent's Avatar
    .been with windows phone for nearly two year, was looking forward to getting 920 in may and probably still will. but 7.8 has been so long coming my phone is now sluggish, problems with live tiles so disappointing. My worry is 18 months into new contract same thing will happen with windows9
    Yeah, you're certainly not the only one with that worry. I understand where that is coming from, but I don't think it is justified. However, that is somewhat off topic. It is being discussed here.
    02-26-2013 05:41 PM
  4. a5cent's Avatar
    Did you see this? It better be a rumour!....
    I did. However, that has absolutely no influence on whether or not WP8 devices will get updated to WPk6.3 (WP with kernel version 6.3). If Microsoft wants that to run on current WP8 devices, it can.
    02-26-2013 05:51 PM
  5. travisel's Avatar
    I did. However, that has absolutely no influence on whether or not WP8 devices will get updated to WPk6.3 (WP with kernel version 6.3). If Microsoft wants that to run on current WP8 devices, it can.
    No but it tells you what BLUE is about. And if the new NT 6.3 Windows Blue OS comes that means the big BLUE update is just a compatibility update to the new OS. So now how I see it is Windows 8, Windows RT, WP8 will get BLUE OS compatibility update!

    So yes Blue update for WP8.
    02-26-2013 06:22 PM
  6. IceDree's Avatar
    Don't worry about that guys ! Worrying about future updates ruins the experience .

    Use your phone for what it is & what it can do RIGHT NOW ! & not for what it MIGHT do ! Something I learned from Android .

    according to the Rumors , we will get Blue ! its too soon to worry about Windows Phone 9 right ?

    just my 2 cents
    02-27-2013 03:09 PM
  7. rockstarzzz's Avatar
    Don't worry about that guys ! Worrying about future updates ruins the experience .

    Use your phone for what it is & what it can do RIGHT NOW ! & not for what it MIGHT do ! Something I learned from Android .

    according to the Rumors , we will get Blue ! its too soon to worry about Windows Phone 9 right ?

    just my 2 cents
    This isn't just Android, its true for WP7-7.5/7.8 as well. I cant imagine how it "ruined" Lumia 900 purchase for so many last year around this time. Its been a year since then, honestly what are they missing? Nothing. Still expectations for future killed Lumia 900 left, right and centre.
    03-01-2013 02:54 AM
  8. WNxAshik's Avatar
    03-17-2013 01:33 PM
  9. Nick Garza's Avatar
    Based on what do you believe that to be true? Blue, yes, WP9, I would claim otherwise
    They have made it pretty clear that windows phone 8, unlike 7 because of the kernel, is able to be updated to something like windows phone 9. Wp8 is completely different that wp7. That's the reason 7 is only updated to 7.8
    spaulagain likes this.
    03-23-2013 09:29 AM
  10. Nick Garza's Avatar
    There are clear reasons why wp7 did not get wp8. I suggest doing some research. It will take care of some of the worrying/speculating here. Wp8 is NOT wp7. It will be able to be updated to wp9.
    03-23-2013 09:42 AM
  11. spaulagain's Avatar
    Like stated previously, people that worry about getting WP9 obviously have no clue why WP7 didn't get the WP8 upgrade.

    WP8 and beyond share the same kernel as W8. These two OSes are getting more frequent updates that will bring more shared features across the two OSes. That's what Windows Blue is all about. WP7 was built on the outdated kernel. Its was pretty much obsolete the day it launched as the new kernel was completed and released only a few months later.
    03-23-2013 10:03 AM
  12. a5cent's Avatar
    They have made it pretty clear that windows phone 8, unlike 7 because of the kernel, is able to be updated to something like windows phone 9. Wp8 is completely different that wp7. That's the reason 7 is only updated to 7.8
    Not to be rude, but in my view your post is little more than unsubstantiated fluff. Not made up by you personally, but by an internet community engaged in a huge game of Chinese Whispers (a.k.a telephone).

    It is symptomatic that nobody on your side of this argument can deliver a single quote, directly attributed to MS, which clarifies the matter.

    You say MS has made its WP8 update policy pretty clear. Okay. Show me! Show me a quote attributed directly to MS that makes MS' intentions clear. So far, all we have is "WP8 will have an upgrade path" and "WP8 will receive updates for 18 months". IMHO that is nowhere close to being "pretty clear".

    So far, the best people can do is link to technically illiterate bloggers taking a stab at interpreting MS' statements. Those interpretations are reliably 99% BS, but are repeated ad nauseum nevertheless. The more professional sites, like WPC, ended up being just as vague on the matter as MS themselves, which is the only honest position anyone can take at this time.

    Look, I'm not saying WP8 will be instantly dropped after 18 months. I consider it certain that all WP8 devices will get every update, up to and including Blue, but already that is little more than informed speculation. To my understanding, WP9 is the next big update after Blue. Many here at WPC are practically guaranteeing, that all WP8 devices will get this WP9 update, which IMHO is highly speculative, since MS has said no auch thing.

    I think many are fooling themselves. I've explained elsewhere in more detail why I believe so.
    03-23-2013 10:30 AM
  13. a5cent's Avatar
    Like stated previously, people that worry about getting WP9 obviously have no clue why WP7 didn't get the WP8 upgrade.

    WP8 and beyond share the same kernel as W8. These two OSes are getting more frequent updates that will bring more shared features across the two OSes. That's what Windows Blue is all about. WP7 was built on the outdated kernel. Its was pretty much obsolete the day it launched as the new kernel was completed and released only a few months later.
    I think you are making the technical argument (technically impossible due to kernel change yada yada yada). Few with actual expertise in this area buy into that argument.
    03-23-2013 10:43 AM
  14. Carlton671's Avatar
    The only reason WP7 did not get WP8 is because they change the kernels of the OS. WP7 is monolithic and WP8 is a Hybrid Kernel(NT KERNAL)
    03-23-2013 11:01 AM
  15. a5cent's Avatar
    The only reason WP7 did not get WP8 is because they change the kernels of the OS. WP7 is monolithic and WP8 is a Hybrid Kernel(NT KERNAL)
    And that causes a problem because...
    Last edited by a5cent; 03-23-2013 at 02:15 PM. Reason: changed 'is' to 'causes'
    03-23-2013 11:06 AM
  16. nessinhaw's Avatar
    i think MS will do a sort of Apple thing...they will officially announce Blue and later, WP9, when they are ready to be distributed and not like half-year before...

    and my friend a5cent, tho i also use the kernel argument to why WP7 devices didn't get WP8, i also have another one...business!! it's as simple as that!!
    they want to sell, that's obvious, but if they upgraded their old devices with WP8, who would buy the new? surely pplz would still buy, but most of them would just stick with their old device running a new upgraded system...want proof? many pplz are still sticking with WP7 despite the fact 7.8 is the last update...imagine if they had gotten WP8!

    Android works in a similiar way...OEMs and carriers won't update old devices to make pplz buy the new ones with the most recent versions...for example, i had an Xperia Mini before my Lumia 620...and if i wanted JB, i would have to buy a new device since 2011 devices apparently aren't eligible for JB (which i think is BS, Sony gave Xperia J the JB update but despite being a 2012 device, it's an entry-level one, far inferior to the 2011 high-ends)...again, it all sums up to one thing: business!!
    Last edited by nessinhaw; 03-23-2013 at 02:34 PM. Reason: typos .-.
    03-23-2013 02:32 PM
  17. Dave Blake's Avatar
    Not to be rude, but in my view your post is little more than unsubstantiated fluff. Not made up by you personally, but by an internet community engaged in a huge game of Chinese Whispers (a.k.a telephone).

    It is symptomatic that nobody on your side of this argument can deliver a single quote, directly attributed to MS, which clarifies the matter.

    You say MS has made its WP8 update policy pretty clear. Okay. Show me! Show me a quote attributed directly to MS that makes MS' intentions clear. So far, all we have is "WP8 will have an upgrade path" and "WP8 will receive updates for 18 months". IMHO that is nowhere close to being "pretty clear".

    So far, the best people can do is link to technically illiterate bloggers taking a stab at interpreting MS' statements. Those interpretations are reliably 99% BS, but are repeated ad nauseum nevertheless. The more professional sites, like WPC, ended up being just as vague on the matter as MS themselves, which is the only honest position anyone can take at this time.

    Look, I'm not saying WP8 will be instantly dropped after 18 months. I consider it certain that all WP8 devices will get every update, up to and including Blue, but already that is little more than informed speculation. To my understanding, WP9 is the next big update after Blue. Many here at WPC are practically guaranteeing, that all WP8 devices will get this WP9 update, which IMHO is highly speculative, since MS has said no auch thing.

    I think many are fooling themselves. I've explained elsewhere in more detail why I believe so.

    Not to be rude, but in my view your post is little more than unsubstantiated fluff. Not made up by you personally, but by an internet community engaged in a huge game of Chinese Whispers (a.k.a telephone).

    It is symptomatic that nobody on your side of this argument can deliver a single quote, directly attributed to MS, which clarifies the matter.

    You say MS wont upgrade WP8 devices to future OS releases. We know based on the core upgrade that it is possible and will work with the new core. You still insist that it wont happen. Okay. Show me! Show me a quote attributed directly to MS that makes MS' intentions clear. So far, all we have is "WP8 will have an upgrade path" and "WP8 will receive updates for 18 months". IMHO that is nowhere close to being "pretty clear".

    So far, the best people can do is link to technically illiterate bloggers taking a stab at interpreting MS' statements. Those interpretations are reliably 99% BS, but are repeated ad nauseum nevertheless. The more professional sites, like WPC, have stated that WP8 devices will get WP9. Daniel Rubino and Jay Bennett who seldom makes statements that they can't back up with insider information, stated this on the WPC podcast.

    Look, I'm not saying WP8 will be instantly dropped after 18 months. I consider it certain that all WP8 devices will get every update, up to and including Blue, but already that is little more than informed speculation. To my understanding, WP9 is the next big update after Blue. Many here at WPC are practically guaranteeing, that all WP8 devices will get this WP9 update, which IMHO this is fact.

    I think many are fooling themselves. I've explained elsewhere in more detail why I believe so
    mlm1950 likes this.
    03-24-2013 08:12 AM
  18. mlm1950's Avatar
    Thank you for further pointing out that a5cent is a broken record of misinformation.
    ryan.kruger likes this.
    03-24-2013 10:34 AM
  19. a5cent's Avatar
    @Dave

    C'mon Dave! I don't expect a soaring intellect from everyone here, but you're better than that. I really don't know if I'm to take you seriously.

    You've taken my own post and thrown it back at me with slight modifications, which for the most part makes little sense...

    Not to be rude, but in my view your post is little more than unsubstantiated fluff.
    Look. You (and those on your side of the argument) are the ones claiming to actually know what Microsoft's update policies are, and how they intend to apply those policies to current WP8 devices. I claim only that neither I nor anyone else can know those policies, given only the sparse statements MS has so far made on the topic.

    So, apparently, you want me to substantiate that I don't know something? That's obviously a logical fallacy. My claim that something is currently unknowable is the premise of my entire argument, so turning the bulk of my own post against me makes absolutely no sense. Hence, I'll just concentrate on the sections you modified.

    We know based on the core upgrade that it is possible and will work with the new core.
    Not every possibility is turned into reality. Technically, WP8 also ran on WP7 hardware, but that update didn't happen either.

    You say MS wont upgrade WP8 devices to future OS releases.
    Yes, and you are saying the same thing. You've just forgotten. Some future OS release will not run on current WP8 hardware. Neither you nor anyone else on this site disputes that a cut-off point exists. The question is not "if", but "when". Apparently, you are privy to Microsoft's roadmap and know where this cut-off point lies. So, why not just tell me and be done with it then?

    I have no doubt that WP8 will receive many updates. I think WP8 devices will get the 'Blue' update. IMHO, that is perfectly acceptable and I wouldn't be at all bothered if current WP8 devices wouldn't get the next big update after that. I know little about Microsoft's plans after 'Blue', so I don't pretend to know. Do you know, or are you too just making assumptions?

    Many here at WPC are practically guaranteeing, that all WP8 devices will get this WP9 update, which IMHO this is fact.
    So, which is it, "your humble opinion", or "fact"? It's either opinion or fact. It can't be both. If this is a fact, and even just a shred of evidence exists to back it up with, I should be easy to convince. Why haven't you?

    Daniel Rubino and Jay Bennett who seldom makes statements that they can't back up with insider information, stated this on the WPC podcast.
    Daniel and Jay do a fantastic job. The world would be a better place if everyone was held to their standard of journalistic integrity. I've enjoyed many of their podcasts, but decided to skip the last one because I'm not that interested in hearing about individual apps and games. Apparently that was a mistake. I'll check up on it later. If either of them say they have solid evidence that WP8 devices will get updated to WP9, then I'll gladly believe them and stop spreading uncertainty.

    However, if their evidence is based on insider information, then that entirely validates my point! If you need insider information to know, then all those yelling at me don't know. They are just pretending to know.
    ChMar likes this.
    03-24-2013 06:50 PM
  20. Dave Blake's Avatar
    @a5cent look everyone in this thread is saying the same thing. No one knows for sure what will happen. Even if Microsoft make OS upgrades available to all WP8 devices that is no guarantee that the carriers wont stop it from happening. What I am disagreeing with is you insisting that future updates wont come. Your argument is no more plausible than the contraire. Now we are all reduced to speculation the field is even. WP7 and WP8 are two different animals the updated kernel puts WP8 on the same playing field with Windows. We can compare the facts at hand and twist them however we want but its still just a mute argument.

    Here is my mute argument. The reason Microsoft made the core change? To make WP OS more adaptable to future hardware. What is the Microsoft update schedule? Microsoft is trying to make WP update schedule mirror the Windows OS. Can Windows 7 be upgraded to Windows 8? Yes it can on most hardware. Even most Windows XP and Vista devices work with Windows 8. This "IS" the Microsoft update schedule and this will carry over to Windows Phone.
    03-24-2013 08:22 PM
  21. MinnesotaSteve's Avatar
    The change in kernels between WP7 and WP8 is the reason why the applications aren't backwards compatible. The whole developer SDK changed, the way you write apps changed... what you compile for WP8 won't run on WP7. That's true, we all know that.

    The kernel is not why a Lumia 900 can't be upgraded. The kernel is just software. The reason why the Lumia 900 can't be upgraded is because Microsoft didn't want to spend the money making it work. This is what they stated in the announcement, so I don't see why that's in question. We don't know the exact reason, it most likely was writing new drivers or possibly working out a way to upgrade the boot loader, or it could simply be that they tried it and WP8 didn't perform due to the single core CPU.

    The thing is, nobody has any idea if this also won't be true when WP9 comes out.

    The real question that I would be asking is if they're going to change the way software is developed yet again. Like let's say .NET vNext comes out, will that be available on WP8?
    03-24-2013 09:05 PM
  22. a5cent's Avatar
    What I am disagreeing with is you insisting that future updates wont come. <snipped> Your argument is no more plausible than the contraire.
    This is disappointing. I've taken care not to insist on any such thing.

    Obviously, I'm not sold on the idea that current WP8 devices will get upgraded to WP9 (or whatever MS labels the next major version after 'Blue'). I don't buy your argument either. However, I completely agree that all our arguments are mute. We can't backup any of our arguments, because none of us have enough information to do so. That is exactly why I didn't actually offer any such argument! Anywhere. Despite having one of course.

    Throughout this entire thread my point has always been that we can't really know. I approached this by trying to explain how Microsoft can fulfil everything they have so far committed to (which isn't much), without that necessarily leading to a WP9 upgrade. Apparently that isn't coming across.

    @a5cent look everyone in this thread is saying the same thing. No one knows for sure what will happen.
    Everyone is saying the same thing? Really? Already the second post in this thread answers the question "Will WP8 devices get upgraded to WP9", with a confident and unambiguous "yes it will". Many of the posts that follow are just as clear. In my book that doesn't at all constitute "everyone saying the same thing".

    If at this point the majority realizes that we can't and don't really know, then I'll consider my goal achieved.
    Last edited by a5cent; 03-25-2013 at 12:46 AM. Reason: 2nd last paragraph
    03-24-2013 09:44 PM
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