Samsung co CEO dumps on Win8 and WP8

Article on Engadget states that the demand for W8 &WP is lackluster.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/15/j...dows-products/

Well Mr Shin can go f*** himself. If Samsung showed the same support for Windows as they do for Android then they would see a better ROI. As great as the S3 sales are and the S4s potentially will be, they can take there plastic **** and f*** off. Ill have my L920 all day over that ****. Also, with the S4 they seem to think they are rhe new apple, nothing innovative but expect people to still buy and i doubt they wont but like Apple, Sammy will realise people get tired of the same old ****. Anyway just my 2cents. I am sure ill have droid fans after my head but this is just my OPINION.

It's obvious that their primary focus is Android. More manufacturers that support WP8 would be great but Nokia is doing an amazing job and HTC isn't doing bad either (they recently won the Red Dot design award for the 8X and 8S).

As many articles have pointed out, Samsung have their Tizen OS due out later this year, it makes perfect sense for them to try and cobble the competition.

Doesn't help when Microsoft is moving as slow as a snail in a traffic jam in updating both operating systems. Too many fixes needed for both W8/RT & WP8 yet Microsoft seems content to wait to fix problems. Windows 8 especially needs it and when you consider that ios and android are eating their lunch left right and center you wonder why they are leaving it so long and don't even update their core apps more frequently.

Ultimately though I think Microsoft needs to realize their so called "partners" are really that in name only and they are no longer they allies they were previously so they need to start pulling the lead out in both hardware and software for W8 and WP8.

Together with the previous rumors of "fixing defects found in Windows Phone apparently need three OEMs to demanding a fix before it is fixed." this paints a very sad picture.

Everybody knows Microsoft need to speed up their updates/fixes but they themselves doing anything about it?

I think the Ativ S could have been a solid seller for Samsung if it had a multi carrier release live the Galaxy. A television commercial every two seconds wouldn't hurt either. Samsung releases the phone late, in few markets, doesn't promote it at all and then complains about sales... NICE!!!

Here's a reasonable three-step program for Microsoft to improve on their WP strategy:


1) Direct all the resources currently working with Samsung to Nokia (or HTC if they want to commit further in their WP strategy).

2) Let Nokia have more influencing power in decisions regarding WP software development direction (they have 80% of the marketshare, they should know by now what's needed and what is not). If Nokia wants support for some HW or wants to change something in the software, think about it very carefully before you say no. Or better yet, just do whatever they ask.

3) Set up a meeting with that JK Shin and kick him in the ****.


One-horse game is not optimal for Microsoft, but they clearly failed to attract other manufacturers to commit to their platform and it's now time to change the game plan.

We all know they're not going to improve. WP7 was released in 2010, we're now in 2013 and we're still not much further than we were 3 years ago.

Originally Posted by afgzee

We all know they're not going to improve. WP7 was released in 2010, we're now in 2013 and we're still not much further than we were 3 years ago.

Exactly. Two steps back, zero steps forward doesn't make for a very successful product. Somebody needs to take a cattle prod to MS and get the ball rolling. Forward, not backwards. There are either major roadblocks with wp8 software or they are going in yet another direction like combining RT and WP kernals. Whatever it is, I've lost my patience.

"Well Mr Shin can go f*** himself. If Samsung showed the same support for Windows as they do for Android then they would see a better ROI. As great as the S3 sales are and the S4s potentially will be, they can take there plastic **** and f*** off. Ill have my L920 all day over that ****. Also, with the S4 they seem to think they are rhe new apple, nothing innovative but expect people to still buy and i doubt they wont but like Apple, Sammy will realise people get tired of the same old ****. Anyway just my 2cents. I am sure ill have droid fans after my head but this is just my OPINION."

Samsung is the new Apple and will have the same lackluster enthusiasm going forward. Google is screwed once Samsung adopts a divide and conquer strategy with Tizen. The low and mid end is where the growth is higher, especially with major countries tipping into recession. Windows phone will do great here.

With all the flaws that wp8 it is still easier to use than either ios or android! I would take my Trophy over my wife's iPhone 5 any day of the week. Microsoft just needs to get the apps people want and then get people to see that using them on WP is better! The celebrity my windows phone campaign was a good start but it needs to continue. Curious to see what Verizon will do for the 928.

Microsoft is competition for Samsung, tablets and phones. What do you expect him to say?

Microsoft is going to have to figure out if their mobile strategy is more suited to an Android type of situation, where they have multiple OEMs making Windows devices, or an Apple type of situation, where they have one OEM making Windows devices.

Judging by the lackluster support from HTC and Samsung, I would imagine that the latter would be the smarter direction.

Originally Posted by mlm1950

Microsoft is going to have to figure out if their mobile strategy is more suited to an Android type of situation, where they have multiple OEMs making Windows devices, or an Apple type of situation, where they have one OEM making Windows devices.

Judging by the lackluster support from HTC and Samsung, I would imagine that the latter would be the smarter direction.

I would say two OEMs are required. That way they can innovate against each other to bring more to the table. One OEM = rehash after rehash...

It sounds for me that Samsung want better deal from Microsoft ... threating is sometimes a way to negotiate ...

I have some Samsung laptops and all with Windows (a last one with Win 8)... would I buy their laptop without Windows ? - No, I would not ...

Samsung make their big money by android cp - maybe they have a better deal with Google, who knows - anyway, it is competitive priced combination (like S3 or Note 2) ...

Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

I would say two OEMs are required. That way they can innovate against each other to bring more to the table. One OEM = rehash after rehash...

That single OEM would still have to compete with other platforms so there would still be a need to innovate, perhaps even greater as they would be the sole maker of WP and would be easier to measure and expose shortcomings against the competition.

Has to be better than the current situation where two of the chief WP OEM's seem to be the ones most against it.

Originally Posted by theefman

Doesn't help when Microsoft is moving as slow as a snail in a traffic jam in updating both operating systems. Too many fixes needed for both W8/RT & WP8 yet Microsoft seems content to wait to fix problems. Windows 8 especially needs it and when you consider that ios and android are eating their lunch left right and center you wonder why they are leaving it so long and don't even update their core apps more frequently.

Ultimately though I think Microsoft needs to realize their so called "partners" are really that in name only and they are no longer they allies they were previously so they need to start pulling the lead out in both hardware and software for W8 and WP8.

Samsung was there for MS in the beginning with their Focus, Omnia and Focus 2 phones and for that they got little in return for their investment. WP is still(?) hovering around 3%. Trying to be objective here but if you owned Samsung where would you have doubts about WP after you supported it in 2010,2011,2012 and say only 3% while your android phone is doing X times better

As of today (March 15,2013), if Samsung wanted to swap out the OS in their Galaxy 4 device with WP they couldn't because WP currently only supports 2 cores, WP currently does not support 1920x1080 resolution. I think HTC even mentioned that they couldnt make a 2013 Hero phone because of the OS limitations.


MS is moving too slow for the HW vendors to show case their latest greatest. We all can argue about the need for HW feature X, but OEM don't care and will just put the their latest greatest HW innovations on Android.

Originally Posted by Gaichuke

Here's a reasonable three-step program for Microsoft to improve on their WP strategy:


1) Direct all the resources currently working with Samsung to Nokia (or HTC if they want to commit further in their WP strategy).

2) Let Nokia have more influencing power in decisions regarding WP software development direction (they have 80% of the marketshare, they should know by now what's needed and what is not). If Nokia wants support for some HW or wants to change something in the software, think about it very carefully before you say no. Or better yet, just do whatever they ask.

3) Set up a meeting with that JK Shin and kick him in the ****.


One-horse game is not optimal for Microsoft, but they clearly failed to attract other manufacturers to commit to their platform and it's now time to change the game plan.

I'm down with item #3. LOL!

I now have a Samsung Ativ S. I think it is a brilliant device. Will see if it is as trouble free as my HTC 8X. Battery life seems to be very good so far.

Originally Posted by andrelamont

Samsung was there for MS in the beginning with their Focus, Omnia and Focus 2 phones and for that they got little in return for their investment. WP is still(?) hovering around 3%. Trying to be objective here but if you owned Samsung where would you have doubts about WP after you supported it in 2010,2011,2012 and say only 3% while your android phone is doing X times better

As of today (March 15,2013), if Samsung wanted to swap out the OS in their Galaxy 4 device with WP they couldn't because WP currently only supports 2 cores, WP currently does not support 1920x1080 resolution. I think HTC even mentioned that they couldnt make a 2013 Hero phone because of the OS limitations.


MS is moving too slow for the HW vendors to show case their latest greatest. We all can argue about the need for HW feature X, but OEM don't care and will just put the their latest greatest HW innovations on Android.

Yes, Microsoft is moving too slow, nobody would argue that. But dumping a couple of devices on the market and not doing anything afterwards to market them is not exactly helping. Look at Nokia, 1st phone released in November 2011 and now they sell the majority of WP devices. All because they dedicated resources to it, promoted it, and innovated on top of it to the point they are winning awards starting with the Lumia 900 and now the 920 is considered the most innovative smartphone, and that is with the same OS Samsung also has access to. So how is Nokia able to achive all this for WP yet Samsung with all their profits and mindshare cant? Simple, they didnt try so they really shouldnt complain.

Samsung clearly are not interested in WP. Watching their (awful) presentation yesterday I noticed they only mentioned Android once. It was all about their own software and customizations which they are selling to differentiate themselves from the competition. With WP they are limited to how they can make it unique to them, plus they have to buy a license from Microsoft. You can see their move to Tizen where they will pretty much own they whole platform.

Samsung is making excuses for their poor Windows tablet sales and their WP sales.

They thought their name alone would let them dominate both.

The Surface, and even Lenovo, dominated them in Windows RT and Windows 8.

Nokia dominated them in WP8.

They underestimated their competition in the Windows arena. Now, they're embarrassed and have to make excuses.

They never went in with a plan to win.

Then again, with Tizen around the corner, they probably don't care too much about losing.

They only still speak positively about Android because they're winning there. But they will turn on them soon enough.

Samsung is a business and business is extremely good for them with Android... but samsung will without a doubt be dropping Android for Tizen once/if it catches on. may take some time or may not catch on at all because new OS's biggest hurdle is apps to compete with appstores that have been building for years.


Not a fan of samsungs business model of stealing ideas from others BUT can respect them as a business in terms of profits.

This only adds further into the conspiracy that Samsung is intentionally crippling Windows 8/Phone 8. After all, they barely launched the Ativ S. Didn't bother to advertise it. You wouldn't even know it existed if not for a handful of blogs. And quite honestly, they didn't try very hard with that name. The same with the Ativ tablet. Zero marketing or effort into getting their W8/WP8 devices into people's hands. Yet, they spent like 4 billion to advertise their Galaxy line.

Samsung: So no one's buying a product they didn't even knew existed...

DING! DING! DING!

As others have pointed out, Microsoft's 1.5 million Surface tablets sounds like a small number but that equals nearly a billion dollars in revenue in only 5 months. That's including limited supply and retail outlets. What did Microsoft do that Samsung didn't?

ADVERTISE

Originally Posted by DreadVenom

Article on Engadget states that the demand for W8 &WP is lackluster.

Samsung's JK Shin: there's 'lackluster demand' for Windows-based phones, tablets

Well Mr Shin can go f*** himself. If Samsung showed the same support for Windows as they do for Android then they would see a better ROI. As great as the S3 sales are and the S4s potentially will be, they can take there plastic **** and f*** off. Ill have my L920 all day over that ****. Also, with the S4 they seem to think they are rhe new apple, nothing innovative but expect people to still buy and i doubt they wont but like Apple, Sammy will realise people get tired of the same old ****. Anyway just my 2cents. I am sure ill have droid fans after my head but this is just my OPINION.

point taken, but pick up a dictionary man. use real words to express what you mean

Originally Posted by EauRouge

point taken, but pick up a dictionary man. use real words to express what you mean

can you point out where i need to use these real words. I will happily amend my post to suit your highly intellectual and grammatical needs.

Originally Posted by DreadVenom

can you point out where i need to use these real words. I will happily amend my post to suit your highly intellectual and grammatical needs.

In place of f*** and ****, most likely.

So, Samsung releases a phone for WP8, a couple PC's for Windows 8, and doesn't do well? Is the Ativ S out in the US? What about there Ativ PC?

I know I can look that up. But that's my point. I honestly don't know, and I live in the US.

I think that Samsung is very interested in WP8. The Ativ S they made is a great device that works based on their S3 flagship. Not on the S2 or some other lower spec product. Problem is Nokia and their plethora of 3rd world cheap devices and their utterly unreliable Lumia 920. Nokia got it wrong, they should make cheap droids and higher end WP8 devices. So many cheap WP8 devices reduce the WP8 market to being cheap and unprofitable. Nokia also needs to get its act together on QC. You can make 10x more profit on one higher end device than on a 'el cheapo'. Samsung wants to make WP8, high end to take on Apple. Look at the Ativ S, it is their nicest device design wise. Even the new S4 is less pretty.

Nokia 920 perfectly reliable for me.

Couldn't disagree more with Coolknight. Nokia is doing everything right. One of their main advantages with their budget phones is WP8. And if they made Androids MS wouldn't be giving them $1B a year. So in what world would it make sense to make low end Androids?

And his quality assessment of the 920 could not be further from the truth. Had 2 here since launch day with no problems whatsoever other than the WP8 reboot bug which has long been fixed.

As for 10x the profit on higher end devices, the problem is there are a lot less people in the world looking to buy them. 10x the profit to 1/50th the market (don't know the actual figure) doesn't make sense.

Please pass the pipe cool knight, got some good stuff going there, I want a smoke, please see PC mag article on Nokia and wp8 satisfaction, admittedly small sample but still highly respected magazine

Originally Posted by theefman

Doesn't help when Microsoft is moving as slow as a snail in a traffic jam in updating both operating systems. Too many fixes needed for both W8/RT & WP8 yet Microsoft seems content to wait to fix problems. Windows 8 especially needs it and when you consider that ios and android are eating their lunch left right and center you wonder why they are leaving it so long and don't even update their core apps more frequently.

Ultimately though I think Microsoft needs to realize their so called "partners" are really that in name only and they are no longer they allies they were previously so they need to start pulling the lead out in both hardware and software for W8 and WP8.

How many updates have there been for Windows 8 and RT since October? Please compare to the stunning array of Android updates - zero. How many updates were there in total to ICS and JB? Let's then take that one step further and ponder how many Android devices ever see a major update. While we are at it, how fast has Apple dealt with known issues with its current MacOS and how many IOS updates have there been in five years? Please get your facts straight before accusing Microsoft of being slow. They are by far the most responsive company in the game when it comes to updates, whether they be for features, performance or bugs. If people stopped buying into ten year old BS about Microsoft, they would easily recognize their press influenced perceptions have no bearing in reality....

I bought a Lumia 920, now Nokia is definitely my favorite phone maker. Their phones have personality unlike Samsung's phones.

Samsung half-assed their way into the Windows Phone 8 market and then complains that WP8 has not been good to them. I know most of us have barely seen an ATIV S on display in any store or even know where they are available. The Nokia and HTC devices have gotten good publicity and are widely available.

I hope Nokia doesn't use Samsung for parts and if they do then they should dump them ASAP and go with another company.

Well everyday i see news of Asus, Dell, Lenovo, HP, Acer bringing new Computers/Hybrids/Tablets for Windows 8 Family.

I bought my Pc in 2009 with Windows Vista but its already on Windows 8 (:

Nokia and HTC bringing new Phones to Windows Phone Family etc...

Samsung is just a lazy company that wants to dominate, soon they will drop Android for Tizan OS but i think that will be the fall of them, they think they can own everything but they aint no Google, Apple or Microsoft.

Meanwhile we can only Hope Nokia will keep rising, i Love Samsung business, i love their Tvs, their DVDs i own all kind of Samsung Devices but they are becoming lazy and arrogante, it stupid, people should allways be honest because future might surprise you.

MS should simply hand over WP8 to nokia. Im 100% sure they'll do a much better and quicker job at getting it to the top of the game and actually snatch away Android and iOS' market share. I can bet on that.

MS is just WAY too slow at fixing ****. And its super weird considering they're THE software giants. They have the resources- the capital, the employees and scientists, the technology, the name- all of it. To make WP8 the king. But they just dont. They need to focus on WP a lot now. Its do or die for them. And if they dont they can say good-bye to even their leadership in the Computer OS market. People will look at getting MacOS and chrome on their notebooks, laptops, computers, tablets sooner or later if MS doesnt make it big in the phone game. Thats just what i think.
If Chrome and Android become ONE single platform for both their phones and notebooks and they optimize chrome to support major software that people use on their computers like photoshop etc.. MS are doomed.

They need to push and make stuff happen now. I love my 920 coming from a Note. It is simply amazing. The tiles are incredible and everything is great. But they need to increase market share and get a lot of big devs to support the platform. Theyve made something great now they need to polish and market it like crazy.

Originally Posted by Winning Guy

The Surface, and even Lenovo, dominated them in Windows RT and Windows 8.

Nokia dominated them in WP8.

'Dominates' makes it sound like they have won a competition worth winning - being the top of the pile in either surface or WP8 is like winning a beauty competition in your home town - nice for your mum but nobody else cares.

Originally Posted by inside man 55

Samsung is the new Apple and will have the same lackluster enthusiasm going forward.

Apple has been the cool company for at least a decade now, though perhaps that is slightly eroding due to the new "openness" RDF and the reemergence of spec *******. But there's no reason why Samsung is going down the drain anytime soon, it has only gained mind share in the past two years. People really do believe in Galaxy just as they believed in iPod and Mac.

Even when (and it is a when not an if) Samsung sales drop off, it doesn't mean that Nokia or any of the other also-rans come back - for all we know the biggest player in 2018 could be Micromax or ZTE or well.. someone we've never heard of.

If product manufacturers keep telling us MS sucks, no body is going to buy the stuff.

These continue to send the wrong message. That should rally behind MS and spread the word the MS has the greatest product in the world and we have to have the Samsung hardware to get the best experience.

Originally Posted by stevethenerd

If product manufacturers keep telling us MS sucks, no body is going to buy the stuff.

These continue to send the wrong message. That should rally behind MS and spread the word the MS has the greatest product in the world and we have to have the Samsung hardware to get the best experience.

When the head guy at Samsung comes out and publically say that this stuff sucks do you really think it's aimed at you or a shot across the bows at microsoft?

@Aditya

Glad to see you still enjoying the 920 :)

I think Microsoft is committed to the long haul. No other major mobile os pushes out major updates on a three month cycle. No one. They will get to feature parity and exceed it very soon.

When the new Verizon 928 is released with GDR2 people will realize Microsoft is serious. I believe the marketing will be impressive. It seems Blackberry, Apple, and high end Samsung phones all cost more to Verizon than high end Windows phones, at least $100 different.

Ecosystems will be more important going forward than specs. Apps will always be important. We have seen the Xbox game situation make a huge turnaround last few weeks. Momentum is building.

I firmly believe when devices with Blue are released for holidays 2013 the device specifications, software, and performance will dramatically exceed the low expectations set. Microsoft, Nokia, and HTC will have products to compete on the high, mid, and low end.

If Samsung switches to Tizen, there will be a huge gap to roll on through.

Sorry for any incoherency, my pregnant wife woke me up in the middle of the night and I can't sleep. I will correct when I wake up. :)

Originally Posted by AngryNil

Apple has been the cool company for at least a decade now, though perhaps that is slightly eroding due to the new "openness" RDF and the reemergence of spec *******. But there's no reason why Samsung is going down the drain anytime soon, it has only gained mind share in the past two years. People really do believe in Galaxy just as they believed in iPod and Mac.

Notice I did not say go down the drain, although I may have implied it. Enthusiasm in the sense people got spoiled from galaxy II to galaxy III, the huge jump in functionality. The leap to the galaxy iv is not as large. The reviews on the new phone are mixed. Samsung went down in the stock market due to disappointment in features and expectations.

Same is true with Apple. 3gs to 4 and 4s, huge leap. 4s to 5, they half assed it. Hardware upgrade to size, processor, graphics, and lte? So passé. And Apple's user interface in mobile terms is ancient and uninspired.

Both got arrogant and complacent. Both will pay the price. They will never lose all their sales, they are just no longer cool.

Two years in mobile is 8 cycles where the current flagship is outdated every 3 months. One year with the same device that is meh means people look at other things.

I am going to go on record as saying I expect Samsung sales for the g iv to be below estimates and for them to cut production soon in the next 6 months, same as Apple. They half assed it and will have the same results.

Long ago and far away, I started with a Motorola Q9c and when the time came to replace it, I looked at many Droids. but decided to wait. I finally got an HTC Trophy and haven't looked back except for:

1) The crippled Bluetooth stack; earlier WIN mobile OS (6.x) supported many more BT devices such as BT keyboard. Let's face it, the MS-Office mobile suite suffers severe productivity issues when trying to do any real volume input with the virtual keyboard especially with Excel. Face candy is nice. but functionality is critical.
2) Low, slow, and awkward OS upgrades; this business where the carrier dictates to MS when (or if) they'll push an update is ridiculous. If the carrier isn't willing to support a robust OS, then just maybe MS doesn't need their business and should really support manufacturers and carriers who want the best.
3) Re: The Samsung issue; I like the look/feel of the Samsung products I've seen, but their pursuit of yet another OS doesn't bode well. I'm old enough to remember serial printers where each manufacturer had their own cable pinout map and . . . don't see too many serial printers anymore, do you?

I saw where one poster said they have an ATIV-S which was the only WP8 phone I was really interested in, but which I understand wasn't going to be released in the US. However, I'm still looking for real improvement in the mobile OS to at least restore the functionality I used to have.

The Win8 issue has been further confused by MS with their RT vs Win8 releases. RT is a crippled OS tied to iPad wanna-be's at a price at least $200 above a realistic price point. Win8 on the tablets I've tried (Samsung and Acer) has been smooth and useful. If MS would concentrate on building a WP8 release focused on reasonably replicating Win8 capability on a WP8 phone or phablet, I'll be in line at midnight waiting for the store to open.

And given Samsung's attitude, it would be especially sweet if Nokia's name were on the case.

Samsung's Windows Phone 8's botched launch was the sole doing of Samsung. Did they honestly think that they could make an impact without even selling an international midtier device? I mean, midtiers like the Lumia 710 are the biggest sellers!

Originally Posted by Anaron

It's obvious that their primary focus is Android. More manufacturers that support WP8 would be great but Nokia is doing an amazing job and HTC isn't doing bad either (they recently won the Red Dot design award for the 8X and 8S).

Nokia has no choice but to promote windows phone as much as they can, Microsoft has invested a huge steak into the company, if Nokia wasn't tied in with Microsoft money, they would have either gone into administration or they would be promoting windows phone or lack there off as much as HTC or even Samsung.

Originally Posted by Oliver Newell

Nokia has no choice but to promote windows phone as much as they can, Microsoft has invested a huge steak into the company, if Nokia wasn't tied in with Microsoft money, they would have either gone into administration or they would be promoting windows phone or lack there off as much as HTC or even Samsung.

Actually Nokia provides Microsoft with mapping for WP and Bing and still pay license fees for WP so they are not just kicking back and enjoying the platform support payments from Microsoft. And they made a choice to go with WP for what they thought they could do with the OS to differentiate themselves and they are following through with that as a business strategy, not out of desperation.

Haters gonna hate! I couldnt care less about what Samsung has to say about WP8 and MS...i love my Lumia 620 and i love WP!
I'm a former Android user (owned an Xperia Mini running Android ICS) and the transition was smooth for me...i quick learned how to use WP and i found all the apps i need in the store, so basically, this phone serves my needs as well as Android did, just in a smoother and more elegant way (i love Metro UI)!
So if the phone is serving the purposes i want it for, i dont see why should i care about pplz saying it sux. I know it doesent!

This Samsung bashing WP thing is all about making way for Tizen OS, #3 OS spot is still open and Samsung wants it with its own OS...i rly hope WP and Nokia will grow even more for the next months, what attracted me to WP world was Nokia and its excellent Lumias, so i think they are doing a pretty good job...if they had picked Android, they would be just another one in the already saturated Android market.

So yeah, i'm happy with my Lumia and that's all i care about XD

We still have HTC and Nokia.

I remembered something earlier today. When Samsung was hit with the 1 Billion dollar fine I read something about how Samsung wasn't too happy that Google didn't do much to back them up and instead Google just released some vanilla statement. I'm sure that wouldn't be forgotten and even though analysts are saying that Samsung won't dump Android it is still a possibility.

And I get the feeling the only reason Samsung retool a galaxy into another case and release a WP phone is to get a lower payment to MS.

That's exactly how it feels and I'm not interested in buying from a company doing it to save some $ here and there but are not really interested any more.

early days I got an Omnia 7 and with it's understated clean front and metal back (and changeable battery) I still think it was one of the better release devices. Then Samsung released some really useful apps; GLONASS (makes omnia7 quickest and best GPS fix I've ever had not just phones), All Share, dictionary etc. etc. don't think there have been any serious new apps since quite a long time now (just updates).

Since the Omnia 7 I've seen zero commitment to WP from them. Devices don't look as premium to me as Omnia 7 did, no more apps, no advertising, almost like they don't care. Well the reason they are not selling **** now is because people pick up on the fact WP is something they don't give a **** about and think Samsung won't be in market for long. They then look at Nokia for example and think " they're in this for the long hall, look at all those useful apps that they give me and I'll get updates for them, and I've had nokia's and know they'll look after me"....

that Mr Dim Witt is why you are not selling WP phones. It's not because the OS isn't good. It's because customers see that you are uninterested and want to buy from a company who is committed and proud to show their WP wares.

Now sod off and do your shot's across the bow and gesturing elsewhere :)

john



PS I won't come back for another WP phone from Samsung it will likely be Nokia as like their; service, apps, designs and commitment

Originally Posted by inside man 55

Notice I did not say go down the drain, although I may have implied it. Enthusiasm in the sense people got spoiled from galaxy II to galaxy III, the huge jump in functionality. The leap to the galaxy iv is not as large. The reviews on the new phone are mixed. Samsung went down in the stock market due to disappointment in features and expectations.

I think you would have to be careful before making the assumptions you are making. There are three I caught in the little excerpt I've quoted above - the relevance of reviewers, the logic of the stock market, and the actual buying public.

• Reviewers. Traditionally, reviewers have never aligned themselves with the public. Tech blogs such as Engadget and The Verge run entirely on OS X, which has a market share more laughable than Windows Phone (because of the length of its existence in the PC industry and the imperfections of Windows). They gave positive upon positive reviews to MacBooks, but that didn't make users flock to them. For PCs, the ordinary consumer gets primarily influenced by three things - marketing, the sales rep and the price tag. With the subsidy model of phones, that narrows down to marketing and the sales rep. (In countries with less focus on subsidies, cheaper phones sell well despite their flaws - I personally saw the Galaxy Ace and original Galaxy S sold to several people in a store this year, with the 620 hidden away in a shelf.)
• The stock market. I don't think any more needs to be said, you can barely draw anything concrete out of a stock moving up or down, especially in such a short time frame.
• The buying public. Here's an example I'd like to give you: the iPad. Tech sites are running stories where the iPad is losing out to Android. Wait, really? Last time I checked, my aunt has an iPad. My brothers have iPads. My other aunt and other aunt and uncle and other uncle also have iPads. My mom wants an iPad. Half the people in my lectures have iPads. Who wants a Galaxy Tab instead of an iPad? Maybe some Android fans and tech enthusiasts, but not the hundreds of millions who create the big honking markets and make the cash flow. Sure, maybe it's the new in-thing to give your kid a laggy Kindle Fire for their birthday, but Apple hasn't lost a thing for that.

Just because some vocal enthusiasts and reviewers are shouting loudly does not mean the Galaxy SIV is going to do poorly. In fact, last year no one really saw the S3 to be leaps and bounds ahead of the competition, yet it still blasted them in sales. That's because becoming a household name and something that ordinary people want or need is not a metric measurable in the hardware and software of a product.

Microsoft desperately needs to change its image. It all starts from whether you like it or not... They need a breath of fresh air. A new marketing personality that doesn't look like he's gonna attack the crowd if they don't get his products (any idea of who I'm talking about? hehe).

Windows 8 is good, but most people hate on it because it is trending to hate Microsoft. Well they should take it seriously... Ballmer is not loved by many and Ben Rudolf is not that smart marketing guy the company needs. Maybe Belfiore is ready, but I don't know if he can create excitement for Microsoft's products.

But I think they need to take the market by surprise with a little bit more enthusiasm and innovative ideas, that will force medias to give good press on Microsoft. It's not by being late to every market that you can succeed. They need a game changer. They have to create a need.

Originally Posted by Simon Tupper

Microsoft desperately needs to change its image. It all starts from whether you like it or not... They need a breath of fresh air. A new marketing personality that doesn't look like he's gonna attack the crowd if they don't get his products (any idea of who I'm talking about? hehe).

Windows 8 is good, but most people hate on it because it is trending to hate Microsoft. Well they should take it seriously... Ballmer is not loved by many and Ben Rudolf is not that smart marketing guy the company needs. Maybe Belfiore is ready, but I don't know if he can create excitement for Microsoft's products.

But I think they need to take the market by surprise with a little bit more enthusiasm and innovative ideas, that will force medias to give good press on Microsoft. It's not by being late to every market that you can succeed. They need a game changer. They have to create a need.

They need to make it not-Windows. i.e. I and many people like me (tech-savvy in other words) understand that WP8 is nothing like Windows apart from the UI similarities with Win 8. But for most people, the name Windows resonates with the old desktop OS and represents something they don't like.

ill just chime this in, Samsung is really crappy for not giving users the phone the wanted in the U.S but even if their tizen does not take off, i doubt it will be samsungs undoing especially considering the fact that they just have a titanic product line, perhaps if tizen fails you will get a samsung who will most likely decide on android but at the end of the day samsung is a juggernaut. i hate how they are acting towards microsoft, but i wont sit here and lie and say ill never buy another samsung product again as i have been a huge supporter of their TV's

Originally Posted by WinFan1

ill just chime this in, Samsung is really crappy for not giving users the phone the wanted in the U.S but even if their tizen does not take off, i doubt it will be samsungs undoing especially considering the fact that they just have a titanic product line, perhaps if tizen fails you will get a samsung who will most likely decide on android but at the end of the day samsung is a juggernaut. i hate how they are acting towards microsoft, but i wont sit here and lie and say ill never buy another samsung product again as i have been a huge supporter of their TV's

Tizen will fail, it looks boring compared to iOS..

Originally Posted by Simon Tupper

Tizen will fail, it looks boring compared to iOS..

dont make assumptions. i want it to crash and burn to be honest but i cant ever count out a competing OS

I think Tizen will do okay. The Galaxy S4 is kind of preparing people for when Tizen comes. They're moving further away from stock Android and focusing on customized software. Kind of like Amazon.

The next step is Tizen. Where they'll probably still have many of those same services to keep continuity.

Also remember that Samsung makes TVs. Those TVs can connect to a Samsung app store. I would not be surprised to see that app store somehow connected to their phones. That could be their answer to getting into your living room. Competition to the XBOX in that sense.

Originally Posted by Winning Guy

I think Tizen will do okay. The Galaxy S4 is kind of preparing people for when Tizen comes. They're moving further away from stock Android and focusing on customized software. Kind of like Amazon.

The next step is Tizen. Where they'll probably still have many of those same services to keep continuity.

Also remember that Samsung makes TVs. Those TVs can connect to a Samsung app store. I would not be surprised to see that app store somehow connected to their phones. That could be their answer to getting into your living room. Competition to the XBOX in that sense.

while I agree with the proposed theory I disagree that it will be any viable competition to the Xbox. The Xbox Is a very well established media consumption device, with the added functionality of a game console.

Originally Posted by Winning Guy

I think Tizen will do okay. The Galaxy S4 is kind of preparing people for when Tizen comes. They're moving further away from stock Android and focusing on customized software. Kind of like Amazon.

The next step is Tizen. Where they'll probably still have many of those same services to keep continuity.

Also remember that Samsung makes TVs. Those TVs can connect to a Samsung app store. I would not be surprised to see that app store somehow connected to their phones. That could be their answer to getting into your living room. Competition to the XBOX in that sense.

I ddon't see it thrive tho... There is a huge lack of personality in Tizen.

I'm guessing they will attempt something similar to BB in that they will add the ability to port over Android apps

Originally Posted by squire777

I'm guessing they will attempt something similar to BB in that they will add the ability to port over Android apps

For Tizen was announced the support for android apps. How deep this support will be remains to be seen. If the app is just a mini web page no problem. If app uses backgraound agents and notifications and links to events related to sms beeing received and stuff one can not know. A great many number of apps on android use such features that may not be supported in Tizen. But the ability to run android apps without recompile on another os will make it sell in great numbers just with a bit of marketing

Originally Posted by WinFan1

while I agree with the proposed theory I disagree that it will be any viable competition to the Xbox. The Xbox Is a very well established media consumption device, with the added functionality of a game console.

I dont think it will be much competition to the Xbox either, but the point is that they are working to gain multiple ways into your life.

I just want Microsoft to innovate with Blue and earn more respect from the medias.

Originally Posted by Winning Guy

I dont think it will be much competition to the Xbox either, but the point is that they are working to gain multiple ways into your life.

well it will be interesting to see the reception of tizen. if its anything like the previews i have seen i think ill pass.

Look at Samsung have the balls to talk trash now that they're #1. I hope they're counting they're days well because there is no other way from up, but to go down.

I don't want to be alarming, but the S4 will sell more than any other phone. Samsung will win this one and by the same occasion android. But this autumn could be all about WP.

Originally Posted by Simon Tupper

I don't want to be alarming, but the S4 will sell more than any other phone. Samsung will win this one and by the same occasion android. But this autumn could be all about WP.

Given how long iPhone was number one for, I think we've got another 2-3 years to go before that happens.

Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

Given how long iPhone was number one for, I think we've got another 2-3 years to go before that happens.

It would not surprise me if it took longer than 2-3 years. The perfect example is the original Xbox. It was released in 2001 and it took nearly a decade for anyone could start calling it a success. And while it took Microsoft that long to become a major player in the console market, look at how long it took Nintendo to lose it's number one spot. . Microsoft isn't just in it for the long haul. It's a long haul, period. I'd be happy if Microsoft hit 20-30% after two years. That's a solid chunk of market share when you consider that there's currently 4 major players now with a few smaller players waiting to emerge.

Strange how lenovo and HP seem to have 0 issues with selling plenty of windows 8 computers...

Originally Posted by abel920

Look at Samsung have the balls to talk trash now that they're #1. I hope they're counting they're days well because there is no other way from up, but to go down. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...8/b80efe23.gif

or more up :D

Depends on what you call #1, in mobile yes, in computers definitely not. They have also only done a mediocre job at their WP8 phones anyways, its not like they really made any new phone for it, they just took their current galaxy line and shoved windows hone onto it, like the ativ S and the focus S. Not that its a bad strategy but they didn't do anything innovative or different like HTC or nokia. In ay case, I would much rather take an HTC one or a lumia 920 over a GS4. Samsung build quality on phones past the GS2 IMO, were not good, same with their tablets, they feel plasticky and cheap. Not like the Lumia, for example which while plastic (polycarbonate), feels very durable and well built.

They're windows 8 computers also seem to be outclassed by HP, Lenovo, dell, other manufactures too.

This, probably, do sent mean Samsung has haven up on the platform , in a whole.

The main problem with wp is that everyone see it as Microsoft Windows and thinks that this is enough to sell. But MS does not promote it's system like the manufactures promotes it's phones.

"Well Mr Shin can go f*** himself. If Samsung showed the same support for Windows as they do for Android then they would see a better ROI. As great as the S3 sales are and the S4s potentially will be, they can take there plastic **** and f*** off. Ill have my L920 all day over that ****. Also, with the S4 they seem to think they are rhe new apple, nothing innovative but expect people to still buy and i doubt they wont but like Apple, Sammy will realise people get tired of the same old ****. Anyway just my 2cents. I am sure ill have droid fans after my head but this is just my OPINION."

Samsung is the new Apple and will have the same lackluster enthusiasm going forward. Google is screwed once Samsung adopts a divide and conquer strategy with Tizen. The low and mid end is where the growth is higher, especially with major countries tipping into recession. Windows phone will do great here.

I don't really see how google can be screwed. Google owns Motorola, they have their own company that will be able to produce slightly less crappy Android phones. Sure Samsung is the android poster child but won't existing google users stay with their current mobile OS?
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as much as i like Windows 8 and WP8 (i dont have WP8 device for now but i have a windows 8 tablet), the main problem with the OS is Microsoft's inability to adapt faster. I remember how shi**y Windows Mobile 6.5 was in first Xperia, very slow and had too much problems. Their first decent mobile OS was Windows Phone 7.5 mango and when it released people already flocked to android and iOS. Even blackberry already in decline back then. Regular people want to play casual games, want their phone to have instagram, etc. Microsoft is truly lacking in these vital features hence why not many casual people buy WP8.

Windows 8 is also facing the same problem. Google and Apple (and you can say Amazon if you count their OS is different from Android) already jumped into tablet market since 2009/2010 and Microsoft's first dedicated touch OS just came out recently. When Google and Apple are now battling in 7-8" screen size, Microsoft hasn't even supported that screen size yet. They are always one step behind. That's why it cant compete. What worse is, they force the same appearance to the desktop version hence why many people don't like it.

There's a reason why Apple never mix Mac OS X and iOS altogether. Instead Apple cleverly borrow iOS features bit by bit to be implemented in Mac OS X but Mac OS X still feels desktop and still pretty much different from iPad. This is actually how Microsoft should do it.

They should allow desktop users to start into desktop mode because like it or not we have to admit productivity is still there, right in desktop mode. People who use desktop are those who want to work not to play. That's why metro feels unimportant in desktop. At least that's how I see it. I have Windows 8 on my desktop too but honestly i almost never touched anything metro except skydrive, mail, skype, and IM+. Recently i even installed skype desktop version because it's easier to just switch between apps there instead having to go to start screen and click "Skype" or move your mouse to the top left and swipe it down and choose skype. The experience is totally different with a tablet because in tablet you can just swipe your finger to switch between apps.

we all know why people are bashing Windows 8. They use it on desktop or laptop. Most of them never really had a Windows 8 tablet hence why their experience was different from us whom use Windows 8 in its best environment (touch screen).

So again, i do like Windows 8. Win8 boot faster than Windows 7. It is even faster than Mac OS X. It's stable, fun, smooth, and refreshing. But in order to please the mass audience (not just me and you), they should try to compete faster and not always one step behind the others. They should try to innovate and (especially for Win8) the price needs to be competitive. Good thing that Intel would reduce its chip prices for next generation haswell and atom bay trail, it would be great to have next Windows Blue tablet for $300-400. They should know the market now is very competitive. Even Amazon wouldnt be able to compete if they never sold their Kindles in very cheap price in the first place.

about WP8, I think they should also allow all the same features of Nokia apps (no restriction at all) to be in Samsung/HTC WP8 devices. Honestly the biggest advantage of Lumia is their offline navigation maps which is very useful for travelers. Why on earth anyone would want to buy HTC/Samsung over Lumia?

You guys should try to be realistic. I hope you all know the iPhone is still the best selling phone. As for Samsung they are the ****tiest company. The s4 is clearly not innovative people don't care about innovation as much they care about brand name. Right the top brand names in the smart phone biz are apple and Nokia. Nokia is by far the most innovative. But as for Microsoft and wp8, come on. Wp8 is so far behind the competition.

Windows 8 is amazing, best OS out there foir sure, on Pcs at least.

On Tablets looks like iOS is still king and those iPad Sales are insane really.

As for WP8 is amazing OS but needs more features but things are coming and fast!

Originally Posted by wokaz80

as much as i like Windows 8 and WP8 (i dont have WP8 device for now but i have a windows 8 tablet), the main problem with the OS is Microsoft's inability to adapt faster. I remember how shi**y Windows Mobile 6.5 was in first Xperia, very slow and had too much problems. Their first decent mobile OS was Windows Phone 7.5 mango and when it released people already flocked to android and iOS. Even blackberry already in decline back then. Regular people want to play casual games, want their phone to have instagram, etc. Microsoft is truly lacking in these vital features hence why not many casual people buy WP8.

Windows 8 is also facing the same problem. Google and Apple (and you can say Amazon if you count their OS is different from Android) already jumped into tablet market since 2009/2010 and Microsoft's first dedicated touch OS just came out recently. When Google and Apple are now battling in 7-8" screen size, Microsoft hasn't even supported that screen size yet. They are always one step behind. That's why it cant compete. What worse is, they force the same appearance to the desktop version hence why many people don't like it.

There's a reason why Apple never mix Mac OS X and iOS altogether. Instead Apple cleverly borrow iOS features bit by bit to be implemented in Mac OS X but Mac OS X still feels desktop and still pretty much different from iPad. This is actually how Microsoft should do it.

They should allow desktop users to start into desktop mode because like it or not we have to admit productivity is still there, right in desktop mode. People who use desktop are those who want to work not to play. That's why metro feels unimportant in desktop. At least that's how I see it. I have Windows 8 on my desktop too but honestly i almost never touched anything metro except skydrive, mail, skype, and IM+. Recently i even installed skype desktop version because it's easier to just switch between apps there instead having to go to start screen and click "Skype" or move your mouse to the top left and swipe it down and choose skype. The experience is totally different with a tablet because in tablet you can just swipe your finger to switch between apps.

we all know why people are bashing Windows 8. They use it on desktop or laptop. Most of them never really had a Windows 8 tablet hence why their experience was different from us whom use Windows 8 in its best environment (touch screen).

So again, i do like Windows 8. Win8 boot faster than Windows 7. It is even faster than Mac OS X. It's stable, fun, smooth, and refreshing. But in order to please the mass audience (not just me and you), they should try to compete faster and not always one step behind the others. They should try to innovate and (especially for Win8) the price needs to be competitive. Good thing that Intel would reduce its chip prices for next generation haswell and atom bay trail, it would be great to have next Windows Blue tablet for $300-400. They should know the market now is very competitive. Even Amazon wouldnt be able to compete if they never sold their Kindles in very cheap price in the first place.

about WP8, I think they should also allow all the same features of Nokia apps (no restriction at all) to be in Samsung/HTC WP8 devices. Honestly the biggest advantage of Lumia is their offline navigation maps which is very useful for travelers. Why on earth anyone would want to buy HTC/Samsung over Lumia?

good thing is that they are going to do boot to desktop in first update coming out this summer. Otherwise I do agree with many points that they are kinda slow, but on the upside, they are seeming to do everything they are doing very well. Sure people will complain about windows 8 but it will catch on and from the news I've been reading, it was actually a success and not a flop like everybody was making it out to be. In my store, we have only like 1 or 2 people a day come in and complain about windows 8. Most people have no major problems getting used to it and they are like "oh a new windows, let me get it". Some people complain but its not a huge amount.

One thing I've noticed about the tablets is that people have a huge misconception about them..for example I was selling a couple a tablet the other day. They just came from our apple department looking at the ipad and they wanted to look at android, but said specifically not windows. then I asked them why, I said that " I thought windows 8 was much faster, more user friendly, and you could do much more on it than android", then they said "well, yeah, but its going to cost me a grand to buy a windows tablet and its a big heavy computer". Then I just showed them the 400$ acer iconia w510 with intel atom and they were impressed that they could buy a tablet that was a full computer with a touch friendly interface and still do 90% of the stuff they do on their pc on a tablet.

MS is going to have a hard time convincing people that they are a better alternative to android and ipad because, while I truly believe they are, they don't really have too much of a foothold yet. Especially when most people believe that its google or apple and don't even realize that MS has tablets other than the surface, and it seems that people don't want RT because they believe its half-baked and useless even though its not just because the app store isn't as big. I mean they give you 90% full office, except macros which are coming apparently, but still they come with office, thats like 140$ right there already included!

Honestly, I don't know why this news would be any big shock to anyone. It's been obvious since day one that Samsung cares about Android and very, very little or rather, not at all about WP. As far as I'm concerned, that's fine. I would rather get quality hardware that's made by a company that actually cares about the platform, like Nokia. Samsung can keep on crapping out malware-ridden plastic phones all they want. It's for the better of WP and for those of us who enjoy WP.

Originally Posted by metalchick719

Honestly, I don't know why this news would be any big shock to anyone. It's been obvious since day one that Samsung cares about Android and very, very little or rather, not at all about WP. As far as I'm concerned, that's fine. I would rather get quality hardware that's made by a company that actually cares about the platform, like Nokia. Samsung can keep on crapping out malware-ridden plastic phones all they want. It's for the better of WP and for those of us who enjoy WP.

Totally true, as someone who owns a focus s, its pretty much the same phone as the GS2 but with wp. My next phone is definitely going to be a lumia. Also, remember that samsung is also trying to push Tizen very soon, it seems they want a platform they can fully control, which is why they went to android in the first place because they can modify it. It would be funny if tizen starts taking marketshare from android...sounds crazy, but not when you consider that tizen can natively run android apps...

Lets be honest, Samsung really isn't into windows phone 8, what else would they say?