What is Nokia's answer to iPhone 5s and Nexus 5 this holiday season?

[ohgood]

Because MS is building up an ecosystem, not a phone? Google is building a browser and a data mining mobile instrument for their ad revenue. Apple has an ecosystem in place. MS is building theirs - if you look at the bigger picture, you will realize that MS hasn't just say twirling their thumbs but have actually done a lot since 2010 to make an ecosystem where having a Windows Phone now makes sense and in coming couple of years will make a LOT more sense to everyone.

With death of support for XP, people will move to Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 or 8.5 (when that is even better!) and in coming 3-5 years for MS it makes sense to aim at those billions of PC users and businesses to give out Windows Phone and consumers to use Windows Phone. This ecosystem will be huge due to advantage of PCs against Macs and advantage of Xbox against iTV or Google Play. People will buy into ecosystem, not into a phone.

Currently I would like to jump the ship and get BBM and all those games by getting an iPhone but I've invested in an ecosystem and seamless sync of my office docs via Skydrive on my phone and on my Windows 8 at work makes more sense to me than BBM. Hence, however much I want BBM, I won't choose an iPhone. It feels like owning an odd one out when I have Surface, Windows 8 PC at work, Windows 8 laptop at home, Xbox 360, Xbox Live, Xbox Music Pass and Windows Phone.

They want about a billion of me in coming 5 years. See? Even though we as consumers don't want an ecosystem, for MS this is the pace at which they want to develop WP. Because if they bring everything into an ecosystem at same point, each component can grow together. Then they can sell us services like cloud storage, Xbox Music, sharepoint and what not.

So if anyone wants apps or games or high spec phones, they have to break out of an ecosystem and go buy that Nexus 5. But there won't be an answer to any of these phones by Apple or Google because they want to sell phones but MS wants to sell you an ecosystem.

Apparently, it's a harder sell to sell someone an "ecosystem" ( 5-10 products, with subscriptions , and different hardware pieces ) than one phone.

 

[chezm]

While your post is a tad more negative then how I am putting it, I basically agree. I just do not think it is "sad". .

The reason its sad is because i've got a hand full of buddies with iPhone 4's ready to HW upgrade, within the next 2 months. They don't want another iPhone, definitely don't want an Android and were looking forward to WP potentially. However, we no longer have the 920 here for sale on contract deals, I cannot recommend a 1020 for 2 year contract $200 because realistically its a 920 with 2GB of ram and 41MP camera (which is awesome but my friends dont really want). Also, here in Canada there are no 928, 925 models and the 4.5" is the ideal size for most. so what situation is left? They will either just get an iPhone 5s or Nexus 5...or G2... (which are closer to 5" but the coolest and latest) or anything other than WP. With the momentum Surface is finally capturing, people NOW are a little more open-minded to WP8...so there may be others thinking the same as my buddies. It's sad because WP8 could finally have gained some foundation during the xmas holiday season with some updated 92x models but are riding on the coat tails of the 1020...which may appeal to some but doesnt leave options open.

And just to add, i respect we can speak our mind on this discussion board...hence my 'negative' tone. its because you guys can handle it and we can talk at an honest, level headed playing field. Most other forums or boards would drive others up the wall or off their seats.

 

[Indistinguishable]

And just to add, i respect we can speak our mind on this discussion board...hence my 'negative' tone. its because you guys can handle it and we can talk at an honest, level headed playing field. Most other forums or boards would drive others up the wall or off their seats.

 

[rockstarzzz]

Apparently, it's a harder sell to sell someone an "ecosystem" ( 5-10 products, with subscriptions , and different hardware pieces ) than one phone.

Exactly it is! But they aren't selling you everything at one time. I didn't buy Surface, Windows 8 PC at work, Windows 8 laptop at home, Xbox 360, Xbox Live, Xbox Music Pass and Windows Phone together on my shopping trip. It isn't harder to sell someone an add-on to something they are already invested in. People are invested in PCs. Many are invested in Xbox 360. If you have Windows at work, Windows at home, Windows on Xbox, heck get a Windows Phone - it is same seamless experience and that's how it all starts.. But to do that, they need to bring a coherent experience which the ecosystem lacks. In trying to do that, WP feels like lagging behind "other phones" - they don't care.

 

[gmlongo]

I think Nokia's biggest issue with their product lineup (at least in the US), is that they have no phones in the size range that most women prefer. I have a 920 with not a single scratch on it, but no woman I know will take it because it is too bulky and too heavy. Nokia is missing an entire demographic here...A demographic that could be filled with something like the Lumia 520, but with slightly better specs and including a FFC and flash. Or a 620 with a 4 inch screen.

 

[Old_Cus]

I think Nokia's biggest issue with their product lineup (at least in the US), is that they have no phones in the size range that most women prefer. I have a 920 with not a single scratch on it, but no woman I know will take it because it is too bulky and too heavy. Nokia is missing an entire demographic here...A demographic that could be filled with something like the Lumia 520, but with slightly better specs and including a FFC and flash. Or a 620 with a 4 inch screen.

My wife is of average height and size and she loves her 920. She even put some kind of big-a case on it (she didn't want to take a chance of it breaking if dropped) and now it looks just like a brick. She doesn't care, she still loves it.

 

[broar94]

In response to 'ecosystem'- wp8 is like wp7 except under the hood changes and some other functionality(I agree direct USB plug-in, and sd card support was probably the best thing they introduced since wp7 but that's not the only thing here...). But even during wp7 days, people did not buy one because it didn't meet their expectations or lacked what the other mobile os had in terms of features. Nokia lumia phones were/are known for their cameras and not for the os itself. If there is a USP of windows phone,there isn't. It's too basic, hardly 5% market share and not too many apps even in 2013. It's been four years since wp came in. And not much has changed ever since. But android has grown so much within the same period(apple is something else). If Nokia brings out more low end phones, and Microsoft keep updating their os, only then the app market will improve with time and more people will buy windows phone in a world that's dominated by apple and google android. Ms needs to keep up with the pace. No developer will want to come to windows market unless there is a demand for his app, or there are a lot of folks using wp.

 

[DJCBS]

Well, now that the competition's heavy guns are all laid out on the table, I'd have to ask: What is Nokia's answer to iPhone 5s and Nexus 5 this holiday season?

If you're on Verizon, it may be the Lumia 929 (though it's still just a rumour). But what about the rest of us?
The 1520? I would say no; it's a phablet so it's not a flagship device, and its size makes it unappealing to a majority of people
The 1020? But that is just a refresh of the 920 with a better camera and extra RAM. To people who are not photo-buffs, it doesn't offer much over the 920 (not to mention it loses built-in wireless charging)

I hope Nokia still has some surprise up its sleeves, It's hard to imagine they would want to enter the holiday buying season without a true flagship to compete against Apple and Google.

The L929 is more than a rumour by now, seeing as we have actually SEEN the phone in the hands of a member of these Forums.

To answer your question, I think the only one to directly compete with the likes of the iPhone 5S, Galaxy S4, Xperia Z1 and Nexus 5, will be an international version of the L929 that must be released.

I completely agree with you on the matter of the L1520 and L1020. They are great devices but they are niche devices. Niche devices aren't meant to be flagships. And so, as of yet, Nokia's flagship is still the L920.

The L929 and international version is clearly the successor for the L920. Why haven't they announced them yet, is something I don't understand...but I also give thanks...means it gives me time to recoup from the blow my wallet has already suffered with the new Surface's accessories, new console games etc...because I'm definitely buying that one.

 

[Smg-Uk]

I'm waiting for the 5" version of the 1520 that will be the perfect upgrade for me. Just hope it isn't too far off !

 

[gmlongo]

My wife is of average height and size and she loves her 920. She even put some kind of big-a case on it (she didn't want to take a chance of it breaking if dropped) and now it looks just like a brick. She doesn't care, she still loves it.

I'm glad your wife loves it. But she is most certainly in the minority when it comes to phone size.

 

[manu_dutt]

Well, now that the competition's heavy guns are all laid out on the table, I'd have to ask: What is Nokia's answer to iPhone 5s and Nexus 5 this holiday season?

If you're on Verizon, it may be the Lumia 929 (though it's still just a rumour). But what about the rest of us?
The 1520? I would say no; it's a phablet so it's not a flagship device, and its size makes it unappealing to a majority of people
The 1020? But that is just a refresh of the 920 with a better camera and extra RAM. To people who are not photo-buffs, it doesn't offer much over the 920 (not to mention it loses built-in wireless charging)

I hope Nokia still has some surprise up its sleeves, It's hard to imagine they would want to enter the holiday buying season without a true flagship to compete against Apple and Google.

I think Lumia 925 is good enough as a flagship to compete with iOS & Android latest & greatest handsets.
Sure I speak for myself.

 

[chezm]

I think Lumia 925 is good enough as a flagship to compete with iOS & Android latest & greatest handsets.
Sure I speak for myself.

ya, I would say I can't agree there...925 looks like a nice device, but its limited to carriers and countries...and the internals are realistically over a year old

 

[scottcraft]

As far as a direct competitor to the 5S, Nexus 5 and the other top android phones out now I feel the 929 will be really the only one until spring and that's only on Verizon. I don't think Microsoft/Nokia trying to compete and win on that level right now, but that will probably change with 8.1. Seems like they are focusing on the low end market right now. Now if the 929 and 1520 was going to be available on all carriers it might be different, but it seems like they are trying to get a unique phone on each carrier, at least in the US.

 

[anon(5325154)]

The reason its sad is because i've got a hand full of buddies with iPhone 4's ready to HW upgrade, within the next 2 months. They don't want another iPhone, definitely don't want an Android and were looking forward to WP potentially. However, we no longer have the 920 here for sale on contract deals, I cannot recommend a 1020 for 2 year contract $200 because realistically its a 920 with 2GB of ram and 41MP camera (which is awesome but my friends dont really want). Also, here in Canada there are no 928, 925 models and the 4.5" is the ideal size for most. so what situation is left? They will either just get an iPhone 5s or Nexus 5...or G2... (which are closer to 5" but the coolest and latest) or anything other than WP. With the momentum Surface is finally capturing, people NOW are a little more open-minded to WP8...so there may be others thinking the same as my buddies. It's sad because WP8 could finally have gained some foundation during the xmas holiday season with some updated 92x models but are riding on the coat tails of the 1020...which may appeal to some but doesnt leave options open.

This is exactly the point I am trying to make.

People tend to make bigger purchases around the holiday buying season (yeah it's a shocker I know). Sure, the diehard fans out there will likely go back to their platform of choice, but for the masses they'll gravitate towards the newest and shiniest gadget with the most buzz around it, and there's no question that the 5s and Nexus 5 fit the bill. But if you look at the WP camp, I can't help but see a void there, and I really think it's a missed opportunity for Nokia/MS that they are not putting up a compelling option during this critical time.

 

[jlzimmerman]

IMO, the only challenger to the Nexus 5 and iCrap 5 would be an updated variant of the 1020 for all other carriers. The 929, 13xx and 15xx really have nothing other than size going for it for a "wow" factor.

And MS/Nokia need to get past their current naming conventions. To the average person all these numbered variants are confusing.

 

[chezm]

This is exactly the point I am trying to make.

People tend to make bigger purchases around the holiday buying season (yeah it's a shocker I know). Sure, the diehard fans out there will likely go back to their platform of choice, but for the masses they'll gravitate towards the newest and shiniest gadget with the most buzz around it, and there's no question that the 5s and Nexus 5 fit the bill. But if you look at the WP camp, I can't help but see a void there, and I really think it's a missed opportunity for Nokia/MS that they are not putting up a compelling option during this critical time.

Agreed. People are letting their personal bias interests proceed the reality of truth...people Want the latest shinny toy to have latest technologies and show off, especially their phone since its on them 99% of the time. There is a void people may not want to admit in these parts. Smartphones are a huge seller at Xmas and I think Google is going to capitalize most at the cheap cost of Nexus 5...most of the WP8 phones at my local shop are 6 months old...with a huge 2 choices (sarcasm). Note 3, iPhone 5c and Nexus 5 will be the top sellers is my guess.

 

[rdubmu]

The Nexus 5 isn't even the best Android device. The Note 3 is #1 for specs, the LG G2 is the best device in its class for all the features it has over the LG Nexus 5

The only thing the nexus has going for it is plain vanilla Android and the price. The G2 has a ton of features plain android doesn't including knock-on feature they stole from Nokia Symbian devices.

I still think the Nokia 1020 is the best Windows Phone available. The sucky part is the 1520 is also a AT&T exclusive. The best 2 windows phone devices on the same carrier.

Hopefully Microsoft comes out with a unsubsidized Nexus type of windows phone that is under $400

Sent from my LG-D801 using WPCentral Forums mobile app

 

[scottcraft]

IMO, the only challenger to the Nexus 5 and iCrap 5 would be an updated variant of the 1020 for all other carriers. The 929, 13xx and 15xx really have nothing other than size going for it for a "wow" factor.

And MS/Nokia need to get past their current naming conventions. To the average person all these numbered variants are confusing.

The 1520 and 929 have the same processor and screen resolution as the newest crop of android phones whereas the 1020 has a processor that's relatively old (I'm not saying the 1020 isn't snappy btw). Since all three of these Lumia have awesome cameras I feel the 929 and 1520 are more on the same level as the newer phones on other platforms, especially when they are updated to 8.1.

 

[Tre Lawrence]

The only thing the nexus has going for it is plain vanilla Android and the price.

But that, along with the ecosystem and the best development community in the mobile space, may be all that it needs.

 

[Keith Wallace]

LOL! Guess I didn't realize flagship phones were a big gift item. :grin:

For me, there's nothing in the iPhone or Android camp that would make me choose those over the 1020 or 928. If people want fancy, release the 1020 in brushed metal cases :amaze:

In reality, if the current WP offerings don't fit for people, I don't think anything being released in the next 6+ months is going to make iPhone or Android fans go gaga and switch to WP. Just my 2 cents as someone who went through the whole decision making process not too many months ago.

It's not a big-gift item necessarily. I got my 920 as an early Christmas gift last year, but it wasn't a big gift (since I got it for just $50). However, I can say that if I was in a position to get a device this year instead of last year (where the 920 was on-par with the competition), I 'd simply pass, probably until my birthday in May. I couldn't justify a 2-year contract on a 920 or 1020, seeing as it runs on an old SoC and runs REALLY hot on most games. The 1520 would be too big for my liking, most likely, and the news that the AT&T model loses the 32 GB of storage and wireless charging would probably be the nail in that coffin. The only option would be the 929, if I had stayed on Verizon (which I didn't care to do one way or the other).