05-14-2014 03:55 AM
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  1. msxbox's Avatar
    The votes against android apps are climbing nicely on Microsoft's user voice site....
    k0de and boxa72 like this.
    02-20-2014 05:01 PM
  2. k0de's Avatar
    True. keep on voting against Android apps everyone.

    http://windowsphone.uservoice.com/fo...oid-apps-on-wp
    msxbox likes this.
    02-20-2014 07:03 PM
  3. Zulfigar's Avatar
    True. keep on voting against Android apps everyone.

    http://windowsphone.uservoice.com/fo...oid-apps-on-wp
    An app is an app, doesn't matter where it comes from. It also gives less work for the publishers out there, and more money for them, so I don't see the point of this being an issue, sorry.
    k0de likes this.
    02-20-2014 07:18 PM
  4. k0de's Avatar
    An app is an app, doesn't matter where it comes from. It also gives less work for the publishers out there, and more money for them, so I don't see the point of this being an issue, sorry.
    Haha an Android App belongs on a Android device. If I wanted Android I would have bought myself a Samsung S 4 phone. But I like MSFT Windows and that's why I left iOS after many years and got me a NL 925. Finally MSFT is the next big thing. MSFT products are and will always be the best that computing can offer. I don't want Android Apps on my NL 925.
    msxbox and boxa72 like this.
    02-20-2014 07:50 PM
  5. Markham Ranja's Avatar
    We Don't need Android apps on Windows Phone as like I said the Platform is growing quite nicely are there are many ways to monetise apps and there are articles written by devs saying how much more successful they have been on Windows Phone over Andriod and IOS. Its a very successful platform already and won't be long before they get the extra sales to prove it to any doubters.
    [citation needed]
    msxbox likes this.
    02-21-2014 04:39 AM
  6. anony_mouse's Avatar
    MSFT products are and will always be the best that computing can offer.
    "Always will be" - that's quite a significant claim. Evidence please.

    I don't want Android Apps on my NL 925.
    Then don't install any.
    02-22-2014 09:50 AM
  7. a5cent's Avatar
    I don't want Android Apps on my NL 925.
    Then don't install any.
    As has been stated many times already... the problem is the probability of developers trashing their WP app efforts, and choosing to provide WP apps primarily in the form of Android ports.

    If you want to convince people, you must explain why Android compatibility wouldn't negatively impact the native WP app market.

    Without that, your recommendation is akin to saying: "then don't install any new apps" (because most new apps will be Android ports). However, people do want a continuous stream of new apps. That is the dilemma.

    People have already been telling us since page one of this thread, that they wouldn't install such android ports... by dropping WP entirely and moving over to iOS, where you'd get both new apps and non-Android apps.
    alveswes likes this.
    02-22-2014 12:10 PM
  8. msxbox's Avatar
    As has been stated many times already... the problem is the probability of developers trashing their WP app efforts, and choosing to provide WP apps primarily in the form of Android ports.

    If you want to convince people, you must explain why Android compatibility wouldn't negatively impact the native WP app market.

    Without that, your recommendation is akin to saying: "then don't install any new apps" (because most new apps will be Android ports). However, people do want a continuous stream of new apps. That is the dilemma.

    People have already been telling us since page one of this thread, that they wouldn't install such android ports... by dropping WP entirely and moving over to iOS, where you'd get both new apps and non-Android apps.
    The amount of apps made for Windows Phone is increasing all the time well made ports are very welcome If they are tweaked with windows phone enhancements this is great

    And those Devs that have and will be porting apps to windows phone stand to make a good amount of extra cash especially if made to a high standard

    This topic is about NOT wanting native android apps with no optimization or enhancements for Windows Phone, there are over 200,000 windows phone apps and its growing quickly.... The windows phone as you can see from many Dev articles on the web is a great place to maximize your income as a Dev/Company

    And once the Windows Phone 8 platform has merged with the Windows platform fully you will be shocked by the sheer size of the platform within the next 12 months, as it stands we have well over 50 millions users and with the merge will be an unbelievable amount more and the numbers will climb dramatically..

    read this if you missed it
    http://www.windowscentral.com/micros...-windows-phone
    Last edited by msxbox; 02-22-2014 at 03:28 PM.
    02-22-2014 02:14 PM
  9. a5cent's Avatar
    This topic is about NOT wanting native android apps with no optimization or enhancements for Windows Phone
    Yes. And? That makes this thread exactly about all the open questions in both of our comments...

    Will Android ports be tweaked for WP?
    Will Android ports include any WP specific enhancements?
    Will developing native WP apps make any sense at all, when it is far cheaper to port the Android version?
    Will developers choose to remove their native WP apps from the marketplace and replace them with direct Android ports instead? If so, how many developers would do that, and which ones?

    At least for me, all those questions require rather positive answers, otherwise I'd probably also cast a vote of no confidence and jump ship, which many others here have already alluded to.

    IMHO it is obvious that the primary goal of Android compatibility is to make it cheaper to port Android apps to WP (for both maintenance and initial development). If the primary goal is to lower costs, then how many of those porting efforts will include budgets to add WP specific features back in, not to mention the budgets to maintain those differences over time as both OS' evolve? My guess is that we won't see that being done to any significant degree, but that is just speculation based on past experiences with similar scenarios. That is also why I still find the recommendation to just "not install Android ports on WP" rather simplistic and unhelpful.
    IlkkaV likes this.
    02-22-2014 03:21 PM
  10. msxbox's Avatar
    updated post above with a link to a wpcentral article on this topic
    02-22-2014 03:29 PM
  11. a5cent's Avatar
    updated post above with a link to a wpcentral article on this topic
    I saw the article, but it doesn't answer any of what I think are the most important questions... or am I missing something?
    02-22-2014 03:49 PM
  12. msxbox's Avatar
    Will Android Ports be tweaked for WP?
    of course any business/dev out there understands the need for a quality/optimized application for whatever platform they create for it maximizes the user base and obviously ratings for the app will be higher

    Will Android Ports include any WP specific enhancements?
    on my personal view it would be the company's/dev's that spend the extra time adding/enhancing WP specific features that would get the greatest rewards for their efforts, I personally would pay more for an app that had been either designed/re-designed with windows phone in mind... and any of the free apps will obviously be rewarded through ad revenue/in app purchases etc

    Will developing native WP apps make any sense at all, when it is far cheaper to port the Android version?
    partly answered above i think, but again it would make a lot of sense going forward to have an Platform specific app already in place as once the Windows Phone user base reaches IOS level and above you already will have a solid, well designed and crafted app to add features/enhancing the user experience etc, it would not make sense to have a basic app get low ratings then add to it, it would always be logical to invest a bit of extra time to get the app to a standard you would be happy with first/get good ratings and generate extra revenue then add any extras etc, I am sure this would be more rewarding in the short term and long term...

    Will developers choose to remove their native WP apps from the marketplace and replace them with direct Android ports instead? If so, how many developers would do that, and which ones?
    I am sure that keeping the native WP apps would make sense going forward due to Windows Phone being the fastest growing smartphone platform, the only devs that would just port and nothing else would be one's that are happy just having a version of their app on another platform, but the popularity and revenue made by an app is very much down to features/speed/reliability and using unique features of the WP Platform etc etc...
    02-22-2014 03:54 PM
  13. msxbox's Avatar
    Keep on voting if you want great Windows Phone apps and great Android Ported apps that are enhanced and redesigned with Windows Phone 8 in mind, and not buggy non optimized ported apps from android...

    Direct Android app access = no
    Quality WP optimized+added feature ports from Android = yes
    WP Apps built from the ground up = impressive and yes, bring em on..

    this was my view maybe i have misunderstood a few of you apologies if that is the case
    Last edited by msxbox; 02-22-2014 at 04:53 PM.
    02-22-2014 04:17 PM
  14. a5cent's Avatar
    Yes, businesses and devs understand the need for a quality/optimized app. To me, it sounds like you expect that understanding to always win out over the need to minimize development costs. I'm sceptical that you've picked the winning side. Not because quality isn't important, but because the battle for "most popular app" just isn't fought on WP. That battle is fought on Android and iOS. Your WP users will eventually switch to whatever app won the popularity contest on iOS and Android, so that is where devs will invest their limited time and money. If the WP port is a little shabby doesn't really matter.

    That is how I expect this to play out, at least if what we've heard so far are the extents of MS' plan... that is why I'd like to hear more.
    02-22-2014 04:41 PM
  15. msxbox's Avatar
    I don't think that is the case as we have popularity contests on the Windows Phone Platform too and some of the Apps on this platform Win Awards too and monetary prizes, our platform is unique, well designed, very efficient/fast in comparison to IOS/Android for many reasons, the dedicated developers on WP are up there with the best of other platforms too.. There are also apps that have been requested by users of the other platforms that have been built from the ground up on WP the quality on the platform is high....
    its late here there is one quick link that may show that our platform has great potential for all devs/companies, if anyone can help link some other success stories please do otherwise i will work on it more tomorrow (UK), Hill Climb Racing €“ A Monetization Success there are I am sure a lot more success stories I will look again tommorow

    http://blog.dvlup.com/2013/12/18/get...ccess-stories/

    http://blogs.windows.com/windows_pho...scenarios.aspx

    http://blogs.windows.com/windows_pho...developer.aspx

    http://blogs.windows.com/windows_pho...ows-phone.aspx

    http://blogs.windows.com/windows_pho...io-10tons.aspx

    http://blogs.windows.com/windows_pho...developer.aspx

    http://blogs.windows.com/windows_pho...r-updates.aspx

    http://www.windowscentral.com/taptit...phone-platform

    http://wmpoweruser.com/microsoft-adv...success-story/

    (Evernote)

    (Nextwave Multimedia)

    (Artifex Mundi)

    (Game Insight)

    (Coltran Studio)

    (Rudy Huyn)

    more success story videos here http://www.youtube.com/user/nokiadevforum?feature=watch

    Some of the stories above are more than a year old so the download figures and amount of money each of these Windows Phone Devs/Companies have made will be way more than in the articles perhaps someone knows more accurate upto date data...

    also if you have a project that needs funding this may help
    http://www.appcampus.fi/

    sorry just added a few extra articles from just having a quick look on the web...I have seen even more success stories, the amounts of money to be made on Windows Phone is impressive with a user base of 50 million+ from before Dec 2013 and rising rapidly, imagine how much money can be made once the userbase overtakes IOS (we have already overtaken Iphone in over 24 countries)
    Last edited by msxbox; 02-23-2014 at 03:53 PM.
    02-22-2014 05:13 PM
  16. a5cent's Avatar
    Obviously there are some very good apps for WP. I'm not denying that. On the other hand, the existence of some 1st class apps doesn't change the fact that a lot of WP apps lack the features and/or polish of their counterparts on iOS and Android. It's this large "middle-class" of apps where WP is trailing. These are also the apps I think are most likely to be affected, not to mention the apps that have yet to enter the WP ecosystem because their devs don't yet see the potential. I imagine even some great apps would probably never have been released in native WP form. Think of some of Rudy Huyn's apps, and what might have been different had WP been supplied with a quick/dirty/cheap Android port of the official app early on.
    Last edited by a5cent; 02-23-2014 at 10:48 AM. Reason: Grammer
    02-22-2014 11:44 PM
  17. anony_mouse's Avatar
    Yes. And? That makes this thread exactly about all the open questions in both of our comments...

    Will Android ports be tweaked for WP?
    Will Android ports include any WP specific enhancements?
    As I've said many times in this thread - apps will likely need porting (or tweaking, if you prefer) to run on WP/Android. And in any likely scenario, Microsoft will control what apps are available, so can *enforce*, for example, design guidelines as they can for WP 'native' apps.

    Will developing native WP apps make any sense at all, when it is far cheaper to port the Android version?
    Given the above, why would it matter whether apps where 'native' WP or WP/Android?

    Will developers choose to remove their native WP apps from the marketplace and replace them with direct Android ports instead? If so, how many developers would do that, and which ones?
    Given the above, why would it matter whether apps where 'native' WP or WP/Android? The final question is clearly impossible to answer at this stage.
    02-23-2014 02:49 AM
  18. msxbox's Avatar
    Excellent News.. Just in by Daniel Rubino

    €˜Open for business€™ €“ Microsoft gives reference design for Windows Phone, announces new OEMs | Windows Phone Central

    Windows Phone is Here to stay :)

    Design Apps from the ground up on WP and reap the rewards... :)
    02-23-2014 07:32 AM
  19. a5cent's Avatar
    As I've said many times in this thread - apps will likely need porting (or tweaking, if you prefer) to run on WP/Android. And in any likely scenario, Microsoft will control what apps are available, so can *enforce*, for example, design guidelines as they can for WP 'native' apps.
    You are speculating, and your assumptions are not ones I'm willing to make.

    While it is true that WP apps are tested before being published to the WP store, that has always been, for the most part, an automated process. The level of automation is soon to reach 100%. In other words, there is nobody at MS who rejects apps if they fail to conform to "modern" UI design guidelines.

    The UI consistency we enjoy on WP exists not because of the app testing process, but because of WP's "consistency-enforcing" UI APIs. These APIs do not exist on Android. MS could replicate them and mandate their use, but that would again make it very costly to port apps. This defeats the whole point of Android compatibility and thus makes little sense. I don't see how to enforce what you think should be enforceable, without being self defeating or cost prohibitive.

    Given the above, why would it matter whether apps where 'native' WP or WP/Android?
    I admit it wouldn't. I just doubt that the above is 'given'.

    IMHO, to decide if this is a good idea or a terrible idea, requires a lot more information than we currently have.
    Last edited by a5cent; 02-23-2014 at 10:52 AM. Reason: Spelling
    02-23-2014 10:31 AM
  20. anony_mouse's Avatar
    You are speculating, and your assumptions are not ones I'm willing to make.
    Well, this whole thread is speculation. I am assuming that Microsoft would not simply adopt the Google Play store, and therefore would control what WP/Android apps were used. We could debate whether that's a good assumption.

    While it is true that WP apps are tested before being published to the WP store, that has always been, for the most part, an automated process. The level of automation is soon to reach 100%. In other words, there is nobody at MS who rejects apps if they fail to conform to "modern" UI design guidelines.

    The UI consistency we enjoy on WP exists not because of the app testing process, but because of WP's "consistency-enforcing" UI APIs. These APIs do not exist on Android. MS could replicate them and mandate their use, but that would again make it very costly to port apps. This defeats the whole point of Android compatibility and thus makes little sense. I don't see how to enforce what you think should be enforceable, without being self defeating or cost prohibitive.
    It will depend on what priorities Microsoft set and how they want to go about doing this. If WP/Android is just to fill in some gaps, it might be feasible. In the end, there will be a trade off between more consistency, and getting fewer apps, and less consistency and making it easier to port apps. It would be interesting to know what people in general prefer. I don't mean people like us, but people who are potential WP buyers.

    I admit it wouldn't. I just doubt that the above is 'given'.

    IMHO, to decide if this is a good idea or a terrible idea, requires a lot more information than we currently have.
    We are certainly extrapolating a great deal from a rumour! Probably much more than is justified.

    BTW, for the record I still think it is very unlikely that Microsoft will add an Android runtime to WP.
    a5cent likes this.
    02-23-2014 12:01 PM
  21. canadian1der's Avatar
    Lots of speculation on this thread, though it is a credible rumor based on the sources that have published it. We really don't have enough information to know what this would look like, how it would work, or if it would be beneficial or disastrous. Since we are all speculating though, I'll add my two cents below.

    What I think might be a fairly strong possibility is that Windows Phone will simply support apps written in Java, aka the language that most Android apps are written in. It would probably be similar to how Windows Phone already supports apps written in HTLM5/JS, C#, C++, etc. It might not mean literally opening and running the .APK on WP8.X, but instead Windows Phone officially supporting a coding language that a lot of mobile developers, ie Android developers, are familiar with.

    It could be a way to make the platform more appealing to developers who haven't looked at Windows Phone before due to coding preferences and familiarity with using Java. I think one of the biggest hurdles for Microsoft right now is that the other platforms have a head start with app development and Microsoft's development tech has seen a decline in popularity recently. If they added support for a popular coding language it could be a boost for interest. It would also maintain the integrity of the Windows Phone ecosystem, since it wouldn't mean that "native" Windows Phone apps would be shoved aside for Android ports, but only that they would be adding more options for app development.
    02-23-2014 03:43 PM
  22. msxbox's Avatar
    on a side note i just added some more success stories in one of my earlier posts in this thread here's a link or just search back on this page higher up, http://forums.windowscentral.com/gen...ml#post2368380

    canadian1der, I agree that adding more support for extra programming languages could be a good idea, but as it stands things are improving quite quickly, maybe i think by the end of the year we will have landed some more big apps possibly even around build in April, if not then I agree fully that extra language support for Devs to create on Windows Phone is important to success (my own view), we need a WP Dev's view on this really, like everyone says a lot of this discussion is speculation....
    Last edited by msxbox; 02-23-2014 at 04:56 PM.
    02-23-2014 03:59 PM
  23. rodan01's Avatar
    Lots of speculation on this thread, though it is a credible rumor based on the sources that have published it. We really don't have enough information to know what this would look like, how it would work, or if it would be beneficial or disastrous. Since we are all speculating though, I'll add my two cents below.

    What I think might be a fairly strong possibility is that Windows Phone will simply support apps written in Java, aka the language that most Android apps are written in. It would probably be similar to how Windows Phone already supports apps written in HTLM5/JS, C#, C++, etc. It might not mean literally opening and running the .APK on WP8.X, but instead Windows Phone officially supporting a coding language that a lot of mobile developers, ie Android developers, are familiar with.

    It could be a way to make the platform more appealing to developers who haven't looked at Windows Phone before due to coding preferences and familiarity with using Java. I think one of the biggest hurdles for Microsoft right now is that the other platforms have a head start with app development and Microsoft's development tech has seen a decline in popularity recently. If they added support for a popular coding language it could be a boost for interest. It would also maintain the integrity of the Windows Phone ecosystem, since it wouldn't mean that "native" Windows Phone apps would be shoved aside for Android ports, but only that they would be adding more options for app development.
    The efforts to "maintain the integrity of the platform" are vain for Windows Phone. If the OSs proliferate the incentives for the adoption of cross platform technologies increase and integrity is destroyed in all the platforms. If there is a consolidation in just one or two big platforms, native apps become viable for more use cases, but you could find the integrity only on Android and iOS, WP would be dead.

    In the short term some OSs are using the Android SDK as the cross platform tech because HTML5 is still immature, probably in 2014 more than 50% of the Android compatible devices won't use GMS. In the long term HTML5 should be the cross platform tech.

    So, if WP survives integrity is an impossible scenario. Microsoft, just bring us the Android apps we need before WP dies.
    k0de likes this.
    02-23-2014 09:52 PM
  24. k0de's Avatar
    The efforts to "maintain the integrity of the platform" are vain for Windows Phone. If the OSs proliferate the incentives for the adoption of cross platform technologies increase and integrity is destroyed in all the platforms. If there is a consolidation in just one or two big platforms, native apps become viable for more use cases, but you could find the integrity only on Android and iOS, WP would be dead.

    In the short term some OSs are using the Android SDK as the cross platform tech because HTML5 is still immature, probably in 2014 more than 50% of the Android compatible devices won't use GMS. In the long term HTML5 should be the cross platform tech.

    So, if WP survives integrity is an impossible scenario. Microsoft, just bring us the Android apps we need before WP dies.
    Yes that was plan B. It already started. Yuck.

    02-24-2014 03:53 AM
  25. ShreyansShah's Avatar
    "Always will be" - that's quite a significant claim. Evidence please.



    Then don't install any.
    i dont understand why u need more evidence for MSFT products being better, after living in a world built up on Windows.
    there are other OSs and products competing with MSFT products, but cant replace it fully.
    that's what it meant.
    i remember a comment read long ago (or it might be a fake argument posing someone else)
    it was like Google arguing MSFT.
    Google is saying i am dominating the Internet, u r nowhere and u will be nowhere in the future.
    Microsoft's Reply was, "cool down buddy. the waves u r riding on are created by me. without me, there would not have been internet, there will be 90% less revenue to you, and u will be lost, where google cannot find u."
    i think its true, as 80-90 % of Non-windows users, use other OSs, because it's free.
    Same thing is true with Android. the main reason android grown this much, is because its free. (another reason is wrong policies of Symbian foundation, which died own death).
    02-24-2014 06:44 AM
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