07-23-2014 07:40 PM
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  1. Cleavitt76's Avatar
    The point is that entire generations (teens, twenty- and thirty-somethings) have now grown up with the perception that Google and Apple are cool and Microsoft is not. Sure, all major business and organizations use Microsoft now, but that's slowly becoming a non-truth. And who do you think will be making those type of corporate decisions in a few years? The twenty- and thirty-somethings who right now are totally invested in Apple and Google. That's what I'm concerned about.
    I understand your concerns about the consumer perception of MS and how that might transfer into the business world, but as someone who works in IT I can guarantee that those corporate decisions will not change any time soon. If some of those hardcore Apple/Google fans do manage to make it into a position to make corporate IT decisions and they decide to switch the company to Apple/Google, they will either be fired very quickly or they will run the company into the ground.

    Seriously, Apple and Google are not even competitors in the enterprise IT market because they don't even have products targeted at those markets. Creating those very complex products or getting existing products up to speed for enterprise is a far more challenging task (I'm being nice, it's practically impossible) than any of the challenges that MS faces in mobile (which are fairly simple devices). It's hard for me to even express how unlikely it is for Apple/Google to break into that market in any meaningful way at this point.
    04-23-2014 09:06 PM
  2. smoledman's Avatar
    Good point... I haven't seen any stats in regard to this.

    But the strategies by Google, Apple and MS are to keep users in their fenced gardens so we can expect, as the whole concept of ecosystem is plugged more and more, people looking to stick to familiar experiences.

    As products mature they will become more seamless (within their ecosystem). This dynamic has a big advantage.

    Also, here we are bunch of tech heads, but does the average Joe seek the best product regardless of what ecosystem it belongs to?

    And what about corporate environments? Cherry picking the best solution is good in principle but can be costly.
    What happens is that people are not looking to get fenced into an ecosystem(Apple/Google) but end up that way organically over 6-12 months of usage. It's definitely quite easy to end up locked into Apple's walled-garden.
    04-23-2014 11:46 PM
  3. anony_mouse's Avatar
    Those examples don't make much sense. You are basically saying that people shouldn't take advantage of the benefits of ecosystems (specifically Microsoft) because they might lose those benefits some day if they switch to a non-ecosystem alternative. As if never having those benefits (even while all other functionality was similar) is somehow better.

    I agree that "locking" yourself into an ecosystem (or proprietary format) is a mistake, but that doesn't mean that there aren't good reasons to align with technology that uses a single ecosystem as long as that ecosystem isn't cut off from other options. An "ecosystem" doesn't necessarily lock you in to anything provided it can be accessed from the outside. It just provides a more consistent and better synchronized experience. Apple's ecosystem absolutely attempts to lock in their users with everything from lightning connectors to proprietary protocols/formats and I avoid Apple products for this reason (although I believe they make good products). However, the Microsoft ecosystem is far more open than most these days. For example, OneDrive, Office, Xbox SmartGlass can be accessed from nearly any competing device. You don't see that very often with Apple and Google is being a bit selective with their "openness" these days too.
    What benefits are there of sticking to a single 'ecosystem'? For example, if I stuck to either Google, Microsoft or Apple I wouldn't be able to get cloud storage on my Linux PC (*). So I use Dropbox. As far as I can tell, it works at least as well as the other services on all my devices. However, because WP is optimised for SkyDrive and support for other cloud storage is limited, it makes WP much less attractive to me. It would be better if Microsoft allowed a level playing field for any cloud storage service.
    Sticking with the cloud storage example, you can argue that Apple favour iCloud, but they have implemented it so badly that it actually works against them. I'm don't really understand what iCloud does for me, apart from backing up a random selection of pictures on my iPad, but in a way that I can't access from any other machine.

    (*) Actually it is possible to use Google Drive with Linux, but it's an unofficial third party solution.
    04-24-2014 05:23 AM
  4. k0de's Avatar
    The point is that entire generations (teens, twenty- and thirty-somethings) have now grown up with the perception that Google and Apple are cool and Microsoft is not. Sure, all major business and organizations use Microsoft now, but that's slowly becoming a non-truth. And who do you think will be making those type of corporate decisions in a few years? The twenty- and thirty-somethings who right now are totally invested in Apple and Google. That's what I'm concerned about.
    That is true. But that is only in theory. That transition can take decades.

    In fact I think that it is good for MSFT to have fierce competition. Iron sharpens Iron. Apple, Google, MSFT competing for the crown is good for computing. Just stick to the one the works for you. And lets see what the (3) find in years to come.

    My opinion is that MSFT will be around for long time. Have fun.
    04-24-2014 06:43 AM
  5. Markham Ranja's Avatar
    I understand your concerns about the consumer perception of MS and how that might transfer into the business world, but as someone who works in IT I can guarantee that those corporate decisions will not change any time soon. If some of those hardcore Apple/Google fans do manage to make it into a position to make corporate IT decisions and they decide to switch the company to Apple/Google, they will either be fired very quickly or they will run the company into the ground.

    Seriously, Apple and Google are not even competitors in the enterprise IT market because they don't even have products targeted at those markets. Creating those very complex products or getting existing products up to speed for enterprise is a far more challenging task (I'm being nice, it's practically impossible) than any of the challenges that MS faces in mobile (which are fairly simple devices). It's hard for me to even express how unlikely it is for Apple/Google to break into that market in any meaningful way at this point.
    Sorry - while I agree that MS is in general more suitable for enterprise, the kind of statements you make about people getting fired, etc, are simply FUD.

    Corporations like the Roche Group (85k) seats have moved to Google Apps. Many US government orgs like the GSA as well, many city administrations, the NOAA and several others. Or think about KLM and the Trump hotel chain. And of course, Google themselves seem to do quite well without MS infra.

    Every employee of every company doesn't need the full capabilities of Excel or Word. I work in corporate engineering for a large organisation (2k seats) and we only deploy Office to a small percentage of our staff (business analysts, quant analysts and a few others). The rest use Google Apps or OpenOffice and we've faced few complaints so far.
    04-24-2014 07:39 AM
  6. Markham Ranja's Avatar
    One question - if you remove enterprise-focused products and revenue from MS, what's left?
    04-24-2014 07:55 AM
  7. tgp's Avatar
    Every employee of every company doesn't need the full capabilities of Excel or Word.
    This is what I've seen. While Microsoft's services, especially Office, are undisputedly the most capable, they are also an overkill in a lot of cases. One of our potential customers described it to our salesman as "using a sledgehammer to drive in a thumbtack." It's the same with PCs. Most consumer PC users could get along fine with a Chromebook. A PC is many times more capable, but few consumers use more than a small fraction of those capabilities.

    That said, I still use my Windows PC even though I could get along fine at home with a Chromebook or tablet. I have no plans to do anything else at the present time. My wife, however, barely uses her 17" HP laptop with Windows 8.1. She instead uses her Chromebook and Moto X.
    A895 likes this.
    04-24-2014 08:00 AM
  8. dkediger's Avatar
    My corp is very much in the "not everyone needs Office" camp - really only 25% of our device base needs it. But I'm moving fully into the Office365 arena - and away from a foray into Google Apps. We have a few 3rd party interactions that require the most complex Excel workbook I have ever seen - General Motors dealer financial statements. GApps falls over flat there. We evaluated the traditional individual install of Office, but combined with everyone's need for some type of email, the AD integration, and ability to mix service levels from Exchange Online/Kiosk Mail/Full Enterprise Level O365 license its a very attractive service.

    Their device platform support is far better than any other out there.

    It makes business managers budget responsible for their Office use - it exposes the user cost rather than one humongous corporate expense that gets eaten once every 3-4 years for a Volume License.

    The Outlook.com web interface is much more "entry level" user friendly than Gmail - we were adding a desktop mail client to GMail to make it usable and efficient.

    In Short - As a corp - we've looked around, and dabbled in other platforms - but we're finding ourselves drawn back to the MotherShip. To borrow a phrase: "It Just Works...."
    Cleavitt76 likes this.
    04-24-2014 10:55 AM
  9. Cleavitt76's Avatar
    What benefits are there of sticking to a single 'ecosystem'? For example, if I stuck to either Google, Microsoft or Apple I wouldn't be able to get cloud storage on my Linux PC (*). So I use Dropbox. As far as I can tell, it works at least as well as the other services on all my devices. However, because WP is optimised for SkyDrive and support for other cloud storage is limited, it makes WP much less attractive to me. It would be better if Microsoft allowed a level playing field for any cloud storage service.
    Sticking with the cloud storage example, you can argue that Apple favour iCloud, but they have implemented it so badly that it actually works against them. I'm don't really understand what iCloud does for me, apart from backing up a random selection of pictures on my iPad, but in a way that I can't access from any other machine.

    (*) Actually it is possible to use Google Drive with Linux, but it's an unofficial third party solution.
    The benefits are more seamless integration, a more consistent experience, and little or no setup/configuration. I haven't had to configure SkyDrive/OneDrive on any device since Windows 7. It just works from the moment I log in for the first time. By itself, that is not a big deal. However, I can say that now about a lot of things thanks to the synching functionality in Windows 8.x, Windows Phone, and various MS services. Having said that, your reasoning for using Dropbox due to Linux support is perfectly valid, but it's no more valid than me going with OneDrive because Dropbox doesn't have a first party client for my Windows Phone (which I use far more than Linux). Dropbox would be my next choice if OneDrive no longer met my needs. I don't always go with the ecosystem option though. I buy my music from Amazon for example.

    I'm not saying that the ecosystem approach is always the way to go. I'm just saying that if it's a fairly open ecosystem and it meets your requirements, then it can be a good choice as there are often benefits to be had from the ecosystem itself.

    As far as Microsoft (or others) allowing deeper "ecosystem like integration" with third party services, that isn't really feasible since they don't have control over the third party service. MS can provide advanced integration of their own products and services because they can guarantee that those things will remain compatible and change together. They can't be sure of that with third party services and they can't make a "consistent experience" for products/services that they don't create themselves. They can provide APIs (they already do), but that only goes so far. APIs, by definition, are generic implementations of functionality so they don't lend themselves to the unique functionality that various services might provide.

    I totally agree with you on iCloud as an example of an ecosystem that works against you. I feel this way about most of Apple's services which is why I never really got into Apple products.

    BTW: OneDrive is also accessible in Linux via third party tools and apparently gnome 3.x has built in support now. I haven't tried it myself yet though.

    Gnome gains Microsoft SkyDrive Support | woGue

    Sorry - while I agree that MS is in general more suitable for enterprise, the kind of statements you make about people getting fired, etc, are simply FUD.

    Corporations like the Roche Group (85k) seats have moved to Google Apps. Many US government orgs like the GSA as well, many city administrations, the NOAA and several others. Or think about KLM and the Trump hotel chain. And of course, Google themselves seem to do quite well without MS infra.

    Every employee of every company doesn't need the full capabilities of Excel or Word. I work in corporate engineering for a large organisation (2k seats) and we only deploy Office to a small percentage of our staff (business analysts, quant analysts and a few others). The rest use Google Apps or OpenOffice and we've faced few complaints so far.
    True enough, but I'm not talking about just replacing one product line like Office. I'm talking about someone making the decision to replace all MS technology in a company with Apple/Google. For example, replacing all the Windows workstations with Macbooks, iPads, or Chromebooks. Replacing all of the Windows servers, Hyper-V, MSSQL servers, Active Directory, Exchange, Visual Studio, etc. with some mystery Apple/Google products that don't even currently exist. It is no exaggeration to say that it would put a lot of companies out of business if all of a sudden the only thing their employees could do is what can be done on Apple/Google products. Now if someone wants to say that Oracle, VMware, RedHat, HP, or IBM might rise up and give MS a run for it's money then I wouldn't say it's impossible (quite unlikely though). However, there is no way that Apple or Google are going to become leaders in the enterprise market just because a bunch of kids with iPods became adults and decided to change things to the brand they like. That is the topic that I was addressing.

    It's interesting to me that your company uses a mix a different office suites. If it works for you that is great, but generally in enterprise IT that kind of thing often comes with hidden costs. Instead of supporting one product the IT department is supporting 3 (and perhaps various versions of those 3). It can also lead to productivity issues when workers have to spend time dealing with document formatting issues due to incompatibilities. Anyway, if it works for your company for that product line then great, but I wouldn't consider it a sound strategy for most companies or for multiple product lines.

    One question - if you remove enterprise-focused products and revenue from MS, what's left?
    Tens of billions of dollars per year. MS is actually quite diversified.
    dkediger likes this.
    04-24-2014 11:31 AM
  10. dkediger's Avatar
    If MS is in the toilet, then its a pretty darn nice toilet to be in:
    Microsoft banks $20B in revenue, Surface pulling in $500M quarterly | Windows Phone Central

    From the Article:
    Both the consumer and enterprise business of Microsoft were up this past quarter. Devices and Consumer is up 12% to $8.3 billion.
    •Windows OEM revenue up 4%, while Windows OEM Pro revenue up 19%
    •Office 365 now accounts for 4.4 million subscribers, adding close to 1 million during the quarter
    •1.2 million Xbox One consoles sold and 0.7 million Xbox 360 consoles sold
    •Surface revenue up 50% and is close to $500 million
    •Bing search share in the U.S. is up 18.6% with advertising revenue up 38%
    •Azure revenue is up over 150%
    •Windows volume licensing grew by 11%
    •Office 365 revenue is up by over 100%
    04-24-2014 04:29 PM
  11. scdkad's Avatar
    Great posts here. Despite the somewhat dour OP MS just continues to rake it in..
    snowmutt likes this.
    04-25-2014 12:35 AM
  12. Xpider_MX's Avatar
    If MS is in the toilet, then its a pretty darn nice toilet to be in:
    Microsoft banks $20B in revenue, Surface pulling in $500M quarterly | Windows Phone Central

    From the Article:
    MS always slapping in the face of trolls XDDD
    snowmutt likes this.
    04-25-2014 01:00 AM
  13. snowmutt's Avatar
    One question - if you remove enterprise-focused products and revenue from MS, what's left?
    That's kinda like saying:

    Remove vehicle sales from Ford Motor Company, and what have you got?

    Microsoft is a historically dominate enterprise solution company. Until someone comes along and knocks them from their perch, they will continue to be. That is what the outsider doesn't understand about things like Bing. They point to it and scream: "It will NEVER catch up to Google, why do it? It is a money pit!!". Meanwhile, it is used to focus in on business needs and is in the fabric of so much of what MS does, it supports everything they do that requires data/information gathering. It is vital to their future which is still and always will be enterprise needs first.

    Do they want WP to be succesful? Do they want XBOX Music to be a huge money grab? Do they want XBOX to outsell the PS, regardless which number is behind the names? Sure.

    But do not confuse the development of these and a dozen other products with what they have to do. Until Apple screws up, the consumer market is theirs with the iPhone, iPad, and ipod. Android leads in OS sales, but not profits per unit. Apple is playing a different game. When it comes to advertisement, Google owns that money stream until they screw up. Bing is a nice money maker, but Google is in a different world.

    But, make no mistake: Enterprise, despite some gains by other companies in the past 20-30 years, still is Microsofts to lose. And they won't. They are too ingrained and are too aggressive. In 5 years, we will wonder what the big debate was during this period.
    Laura Knotek and Cleavitt76 like this.
    04-25-2014 02:54 AM
  14. rex.reyesiii's Avatar
    Until Apple screws up, the consumer market is theirs with the iPhone, iPad, and ipod
    uhm "rumor" has it iPad's sales are going down. but I think that's mostly because of Android tablets though.
    04-25-2014 03:13 AM
  15. rodan01's Avatar
    But, make no mistake: Enterprise, despite some gains by other companies in the past 20-30 years, still is Microsofts to lose. And they won't. They are too ingrained and are too aggressive. In 5 years, we will wonder what the big debate was during this period.
    Microsoft already screwed up in the Enterprise.
    1)They are irrelevant in Mobile, now you have more iOS and Android devices than Windows PC being used in the Enterprise. The long term consequence is that companies have to develop their apps in a cross platform technology, they can't use exclusive MS technologies. That opens the door to cheaper solutions for the desktop like Chromebooks and even Ubuntu. If the enterprise apps are developed in HTML5 you don't need to pay a Windows license to run those apps. This won't happen fast, It could take years, but we will see some companies adopting Chromebooks and using remote desktop for the few apps that are Windows exclusive.

    2)They bet everything in the cloud in their PaaS solution, while Amazon is all IaaS. The result: Now Azure is insignificant compared to Amazon AWS, in fact AWS is so big that if you add the next 10 competitors, AWS double them. So, as companies move to the cloud and stop buying licenses of Server products, Microsoft lose money, they are moving primarily to Amazon not Azure. Azure is growing at 150% rate, but It's so small that I think is not enough.
    Microsoft screwed up and they have recognized publicly, now they repeat like a mantra "cloud first" even thought Microsoft is irrelevant in the cloud. Not everything is lost, It's still early in that market and the MS has a big advantage in PaaS which could take off in any moment, but you can see how nervous they are.

    This quarter and a maybe the next two will be heavily distorted by the end of life of XP, I think the company is in trouble and without this effect you could see It in the revenue, the end of life of XP is hiding the problem, they also giving up in mobile a bit, they marketing spending fell drastically, that also helped to increase the margins.
    04-25-2014 06:38 AM
  16. Michael Alan Goff's Avatar
    uhm "rumor" has it iPad's sales are going down. but I think that's mostly because of Android tablets though.
    I would say it has more to do with the market starting to mature. I doubt the tablet market will stop growing for a while, but it won't have the explosive growth that it had at the start.
    Laura Knotek and rex.reyesiii like this.
    04-25-2014 09:05 AM
  17. undulose's Avatar
    Wait for some time to settle. There will be very big differences now with Satya Nadella's regime (can't you feel it)?

    Sent from my Nokia Lumia 1520 (RM-937 Malaysia) using Tapatalk
    snowmutt likes this.
    04-25-2014 09:10 AM
  18. Michael Alan Goff's Avatar
    Microsoft already screwed up in the Enterprise.
    1)They are irrelevant in Mobile, now you have more iOS and Android devices than Windows PC being used in the Enterprise. The long term consequence is that companies have to develop their apps in a cross platform technology, they can't use exclusive MS technologies. That opens the door to cheaper solutions for the desktop like Chromebooks and even Ubuntu. If the enterprise apps are developed in HTML5 you don't need to pay a Windows license to run those apps. This won't happen fast, It could take years, but we will see some companies adopting Chromebooks and using remote desktop for the few apps that are Windows exclusive.

    2)They bet everything in the cloud in their PaaS solution, while Amazon is all IaaS. The result: Now Azure is insignificant compared to Amazon AWS, in fact AWS is so big that if you add the next 10 competitors, AWS double them. So, as companies move to the cloud and stop buying licenses of Server products, Microsoft lose money, they are moving primarily to Amazon not Azure. Azure is growing at 150% rate, but It's so small that I think is not enough.
    Microsoft screwed up and they have recognized publicly, now they repeat like a mantra "cloud first" even thought Microsoft is irrelevant in the cloud. Not everything is lost, It's still early in that market and the MS has a big advantage in PaaS which could take off in any moment, but you can see how nervous they are.

    This quarter and a maybe the next two will be heavily distorted by the end of life of XP, I think the company is in trouble and without this effect you could see It in the revenue, the end of life of XP is hiding the problem, they also giving up in mobile a bit, they marketing spending fell drastically, that also helped to increase the margins.
    No, they haven't screwed up enterprise. They're still a major player in enterprise. One good example is that O365 subscriptions are up. Azure is still a big name. It isn't number one, but that doesn't make it a failure. I don't know how you're coming up with these things you're saying.

    This just sounds like you started with the idea that Microsoft was in trouble and went to move the facts to try to make it seem like that.
    Cleavitt76 likes this.
    04-25-2014 09:14 AM
  19. Grant Hildyard's Avatar
    Phones
    The iPhone did not catch on until us tech heads saw the advantages of them over standard phones at the time. When the average consumer started to see IT guys using these phones, they asked our advice and the iPhone caught on. Same happened to Android, techies started using them as they were more configurable than iPhone and now look at the market share.
    One thing I have noticed is a lot of techies are starting to use Lumia's and that will filter down to the general public over time. And especially now that Windows Phone is now free, it will be cheaper for manufacturers to create Windows Phones instead of Android handsets.. Androids still cost licencing fees per handset for most manufacturers, so I see a large shift coming.

    Tablets
    Windows free under 9", 18 months I see a massive market share gain for Microsoft and anyone I know who has a surface have glowed about them, and people comment on mine all the time. Comments here regarding Microsoft being patient are spot on, Apple is losing market share hand over fist even though still making massive profits, but sooner or later they will get called out on their products as the competition are outpacing them technology wise and on price. Just give it a little bit more time.

    Xbox
    The PS4 might well win this generation, but MS can improve the situation with constant upgrades to the Xbone OS and they have a ****load on consoles ruling the loungeroom with universal apps and tv integration. But they need to seriously speed there cadence for updates up.

    Enterprise
    Cant be beaten

    BING
    Last I read they have like 20% of the search market and have increased their ad revenue and it is not running as a massive loss anymore. This can seriously dent google in the future, if Bing can pick up more market share and more advertising, it is effectively eating google alive from the insides. That's googles main revenue stream.

    What do I want to see?
    I want Satya to get aggressive. Google and Apple have effectively been carving their massive amounts of cash from the carcass of MSFT. iTunes on PC and Google through Windows search. Google wont write apps and block msft from writing apps for windows phone! OK. lock google out of MSFT store, lets have that walled garden.

    What will be the saving grace of MSFT?
    Cortana everywhere, Xbox, PC, Tablet and Phone
    Universal Apps (write once, run Xbox, Tablet, Phone & PC)
    And stop the US Centric release of everything. MSFT have more marketshare outside of the US than they do at home, concentrate on that a bit more.
    04-25-2014 10:30 AM
  20. Vistary's Avatar
    Microsoft is the LARGEST software company, how come they need to recover?
    04-25-2014 10:40 AM
  21. dkediger's Avatar
    Microsoft already screwed up in the Enterprise.
    1)..... now you have more iOS and Android devices than Windows PC being used in the Enterprise. ......
    Say again? Besides personal devices (of which we don't do BYOD) I have 1% of my device base IOS/OSx, and 0.0% Android/Chrome. The last Apple purchase was a MBP for one of our owners about 6 months ago, with none planned in the next 3-6 months either. The iPads we do have were an OEM initiative that has largely been idle - they sit in desk drawers.

    Anecdotes, taken individually, I know are not data, but I have seen no penetration of IOS/OSx/Android/Chrome in meaningful capacities in the environments of my, or my peers, networks. If anything, it has declined over the last 18 months to two years as initiatives to use them just withered away.
    Cleavitt76 and snowmutt like this.
    04-25-2014 11:02 AM
  22. Cleavitt76's Avatar
    The enterprise environment I work in has similar device percentages to what dkediger describes. Except the iOS/OSx values are well under 1%. The dozen or so iPads that the company purchased are all but unused these days. It was kind of an experiment to see how they could be used in our workflows and to reference when supporting user's personal devices. They were pretty much useless in our workflows so all that is left is to use them to support user's personal devices.

    As far as the user's personal devices, they can be used to connect to some of our systems. However, they accomplish that by connecting to a virtual desktop infrastructure (VDI). The VDI systems cost hundreds of thousands of dollars and the OS on the virtual desktop that they are connecting to is Windows (which must be licensed). The user's personal device is basically just being used as a dumb terminal. So in our line of business, an iPad/Android tablet + a Windows desktop OS license + a percentage of a VDI infrastructure's hardware, host OS, etc. allow a user to do what a Windows 8 tablet can do natively for less than $500 (Dell Venue Pro for example). The cost for the iPad/VDI route is easily $2000 per user and probably quite a bit more. That is probably why we are only deploying it on a fairly limited basis. I'm not even factoring in the additional cost of supporting a system as complicated as VDI or things like SAN space and fiber channel switches/NICs for the clustered storage used by a typical VDI.

    The point is that most companies would significantly increase their costs by switching to iPads/Macs/Android and it's not just because "apps would need to be rewritten in HTML5" (a monumental task by itself). It's also because those other systems lack even the basic tools/configuration required by an IT department to keep things monitored, working, and upgraded.
    snowmutt likes this.
    04-25-2014 02:18 PM
  23. rodan01's Avatar
    Companies move slow, but aren't in a bubble, they won't be 20 years locked in a technology while the consumer market moves away and tech change completely. Even more now that computing is becoming ubiquitous and tech improve faster than ever. The consumer market is becoming several times bigger than the enterprise market and will drive the innovation, enterprise will have to adapt to this changes.

    If a company adopts BYOD, you automatically get the same number of devices in other platforms than in Windows. Not only communication devices, devices that you could use to increase productivity, develop internal software for them, or adopt third party software.
    If Windows keep declining in the consumer market, not only in mobile where is nonexistent, but also in the desktop as the Mac, Chromebooks and Linux are slowly taking market share, people will ask to access resources with all those devices, because as an employee you don't want to carry a PC and Mac, a Windows tablet and iPad, a BlackBerry and an iPhone, a wearable a vs b, just because your employer doesn't want to adopt new tech. So, BYOD is really hard to stop.

    A solution is virtualization, which is not a good user experience and impacts productivity, and as you said It's expensive, I would said artificially expensive because the cost of Microsoft licenses. But this cost is another big incentive to adopt cross platform technologies in new projects and Microsoft will be forced to reduce it over time.

    My point is, the seed that initiates the process of creating a multi-platform environment in the enterprise is already sowed and the process can't be stopped. There are economic incentives that move in that direction, there also a lot of problems to solve, for example the productivity of cross platform development tools the manageability of devices, security, but those problems will be solved.
    04-25-2014 08:50 PM
  24. dkediger's Avatar
    Sure, the seed has been sowed, but I've been in this business a long, long time and have seen many other similar seeds sowed and fail to bloom. Desktop Linux? That doesn't mean BYOD is doomed, but not all aspects have been fully exposed and worked through yet. It's going to be a long, tough road to overcome data security without resorting to virtualization, and its attendant costs.

    In my industry, the mobile apps just aren't there, and aren't coming in the foreseeable future. At best, our vendor partners are going the HTML5 route, and we sit on advisory panels for most of them so we know. They are very cognizant themselves of avoiding ecosystem lock in on the development side becoming a competitive disadvantage.

    I'm all for getting the right device in front of my people, but more important is a proper workflow. It's just not there yet, and looks to be several dev cycles away.

    Ironically enough, the nearest "universal" app out there is what, Office? You have traditional standalone, O365, Online, and Chrome webapp. But our work is more than Excel and email. We've tried to place a few tablets with people, but no one really wants them to "work" on.

    I think there is a real argument that Microsoft offers the most compelling, viable, and comprehensive vision right now.
    Last edited by dkediger; 04-25-2014 at 10:41 PM.
    snowmutt and ajj3085 like this.
    04-25-2014 10:24 PM
  25. smoledman's Avatar
    Companies move slow, but aren't in a bubble, they won't be 20 years locked in a technology while the consumer market moves away and tech change completely. Even more now that computing is becoming ubiquitous and tech improve faster than ever. The consumer market is becoming several times bigger than the enterprise market and will drive the innovation, enterprise will have to adapt to this changes.
    BOYD has nothing to do with enterprise decisions companies will make. iPhones have to be able to talk to MS Exchange server. Nothing changes. Is Apple going to write the back-end too?
    dkediger likes this.
    04-26-2014 12:44 AM
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