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06-10-2014 11:24 PM
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  1. A895's Avatar
    Hold up some quick searches actually support your argument.

    38-50% of smartphone users play games. Ouch. I'll post the links

    http://www.iacquire.com/blog/smartph...tivities-study

    http://www.insidemobileapps.com/2013...playing-games/

    Ouch. I thought most people didn't play games.

    Learn something new everyday.
    Yeah a good number of smarptohne users use their smartphone mainly for games. I was the same way in high school hut now I am in college I use it for web browsing, emails, calendar and checking news and forums. I do play Badlands here and there too.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-28-2014 11:12 AM
  2. Mellifluous's Avatar
    The major problem with Windows Phone is that 1) phone shops don't push them and b) people don't have the opportunity to try them and see how fluid and user friendly they are.

    Microsoft need to develop a strategy that results in knowledgeable sales people who have the ability to give WP as much attention as Android and iOS. Not necessarily push the product but just know the advantages and disadvantages and know that despite the app gap, that there are plenty of apps available.

    They also need to create events that get people hyped about the product as well as allow them to experience the OS. E.g. they could have an event in a city like London which allows hands on experience. They could use special phones which allow people to set up their accounts on them and see for themselves how integrated the phones are, which are easily reset-able for the next person to use. They could also have a giveaway of lots of handsets to a number of people who use the phones to complete some actions, like taking a creative selfie and sharing it on Twitter/Facebook/Instagram etc with the phone, using various apps etc. Basically they need to create an experience like Apple when people queue overnight to buy the new iPhone. Excitement. Interest. Curiosity. Desire.
    05-28-2014 12:05 PM
  3. TechFreak1's Avatar
    They really need to get agressive, I have yet to see a windows phone advert on tv - probably saw a handful compared to ipad, iphone, galaxy and htc one m8 adverts. Sure you can offer to incentives to sales men and women, but people being people will always have a bias towards their own preference. You can spot this behavior a mile away from the way the vocal tones and body language changes.

    Furthermore MS needs to have reps that make occassional visits to key places i.e Westfields in Stratford city to make sure the stores are giving WP a fair game - I have seen so many "dead" windows phones not set up properly, plugged into faulty charges, turned off and no way to turn it on as the power button is covered by the locking mechanism - All this is used by sales rep to further their egoistic bias.

    This is not isolated to windows phones either but surface's as well, I went to try a surface 2 at Currys' in Mile End and it was turned off. I asked the rep why wasn't it turned on - her reply was because these devices are crap and just short out unlike the ipad gleefully . A bit annoyed I walked further down the store and I asked another rep, he came fumbled around, then gave up and asked if i would like to look at other tablets. I asked (again) out of curiosity what the problem was and he said its probably the battery, when I said why not replace it with a working unit and he said it was the only display model in stock..

    Maybe it's just me and I just some how automagically trigger the sales rep's confirmation bias where as others may have a better experience lol...
    05-28-2014 02:02 PM
  4. A895's Avatar
    They really need to get agressive, I have yet to see a windows phone advert on tv - probably saw a handful compared to ipad, iphone, galaxy and htc one m8 adverts. Sure you can offer to incentives to sales men and women, but people being people will always have a bias towards their own preference. You can spot this behavior a mile away from the way the vocal tones and body language changes.

    Furthermore MS needs to have reps that make occassional visits to key places i.e Westfields in Stratford city to make sure the stores are giving WP a fair game - I have seen so many "dead" windows phones not set up properly, plugged into faulty charges, turned off and no way to turn it on as the power button is covered by the locking mechanism - All this is used by sales rep to further their egoistic bias.

    This is not isolated to windows phones either but surface's as well, I went to try a surface 2 at Currys' in Mile End and it was turned off. I asked the rep why wasn't it turned on - her reply was because these devices are crap and just short out unlike the ipad gleefully . A bit annoyed I walked further down the store and I asked another rep, he came fumbled around, then gave up and asked if i would like to look at other tablets. I asked (again) out of curiosity what the problem was and he said its probably the battery, when I said why not replace it with a working unit and he said it was the only display model in stock..

    Maybe it's just me and I just some how automagically trigger the sales rep's confirmation bias where as others may have a better experience lol...
    What can you do? If you have the product, then enjoy it but if other people are missing out because of their biases let them be. We can't make people spend money on anything. They have to convince themselves that they want to get it first.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    FinancialP likes this.
    05-28-2014 02:07 PM
  5. HAMEDACC's Avatar
    I think MS should stop making that kind of advertising who competes other OS(s)
    WP is great but he is still a child who should wait to be mature to compete his uncle.
    "Revenge is a dish best served Cold"
    05-28-2014 03:56 PM
  6. AngrySprintUser's Avatar
    It's not about marketing at this point any more. I know that's contrary to popular belief around here, but people know what windows phone is now.

    The problem is people just don't want them. No marketing can change that.

    It's a conundrum. How can you make people want what they don't want?
    I disagree, majority of it is all hearsay.
    05-28-2014 05:00 PM
  7. AngrySprintUser's Avatar
    I think MS started off pretty well with their ads, "The Wedding" and "The Recital" going after iPhone and Android user's fanboyisms. Even the users of those OS' kind of had to tip their caps and acknowledge that it does get that crazy. Then they started advertising about their amazing cameras.

    The thing is, none of their ads really talk about the OS itself. You don't see anything advertising about the advantages of having WP. You can make fun of the competitors as much as you want but eventually you're going to have to show what you're offering. You're going to have to explain why someone would want WP, which I think Apple does a very good job of in their ads that sometimes have no dialogue at all, just people using their iphones in different situations. That's my $0.02 on it.
    A895 likes this.
    05-28-2014 05:14 PM
  8. Guytronic's Avatar
    What Kind of Marketing Strategy Does WP Need?
    Mmmm...
    I'll say none as far as popular media.

    My instincts indicate MSFT just may go on as a total entity meaning:
    Waiting for the FCC to push harder for the allowance of unlocked/global devices to be sold and used on existing carrier networks (US).
    More Microsoft owned and controlled retail locations.
    Firming up and driving discount sales through large on-line retailers.
    Working with entities outside of the usual suspects (Verizon-T-Mo\Metro-AT&T-Sprint) for data/call services.

    I think companies such as Xfinity, Amazon etc... are just chomping at the bit to start selling nationwide wireless network services to smart device users.
    T-Mobile\Metro may even be the first provider to fall and cut a deal with other massive media providers to open this market up...who knows.

    In any case if I was Microsoft this is what I'd do.
    Of course there are probably way too many FTC or other governmental roadblocks for anything consumer friendly to happen.

    *Disclaimer
    Just conjecture of course my views are mine and completely unfounded.
    05-28-2014 05:28 PM
  9. Citizen X's Avatar
    The major problem with Windows Phone is that 1) phone shops don't push them and b) people don't have the opportunity to try them and see how fluid and user friendly they are.

    Microsoft need to develop a strategy that results in knowledgeable sales people who have the ability to give WP as much attention as Android and iOS. Not necessarily push the product but just know the advantages and disadvantages and know that despite the app gap, that there are plenty of apps available.
    I agree. For much of Windows Phone's history it was relegated to a dark back corner of at&t stores. They've definitely improved it's positioning in stores but the sales effort is abysmal. No one sells these phones. MSFT and Nokia need to do secret shopper routines in US retail stores and see just how bad the sales effort is.

    Personally I am kind of glad Windows Phone didn't get pushed till now. Now that I have a Lumia 1520 32 GB in my hands I think Windows Phone is ready for prime time. This thing is so much better than an iphone. The only issue now is the app gap. And the app gap is not as bad as some people make it out to be. There is a group of people that don't use that many apps and Windows Phone 8.1 is good for them. Once we get a bigger user base then we will start to get all the niche apps such as regional banks and epocrates.
    05-28-2014 07:02 PM
  10. Jordan Laureano1's Avatar
    [LIST=1]
    How does Microsoft need to go about improving their marketing strategy? Is it a bad strategy? Is there one at all?
    For me, i think it will be awesome if windows phone central apps is preinstalled to all windows phone .. Just like some apps which comes pre installed in phones.. For my experience, your updated news from windows phone are a helpful tool it keeps me updated all times.. So hope it comes pre installed so users or new users will be aware of your site almost always.. Love reading your articles
    05-28-2014 07:45 PM
  11. Citizen X's Avatar
    For me, i think it will be awesome if windows phone central apps is preinstalled to all windows phone .. Just like some apps which comes pre installed in phones.. For my experience, your updated news from windows phone are a helpful tool it keeps me updated all times..
    The problem is the forum is full of people saying Windows Phone sucks or is broken so that won't help the perception side of things very much. I was merrily using whats app on my Lumia 1520 with WP 8.1 installed and I had to come here to learn it shouldn't be working and I should be upset and get an iphone.
    James8561 likes this.
    05-28-2014 08:12 PM
  12. Muralidhar Parimi's Avatar
    It should be like this.!

    If Microsoft is working on some major apps to bring it windows phone OS then they should not inform the same thing to us early... (like BBM coming soon Cortana coming soon to other country's Etc....) because I'd they said the same thing people are expecting it very soon... For some reason if Microsoft delayed that then every body will think that Microsoft is getting delayed on everything... They will go back to "Dabba Android". They don't the value of our perfect Windows Phone OS. ( I mean no other OS will give these many of updates and older version phones also can update to new version of is.. At-least a half they can update. I mean 7.5 to 7.8 & 8.0 to 8.1 dies anybody gives like this.) ?
    05-28-2014 08:22 PM
  13. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    How does Microsoft need to go about improving their marketing strategy? Is it a bad strategy? Is there one at all?
    I think marketing aside their devices are lacking core functions and good apps (This last is slowly changing) and are not ready for certain market segments, especially on the high end. So even pushing on marketing with hoards of people flocking to buy their devices, many would end up unhappy past the "tile enthusiasm" moment. Apart from this, they are slow in fixing things; there is a underlying bad attitude that makes some users (even those who, like me, have been MSFT aficionados for decades, including mice and other peripherals) leave in disgust. They really need to rethink the way all this is working and beef up the OS and the lacking functionalities.
    A895 likes this.
    05-28-2014 08:31 PM
  14. Citizen X's Avatar
    I think marketing aside their devices are lacking core functions and good apps (This last is slowly changing) and are not ready for certain market segments, especially on the high end. So even pushing on marketing with hoards of people flocking to buy their devices, many would end up unhappy past the "tile enthusiasm" moment. Apart from this, they are slow in fixing things; there is a underlying bad attitude that makes some users (even those who, like me, have been MSFT aficionados for decades, including mice and other peripherals) leave in disgust. They really need to rethink the way all this is working and beef up the OS and the lacking functionalities.
    Do you have any concrete substantial examples to back any of those vague statements?!

    I think if you look at the objective reviews of the Lumia 1520's camera you would see it goes toe to toe with many "high end" phones. By which I mean it is BETTER than just about all of them. Also I haven't seen a single 6" phone put out by anyone with the gorgeous build quality of the Lumia 1520. I also don't see anyone with a track record of putting out phones with built in GPS with downloadable maps for the entire planet.

    I use HERE Drive, Maps, and Transit all the time. I totally agree there is an app gap. There is no epcrates and no app for my regional bank. There are a lot of niche apps missing. But as far as functionality my girlfriend has to either pay through the nose for apps to do what my 1520 does right out of the box or she is simply SOL if she wants a bigger screen on an iphone or more control of her camera. I remeber my old Lumia 900 even had LTE way before she had an iphone with LTE. I was like all those apps are great but if your internet is moving at a snail's pace what good are they? Windows Phone gets no respect. HERE Drive and transit are incredibly useful apps. They are far more useful to me for business and pleasure than a billion social media apps.

    It is astonishing to me that when the Lumia 900 was launched they didn't say FREE GLOBAL DOWNLOADABLE MAPS OFFLINE GPS and LTE. On road trips my phone was so much more useful than my girlfriend's. I loved watching streaming movies on the highway while she just looked sad.
    05-28-2014 11:29 PM
  15. James8561's Avatar
    ^yea I agree they need to feature the phone more. especially tangibly useful features such as offline maps, live tiles, speed and smoothness, and build quality. Not many vendors talk about build quality these days as they expect people to use cases. I and many other hate cases so Lumias are best.
    Also, stop being so mean to your girlfriend LOL! what does she have? I'm guessing android?
    05-28-2014 11:41 PM
  16. Boris Alexandrov's Avatar
    It's not about marketing at this point any more. I know that's contrary to popular belief around here, but people know what windows phone is now.

    The problem is people just don't want them. No marketing can change that.

    It's a conundrum. How can you make people want what they don't want?
    Consumer trackings? Any other proof?

    Before I bought Lumia 99% of my friends never heard of WP before. Moreover, most of them actually thought Nokia runs on Android.

    Then I started marketing Lumia amongst them, and damn people had no idea what WP is and expected the platform to be luggy and slow without having key apps such as WhatsApp, Instagram and Pinterest.

    Its not about games and the lack of desire. Its about lacking basic knowledge and trial of WP, combined with high loyality rates on the smartphone market.
    05-29-2014 01:12 AM
  17. kc77's Avatar
    I think they need to compete with Samsung and Apple directly in the flagship phone market by developing a brand name phone and consistently updating it. This business that Nokia had with a plethora of models identified by numbers was confusing to say the least. Create a true flagship, give it a name (not a number), make it available on all carriers, and market it aggressively. Microsoft needs to build brand recognition for Windows Phone. Even if most don't buy the flagship, its existence and the brand recognition it creates have an effect on their buying decision.
    Agreed! I would love to see a Surface phone or an Xbox phone come out. I think an Xbox phone would sell like hotcakes if they could offer some special incentives on Xbox live for buying the phone. Offer some free weapon DLC on Halo or something to people who buy the phone to give them a strong advantage over people who dont buy it. Sometimes you just need to play dirty ;)
    05-29-2014 01:38 AM
  18. A895's Avatar
    Agreed! I would love to see a Surface phone or an Xbox phone come out. I think an Xbox phone would sell like hotcakes if they could offer some special incentives on Xbox live for buying the phone. Offer some free weapon DLC on Halo or something to people who buy the phone to give them a strong advantage over people who dont buy it. Sometimes you just need to play dirty ;)
    Doubtful they would do that. Microsoft has a problem doing obvious moves.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-29-2014 05:48 AM
  19. EC Translating Services's Avatar
    Do you have any concrete substantial examples to back any of those vague statements?!

    I think if you look at the objective reviews of the Lumia 1520's camera you would see it goes toe to toe with many "high end" phones. By which I mean it is BETTER than just about all of them. Also I haven't seen a single 6" phone put out by anyone with the gorgeous build quality of the Lumia 1520. I also don't see anyone with a track record of putting out phones with built in GPS with downloadable maps for the entire planet.

    I use HERE Drive, Maps, and Transit all the time. I totally agree there is an app gap. There is no epcrates and no app for my regional bank. There are a lot of niche apps missing. But as far as functionality my girlfriend has to either pay through the nose for apps to do what my 1520 does right out of the box or she is simply SOL if she wants a bigger screen on an iphone or more control of her camera. I remeber my old Lumia 900 even had LTE way before she had an iphone with LTE. I was like all those apps are great but if your internet is moving at a snail's pace what good are they? Windows Phone gets no respect. HERE Drive and transit are incredibly useful apps. They are far more useful to me for business and pleasure than a billion social media apps.

    It is astonishing to me that when the Lumia 900 was launched they didn't say FREE GLOBAL DOWNLOADABLE MAPS OFFLINE GPS and LTE. On road trips my phone was so much more useful than my girlfriend's. I loved watching streaming movies on the highway while she just looked sad.
    I have mentioned this endless times in this very website but if you insist and have so many doubts i feel myself compelled to let you know that:
    - Lacks keyboard inputs for some languages
    - There isn't one single app able to allow you to aggregate your mails in one single app. You can do in a way that is not suitable for work and without differentiation between mailboxes in the same way Android allows you to do with third party apps (like K9, which allows for different colors, different sounds, different led colours...oh forgot...WP don't have leds so you need SOUND also where in theory you wouldn't need..or at best vibration)
    - Microsoft OFFICE won't open password protected files. Only in 8.1 allows you to open files from SD. In 8 it wouldn't allow you
    - File management, plainly sucks (there isn't any other technical description for the level of mediocrity it offers)
    - Multitasking sucks, too. There is no way to split screen and do two things at the same time. 6" inches wasted in a 1520 (which incidentally i own).
    - TILES: You have 3 rows; you can't extend tiles for 3 rows; you can't resize tiles at your will; tiles are more than icons, less than widgets. They are rotating pics with limited interaction.
    - IE 11: Doesn't share with Pocket, Instapaper, doesn't have https out of the box, doesn't haev ad blocking, script blocking, (unlike Firefox mobile). It behaves funny in many situations. I am using Surfy and Maxthon.
    - No encryption at all. No security apart the password
    - MAPS: Maybe they work for you. They don't for me in Asia. A) they lack a lot of POIs Google offers; public transit in GMAPS are clickable, a list of buses shows up and you can plan a trip. BING Maps not only don't have clickable public transports but they even miss some metro lines or stops. They miss tons of places.
    - Bing Translator is designed by Mr Bean. It offers Chinese translation but doesn't offer romanized translation of characters. This means that if you're looking forward to understand something or read something it's utterly useless. This worsens as apparently Microsoft only supports Simplified Chinese and forgot Taiwan, Hong Kong and a few hundred millions of users who don't use simplified Chinese but Traditional. However, they came up with Cortana, which in US-Centric websites is the best thing, while in other regions is a no-go a priori due to privacy issues. The life of Cortana for many users doesn't go beyond one week of tests then ends up deactivated (Like Google Now). Microsoft doesn't seem to understand a huge share of users.
    - Bing News: gives you the news it wants. Won't allow you to choose your owns. Also it's region depending. The antithesis of usefulness if you keep 170/ 200 RSS on check, in multiple languages.
    - Apps/Market: 90% of apps are bad copies of the originals, often badly implemented and even have a price tag on it. So what comes for free on Android comes paid on WP with subpar quality. Calendars, note taking apps, News aggregators (i have bought 3, tested them all. The only one worth mentioning is Next Reader which is a very good app, in recent times)
    - Notification centre: Android offers a scrollable one with much more than 4/5 icons...those icons can be moved around as you wish without need to enter a menu.
    - Lack of a lot of apps: I miss good translating/language apps (Pleco, Hanping, Dictionaries of various type, not even CE DICT is available).
    - Sharing functions: In Android every app has a long list of apps you can share of apps you can share from any other app. This includes tons of third party apps. I click on a pic to share, and i am offered FB, Twitter (which i don't use), then Line, IM+, IMO, Mail etc. WP offers you two peanuts at best. So what i need to do, often is copy paste on word or one note and save stuff in that way. THEN, share it with other apps. That's how good WP is for sharing. Again, MR Bean at work.

    Photocamera? Yes it's good, the best of them all..but with 700 euros (the cost of the phone unlocked ) i buy a good DSLR.
    Screen: It's the best of them all for me. However due to OS limitations all that real estate is under exploited
    You can download those maps: However they are unreliable and inaccurate. that makes them useless. Wait for Microsoft to admit it.

    I need my phone to work, not to take pictures. To work i need interoperability between apps, i need good apps (which i pay for); i need integrated solutions on a solid platform and i need encryption. WP has none of all this.

    Are my statements less vague? Do i need to go on?

    The OS is mediocre. Simple as that. It's not a matter of marketing. You can market something that's good and people don't understand. WP is only partly misunderstood. The rest is due to A) its shortcomings and B) Microsoft slowliness in tackling them.
    You and I can spend the whole life arguing but while you seem satisfied, i am deeply frustrated. Checking at the sales, i am not alone.
    A895 likes this.
    05-29-2014 05:49 AM
  20. FinancialP's Avatar
    Consumer trackings? Any other proof?

    Before I bought Lumia 99% of my friends never heard of WP before. Moreover, most of them actually thought Nokia runs on Android.

    Then I started marketing Lumia amongst them, and damn people had no idea what WP is and expected the platform to be luggy and slow without having key apps such as WhatsApp, Instagram and Pinterest.

    Its not about games and the lack of desire. Its about lacking basic knowledge and trial of WP, combined with high loyality rates on the smartphone market.
    Sure it is. Sure.

    Let's let the carriers, and Microsoft/Nokia continue to pour millions into marketing and we continue to say people don't know about Windows Phone.

    Let's continue to say it's not about games and apps.

    Let's continue to say these things.
    A895 likes this.
    05-29-2014 07:54 AM
  21. Jazmac's Avatar
    Microsoft should go back marketing in the same manor they did when they pushed the OS and Office back in the day. For some strange reason, MS decided that in order to attract attention it needed to be loud colors, ridiculous choreographed dance numbers with the Surface promotion and such. Even as much as I like Cortana it receives more attention than it deserves. Especially being a very untested utility. Microsoft would do well to calm the GenX level pyrotechnics in its adverts and get a lot more smooth, grownup and direct. In fact, I think the phone division might be better served if it was split off from the company at large so it can find its place.
    Guytronic and b23h like this.
    05-29-2014 10:03 AM
  22. radmanvr's Avatar
    Commercials with monkeys flying a space ship while shooting lasers using Windows Phone as a control panel
    Guytronic likes this.
    05-29-2014 10:38 AM
  23. Ten Four's Avatar
    First I would say to make Windows Phones more widely available on lots of different carriers, including MVNOs. Companies like Straight Talk sell lots of phones at WalMart. The more phones out there the more people will see them. Second, I would go for advertising targeting the young and geeky market. Most phone ads seem to try to be everything to everyone, and feature lots of feel good shots of families, kids, and get togethers. How about ads featuring gamers and geeks? Target a segment of the market and hit it hard with marketing. Get a toehold there before trying to sell to everyone, everywhere, but meanwhile actually make the phones available with my point one. There are lots of old fogies, like me, who want to be more tech saavy and want to buy things that are young and cool, even if we are not. Nobody wants to be grandpa at the wedding taking photos. Have a mountain climber taking photos, or a skier, or an adventurer. Somebody hiking through the jungles of the Amazon documenting their travels with a phone and staying in touch with the world too (if there's a cell signal there).
    05-29-2014 10:58 AM
  24. radmanvr's Avatar
    - Bing Translator is designed by Mr Bean. It offers Chinese translation but doesn't offer romanized translation of characters. This means that if you're looking forward to understand something or read something it's utterly useless. This worsens as apparently Microsoft only supports Simplified Chinese and forgot Taiwan, Hong Kong and a few hundred millions of users who don't use simplified Chinese but Traditional. However, they came up with Cortana, which in US-Centric websites is the best thing, while in other regions is a no-go a priori due to privacy issues. The life of Cortana for many users doesn't go beyond one week of tests then ends up deactivated (Like Google Now). Microsoft doesn't seem to understand a huge share of users.
    .
    I read your thought out well put together piece and then realized you made a mistake so I did not read the rest because no more credibility

    Traditional Chinese is support on Bing translate
    Last edited by radmanvr; 05-29-2014 at 11:47 AM.
    05-29-2014 11:05 AM
  25. A895's Avatar
    First I would say to make Windows Phones more widely available on lots of different carriers, including MVNOs. Companies like Straight Talk sell lots of phones at WalMart. The more phones out there the more people will see them. Second, I would go for advertising targeting the young and geeky market. Most phone ads seem to try to be everything to everyone, and feature lots of feel good shots of families, kids, and get togethers. How about ads featuring gamers and geeks? Target a segment of the market and hit it hard with marketing. Get a toehold there before trying to sell to everyone, everywhere, but meanwhile actually make the phones available with my point one. There are lots of old fogies, like me, who want to be more tech saavy and want to buy things that are young and cool, even if we are not. Nobody wants to be grandpa at the wedding taking photos. Have a mountain climber taking photos, or a skier, or an adventurer. Somebody hiking through the jungles of the Amazon documenting their travels with a phone and staying in touch with the world too (if there's a cell signal there).
    Geeks are a minority and then being your makes the market even smaller. I think they should market towards the younger crowd though but they need to out a new low end WP first. The 520 is a little long in the tooth.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-29-2014 11:41 AM
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