07-01-2014 01:13 PM
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  1. anony_mouse's Avatar
    I already pay for my internet, I block every single ad I can - if a site can't cope without ads, shutdown the site
    Remind me - how much is the subscription to use this website?
    Chregu and Reflexx like this.
    06-24-2014 08:23 AM
  2. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Remind me - how much is the subscription to use this website?
    Remind me again, what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Using AdBlock is nowhere near the same as piracy. No more than ripping the tag off my underwear.


    Sent from my iPhone using WPCentral Forums
    06-24-2014 08:45 AM
  3. Chregu's Avatar
    Remind me again, what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Using AdBlock is nowhere near the same as piracy. No more than ripping the tag off my underwear.
    Well, good to know.

    I think Google would disagree though:

    How much damage can two blokes in Cologne do to Google? “We have probably cost them billions, yes,” says Till Faida. How many billion, I ask. Three, four, five? “It could be five billion dollars” says Faida. He’s not sure.
    Meet the most destructive force on the internet | Features | LondonlovesBusiness.com
    06-24-2014 08:48 AM
  4. anony_mouse's Avatar
    Remind me again, what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Using AdBlock is nowhere near the same as piracy. No more than ripping the tag off my underwear.
    I didn't say it was, although it's certainly an interesting question to discuss. I was just curious how you think this site is funded, and whether you think users have any moral or ethical obligation to co-operate with its monitisation activities. If they don't, couldn't a case be made that they are freeloading?

    On a side note, your analogy about using AdBlock being like ripping the tag off your underwear is rather curious. Obviously I don't know anything about your lifestyle and I'm certainly not judging you, but how many people see the tag on your underwear in a typical month? Is the viewing of this tag your main source of income?

    Anyway, here's a strategy for people who don't like advertising but recognise that journalists on these sites need to eat, and servers need to be paid for. Only click on adverts for companies you don't like. That way, the company you don't like will pay click-through fees to the website that interests you, but the money is wasted because you won't buy any product from that company. It's a win-win! (Except for me, of course, as I won't do this because of my worry about ad-sites being fronts for malware distribution, and because I find it hard to have strong differentials of opinion between commercial operations).
    Chregu likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:01 AM
  5. fatclue_98's Avatar
    ^ Very simple, I already pay for my ISP. How Mobile Nations conducts their business is no business of mine. As for my undies, I just developed that habit very young in life when many ladies saw what brand I wore. Didn't make any money from it but the fringe benefits were awesome.
    Sent from my Ativ S Neo using Tapatalk
    06-24-2014 09:07 AM
  6. anony_mouse's Avatar
    ^ Very simple, I already pay for my ISP. How Mobile Nations conducts their business is no business of mine. As for my undies, I just developed that habit very young in life when many ladies saw what brand I wore. Didn't make any money from it but the fringe benefits were awesome.
    As you may or may not be aware, your ISP does not pay the owners of this website for their content. It's the same as taking the tram into town. You will pay for a tram ticket, but none of your fare goes to the shops in town so you still have to pay for any squirrel clamps, sprout holders or other gizmos you want to take home. Your ISP subscription also doesn't pay for Netflix or Amazon. So perhaps you could elaborate further?

    And do you find that ladies have any interest in your choice of underwear brand? Is the brand you choose somehow embarrassing? I'm genuinely curious.
    Chregu and Reflexx like this.
    06-24-2014 09:15 AM
  7. MDMcAtee's Avatar
    What cracks me up here is that people who choose to pirate software,knowingly use pirated software,think it's perfectly fine to do so,then they take umbrage when folks like myself point out that it is theft when they do this.

    Others here apparently don't know the difference between stealing and exercising their rights in blocking adds in their phones and continue to try to cloud the subject of hand.

    Tell you what....let's ask the management here what their take on this issue is,and see what they say about it..
    06-24-2014 09:18 AM
  8. Citizen X's Avatar
    BataBole,

    Great thread! I hope the mods don't shut it down.

    As someone else stated I think technically piracy is illegal everywhere except Somalia or similar failed states. There are probably two dynamics at work. One the Government in your country has other priorities other than protecting the coffers of multibillion dollar foreign corporations and those corporations have other fish to fry.

    I live in the United States and I have to strongly disagree with the ludicrous statement by another poster regarding the cost of MSFT software. It is pretty reasonably priced in the US if you consider the purchase price as a percentage of income. When Windows 8 came out they had some sick upgrade offer for something like $39 per an upgrade. And that was for the Pro version. Windows media center was free... or there was some negligible cost. $39 dollars every five years is nothing to the average American.

    Given the annual income in the US and how useful MSFT software is it is a no brainer really. There are plenty of people who are still using XP! That's a lot of longevity for a negligible cost.

    As far as games are concerned for Americans we can just wait a few years after a game is released and the price comes down. Civilization V can now be purchased for next to nothing with all the expansion pacts and updates included (Sorry I tried to link to the deal but the forum marked the post as SPAM and wouldn't allow me to post). You just have to keep your eye out on deal websites.

    My advice is to look out for deals and only get what you need. Often times with piracy I find people just go into a feeding frenzy and get stuff just because they can. It's like this app thing on cell phones. Most apps that are downloaded are used a couple of times and that's it. Save your money. Look for deals. And only get what you need. If you have a US income there is no need to pirate software.
    Reflexx and BataBole like this.
    06-24-2014 09:26 AM
  9. Chregu's Avatar
    Tell you what....let's ask the management here what their take on this issue is,and see what they say about it..
    I think that's a good idea. I'm curious myself.

    Until we have the answer (I assume you are writing them?), here another tech blog writing about the issue:

    Why Ad Blocking is devastating to the sites you love | Ars Technica
    06-24-2014 09:30 AM
  10. fatclue_98's Avatar
    As you may or may not be aware, your ISP does not pay the owners of this website for their content. It's the same as taking the tram into town. You will pay for a tram ticket, but none of your fare goes to the shops in town so you still have to pay for any squirrel clamps, sprout holders or other gizmos you want to take home. Your ISP subscription also doesn't pay for Netflix or Amazon. So perhaps you could elaborate further?

    And do you find that ladies have any interest in your choice of underwear brand? Is the brand you choose somehow embarrassing? I'm genuinely curious.
    Dude, get off your high horse already. If I take a train or a bus it's probably because my car is broken down. I am one of those people who PAYS for their conveniences. I don't go asking questions and I don't care if Spotted Owls get fed from the money I pay. What that provider does with my money is his business, not mine. I only care about the service I'm getting.

    If you're genuinely curious about how women react to a man's underwear, I suggest spending some time with them in the bedroom. Lots of time, you might learn a thing or two.
    06-24-2014 09:31 AM
  11. Chregu's Avatar
    What cracks me up here is that people who choose to pirate software,knowingly use pirated software,think it's perfectly fine to do so,then they take umbrage when folks like myself point out that it is theft when they do this.
    Okay, I'll try to explain this again.

    When we state that piracy isn't theft, it's just the definition we are talking about. We try in now way to lesser the crime of copyright infringement, it's a pure question of the right choice of words.

    We know piracy is bad, we agree that it's a crime, we just choose to not use a wrong term to refer to it.
    Reflexx likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:35 AM
  12. Citizen X's Avatar
    When we state that piracy isn't theft, it's just the definition we are talking about. We try in now way to lesser the crime of copyright infringement, it's a pure question of the right choice of words.
    When your intellectual property is stolen you won't be delving into such semantics. You will want a cash payment... the same as anyone who's property has been stolen.
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:38 AM
  13. anony_mouse's Avatar
    What cracks me up here is that people who choose to pirate software,knowingly use pirated software,think it's perfectly fine to do so,then they take umbrage when folks like myself point out that it is theft when they do this.

    Others here apparently don't know the difference between stealing and exercising their rights in blocking adds in their phones and continue to try to cloud the subject of hand.
    It's good you find the subject so amusing. I also thought my posts were quite funny and I'm thoroughly enjoying the discussion about underwear labels.

    Nevertheless, it's a shame you find the subject of ad blockers clouding the outrage against piracy. Maybe you could make two lists - one of the posts about piracy, and the other of the posts about ad blocking. You could then read just the posts from one list at a time. That might help uncloud each issue for you!

    Nevertheless, I am still waiting for someone to provide a moral or ethical justification for using an ad blocker and enjoying this site without contributing to its costs. Without such an argument being provided, I find it very hard to make a judgement. It's nice that MDMcAtee has a 'right' to block ads on his phone, but is she/he 'right' to do so?
    Chregu and Reflexx like this.
    06-24-2014 09:38 AM
  14. Chregu's Avatar
    When your intellectual property is stolen you won't be delving into such semantics. You will want a cash payment... the same as anyone who's property has been stolen.
    I don't want to make a big deal out of it. It was just mentioned initially, and since then some users are claiming it's a way to downplay the issue. That's just not what it is.
    06-24-2014 09:43 AM
  15. anony_mouse's Avatar
    Dude, get off your high horse already. If I take a train or a bus it's probably because my car is broken down. I am one of those people who PAYS for their conveniences. I don't go asking questions and I don't care if Spotted Owls get fed from the money I pay. What that provider does with my money is his business, not mine. I only care about the service I'm getting.
    I'm very sorry and this may be my fault, but I still don't think you're answering the question. Perhaps you did and I missed it? Given that your ISP doesn't contribute to the costs of running this site, and that the *deeply* respected moderators and writers here need to eat, is it justifiable to use an ad blocker and remove their source of income?

    If you're genuinely curious about how women react to a man's underwear, I suggest spending some time with them in the bedroom. Lots of time, you might learn a thing or two.
    If I'm male, I will ignore your uncalled-for affront, and if I'm female, I will laugh knowingly to myself and move on. But maybe you can elaborate on why you had to remove the labels? Were they sticking up out of the back of your trousers? Did they say 'property of the prison service' or 'boil wash only at 90C'? Did they get very smelly?
    Chregu likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:47 AM
  16. fatclue_98's Avatar
    It's good you find the subject so amusing. I also thought my posts were quite funny and I'm thoroughly enjoying the discussion about underwear labels.

    Nevertheless, it's a shame you find the subject of ad blockers clouding the outrage against piracy. Maybe you could make two lists - one of the posts about piracy, and the other of the posts about ad blocking. You could then read just the posts from one list at a time. That might help uncloud each issue for you!

    Nevertheless, I am still waiting for someone to provide a moral or ethical justification for using an ad blocker and enjoying this site without contributing to its costs. Without such an argument being provided, I find it very hard to make a judgement. It's nice that MDMcAtee has a 'right' to block ads on his phone, but is she/he 'right' to do so?
    We don't have to contribute to this site's costs because the site administrator doesn't require it. There's nothing to justify. If they needed help there would be a "donate" button somewhere for us to contribute.
    anony_mouse likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:51 AM
  17. Citizen X's Avatar
    I don't want to make a big deal out of it. It was just mentioned initially, and since then some users are claiming it's a way to downplay the issue. That's just not what it is.
    The problem is every time the topic comes up on the internet that semantic word play comes up. And I really have to wonder why. We all know when you go to court lawyers call day "night" and night "day". I would never presume to know what the correct legal term is for anything. The average person on the street though knows exactly what is meant when you say someone stole my music from the internet. You may have just been making a technical point but tons of people use that word play to somehow make illegally downloading and sharing files seem less bad than stealing a magazine.

    You do realize that a lot of magazines are sold on consignment. That means that if a store doesn't sell all the magazines at the end of the month they don't have to pay for them and in fact they just shred them and toss them in a dumpster behind the store. So if you shop lift a magazine that they were going to throw away anyway (ie has zero economic value) you will get arrested for "theft." If you download a number one song (it has economic value) you probably won't get arrested and it will not be considered "theft." Does that make any sense? See why going around the internet having that semantic argument rubs people the wrong way?
    Chregu likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:52 AM
  18. Chregu's Avatar
    The problem is every time the topic comes up on the internet that semantic word play comes up. And I really have to wonder why. We all know when you go to court lawyers call day "night" and night "day". I would never presume to know what the correct legal term is for anything. The average person on the street though knows exactly what is meant when you say someone stole my music from the internet. You may have just been making a technical point but tons of people use that word play to somehow make illegally downloading and sharing files seem less bad than stealing a magazine.
    I agree with everything you are saying here.

    You do realize that a lot of magazines are sold on consignment. That means that if a store doesn't sell all the magazines at the end of the month they don't have to pay for them and in fact they just shred them and toss them in a dumpster behind the store. So if you shop lift a magazine that they were going to throw away anyway (ie has zero economic value) you will get arrested for "theft." If you download a number one song (it has economic value) you probably won't get arrested and it will not be considered "theft." Does that make any sense? See why going around the internet having that semantic argument rubs people the wrong way?
    I don't agree here. At least to my knowledge, in many countries the penalties for downloading music is much higher than for stealing a magazine.
    06-24-2014 09:54 AM
  19. fatclue_98's Avatar
    I'm very sorry and this may be my fault, but I still don't think you're answering the question. Perhaps you did and I missed it? Given that your ISP doesn't contribute to the costs of running this site, and that the *deeply* respected moderators and writers here need to eat, is it justifiable to use an ad blocker and remove their source of income?



    If I'm male, I will ignore your uncalled-for affront, and if I'm female, I will laugh knowingly to myself and move on. But maybe you can elaborate on why you had to remove the labels? Were they sticking up out of the back of your trousers? Did they say 'property of the prison service' or 'boil wash only at 90C'? Did they get very smelly?
    The question has been asked and answered, pay attention. If I have to explain why underwear tags bother me, you're obviously too young to understand given the way labels are placed nowadays.
    06-24-2014 09:55 AM
  20. Chregu's Avatar
    We don't have to contribute to this site's costs because the site administrator doesn't require it. There's nothing to justify. If they needed help there would be a "donate" button somewhere for us to contribute.
    I have never seen a "donate" button on Microsoft Corporation either.
    Reflexx likes this.
    06-24-2014 09:57 AM
  21. anony_mouse's Avatar
    We don't have to contribute to this site's costs because the site administrator doesn't require it. There's nothing to justify. If they needed help there would be a "donate" button somewhere for us to contribute.
    Ah thank you! That's more like it - some answer vaguely related to my question. You're right of course that this site does not require you to see ads. You are entirely at liberty not to do so! Nevertheless, I hope you will extend your heartfelt thanks to all those people who don't use an ad blocker and do help to pay for the site. Perhaps you could do something nice for them? And also, of course, for the journalists and technies who work on this site, which you enjoy ad-free.
    Chregu and Reflexx like this.
    06-24-2014 10:02 AM
  22. Reflexx's Avatar
    Remind me again, what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Using AdBlock is nowhere near the same as piracy. No more than ripping the tag off my underwear.


    Sent from my iPhone using WPCentral Forums
    In some instances, ad blocking is worse. These are content providers that rely on a particular revenue model. Ad blocking is pretty much an attempt to get the benefits of a service without allowing for revenue generation.

    ​There really isn't an excuse of "I can't afford it" with ad blocking.
    Chregu likes this.
    06-24-2014 10:08 AM
  23. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Ah thank you! That's more like it - some answer vaguely related to my question. You're right of course that this site does not require you to see ads. You are entirely at liberty not to do so! Nevertheless, I hope you will extend your heartfelt thanks to all those people who don't use an ad blocker and do help to pay for the site. Perhaps you could do something nice for them? And also, of course, for the journalists and technies who work on this site, which you enjoy ad-free.
    I don't enjoy anything ad-free. Until this thread, I had no idea what AdBlock was, but I quickly educated myself. Ads may be irritating, but I won't pay to not have to see them. After 45 years in this country, I don't know anything but commercials. They bother me no more than a late afternoon thunderstorm in Miami. In other words, I'm used to it and immune from it.
    06-24-2014 10:10 AM
  24. Reflexx's Avatar
    ^ Very simple, I already pay for my ISP. How Mobile Nations conducts their business is no business of mine. As for my undies, I just developed that habit very young in life when many ladies saw what brand I wore. Didn't make any money from it but the fringe benefits were awesome.
    Sent from my Ativ S Neo using Tapatalk
    ​That's like someone saying they pay for XBOX LIVE, so they should be able to pirate the games.
    Chregu likes this.
    06-24-2014 10:11 AM
  25. anony_mouse's Avatar
    The question has been asked and answered, pay attention. If I have to explain why underwear tags bother me, you're obviously too young to understand given the way labels are placed nowadays.
    I assume you are referring to this statement? "As for my undies, I just developed that habit very young in life when many ladies saw what brand I wore. Didn't make any money from it but the fringe benefits were awesome." (if not, please let me know which I should look at)

    For me, that doesn't fully answer the question. It appears that you removed to tag to prevent any ladies from finding out what brand of underwear you wore. The curious reader will immediately wish to know why you felt the need to do this - hence my follow up questions.
    Chregu and anon(8150199) like this.
    06-24-2014 10:11 AM
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