The app gap will close. MSFT living up to its promise.

[smoledman]

I reiterate, unless MS is willing to pour a billion into WP app development(bribe the iOS devs), the app gap will stay forever.

 

[snowwake8]

I reiterate, unless MS is willing to pour a billion into WP app development(bribe the iOS devs), the app gap will stay forever.

Let's not exaggerate here. Facebook, and some 3rd party apps are all its going to take. 1 billion is a ridiculous number.

 

[smoledman]

Let's not exaggerate here. Facebook, and some 3rd party apps are all its going to take. 1 billion is a ridiculous number.

No it's the price MS has to pay for being ridiculously late to the modern smartphone game. It's also karma for what Ballmer said about the iPhone in 2007.

 

[trooper11]

I'm surprised so many around here are so down on the prospects of WP considering the strides that the platform has made to this point. A really tough crowd lol.

What I see here is a platform that continues to take its lumps from almost every angle and yet continues to grow. Its still a small % world wide, but the numbers are trending up, not down. MS basically started from scratch when Apple and Google were starting to dominate and have been able to scrape and claw their way to a decent spot considering. MS just needs to stay aggressive with updates and improvements. We have seen many recent changes that point to them trying to move quicker and be more flexible in rolling out things like app updates. The 'app gap' will remain for quite a while, but I think we are near a point where the gap will mean less and less. There is a positive trend of app developers either bringing an app over, or new developers bringing out quality alternatives. That just needs to be fostered by MS as much as possible.

I see people commenting on MS' lack of commitment to sticking to a platform, but I really have to wonder what they have been looking at. MS has clearly been making a play for platform convergence across WP and Windows. The first step in that process was the WP7 to 8 move. It definitely was not pleasant and it certainly fueled the argument that MS was just abandoning users again, but I think it setup MS for a better long term position. The next step was universal apps. I have seen no evidence that MS will need to make such a move again. WP9 will bring it and Windows even closer together (not to mention see WP and RT merge) and should prove to developers that MS is in it for the long haul, not lacking commitment.

WP definitely burned people that favored the WM platform, and clearly Android became the spiritual successor, but I really have trouble believing that WM represented a platform that could carry MS forward into this current era of smartphones. WM was considered the 'old school' smartphone OS and I don't see it faring much better against Apple or Google. MS chose to reinvent the platform around a less robust set of features, but something that is more inviting to the average smartphone user. We have seen robust features start to make their way back in over the years though and I think the path of joining with Windows will see much more of that returning. Its been a rough road, no doubt, but at least MS seems willing to take the lumps and spend the money to suffer until they reach their goals. This will still be a long road, but it doesn't seem so dire to me at this point.

 

[WillysJeepMan]

I'm surprised so many around here are so down on the prospects of WP considering the strides that the platform has made to this point. A really tough crowd lol.

What I see here is a platform that continues to take its lumps from almost every angle and yet continues to grow. Its still a small % world wide, but the numbers are trending up, not down. MS basically started from scratch when Apple and Google were starting to dominate and have been able to scrape and claw their way to a decent spot considering. MS just needs to stay aggressive with updates and improvements. We have seen many recent changes that point to them trying to move quicker and be more flexible in rolling out things like app updates. The 'app gap' will remain for quite a while, but I think we are near a point where the gap will mean less and less. There is a positive trend of app developers either bringing an app over, or new developers bringing out quality alternatives. That just needs to be fostered by MS as much as possible.

I see people commenting on MS' lack of commitment to sticking to a platform, but I really have to wonder what they have been looking at. MS has clearly been making a play for platform convergence across WP and Windows. The first step in that process was the WP7 to 8 move. It definitely was not pleasant and it certainly fueled the argument that MS was just abandoning users again, but I think it setup MS for a better long term position. The next step was universal apps. I have seen no evidence that MS will need to make such a move again. WP9 will bring it and Windows even closer together (not to mention see WP and RT merge) and should prove to developers that MS is in it for the long haul, not lacking commitment.

WP definitely burned people that favored the WM platform, and clearly Android became the spiritual successor, but I really have trouble believing that WM represented a platform that could carry MS forward into this current era of smartphones. WM was considered the 'old school' smartphone OS and I don't see it faring much better against Apple or Google. MS chose to reinvent the platform around a less robust set of features, but something that is more inviting to the average smartphone user. We have seen robust features start to make their way back in over the years though and I think the path of joining with Windows will see much more of that returning. Its been a rough road, no doubt, but at least MS seems willing to take the lumps and spend the money to suffer until they reach their goals. This will still be a long road, but it doesn't seem so dire to me at this point.

Microsoft has not been "making a play" at platform convergence... they've simply been "playing"... and those who wanted them to succeed have been "played". Their greatest effort in platform convergence has been to put "Windows" in the name of every operating system.

Microsoft apparently restarts their mobile platforms every 4 years (if history is any indication). To your credit you acknowledge that this has happened. You have chosen to give them a pass. Consumers-at-large haven't. Why should they?

You said that you don't think that MS will need to make such a move to restart again... that is the same sentiment expressed by others over the years every time MS re-booted their mobile OS.

Microsoft isn't new to the scene. They've been at this thing (mobile operating systems) for over 14 years. It is painfully obvious (to me anyways) that their mobile goals are different than what many expect.

 

[rodan01]

Microsoft has not been "making a play" at platform convergence... they've simply been "playing"... and those who wanted them to succeed have been "played". Their greatest effort in platform convergence has been to put "Windows" in the name of every operating system.

Microsoft apparently restarts their mobile platforms every 4 years (if history is any indication). To your credit you acknowledge that this has happened. You have chosen to give them a pass. Consumers-at-large haven't. Why should they?

You said that you don't think that MS will need to make such a move to restart again... that is the same sentiment expressed by others over the years every time MS re-booted their mobile OS.

Microsoft isn't new to the scene. They've been at this thing (mobile operating systems) for over 14 years. It is painfully obvious (to me anyways) that their mobile goals are different than what many expect.

Microsoft can't support an inferior platform like Windows Mobile just because a mediocre developer can't learn new things.
Everybody feels pity for you, but come on man, get over it.

Winrt is the convergence but you don't know about it because you're still thinking about the past.

 

[anon(6038817)]

As much as I'd like to see another player, I do think WP will fail. Just go into any store, they push iOS or Android. WP is market share is non existent in Canada. The Amazon deal was probably the best alternative they had so they can focus on enterprise. While I like native apps, in the grand scheme of things, as long as my Google Maps continues to work, then the Android runtime was well worth it in the end.

Posted via the WPC App for Android on BlackBerry Z30

I don't think WP market share in Canada is indicative of the state of the platform as a whole.

WP market share has increased in many other countries over the past year.

Smartphone OS market share - Kantar Worldpanel ComTech

 

[trooper11]

Microsoft has not been "making a play" at platform convergence... they've simply been "playing"... and those who wanted them to succeed have been "played". Their greatest effort in platform convergence has been to put "Windows" in the name of every operating system.

I'm simply going by MS' own words and their actions in the latest attempt at a new platform. I would love to see evidence that this is all a ruse and MS is in fact not working towards a unified OS. If you have such evidence, then please share it.

It sounds like to me your response is based on the past, which certainly does matter, but it cannot negate the actions MS has taken in the present alone.

Microsoft apparently restarts their mobile platforms every 4 years (if history is any indication). To your credit you acknowledge that this has happened. You have chosen to give them a pass. Consumers-at-large haven't. Why should they?

As far as I'm aware, MS only restarted their mobile platform once, going from WM to WP. Are you referring to changes to WM before that? If so, then fair enough. I guess you can count WP7 to WP8 as a change, but that was certainly not a restart. It was not a smooth transition though and it was not great for the end user, no arguments there.

I'm not denying MS' actions in the past, I'm just wondering what the evidence is beyond 'history' that the same thing is about to happen now. I'm not giving MS a pass, I'm just looking at their words and actions today versus in the past. I'm not going to blindly support them, but if they follow through on the current path, then it will be a good thing. Also, I kind of doubt this topic really matters to most consumers-at-large. Most consumers are not following the history of these companies and using that as a basis for a smartphone purchase. It matters to developers though and if developers jump ship, then that hurts the experience for end users, resulting in those users going to other platforms.

You said that you don't think that MS will need to make such a move to restart again... that is the same sentiment expressed by others over the years every time MS re-booted their mobile OS.

Microsoft isn't new to the scene. They've been at this thing (mobile operating systems) for over 14 years. It is painfully obvious (to me anyways) that their mobile goals are different than what many expect.

Again, beyond the historic moments you refer to, is there any evidence today that they are not trying to unify all of their devices under a single OS? Your absolutely right that MS is not new to the mobile scene, but that still does not mean things will always repeat themselves. I mean something as simple as employee turn over at MS can have a drastic effect on how they operate. It has an effect at any company that has gone through as much as MS has recently.

If you feel that MS will just abandon WP and go in a different direction, then what do you think their goal is long term?

 

[Pierre Blackwell]

Very well said. People want to doubt MSFT's moves and that's okay because after all everyone is entitled to their opinions, but facts are facts and that facts show MSFT in the top three spots in every category when it comes to the technology and devices they put out. Top OS being utilized on desktops and laptops, not to mention claiming the second and third place spots as well. Top selling gaming console with the Xbox 360. Even the much criticized WP platform is treading water as the third mobile OS in the world, though it has been dubbed the fastest growing. I've increased my share in MSFT because the one thing I know they do is what is in the best interest of the company. The revelation that I've seen occur over the past two years is a shift to also try to do what's in the best interest of the consumers that utilize that companies products and those that design for it. If MSFT can capture that aspect then they will be back on top. I for one am excited as to what MSFT will produce for WP. Everything is trending up. I think Apple has plateaued as far as the mobile market is concerned and Google realizes they need to expand to be more then just a mobile company with a robust search engine. As saturated as the mobile market is WP continues to grow and most metrics indicates that it's at the expense of iphone users. We'll see how much truth there is to that, but the future certainly looks bright for WP.

 

[Jas00555]

I mean, honestly, if Microsoft lets Windows 9 be free to Windows 7 and 8 users, then that'll bring the install base of Windows 9 to maybe 50%. By my math, that's 750 million people. With that many people, Windows will never have an app problem ever again and the convergence with Windows Phone with 90% shared APIs and universal apps will mean that the app gap will mainly be closed.

My 2 cents have been shared.

 

[Chregu]

How many people are using the Windows 8 marketplace and its app regularly? More than people using Windows Phone apps?

How many apps are available in either store?

Unification may make it easier for developers to bring apps from Windows to Windows Phone and the other way around, but it doesn't inherently increase the user base for either of them. And according to rumors one of the next releases of Windows will revert from forcing Metro on everybody as it just didn't work out.

This is a serious question, what are the benefits of unification?

 

[Chregu]

I mean, honestly, if Microsoft lets Windows 9 be free to Windows 7 and 8 users, then that'll bring the install base of Windows 9 to maybe 50%. By my math, that's 750 million people. With that many people, Windows will never have an app problem ever again and the convergence with Windows Phone with 90% shared APIs and universal apps will mean that the app gap will mainly be closed.

That's only true if these 750 million people use Metro apps though. Also, only because something is free it doesn't mean that people will upgrade. And If they release the update for free for Windows 7 and Windows 8, a lot of people will feel ripped off that payed good money for the upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8.

 

[Jas00555]

I can't find the place, but I remember somewhere that the store received 14 million app downloads per day, so I would say a decent amount use them.

After Windows usually costing a few hundred dollars, I think a lot of people would jump on a free version of Windows, but that's just my guess.

 

[Pierre Blackwell]

Most users utilizing Win8/8.1 are using metro apps because that's the biggest reason to upgrade, so to answer your question, a lot are utilizing the Windows app store for Win8/8.1. Why would you use Win8/8.1 and not utilize any metro apps? Those that feel ripped off about paying a lot should be frustrated with themselves for waiting so long to upgrade. I only paid around $20 for my upgrade, but the key is doing it as soon as it comes out to take advantage of the promotion.

 

[Chregu]

Most users utilizing Win8/8.1 are using metro apps because that's the biggest reason to upgrade, so to answer your question, a lot are utilizing the Windows app store for Win8/8.1. Why would you use Win8/8.1 and not utilize any metro apps?

Well, if that is the biggest reason it's clear now why nobody buys it. Actually I don't use Metro apps because I have big screens and they are made for small touch screens. So does the Windows 8 marketplace have a better quality than the Windows Phone marketplace by now? I only ever looked at it during the first few months I had Windows 8, and back then it was terrible, so I really don't know.

Those that feel ripped off about paying a lot should be frustrated with themselves for waiting so long to upgrade. I only paid around $20 for my upgrade, but the key is doing it as soon as it comes out to take advantage of the promotion.

I really hope Microsoft uses this argumentation to promote the free upgrade, the reactions would be hilarious!

 

[rodan01]

According to adduplex stats Windows 8 user aren't using the store.


Metro apps are competing with the web in PCs. For example why the Facebook, Twitter or CNN metro apps optimized for touch are better than the websites optimized for keyboard and mouse?


MS has to find an advantage to defeat the web.


In mobile the web sucks for many reasons, so native apps dominate.

 

[Pierre Blackwell]

I think the average computer users hesitation to embrace the metro environment is pretty evident. That is why XP and Win7 dominate when it comes to non-mobile OS's. There's no surprise there. What I'm talking about is for those who are utilizing Windows 8/8.1, the majority are using apps from the apps store. As for feeling ripped off, if I paid $120 to upgrade knowing I could've gotten it for only $15-20, I'd probably feel a little ripped off too, but ultimately I'd kick myself for waiting so long. That really can't be blamed on MSFT. If they make threshold free for Win7-Win8/8.1 users, I'm sure that offer won't last forever. MSFT has been working to combine the stores to form one unified experience. Most apps available for Win8 are available for WP, but with MSFT concept to build more universal apps, that will change as apps downloaded in the store will be accessible on any device. If you were to go look at the Windows app store now, I think you'd agree it's improved drastically.

 

[AG VK]

Most users utilizing Win8/8.1 are using metro apps because that's the biggest reason to upgrade, so to answer your question, a lot are utilizing the Windows app store for Win8/8.1. Why would you use Win8/8.1 and not utilize any metro apps? Those that feel ripped off about paying a lot should be frustrated with themselves for waiting so long to upgrade. I only paid around $20 for my upgrade, but the key is doing it as soon as it comes out to take advantage of the promotion.

No, most users with W8 have it because it came pre-installed on whatever hardware they purchased. And I only have Windows 8 because I build my own computers and at the time, Windows 8 Ultimate was cheaper in India than Windows 7 Ultimate.

 

[Pierre Blackwell]

According to adduplex stats Windows 8 user aren't using the store.


Metro apps are competing with the web in PCs. For example why the Facebook, Twitter or CNN metro apps optimized for touch are better than the websites optimized for keyboard and mouse?


MS has to find an advantage to defeat the web.


In mobile the web sucks for many reasons, so native apps dominate.

I think MSFT has found aways to defeat it, and that is not even compete with it. I think that is why "threshold" has been rumored to be able to disable the metro interface on PC devices but not tablets or anything smaller. I'm sure if you looked at those utilizing mobile devices, you'd see more utilizing the store. The question is of the numbers reflecting those using Win8 how many are using it on a screen 10" or smaller?

 

[Pierre Blackwell]

No, most users with W8 have it because it came pre-installed on whatever hardware they purchased. And I only have Windows 8 because I build my own computers and at the time, Windows 8 Ultimate was cheaper in India than Windows 7 Ultimate.

I was referring to ugrade as OS...not the hardware that the OS is on. Honestly I only upgraded to Win8 initially because the laptop it's on was using Vista. I still have a laptop with Win7.