09-05-2014 08:21 PM
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  1. a5cent's Avatar
    Good luck with that one...
    I'll enforce it if necessary... already started...
    09-02-2014 09:02 AM
  2. JasoX's Avatar
    Does it really matter? The fan boy mentality is ridiculous, it's like two five year old kids argue at the sandbox...."my dad I stronger than yours". EDIT: Pointless in other words.
    09-02-2014 09:02 AM
  3. a5cent's Avatar
    Does it really matter? The fan boy mentality is ridiculous.
    Isn't that precisely why it matters? Starting now, we can either get back to the actual thread topic, or let this thread R.I.P. If anybody feels the urge, they are of course free to open a new thread specifically for a debate on MS vs Google services, but that isn't what the OP wanted this thread to be about. I think we've disrespected the thread topic long enough. It stops here.
    N_LaRUE and Karthik Naik like this.
    09-02-2014 09:09 AM
  4. Jas00555's Avatar
    [INFO]Anyway, it would be nice if someone found a way to tie all this back to the original topic (I have a faint memory that this thread should be about resolving the MS/Google war, not throwing more fuel on the fire). I'm not sure such a connection exists, but I'm willing to let people try. Failing that, well, you know...[/INFO]
    Here, I've got an idea...

    ---------------------

    And THIS ladies and gentlemen, is why we need to end the war between Google and Microsoft. It ends up starting ridiculous fights and is hurting everyone.

    Alright, now lets go from there.
    a5cent, Pete, N_LaRUE and 1 others like this.
    09-02-2014 10:15 AM
  5. anon(8985111)'s Avatar
    I wouldn't call this a war since Google (and Apple) have very different business models. This is something that many people keep mixing up all the time but it makes such a huge difference. Bottom line is:

    Google's core business is advertising and they are performing exceptionally well in this field. Almost everything that you will read in the media about balloons providing Internet access in underdeveloped spots, smart homes etc. is done in order do expand their advertising power in the medium to long term.

    Apple's core business is hardware and they are doing it remarkably well because I don't know any other company where people would voluntarily spend huge amounts of money without the need to target them expensively. They have a strong brand and what I admire from a business point of view is that they have understood that this shark pool called price competition would only have negative ramifications for their business. In other words: They don't need to try and get every single user out there aboard. There's a sufficient amount of folks that have the characteristics of an ordinary Apple consumer. And they need to get both Google and Microsoft as well as other partners onboard because traditonally they are a hardware company and can't provide all services on their own (they don't even have a search engine, let's not forget that you can't build a product like Cortana without having a search engine feeding it with all kind of data).

    So as for the relationship between Microsoft and Apple I don't see any need for Microsoft to try and attack them. Products like Office are a selling point for Apple's products and Microsoft can earn money with them. So from my perspective it's good for both. The only area where I see Apple and Microsoft competing is in the field of flagship phones. But if you look at the statistics, the 1520 or 930 don't make up a large fraction and as written above Apple doesn't care at all if someone buys a 520 or 630.

    I'm also sure that Google will start to support the MS ecosystem once it has build a strong userbase. They have some of the smartest employees our planet holds in store and I would be very surprised if they were to ignore them completely. By the way, the working environment at Google is a strong advantage. I'm not a strong supporter of those religious corporate cultures, but businesswise it's obvious that employees who are so strongly dedicated to their employer will build better products on average.

    So to bring this post to a close: The upshot simply is that MS should focus on what they are strong at while stopping to compare their products with Apple and Google all the time. It doesn't make any sense at all and gives the media yet another reason to come up with negative press about MS.
    tgp and a5cent like this.
    09-05-2014 05:03 AM
  6. Pete's Avatar
    Very nice post, and almost full of win. The problem is that Google look as though they're actively working against Microsoft in some respects and not really working well to ensure that Google customers have a good experience on Microsoft products (they won't produce a good YouTube App (and won't let Microsoft create one), they also won't create good Google search and Gmail apps) - they basically would rather their customers use Android. I'm not sure that a rise in Microsoft's market share would make any changes to that business model (Google would rather improve it's own systems than support customers on another platform).
    a5cent and anon(8985111) like this.
    09-05-2014 05:54 AM
  7. anon(8985111)'s Avatar
    Very nice post, and almost full of win. The problem is that Google look as though they're actively working against Microsoft in some respects and not really working well to ensure that Google customers have a good experience on Microsoft products (they won't produce a good YouTube App (and won't let Microsoft create one), they also won't create good Google search and Gmail apps) - they basically would rather their customers use Android. I'm not sure that a rise in Microsoft's market share would make any changes to that business model (Google would rather improve it's own systems than support customers on another platform).
    Thanks for the flowers. By the way you have an impressive line-up of products, sounds like a productivity powerhouse to me!
    Pete likes this.
    09-05-2014 07:21 AM
  8. a5cent's Avatar
    So as for the relationship between Microsoft and Apple I don't see any need for Microsoft to try and attack them. Products like Office are a selling point for Apple's products and Microsoft can earn money with them. So from my perspective it's good for both. The only area where I see Apple and Microsoft competing is in the field of flagship phones. But if you look at the statistics, the 1520 or 930 don't make up a large fraction and as written above Apple doesn't care at all if someone buys a 520 or 630.

    I'm also sure that Google will start to support the MS ecosystem once it has build a strong userbase. They have some of the smartest employees our planet holds in store and I would be very surprised if they were to ignore them completely.
    I'm possibly misunderstanding parts of your post, but I seem to sense a contradiction in there somewhere.

    On the one hand you mention how Apple and MS aren't necessarily competitors. You therefore conclude that it is reasonable that they work together. I agree.

    On the other hand, you also mention how it would be reasonable for Google to offer their services on WP, but the arguments you made for an Apple/MS cooperation don't apply to Google. Google has created products and services in many of the areas where MS earns its money, and offers them free of charge. As a result, there currently is no greater threat to MS than Google, and the opposite is also true. Particularly Bing represents a direct threat to Google's primary revenue streams. That makes Google and MS very strong competitors.

    My point is, that I don't think the same rules apply, when it comes to a Google/MS cooperation, as do apply for a Google/Apple or MS/Apple cooperation.

    With over 50 million users, MS has already developed a strong enough WP userbase. It already represents fertile ground for Google profits. As a result, I don't think MS having a "strong userbase" is the criteria that counts, because we already have that. What will count is when WP unacceptably weakens Google's userbase. I realize that in a way those are just two sides of the same coin, but I find it's a more accurate way of thinking about it. Unfortunately, its also not really about cooperation.
    anon(8985111) likes this.
    09-05-2014 08:19 AM
  9. anon(8985111)'s Avatar
    I'm possibly misunderstanding parts of your post, but I seem to sense a contradiction in there somewhere.

    On the one hand you mention how Apple and MS aren't necessarily competitors. You therefore conclude that it is reasonable that they work together. I agree.

    On the other hand, you also mention how it would be reasonable for Google to offer their services on WP, but the arguments you made for an Apple/MS cooperation don't apply to Google. Google has created products and services in many of the areas where MS earns its money, and offers them free of charge. As a result, there currently is no greater threat to MS than Google, and the opposite is also true. Particularly Bing represents a direct threat to Google's primary revenue streams. That makes Google and MS very strong competitors.

    My point is, that I don't think the same rules apply, when it comes to a Google/MS cooperation, as do apply for a Google/Apple or MS/Apple cooperation.

    With over 50 million users, MS has already developed a strong enough WP userbase. It already represents fertile ground for Google profits. As a result, I don't think MS having a "strong userbase" is the criteria that counts, because we already have that. What will count is when WP unacceptably weakens Google's userbase. I realize that in a way those are just two sides of the same coin, but I find it's a more accurate way of thinking about it. Unfortunately, its also not really about cooperation.
    You're certainly making some good points there and the Google and MS world is partly intertwined indeed. What I was trying to underline is that Google has build this large ecosystem around search (YouTube, Google Office, Maps on it goes) for the one and only purpose to be in a position to collect more data because that's what at the end of the day is driving their advertising revenues. That's actually what gives me confidence that they would support WP with their products once they feel they are otherwise missing out too many opportunities. For the time being they might find that the sacrifices of opening up still exceed the benefits. Anyway, I'd agree with you that sometimes it's better to look at the absolute numbers. The relative WP market share (not talking about new sales) might still be decreasing by the day but that doesn't mean that the absolute number of users wasn't steadily growing.

    EDIT: Google holds a massive market share for search over here in Germany, I believe it's still >95%. However, it's interesting to see how more and more people here get scared of Google (that's something somehow also rooted to our culture here, not saying it's a bad attitude though). The cases of people trying to get rid of Google completely still might be rare, but you hear this topic surfacing in the public more and more often for sure. So one thing I tend to remind myself is that even things might appear to be set, especially when it comes to technology, they might change faster than we can imagine today.
    Last edited by n_tesla; 09-05-2014 at 09:33 AM.
    a5cent and tgp like this.
    09-05-2014 09:09 AM
  10. scandiskwindows9x's Avatar
    Google just do not care about Microsoft because just they have the higher market share on smartphones and also they takes full control of Internet through google search , also they have their own Operative system for smartphones so they just do not care to do applications for windows phone, because each platform have their exclusive applications, in this case we have the bad lucky that Google takes control of everything of what we watch on the internet, with such arrogance you can not even ask them do applications to our phones if they still having customers who appear as user agent IE 10-11 for windows phone and we still using their products.

    Also google will not do anything to us because of that way keep us tied of someway to Android platform.

    i personally i use as e mail yahoo, and skype as my main messenger besides that if can use bing would be good, but in Chile Bing give awful bad and not accurate results, also i wonder if Microsoft have regional in every country then why not microsoft start to do tailored bing services and algorithms of search for get accurate search results even comparable to google ones, even is just a joke that microsoft having an regional office in Chile the bing version for chile and even the latest windows phone 8.1 thinks that our spanish scheme is of the mexican spanish , already looks a joke that have not even cooperation between the regional offices.

    also is an fake belief that windows phone have no games, have no what app and have not applications and have heard that from my colleagues from work even, i think microsoft need do agressive tv ads showing that windows phone exist instead of hang of the tradition of Nokia brand
    Karthik Naik and prasath1234 like this.
    09-05-2014 08:21 PM
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