[Florin_Anghel]

First off all, this is not a rant, just a true concern. I am wondering if I am the only one seeing it this way.
So, at the start of 2014 a lot of things were promised, but two of them were very important to me:
- smooth buttery facebook app
&
- immensely improved xbox music with bimonthly updates.

2014 has passed, so I look back on what happened.

Facebook app received a lot of updates, but did it reached the status that was promised?
Well, it has more features, but is it smooth? ..not by far, neither official facebook app or the beta one.
The xbox music app, received the bimonthly updates and improved a bit more, but still, is not there, it's far away from what Zune was or previous xbox music app. They stopped the updates because they are focusing on Windows 10.
On this approach I fully disagree. I understand that they are working on Windows 10, but when will W10 hit our phones?
I can swear on this, that is not going to be (not on official status) in 2015. Maybe start of 2016 but that timeframe is also a long shot.
The big question now is.. What should users do until WM10 comes? Wait another year with these broken apps? but that would make it 2 years from their early promise in 2014.
Some say you can have WM10 with Microsoft inside program, ok... but that means you get into a beta program. For the last 4 years the development of windows phone has been immense, as OS structure, but app related? we are stuck in beta stage for years.

Next scenario:
We will all get WM10 because of the insider program. What did we learn from previous experience? From WP8 to WP8.1?
Well, we learned that they fixed something and broke something else.
1. The people hub was amazing at least for basic fb functionality. Is it the same now? Nop - you can only see pictures, that is all, as soon as you want to comment, like or share you must open facebook app (which is sluggish).
2. Xbox Music app - ripped from OS and now a standalone app. Is it better? No, is slower than before.
3. Messenger hub - now only text messages show there and room messages. Before in WP8, you had all your chats there, all-in-one, a perfect unified experience. If I remember correctly at some point they promised Skype messages in messaging hub. I think we can cross that off the list.
They started with the idea of one hub for all, and they ended in having an app for each thing.

In WM10, what should we expect? A lot of promises like usual, then more promises. They will go on and on with all the improved things in WM10 and when we'll install WM10, we will probably find out we have new things to play with but others will be broken, god knows what. I am just afraid.

Oh, I forgot, the instagram app , the most wanted app, is advertised on each of their phones, in every video of image, but that app is still beta and lacking features. Yet they show it on screen like it's all good.

[aximtreo]

If you have seen some of my former postings, you would know that I would jump on you like white on rice for a whiny post but in this case, I agree with you.

There are so many gaps between what was promised and what we have gotten since the Nokia buy out. I don't know the reason other than trying to assimilate a new company into another is not as easy thing to do.

I'm fighting a particular problem right now that is stupid. How in the hell do you turn off music that is playing, radio, stored music; any music. You can pause it but to turn it off takes a third party app like STOP MUSIC. Sorry, a simple exit within the app would be most helpful and even sensible.

Anyway, hope this post doesn't become a p*****g contest to see who can complain the most. Just saying

[wpcautobot]

I agree with this post, except I believe MS needs more credit for the XBox Music improvements than mentioned. It's much better, by far, than it was initially in 8.1. It's not great by far too, but they didn't say anything about giving it all the features Zune had. That ship has asked.

I began worrying several months back, again thinking that MS has stopped focusing on doing anything more with WP, our even when letting us know, until W10. A couple weeks ago I email Joe Belfior, and he actual wrote me back, and asked me specifically what I thought could be said between now and Jan 21 that would make a difference for users frustrated with MS's silent treatment for the product. He stated they believe it's better to announce all the incredible new things, and new apps, in their big conference this week, when all press will be attending rather than occasionally giving a small announcement about one app or feature plan where not many would hear about. He made it sound like there are some really great things to announce this week, which is great. It's just that I'm thinking that we've all heard this before, lots of excitement and then nothing again for a year or so. And I haven't even mentioned the carriers. I'm happy to paste my thread with him here, I'd anyone is interested

So, I'm excited about what's coming, but much more cautious than before. We'll still have to wait a very long time for anything to come out. What mobile OS can go without any meaningful flagship leaks or announced plans for over a year? One more thing... The single thing that keeps me happy is the Preview for developers (ability to get updates earlier), didn't matter what name they give it. I plead that they do not stop showing users to do it. It's the only way any of us get any update. I don't trust a carrier to give you one unless you buy a new phone, and we don't have new ones in the US.

[sanjeet_deshwal]

21st Jan.........

[sinime]

21st Jan.........

Finger crossed... Not sure how much of what's going on Jan 1st will relate to WP... Is it more of an OS event or will new hardware get a roadmap too?

[Bagzton]

Finger crossed... Not sure how much of what's going on Jan 1st will relate to WP... Is it more of an OS event or will new hardware get a roadmap too?

More of an OS event. But if we do get hardware, well all the better.

[Jas00555]

Facebook is terrible on any OS though, so its not like this is a Microsoft only problem.

"when are we getting W10?"
Daniel said that he expects new flagships at BUILD, which is in June. Those phones will ship with Windows 10, so you'll only have to wait about 6 months.

[Florin_Anghel]

Facebook is terrible on any OS though, so its not like this is a Microsoft only problem.

"when are we getting W10?"
Daniel said that he expects new flagships at BUILD, which is in June. Those phones will ship with Windows 10, so you'll only have to wait about 6 months.

Ok, but how is it that Facebook in People hub, works so good? It is fluent in scrolling, you can easily see pictures. And before in WP8 it had more features, comment like, share. So it is possible to have something good. If I didn't had proof I would have believed that fb sucks on any platform.

Regarding flagships, ok, build is in June, and you will think you will have the new flagship immediately after build? C'mon, let's be serious. Did you know how long it take for L930 to be available world wide since the announcement? another 6 months! So, only by next holidays users can rejoice a new phone. I don't know but for me that's way too long.
In my main post, I didn't mention anything about high-end devices, just OS and apps, because at the moment the L930 can easily do it's job.
However, there is a need for a new high-end. Why? Well, for start the build quality of L930 is hit and miss. Many users had problem with the screen lifting, purple hue, incorrect colour reproduction, heating in low right corner.
A high-end phone shouldn't have all this problems.

[AlexT09]

I hope they don't screw over HTC owners

[fatclue_98]

Back in the old days, GM would put their newest, most cutting edge features on Oldsmobiles and Buicks first. The idea was that they didn't want egg on Cadillac's face if something didn't work right or the public bemoaned it. It's no coincidence that the single most important feature to come to the automotive world was the automatic transmission - in an Olds first. Microsoft is no different, this is a tried and true tactic that's been used by parent companies in smaller subsidiaries for decades. Kenmore dishwashers get the goodies before Whirlpool and so on. I've been reading the whining about the Office app being better on iOS or Android, yadda, yadda, yadda. To that I say - no s**t. Do people really think Microsoft's shareholders will approve a CEO without hearing a game plan first? You think Nadella just went before the Board and proclaimed to be the best man for the job based on his boyish good looks? Microsoft is not a 501C non-profit, they have an idea of what to do to push the brand.

[Jas00555]

Ok, but how is it that Facebook in People hub, works so good? It is fluent in scrolling, you can easily see pictures. And before in WP8 it had more features, comment like, share. So it is possible to have something good. If I didn't had proof I would have believed that fb sucks on any platform.

Regarding flagships, ok, build is in June, and you will think you will have the new flagship immediately after build? C'mon, let's be serious. Did you know how long it take for L930 to be available world wide since the announcement? another 6 months! So, only by next holidays users can rejoice a new phone. I don't know but for me that's way too long.
In my main post, I didn't mention anything about high-end devices, just OS and apps, because at the moment the L930 can easily do it's job.
However, there is a need for a new high-end. Why? Well, for start the build quality of L930 is hit and miss. Many users had problem with the screen lifting, purple hue, incorrect colour reproduction, heating in low right corner.
A high-end phone shouldn't have all this problems.

The Facebook app was good for what it did, but it was seriously lacking in features. Way more so than the current Facebook app. IIRC, you couldn't even see comments that had photos in it. Those things made it almost unusable for me, which is why I never used it. Microsoft could do little about it since they couldn't update it without updating the OS, which made basic features take months to get implemented.

Ok, since we're being serious, are you seriously saying that how Nokia handled phone distribution somehow impacts how Microsoft will handle them 6 months from now. Nokia couldn't get the 520 on any other carrier and had to make a different model for T-Mobile, which meant that there was no single Lumia that was on multiple carriers. Now Microsoft took control and the Lumia 635 is on AT&T, T-Mobile, Sprint, Cricket, and a bunch of other GSM based carriers. It's obvious that Microsoft has a lot more power over carriers than Nokia did, so you're worrying over nothing.

"that's way too long"

um.... that's almost exactly one year after the 930 was announced, so it would actually be right on time. It doesn't make sense to release a new flagship every 6 months. If a year is too long for a new flagship, then you're SOL. Did Apple release the 4S early because of antenna problems? Did Samsung release the S5 early because of screen problems? Nope. You're honestly making a big deal over regular product release cycles.

[Florin_Anghel]

The Facebook app was good for what it did, but it was seriously lacking in features. Way more so than the current Facebook app. IIRC, you couldn't even see comments that had photos in it. Those things made it almost unusable for me, which is why I never used it. Microsoft could do little about it since they couldn't update it without updating the OS, which made basic features take months to get implemented.

They should have left it in place and not remove it completely.
Now we have FB standalone app that is so sluggish.

Ok, since we're being serious, are you seriously saying that how Nokia handled phone distribution somehow impacts how Microsoft will handle them 6 months from now. Nokia couldn't get the 520 on any other carrier and had to make a different model for T-Mobile, which meant that there was no single Lumia that was on multiple carriers. Now Microsoft took control and the Lumia 635 is on AT&T, T-Mobile, Sprint, Cricket, and a bunch of other GSM based carriers. It's obvious that Microsoft has a lot more power over carriers than Nokia did, so you're worrying over nothing.

I don't know what you are talking about, honestly. I really don't know what are you saying. You are starting a rant against Nokia, to defend Microsoft.
But I don't care if it's Nokia or Microsoft, and my main post wasn't about this. Please be on par with the subject.

"that's way too long"

um.... that's almost exactly one year after the 930 was announced, so it would actually be right on time. It doesn't make sense to release a new flagship every 6 months. If a year is too long for a new flagship, then you're SOL. Did Apple release the 4S early because of antenna problems? Did Samsung release the S5 early because of screen problems? Nope. You're honestly making a big deal over regular product release cycles.

I think you should get your math straight. We are in January 2015, Lumia Icon was available in February 2014. So for almost one year, no high end device. If they make an announcement in build which is in summer, it will be 1y6months. Usually phone will be available in the next months, that will make it almost 2 years.
It seems to me that you are very protective with Microsoft, and trying to blame it on someone else, be it Nokia or carriers. I don't see it that way.
Keep in mind that I mentioned that L930 does its job, the main post wasn't about this. Please refrain yourself if you can't be objective.

[anon(8141431)]

*triple quotes* "'Windows 10 will fix everything'"

[Jas00555]

They should have left it in place and not remove it completely.
Now we have FB standalone app that is so sluggish.

As I said, this is normal of facebook. I have a OnePlus one at home and I've used my sister's iPhone 6 and the Facebook app is pretty much slow and buggy on all platforms, maybe even more sp the iPhone because it tends to slow down incredibly when ads go by, while we have no ads. You're acting like we have a terrible facebook experience when we arguably have one of the best. If they had invested more into the People Hub version, we would've had two even more gimped version instead of one decent one. Sorry, but I think that's a terrible idea.

I don't know what you are talking about, honestly. I really don't know what are you saying. You are starting a rant against Nokia, to defend Microsoft.
But I don't care if it's Nokia or Microsoft, and my main post wasn't about this. Please be on par with the subject.

You claimed that a flagship wasn't coming for a few months based on evidence of "well, that's how Nokia did it"

I claimed that Microsoft has clearly shown that they're better at negotiating with carriers compared to Nokia and that claim shouldn't be taken as fact. Get it now?

I think you should get your math straight. We are in January 2015, Lumia Icon was available in February 2014. So for almost one year, no high end device. If they make an announcement in build which is in summer, it will be 1y6months. Usually phone will be available in the next months, that will make it almost 2 years.
It seems to me that you are very protective with Microsoft, and trying to blame it on someone else, be it Nokia or carriers. I don't see it that way.
Keep in mind that I mentioned that L930 does its job, the main post wasn't about this. Please refrain yourself if you can't be objective.

The US isn't the world. The Icon is a high end phone, but its not a flagship. The Lumia 930 is a flagship. The Icon is a variant, but its still not the flagship, its just a high end phone. Unless you're saying that a phone that still doesn't have 8.1 is a flagship? I don't think so.

You seem to keep getting confused. The Lumia 930 comment was in direct response to you saying that we don't know when we'll get Windows 10. I claimed that Daniel and the company Yezz have said that it's coming in the summer, around BUILD. Launching a flagship at BUILD would be one year after the last flagship, the Lumia 930 was announced.

[Florin_Anghel]

As I said, this is normal of facebook. I have a OnePlus one at home and I've used my sister's iPhone 6 and the Facebook app is pretty much slow and buggy on all platforms, maybe even more sp the iPhone because it tends to slow down incredibly when ads go by, while we have no ads. You're acting like we have a terrible facebook experience when we arguably have one of the best. If they had invested more into the People Hub version, we would've had two even more gimped version instead of one decent one. Sorry, but I think that's a terrible idea.

You seem not to get it, when they launched WP, the idea behind People hub was this, having Facebook, LinkedIn, and Twitter. They all had the minimum features. Why kill the features if they still worked?
It wasn't a bad experience, it was not complete. That is a difference that you don't get. Having a separate FB app that has all features is ok (even though is sluggish) but keep the People Hub with the initial features. And don't even start with the fact that they weren't able to update them, because for these features there was no need. The commenting function in Facebook has never changed, neither the like. It is the same coding as it was 3 years ago.
Now People Hub is just the agenda and a news feed, that all. You can't do much for FB, at least on Twitter you can tweet or reply.
Because you think it's a terrible idea doesn't make it so.
And why are you comparing this with other platforms? Why does this "need" exist, of the neighbors grass? I don't care if it's green or burned on the other side, I care what I have. You need to work on that.

You claimed that a flagship wasn't coming for a few months based on evidence of "well, that's how Nokia did it"

I claimed that Microsoft has clearly shown that they're better at negotiating with carriers compared to Nokia and that claim shouldn't be taken as fact. Get it now?

Don't put words on my mouth. Don't use quotes if I really didn't say that. I just explained how a roll out of a device is happening, be it done by MS, Nokia, or everybody else. The point was that when you are announcing a device it takes at least few months to have it widely available.

The US isn't the world. The Icon is a high end phone, but its not a flagship. The Lumia 930 is a flagship. The Icon is a variant, but its still not the flagship, its just a high end phone. Unless you're saying that a phone that still doesn't have 8.1 is a flagship? I don't think so.

You seem to keep getting confused. The Lumia 930 comment was in direct response to you saying that we don't know when we'll get Windows 10. I claimed that Daniel and the company Yezz have said that it's coming in the summer, around BUILD. Launching a flagship at BUILD would be one year after the last flagship, the Lumia 930 was announced.

First detail that you missed and you bluntly ignore. Icon = L930 , SAME SPECS!!!
The US isn't the world, but if you were a US citizen and you had an Icon as a flagship, it is already more than a year.
I will just quit explaining it to you as it seems you blindly defend Microsoft.
Like I first mentioned, it is not a rant, just a true concern of what happened and what is happening. History repeats itself, while you are dreaming.

[stephen_az]

First off all, this is not a rant, just a true concern. I am wondering if I am the only one seeing it this way.
So, at the start of 2014 a lot of things were promised, but two of them were very important to me:
- smooth buttery facebook app
&
- immensely improved xbox music with bimonthly updates.

2014 has passed, so I look back on what happened.

Facebook app received a lot of updates, but did it reached the status that was promised?
Well, it has more features, but is it smooth? ..not by far, neither official facebook app or the beta one.
The xbox music app, received the bimonthly updates and improved a bit more, but still, is not there, it's far away from what Zune was or previous xbox music app. They stopped the updates because they are focusing on Windows 10.
On this approach I fully disagree. I understand that they are working on Windows 10, but when will W10 hit our phones?
I can swear on this, that is not going to be (not on official status) in 2015. Maybe start of 2016 but that timeframe is also a long shot.
The big question now is.. What should users do until WM10 comes? Wait another year with these broken apps? but that would make it 2 years from their early promise in 2014.
Some say you can have WM10 with Microsoft inside program, ok... but that means you get into a beta program. For the last 4 years the development of windows phone has been immense, as OS structure, but app related? we are stuck in beta stage for years.

Next scenario:
We will all get WM10 because of the insider program. What did we learn from previous experience? From WP8 to WP8.1?
Well, we learned that they fixed something and broke something else.
1. The people hub was amazing at least for basic fb functionality. Is it the same now? Nop - you can only see pictures, that is all, as soon as you want to comment, like or share you must open facebook app (which is sluggish).
2. Xbox Music app - ripped from OS and now a standalone app. Is it better? No, is slower than before.
3. Messenger hub - now only text messages show there and room messages. Before in WP8, you had all your chats there, all-in-one, a perfect unified experience. If I remember correctly at some point they promised Skype messages in messaging hub. I think we can cross that off the list.
They started with the idea of one hub for all, and they ended in having an app for each thing.

In WM10, what should we expect? A lot of promises like usual, then more promises. They will go on and on with all the improved things in WM10 and when we'll install WM10, we will probably find out we have new things to play with but others will be broken, god knows what. I am just afraid.

Oh, I forgot, the instagram app , the most wanted app, is advertised on each of their phones, in every video of image, but that app is still beta and lacking features. Yet they show it on screen like it's all good.

It is always fascinating when people start by saying they are not ranting. Inevitably they then proceed to rant and this is no different. It sure seems like lots of declamatory statements tied to personal opinion. You also bring along the obligatory bombastic claims and obvious emotional investment in your position. Evidently you know (and can swear on) when Windows 10 will be released for phones?

Of course then there is Zune. That has been gone for a long time and many of us have no problem with Xbox Music in its current form. It is also certainly not slower than the embedded version on my 928 or old 822 and is far less buggy when used with the hands free Bluetooth in my car. At least for Windows 8.X modern apps, Xbox Music is still called Zune under the hood if that makes anyone feel any better. The point being in this case, why bring up ancient history? Zune have never existed in any visible form on a WP 8 device and was otherwise cancelled as a standalone product and service line in 2012. It is now 2015 for anyone who missed it. It served its purpose and continues to influence Microsoft design principles to the present day but was otherwise a total failure as product in popular culture and has made into sitcoms and late night talk show monologues. Now that is a name you want to retain as you try to build a mobile market. Yes, that is sarcasm.

As to what has been promised (your word multiple times), please cite verifiable statements from Microsoft promising things - you could start with Facebook but then might want to confirm what "a lot of promises like usual...." means in the real world. With respect to Instagram, I have never seen it advertised by VZW for the 822 or 928 and is not mentioned for either current model. At least in the US carriers are the pivot point for advertising. So where are all of the ads and, BTW, where is the systematically completed survey documenting it as the most wanted app?

Seriously, if people want to rant then go right ahead and rant but don't try to elevate it above what everyone else is doing. This is just a rant like so many others. Alternatively, take the 30 seconds to look up the definition of words before starting out by saying you are not doing something....

[fatclue_98]

This is just a rant like so many others

You sooooo need coffee.

[Florin_Anghel]

It is always fascinating when people start by saying they are not ranting. Inevitably they then proceed to rant and this is no different. It sure seems like lots of declamatory statements tied to personal opinion. You also bring along the obligatory bombastic claims and obvious emotional investment in your position. Evidently you know (and can swear on) when Windows 10 will be released for phones?

Of course then there is Zune. That has been gone for a long time and many of us have no problem with Xbox Music in its current form. It is also certainly not slower than the embedded version on my 928 or old 822 and is far less buggy when used with the hands free Bluetooth in my car. At least for Windows 8.X modern apps, Xbox Music is still called Zune under the hood if that makes anyone feel any better. The point being in this case, why bring up ancient history? Zune have never existed in any visible form on a WP 8 device and was otherwise cancelled as a standalone product and service line in 2012. It is now 2015 for anyone who missed it. It served its purpose and continues to influence Microsoft design principles to the present day but was otherwise a total failure as product in popular culture and has made into sitcoms and late night talk show monologues. Now that is a name you want to retain as you try to build a mobile market. Yes, that is sarcasm.

As to what has been promised (your word multiple times), please cite verifiable statements from Microsoft promising things - you could start with Facebook but then might want to confirm what "a lot of promises like usual...." means in the real world. With respect to Instagram, I have never seen it advertised by VZW for the 822 or 928 and is not mentioned for either current model. At least in the US carriers are the pivot point for advertising. So where are all of the ads and, BTW, where is the systematically completed survey documenting it as the most wanted app?

Seriously, if people want to rant then go right ahead and rant but don't try to elevate it above what everyone else is doing. This is just a rant like so many others. Alternatively, take the 30 seconds to look up the definition of words before starting out by saying you are not doing something....

... just go on windowsphone.com and tell me, how many times you see instagram icon, or in their youtube videos. Also, I wasn't talking about VZW, I specifically wrote MS.
Regarding rant... I think you can't read it objectively, you take it personally and therefor it becomes a rant for you, but then again that's your problem.
I can explain each statement I make with pertinent arguments, while you try to make a personal approach against me.

[denzilla]

I think MS is in a holding pattern with WP until Win10 is released. This IMO, is a mistake and will only damage their rep with existing customers who need to be kept happy. Bad new travels fast, MS. You're dropping the ball on software updates. Everyone who owns a 920 and wanting to upgrade are being asked to wait and wait.....I can't see this as a net positive for Microsoft. All I see at this point is MS throwing existing customers under the bus in favor of starting over yet again with Win10. Sure Win10 will be made available to existing hardware, but there is still a good wait ahead and more importantly, will your carrier offer it?

[afgzee]

I don't see too much wrong with the facebook app anymore, its very smooth but still lacks some important features such as the ability to see replies to comments you've posted and reply to comments

Maybe some other things need adding, but nothing that bothers me.

[aximtreo]

I see a real need to close this post. It has become another p*****g contest on who is right, wrong or believes the strongest.

Let's put it to bed and close this.

[dlalonde]

21st Jan.........

That's actually what I'm starting to think (hope). Things have slowed down so much that I've started wondering if they aren't waiting for Windows 10 to do something. For Xbox Music it's been said that the team is working on the Windows 10 version. But I'm also thinking of app creators such as Twitter or even Vine and Instagram.

We'll see in due time.

[vEEP pEEP]

MS is focusing on services. Some of those of mobile services. Android and iOS dominate - they consume MS services and MS profit.

However, the UK has 10% penetration. China and India are wide open. So I hope they beef up what phone buyers want - apps!

Are there any dual sim Lumias? Because the would be great for work - MS owns the desktop world, and one would think mobile office apps would work better on a Windows phone - and integrate better with Windows/Office/SharePoint. Sim for work, sim for home. Separate those on one device. Does that make sense? Anyone know a bit more?

I'd love to see Windows Phone flourish AND keep the Nokia build quality!
my $0.02.

Mr. V

[SammyD97]

How in the hell do you turn off music that is playing, radio, stored music; any music. You can pause it but to turn it off takes a third party app like STOP MUSIC. Sorry, a simple exit within the app would be most helpful and even sensible.

I've seen this complaint before and I always find it strange that I've never owned a phone with a stop button. It's always the current set up. Maybe I just forgot but I really can't recall.

[SammyD97]

Everyone who owns a 920 and wanting to upgrade are being asked to wait and wait.....

920 users were given a phone; they didn't want it. People can't expect MS to change their phone refresh cycle because their current device isn't getting much love.