07-27-2015 07:25 PM
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  1. Edge007's Avatar
    You state there is a huge percentage of people out there who do use and need these apps. I'd like to know what this 'huge percentage' is? I'm betting the number is much smaller than you might realize. You can't calculate based on vocal 15-25 year olds in the forums. I only know 1 person who uses Kik and this person does so on a very limited basis. Almost everyone I know just uses texting and Facebook Messenger. Beats Music is owned by Apple now and Apple plans to integrate it into their own streaming service. The majority of Beats users are Android users so although Apple would very much like make it exclusive to iOS, they simply can't afford to lose that many users. What Microsoft needs to do is improve Xbox Music to properly compete with iTunes and Beats. Windows 10 looks promising but it's too early to tell.

    Banks such as Bank of America and Chase are all about maximizing profits. They couldn't care less about most customers, particularly those smaller customers who may just want the ability to make a mobile deposit, and these customers they make very little money off of in general. Also if 1% of their customers use the WP app, for example, they may have calculated that even if they lose half of them as customers, they would still be saving money by discontinuing support. Large business customers do not depend on the phone app.

    I'm certainly not saying there isn't a problem. There most definitely is. However, I think people tend to focus on the negative stuff when it comes to Windows and not anything else. This leads back to the perception I mentioned in a previous post. Tons of Android devices are currently being infected by viruses. Their phones are constantly crashing and many times apps don't work as expected. Apple recently released an iOS update that caused a lot of problems with the phones, causing many people to not be able to properly use their phones for a few days. The users don't really care though. They are quick to talk bad about Windows or Microsoft if there is an issue with it but if iOS or Android has a problem, they just shrug it off.
    To Maaz,

    Seemingly, we really don't know how many WP users are BOA customers, but when I look at the article that was mentioned on this site, there are about 780 Comments resulting from the article about BOA pulling their app from WP. Now, think for a second about how many people that did not comment regarding that story, and then think about the number of articles from other blog sites about BOA pulling their app from WP. So, although we don't have an actual statistic of BOA users that use the WP app. One thing for sure is, that it was significant enough for a lot of people to be upset with BOA's decision.

    Secondly, I hope that you realize that you have stereotyped the WP Central community as, "15-25 year olds in the forums." I hope that you were joking, because I am older than 25, plus, what does age have to do with wanting apps on Windows Phone. Are you saying that only 15-25 year olds that needs apps are the only group of people that are vocal?

    Lastly, you said that BOA and Chase are all about maximizing profits, but, it is a contradictory statement, because it really doesn't cost a lot of money to maintain a bank app on any platform (especially when you add in the bank fees). The app pays for itself thanks to a few customers that has access to the bank via the app, also, the numbers game is always changing, so, for BOA to remove the app counters the argument about maximizing profits. BOA has to consider in making this decision, that their competition will gain new customers from pulling their accounts away from BOA. Now, do you think that once that BOA customer that has left will return to BOA in the future. NO!

    Your last paragraph was dead on, and it is just another aspect of how this is the Season Of Hell For Windows Phone, because regardless of how good MSFT will put together WP10, the reality is that it is the Chicken vs. The Egg. Meaning, without apps there is nothing to attract customers, and without customers there is nothing to attract company/app developers. Also, the bloggers, are not balanced with their reporting, so, they lean towards whatever their Editor-in-chief wants to promote, which happens to influence consumers and company/app developers (meanwhile, MSFT has little to say about it, and chooses to do little about it). Every once in awhile, MSFT will do something to promote WP to companies/app developers, and once in awhile make a big splashing headline (like buying Sunrise Calendar, or investing in Cyanogen). But, for the most part what can we do about it? How can we change all of this negativity.
    02-08-2015 01:17 PM
  2. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    To Maaz,

    Seemingly, we really don't know how many WP users are BOA customers, but when I look at the article that was mentioned on this site, there are about 780 Comments resulting from the article about BOA pulling their app from WP. Now, think for a second about how many people that did not comment regarding that story, and then think about the number of articles from other blog sites about BOA pulling their app from WP. So, although we don't have an actual statistic of BOA users that use the WP app. One thing for sure is, that it was significant enough for a lot of people to be upset with BOA's decision.

    Secondly, I hope that you realize that you have stereotyped the WP Central community as, "15-25 year olds in the forums." I hope that you were joking, because I am older than 25, plus, what does age have to do with wanting apps on Windows Phone. Are you saying that only 15-25 year olds that needs apps are the only group of people that are vocal?

    Lastly, you said that BOA and Chase are all about maximizing profits, but, it is a contradictory statement, because it really doesn't cost a lot of money to maintain a bank app on any platform (especially when you add in the bank fees). The app pays for itself thanks to a few customers that has access to the bank via the app, also, the numbers game is always changing, so, for BOA to remove the app counters the argument about maximizing profits. BOA has to consider in making this decision, that their competition will gain new customers from pulling their accounts away from BOA. Now, do you think that once that BOA customer that has left will return to BOA in the future. NO!

    Your last paragraph was dead on, and it is just another aspect of how this is the Season Of Hell For Windows Phone, because regardless of how good MSFT will put together WP10, the reality is that it is the Chicken vs. The Egg. Meaning, without apps there is nothing to attract customers, and without customers there is nothing to attract company/app developers. Also, the bloggers, are not balanced with their reporting, so, they lean towards whatever their Editor-in-chief wants to promote, which happens to influence consumers and company/app developers (meanwhile, MSFT has little to say about it, and chooses to do little about it). Every once in awhile, MSFT will do something to promote WP to companies/app developers, and once in awhile make a big splashing headline (like buying Sunrise Calendar, or investing in Cyanogen). But, for the most part what can we do about it? How can we change all of this negativity.
    Edge007, the 15-25 year olds was in reference to the social apps such as Kik, Instagram, Snapchat, etc.. The majority of those users fall within that age group and they tend to be more vocal when it comes to complaining about apps in public. How often do you see a 50 year old complaining that there is no Snapchat on Windows Phone? Those of us who are a bit older are generally happy with what's available, and yes there are always exceptions. It was more statistically speaking and not meant to be a stereotype.

    I agree that the loss of Chase and Bank of America apps are a setback to the platform. Any major app loss is. However, many of the 780 comments were from people who did not actually use or care about these 2 apps. It was more so discussion of the setback and concern that despite the large number of apps the platform has gained, it lost 2 major ones. Banks make very little money off of the general customer when it comes to a checking account. In some cases, they even take a loss because they offer free checking with a minimum balance and the minimum balance isn't large enough for them to make money off of considering today's interest rates. When you offer a feature such as mobile deposit, it needs to be done in a secure way and security needs to be maintained and the app needs to be updated on a regular basis to accommodate updates to the platform. Sure, both banks have plenty of money to maintain and update the app. They could rewrite the app from scratch as a universal app and they very well might in the future but right now they don't want to spend any resources doing so to appeal to a small number of customers. They know that many customers will do without the mobile deposit feature because they primarily do direct deposit. They also know that if it is important enough to the customer, they will switch to an iPhone or Android the next time they are due for an upgrade. Lastly, there is the very small number of customers who will switch banks, whether it be out of principle or because it is legitimately too inconvenient for them to do without the feature and they absolutely refuse to give up on Windows Phones.

    You raise an interesting question, what can we do about the unbalanced reporting and the negativity? This is not something that can be addressed immediately. Microsoft has a real opportunity here by combining Windows on the desktop, tablet, Xbox, phone, and even Hololens. For the first time, tech sites are finally acknowledging that there is potential here. Now it's time for Microsoft to educate consumers on the capabilities and not mess it up again. They also need to be aggressive to push universal apps once Windows 10 is released citing the market share of all devices and not just phones. It will take some time; probably at least a year after Windows 10 is released but they have a real opportunity to make significant gains.
    Edge007 likes this.
    02-08-2015 01:51 PM
  3. tiziano27's Avatar
    ..The app it's coming to Android but more than likely it's not coming to Windows Phone...
    So, you think It's likely, and that's all.
    02-08-2015 02:03 PM
  4. BBerryPowerUser's Avatar
    To BBerryPowerUser,

    You get a big THANK YOU because you see the same thing I see, and you did something about it by telling the two people about WP 8.1. I wish that there were more of you, and more of us.

    Kudos to BBerryPowerUser!
    My Pleasure. Those of us that truly adopted and like WindowPhone have to stick together and discuss positives and negatives about the brand, or in fact it will continue to decline. As I typed earlier, I do tell everyone in my circle that I like my WindowsPhone. If I can get them to at least look at it, and play with Cortana, they are usually very impressed.

    iPhone has very beautiful equipment, that's for sure, but their architecture is now dated. Even with the improvements of iOS 8.x, it really dulls me to see page after page of icons plastered on the home screen pages. WindowsPhone is fresh, vibrant, fun and very productive to use. As I said, I'm not an App-Happy guy, but let's face it. Apps run the world of much of what a Smartphone does. You have to have the apps you want and need otherwise the platform is not that useful and somewhat frustrating to you. iPhone has an app for just about anything you can imagine, and they all work great. Well, at least all of them I have tried work great.

    So I look like Ari Gold from "Entourage" walking around with two phones. That alone triggers conversation. And it gives me an opening to show off the WindowsPhone platform to those asking why I carry two phones. :)
    Laura Knotek and aximtreo like this.
    02-08-2015 02:44 PM
  5. rhapdog's Avatar
    Apple recently released an iOS update that caused a lot of problems with the phones, causing many people to not be able to properly use their phones for a few days.
    *Off Topic Warning*
    Yet we hear so much whining on these forums about how Microsoft doesn't get the updates out fast enough for the next big OS or firmware, but Apple is always right on schedule. Personally, I'd rather it be right than be fast or on time.

    Kudos to Microsoft for taking the time to work with carriers to work out all the issues before it gets sent to the end user. Apple gets to shake it off fairly quickly. If Microsoft made the mistake, they would never live it down. They are expected to be perfection, which is why so many people are throwing a tizzy over the Win10 TP, because there are bugs and it is unfinished. Wah!

    Sorry about the rant, but your statement was demanding that I point out this obvious issue.

    Are you saying that only 15-25 year olds that needs apps are the only group of people that are vocal?]
    I don't think that's what Maaz was saying. I think it was just to point out that 15-25 year old people are the largest group of those that are the most vocal. I am quite vocal, but I try, for the most part, to be a voice of reason on the forums and not a doom and gloom naysayer (not that you are, just citing a specific type of example.) I am, however, quite vocal with honest critique directly to Microsoft for Windows 10 TP where I think it will do the most good. I'm 50, and I'm vocal. So no, it's not all 15-25, but that age range tends to be the largest group of the ones who are vocal.

    But, for the most part what can we do about it? How can we change all of this negativity.
    Microsoft still has a long road ahead, no doubt. However, the reason for much of what Microsoft is doing now is something that was said during the Windows 10 Event. They want people to "love" Microsoft again.

    I read an article on another site about how this guy, who was an iPhone junkie for years and years, had gotten completely away from all things Microsoft, said he woke up one morning and realize that he was a Microsoft Phone user, and that he was very happy with that. He also realized that he loves using the Microsoft apps, and it has made him want to look at more things Microsoft.

    It was when he looked at his iPhone one morning that made him realize this. Why? Because his 4 top apps that he used most often on his phone, out of all the apps available on the iPhone, were Acompli (now a Microsoft app), Sunrise (also now MSFT), Word, and Excel. He said those programs that are all Microsoft has him feeling good about Microsoft, and that he was considering looking at WP once Windows 10 came out to see what it had to offer.

    THAT is the kind of reaction a lot of people will be having as they wake up one day and realize that Microsoft has the best software on their phone. Doesn't matter what phone they have, they will start to love Microsoft, and, eventually, Microsoft hardware will be given another chance with Windows 10.

    Microsoft is already working to change all the negativity. Look at the ads they are running. Ads about them helping cancer patients. Patients who have lost limbs. I read an article this morning about how Microsoft is solving problems for business issues in the Healthcare industry, working to help bring down the cost of our health care. Things like this becoming public and marketed well will also help people to start to love Microsoft as a brand. When they realize their favorite email client is now Outlook, and that Microsoft does so much to help so many, people will change how they feel. Not everyone, sure, but I believe a majority will change how they feel. Will this give Microsoft WP the largest market share? I doubt it, but it will probably exceed Apple within 7 years.
    02-08-2015 03:36 PM
  6. Al4video's Avatar
    Not to be harsh but I would say just take a shot at growing up. It's a phone. That's all it is. You are not tied to it. You can head over to Apple or Android and get all the apps you could ever wish for. While I love windows phone I have a Samsung Tablet that gives me access to every single app i would like to whine about missing. And honestly that's not many. Mainly my banking app which I use rarely. For everything else I use my 1520.3 far more than I use my Tablet. I also have a Apple retina tablet which I hardly ever touch anymore. My 1520 has just replaced so much of the functionality of my other devices I rarely reach for them anymore. But worrying about where Windows phone is headed is a exercise in futility. Life will go on. You would be served better by trying to figure about where you are going.
    02-08-2015 04:41 PM
  7. vEEP pEEP's Avatar
    Hello,

    Just a point - American Bank apps are less important for non Americans. Marketshare for WP is higher in the UK for example. Do they have apps being pulled - that would concern me more.

    Of, I thought that said FreePINTS!!! Losing that would be far more distressing ...

    I do think things will work out for MS - their Surface is doing well. Windows 10 looks like a winner. MS has money - maybe they will try a real push? With Skype, Xbox, Surface, Windows10, Office, Bing - they offer a lot of services. I think WP has a future. I just hope they don't kill off WP 8 when WP10 comes out.....

    If you want an app, the best thing to do is contact the company and let them know. If they got 500 emails from different people wanting the app - it might happen.

    Sell a Surface 3, WP, Band combo?

    I just hope WP does better ... I miss the the Nokia days...
    Al4video likes this.
    02-08-2015 04:55 PM
  8. Ryzzlle's Avatar
    You state there is a huge percentage of people out there who do use and need these apps. I'd like to know what this 'huge percentage' is? I'm betting the number is much smaller than you might realize. You can't calculate based on vocal 15-25 year olds in the forums. I only know 1 person who uses Kik and this person does so on a very limited basis. Almost everyone I know just uses texting and Facebook Messenger. Beats Music is owned by Apple now and Apple plans to integrate it into their own streaming service. The majority of Beats users are Android users so although Apple would very much like make it exclusive to iOS, they simply can't afford to lose that many users. What Microsoft needs to do is improve Xbox Music to properly compete with iTunes and Beats. Windows 10 looks promising but it's too early to tell.

    Banks such as Bank of America and Chase are all about maximizing profits. They couldn't care less about most customers, particularly those smaller customers who may just want the ability to make a mobile deposit, and these customers they make very little money off of in general. Also if 1% of their customers use the WP app, for example, they may have calculated that even if they lose half of them as customers, they would still be saving money by discontinuing support. Large business customers do not depend on the phone app.

    I'm certainly not saying there isn't a problem. There most definitely is. However, I think people tend to focus on the negative stuff when it comes to Windows and not anything else. This leads back to the perception I mentioned in a previous post. Tons of Android devices are currently being infected by viruses. Their phones are constantly crashing and many times apps don't work as expected. Apple recently released an iOS update that caused a lot of problems with the phones, causing many people to not be able to properly use their phones for a few days. The users don't really care though. They are quick to talk bad about Windows or Microsoft if there is an issue with it but if iOS or Android has a problem, they just shrug it off.
    Again, you cannot say that an app isn't needed or has to be updated because you or your group don't use it.
    I'm an inner city HS student, and I can confidently say that kik is always the preferred method of texting friends, everyone uses it. To have a major social app like that that hasn't been updated since 2012 is ridiculous. My friend asked me what I was talking about, so I opened the app. When it did that little animation and went to the logo screen he was like "oh.." because they don't even use those colors anymore.
    Facebook messenger is super slow for me, I mean I have to wait for things to load, and the keyboard is slow to show. The regular messaging app was much more better, I have no idea why they changed it.
    I think it's great to speak about the negative aspects of WP, that way things can be changed, and improved upon. I love WP so much, the design, the way everything works and looks. This is why I am voicing my negative opinions so that way in the future, I'll only be able to voice positive ones :)
    aximtreo likes this.
    02-08-2015 05:03 PM
  9. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    Again, you cannot say that an app isn't needed or has to be updated because you or your group don't use it.
    I'm an inner city HS student, and I can confidently say that kik is always the preferred method of texting friends, everyone uses it. To have a major social app like that that hasn't been updated since 2012 is ridiculous. My friend asked me what I was talking about, so I opened the app. When it did that little animation and went to the logo screen he was like "oh.." because they don't even use those colors anymore.
    Facebook messenger is super slow for me, I mean I have to wait for things to load, and the keyboard is slow to show. The regular messaging app was much more better, I have no idea why they changed it.
    I think it's great to speak about the negative aspects of WP, that way things can be changed, and improved upon. I love WP so much, the design, the way everything works and looks. This is why I am voicing my negative opinions so that way in the future, I'll only be able to voice positive ones :)
    I stated that Kik and similar apps are popular among people in your age group and you guys are more vocal about it. That's perfectly fine. Although I find the statement about the logo screen and colors a bit of a silly argument, I recognize that the app probably has missing features found on other platforms that you want to use and I agree that it should be updated. I think some people have the misunderstanding that I think the app situation is fine. That's not the case at all. The more quality apps for the platform, the better it is. However what I'm saying is that there are a large number of users that these apps are not important enough if at all to choose a phone other the Windows and for a lot of people the current app situation is sufficient for their needs. They choose iPhone or Android for other reasons including but not limited to perception that Windows is inferior and wanting to belong to a particular clique of users of one of the other 2 platforms.
    Ryzzlle and rhapdog like this.
    02-08-2015 05:23 PM
  10. Ryzzlle's Avatar
    I stated that Kik and similar apps are popular among people in your age group and you guys are more vocal about it. That's perfectly fine. Although I find the statement about the logo screen and colors a bit of a silly argument, I recognize that the app probably has missing features found on other platforms that you want to use and I agree that it should be updated. I think some people have the misunderstanding that I think the app situation is fine. That's not the case at all. The more quality apps for the platform, the better it is. However what I'm saying is that there are a large number of users that these apps are not important enough if at all to choose a phone other the Windows and for a lot of people the current app situation is sufficient for their needs. They choose iPhone or Android for other reasons including but not limited to perception that Windows is inferior and wanting to belong to a particular clique of users of one of the other 2 platforms.
    Couldn't agree with you more on the app issue, on the quality of apps, and especially on the iOS/Android clique.
    02-08-2015 05:38 PM
  11. Alain_A's Avatar
    universal apps...you guys taking about "Universal web apps"?????
    02-08-2015 10:59 PM
  12. Wen Wong's Avatar
    Forgive me being a total noob on internet and its things, that I don't even know how to catergories WP and google together.. , but as a WP supporter for years ( since Mango ), it was full of frustration that WP never have gotten what it deserved, and many those frustration originated on Google company ( a lot more than Apple ). It made me really angry for Google sometimes, why are they being such a jerk.

    What I always don't get it is, why is that while Google is not necessary to provide Google Map, Google now, youtube, all their popular gagets on WP phones, WP on the other hands, they have to allow Chrome , Google.com on their desktop?? Let's face it, if they banned google and all its stuffs on desktop, it would have killed their business instantly?? ( maybe back 10 years ago.. )

    How can Google not think of this as gesture and give some graditute back put their stuffs on WP phones?? it's just not fair.
    Last edited by Laura Knotek; 02-08-2015 at 11:44 PM.
    02-08-2015 11:30 PM
  13. dKp1977's Avatar
    I couldn't agree more with this statement. Ballmer had good intentions, but the WORST possible execution.
    Wondering what all the Ballmer bashing lately is about. I'm not saying that everything he did was right and great, but let's face it: with a company as huge as Microsoft, it's just like in politics. Whatever you do right now doesn't come to full effect immediately. It takes years before you actually see the impact decisions may have. A lot of what has been going wrong regarding mobile was because of decisions Bill Gates made more than a decade ago. I'm not saying everything Bill Gates did was bad either, but in this certain case, it definitely was. Ballmer could have done more, or at least could've approached things differently, I don't doubt that, but if we see things change a little more to the positive side, it's not because Satya Nadella is the big savior here who turned things around in no time. It's because Ballmer already laid the foundation.
    02-09-2015 01:21 AM
  14. SamJHannan's Avatar
    Forgive me being a total noob on internet and its things, that I don't even know how to catergories WP and google together.. , but as a WP supporter for years ( since Mango ), it was full of frustration that WP never have gotten what it deserved, and many those frustration originated on Google company ( a lot more than Apple ). It made me really angry for Google sometimes, why are they being such a jerk.

    What I always don't get it is, why is that while Google is not necessary to provide Google Map, Google now, youtube, all their popular gagets on WP phones, WP on the other hands, they have to allow Chrome , Google.com on their desktop?? Let's face it, if they banned google and all its stuffs on desktop, it would have killed their business instantly?? ( maybe back 10 years ago.. )

    How can Google not think of this as gesture and give some graditute back put their stuffs on WP phones?? it's just not fair.
    Microsoft tried that by having Metro IE as the default browser on Windows 8. They were soon hit with a lawsuit regarding competition laws so were forced to add in that weird little "Default Browser Choice" app. Bizarre really, doesn't seem fair that Microsoft were forced when others still aren't.
    02-09-2015 01:45 AM
  15. dKp1977's Avatar
    Microsoft tried that by having Metro IE as the default browser on Windows 8. They were soon hit with a lawsuit regarding competition laws so were forced to add in that weird little "Default Browser Choice" app. Bizarre really, doesn't seem fair that Microsoft were forced when others still aren't.
    That wasn't the Modern UI IE and Windows 8, but Windows XP and IE 6, ;)
    02-09-2015 01:52 AM
  16. agentmikeyd99's Avatar
    In regards to the OP, are app develops dropping their apps, perhaps bc they need to be redone for Windows 10??
    02-09-2015 02:07 AM
  17. dKp1977's Avatar
    In regards to the OP, are app develops dropping their apps, perhaps bc they need to be redone for Windows 10??
    Unlikely. Microsoft will most certainly mess with some APIs again, but none of the changes would render entire apps useless. That would ultimately kill WP.
    aximtreo likes this.
    02-09-2015 02:14 AM
  18. AirSlab's Avatar
    I feel as though the OP is really passionate about the current situation and that's always good to see. If it helps, Edge007, I have a 930 and 2 of my friends have also picked one up, and my gran has a 520.

    My thoughts:

    1) Firstly, Nadella has a lot of rubbish to fix. 2014 was a messy year for WP with the acquisition of Nokia, but I feel he's started well and genuinely excited about the road ahead.
    2) I've read of people saying things like "WP will ALWAYS be behind" or "WP will NEVER succeed" . Just remember, Nokia was NEVER going to not be Number 1 and Android was NEVER going to a true competitor to iOS. Always is a long time.
    3) I feel as though Microsoft needs to get themselves into a predictable release cycle. By this I mean that every *insert month here* we need to be seeing a new WP flagship along with a phablet and of course other lower end devices throughout the year. My dad REALLY wanted a WP but with no concrete evidence of when the next flagship would arrive, he picked himself up an iPhone 6.
    4) The app gap exists but is closing and instead, I feel as though a bigger issue is search "discoverability" . The search function on the Store is really poor IMO. Perception, however, that we have no apps is hurting us, though for me, I have all I need.
    5) I honestly believe that WP is the best OS there is. It isn't as customizable as Android, but it's elegant, slick and works well.
    6) I think it's important to remember that the problems WP has aren't going to go away overnight. That's why, I've committed myself to this platform for 2 years. That will give MS enough time to straighten everything out. I don't expect WP to kill Android by end 2016, but I expect and believe there will be progress.
    7) I realise that WP is the smallest of the big OS's. This however, does NOT mean we have to be negative or assume that it's behind the curve. Seeing problems is easy, suggesting solutions not so much. I'm sick of the whole world going off about WP being bad or acting like WP users need to be the type that hide in the corner at dinner parties. Keep faith, and enjoy a platform that's getting better all the time.
    Tom Snyder likes this.
    02-09-2015 02:43 AM
  19. WPit's Avatar
    Since the Windows 10 event I've noticed the tech press which are usually anti Microsoft have become a lot more positive. With the new unified OS this could help boost Windows phone.
    Thank you! I've also noticed! Only a few people have mentioned this here, I'm afraid. I second! +925 +930

    And with Work Assistant, I believe we'll capture Office pole position again among mobiles?
    Last edited by WPit; 02-09-2015 at 09:50 AM.
    02-09-2015 05:12 AM
  20. HoosierDaddy's Avatar
    Banks such as Bank of America and Chase are all about maximizing profits. They couldn't care less about most customers, particularly those smaller customers who may just want the ability to make a mobile deposit, and these customers they make very little money off of in general. Also if 1% of their customers use the WP app, for example, they may have calculated that even if they lose half of them as customers, they would still be saving money by discontinuing support.
    Got to be THE silliest thing I've read here. But maybe you are on to something: the reason there are so few WP apps, is as you point out, even maintenance for an already published simple app costs more than the profits from thousands or even just mere hundreds of Windows Phone customers. Yeah, right.
    02-09-2015 07:58 AM
  21. TheCudder's Avatar
    Wondering what all the Ballmer bashing lately is about. I'm not saying that everything he did was right and great, but let's face it: with a company as huge as Microsoft, it's just like in politics. Whatever you do right now doesn't come to full effect immediately. It takes years before you actually see the impact decisions may have. A lot of what has been going wrong regarding mobile was because of decisions Bill Gates made more than a decade ago. I'm not saying everything Bill Gates did was bad either, but in this certain case, it definitely was. Ballmer could have done more, or at least could've approached things differently, I don't doubt that, but if we see things change a little more to the positive side, it's not because Satya Nadella is the big savior here who turned things around in no time. It's because Ballmer already laid the foundation.
    But we're not really bashing Balmer. He had a great idea to move towards mobile, but the execution was terrible --- and I know he wasn't the guy behind it all, but he certainly had the power to change the execution & overall plan. From the Windows 8 UI/UX, alienating the core functionality of Windows, Windows RT, poor marketing, over bloated company (unnecessary divisions) and fragmentation within the company --- I'd have to say Balmer has to take the blame on all of that.
    02-09-2015 08:33 AM
  22. MikeSo's Avatar
    Got to be THE silliest thing I've read here. But maybe you are on to something: the reason there are so few WP apps, is as you point out, even maintenance for an already published simple app costs more than the profits from thousands or even just mere hundreds of Windows Phone customers. Yeah, right.
    Maintenance costs a lot of money. Every other change in the system would have to be done so the WP8 app kept working, and for a bank of this size that is a lot of money. I have no doubt that the very few WP8 customers who can't use the mobile website instead was worth losing.
    02-09-2015 08:36 AM
  23. MikeSo's Avatar
    I agree about Windows Central doing some real reporting about the app situation. It's a good opportunity for the site to establish itself, if nothing else.
    02-09-2015 08:39 AM
  24. MDMcAtee's Avatar
    Nadella is still fighting the "old boys club" with all the different fractions at Microsoft.

    There is a chance for WP becoming a real Player in mobile but it's going to take a heck of a lot to convince people who are invested on the other platforms to switch.

    Microsoft is dammed if they do and dammed if they don't namely because they are going to po many of their supporters when they restructure their phone line. The premise of not having to have high end spec's to have the best experience with it is going to go away. Today's phones are soon going to become a extention of the desktop and to do this they will need to be able to run all the programs without bogging down and receive all updates when produced

    All one has to do is to look at what is being said about the 512 mb phones not getting all the features of Windows 10 to see the anger there.

    I think the season of hell hasn't really started yet. I think it is yet to come. Loosing a few banking apps isn't the end of the world and won't make or break the platform , and the patents Microsoft gained from buying Nokia will pay dividends for years to come.

    I'm going to reverse my long standing position here. I feel Microsoft has put itself in a very bad position by allowing multiple oems to produce Windows phones. While to some myself included thought that the more the merrier was/is a good thing, it's only going to be problematic in the long run.

    Microsoft needs to consolidate it's entire mobile phone line to 4 phones. Phablet Flagship medium tier and low-end from 1 manufacturer. The experience needs to be the same across all 4 so people will know exactly what they are going to get with each model at the price point they are buying. Apple now does it with 2 models and is just 1 of the reasons they do so well. Once the hardware issue has been rectified across the entire family of phones the software can be corrected. People know what they are getting with a iPhone and while it may be boring to the majority here by being the same, they have developed a sales leader... Google on the other hand promotes being different but all the same and that is a lie because they aren't the same experience... I know this I use Android phones. Microsoft is in a very unique position right now with Windows 10 and if they could capitalize on being this they could very easily overtake the other platforms market share.

    I understand why Microsoft chose to flood the low-end market but that strategy is going to backfire on them in the long-term. They need to consolidate now just as they needed to loose the legacy devices on the desktop to move forward without bogging the new system down with code and none of this is easy when faced with just how many older devices are still in use and the costs to upgrade. Dammed if you do... Dammed if you don't... The only true business model that works is for planned obsolescence and this doesn't sit well with many people.

    Nope this isn't the season of hell for Microsoft... Not yet... That will be when they do what is needed to the mobile division because that will be the only way they will ever be a true leader in the market. The experience needs to be the same across all screen sizes and if the hardware isn't the same there is no way that they can ever deliver on the experience. This is Apple's strength and why they do so well and why everyone else is struggling to break even.

    Software tweaks only go so far to help but it is the hardware that makes or breaks the phone. While I know that many people can't afford a new phone every other year, its going to be the norm to have the best experience with it.

    I want Windows phone to succeed but I don't see how it can if they don't change how they do things and the "old boys club" is allowed to keep running things there.

    Cry me a river if you want but then build me bridge to get over it... Posted from my HTC M8
    aximtreo and Edge007 like this.
    02-09-2015 09:09 AM
  25. Alain_A's Avatar
    Microsoft needs to consolidate it's entire mobile phone line to 4 phones. Phablet Flagship medium tier and low-end from 1 manufacturer.
    agreed
    02-09-2015 09:43 AM
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