07-27-2015 07:25 PM
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  1. Edge007's Avatar
    Hello 2015,

    Apparently, this year is Windows Phone Season Of Hell, in other words, companies and developers are coming toward a consensus that they need to pull their apps from Windows Phone. I feel like with Windows Phone 10 around the corner, that we are starting over again (but, we really are not). I have been a Windows Phone user since going back to the Samsung Focus WP OS 7. I have remained a WP user from 2011 up to now. Admittedly, Windows Phone only has a small segment of marketshare in the mobile phone environment, but nevertheless, as this year is starting, we have lost big time apps from Chase, Bank Of America, and Beats Music (and to add insult, FreePrints).

    Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella has said that Windows Phone is here to stay, in a recent ABC News interview this week. Microsoft has committed to supporting WP with Office Cortana updates, and Swatch is creating a smartwatch to operate in conjunction with WP.

    The point is that the weather around WP is so unstable, in which, everything that Microsoft tries to encourage is being destroyed by negative news, negative blogsites, negative third party company/developers, and negative marketshare news (regardless, of some positive news), to create the atmosphere of eliminating WP. Microsoft needs to take a forward stance to address the problems and concerns for the consciousness of WP users, we need to hear from Satya Nadella in detail what the vision for WP is. We need for App developers to send a message to the public of their support of WP. We need for WP Central to go on the offensive by doing investigative reporting about App Gap for WP, as well as, reach out to companies/developers on what WP needs to do to regain support of their app development for WP. We need to take every opportunity on social media, to promote WP (make a YouTube video, post on Instagram, Facebook, Myspace, Twitter, etc.).

    Please tell me what you think, and how you will be an influence to others regarding making WP grow.

    Sincerely,
    Edge 007
    02-07-2015 04:14 PM
  2. WDavis4692's Avatar
    I think that for all the negativity, there's positivity. Of all the apps pulled lately I am glad to say I don't use any of them, nor can I imagine them being missed by all that many users.

    In a way W10 IS a reboot because it stirs the pot up far more than previous versions have done. Let's face it, Ballmer was a buffoon. Now he's gone it feels like things are actually starting to move.
    02-07-2015 05:58 PM
  3. TheCudder's Avatar
    Let's face it, Ballmer was a buffoon. Now he's gone it feels like things are actually starting to move.
    I couldn't agree more with this statement. Ballmer had good intentions, but the WORST possible execution.
    02-07-2015 06:32 PM
  4. tiziano27's Avatar
    Beats Music is in the store. FreePrints? what's that? who cares? The bank apps are important, that's a big lost.

    WP has more apps than It deserves for the low market share it has. It's normal if some apps are retired, but they can comeback if market conditions improve.
    Edge007 and colinkiama like this.
    02-07-2015 06:51 PM
  5. m3tv's Avatar
    As a Developer and WP supporter i couldn't agree more. Only problem is getting support for your App you want to make or making it known. I'm developing a (basic) NHL app that I think many NHL fans would like along with individual NHL Team apps. Only issue is developers are finding it hard to find ways to spread their app and get support for it
    Edge007, Al4video, leo74 and 1 others like this.
    02-07-2015 06:59 PM
  6. realwarder's Avatar
    Over the last year there have been a lot more gains than losses. It's easy to look at a few US losses where market share is tiny, but in the rest of the world the platform is doing well and expanding.
    02-07-2015 07:03 PM
  7. Edge007's Avatar
    Ballmer may be seen as a buffoon, but in reality, he could not implement the changes efficiently. Nadela is implementing Ballmer's ideas, with Ballmer behind the scene. There is a Yahoo article that suggests that this is happening. Do a Bing search tagged, "Ballmer Microsoft".
    KarmaEcrivain94 and Jazmac like this.
    02-07-2015 07:23 PM
  8. tiziano27's Avatar
    To tiziano27,

    ​Apple is planning to remove Beats App from WP. Check out the article at wmpoweruser.

    That's a rumor.
    02-07-2015 08:07 PM
  9. Edge007's Avatar
    Okay, so, if the article about Beats is just a rumor, then, I hope that Apple doesn't pull Beats from Windows Marketplace. But, suppose it is true, then, it becomes another negative axe against WP. The conjecture is developers are pulling their apps from WP because of marketshare. Also, just having articles pronouncing that Apple will pull Beats App from the Windows Marketplace, hurts WP image, and places a bad taste into potential future WP users.

    ​So, this type of reporting is what I am trying to explain of how we are now experiencing a Season Of Hell, as a WP user.

    ​If my contract was (hypothetically speaking), and I am currently an Android or iPhone user, if I have apps that I use, but it was not supported for WP, then, I would not consider getting a WP. Plus, if I never had a cell phone, and I wanted a smartphone that I could the most from with apps (also, 9 out of 10 of my friends ether had Android or iPhone, also, there is a higher chance that my home alarm, Nest thermostat, OnStar/Sync, etc. interacts only with Android or iPhone), then, I would not consider getting a WP.

    ​So, the question is how will we do our part to strengthen Window Phone? Because, this is a battle that unless we question Microsoft, the media bloggers, and app creators, then, no matter how many times MSFT updates WP (or introduce new phones) is destined to always be in 3rd place in market share and losing apps. What are we going to do about it?
    02-07-2015 08:58 PM
  10. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    I agree that there is a problem with the apps, both in missing ones as well as ones that lack features found on other platforms or ones that are buggy and not been updated in several months or even a couple of years. However, I'm what one would consider a power user, yet my Lumia 1520 does everything I want it to do. Why? I don't care about the latest games. I rarely play anyway. I have a credit card from both Chase and BoA; very rarely opened the mobile app. My main bank is PNC; they never had a WP app but I've used the app on an iPad and found mobile deposit a big pain. You have to get the perfect picture both front and back and it often takes more than 1 attempt; then they want you to hang on to the original check for a few weeks just in case. It's far easier for me to go a few blocks and put the check in an ATM. And nowdays direct deposit is very common and eliminates the need to deposit most paper checks. And we have Mint app that is good for both downloading transactions and tracking expenses.

    So IMDB hasn't been updated in years; I just pinned the mobile site. It works great, fully functional. YouTube isn't available? Who cares. Metrotube and myTube work great. Google maps and related apps; why not use HERE and good selection of other mapping apps available in the Store. Why does it have to be Google? Snapchat - I never understood the concept. Why would you want to receive a message only to have it disappear a few seconds later and no option to save it? I think it's the most pointless thing. I don't understand the appeal. Beats Music? We still have it as of now but even if we lost it, Pandora and Spotify work just fine. How many similar apps do you need?

    So what percentage of people stay away from Windows Phone solely because of the app situation? There are a ton of people, especially the older generation, that could care less about apps. All they want to do is call, text, read the news, and check e-mail, and if they happen to have Facebook or Twitter, we have those too and they could care less if 1 or 2 small features are missing. They aren't knowledgeable enough to really even notice.
    So my question is - Are apps the primary problem or is it poor reputation/negative press or something else? Sure, there are a number of people who depend on a particular app for a given reason but 95% of all smartphone users? I think not! WP and Windows are perceived to be inferior products by the general public. In addition, Apple is considered to be cool and it's more like an exclusive club and a large number of people of a certain class want to be like everyone else and have an iPhone as well and as a bonus they get to talk to each other with FaceTime and use iMessage, something that there non-Apple friends can't do. Android is more capable, but doesn't have those exclusive apps. A typical Android chooses Android because they are locked in the Google ecosystem and likes the low prices and flexibility that Android provides. Google forces you to get an e-mail address from them and then makes one service depend on another just so you have to use them all. Then it is all advertising based so no fee to users, drawing a large appeal. Tech savvy youngsters and salespeople convince others that Android is the way to go and that Windows is a thing of the past and totally uncool to have. This is something that is difficult to overcome, but at the same time, Microsoft earned a large amount of positive press following the Windows 10 event last month. So I guess only time will tell.
    02-07-2015 10:23 PM
  11. 1101x10's Avatar
    Since the Windows 10 event I've noticed the tech press which are usually anti Microsoft have become a lot more positive. With the new unified OS this could help boost Windows phone.
    Edge007, rhapdog and WPit like this.
    02-07-2015 10:28 PM
  12. BBerryPowerUser's Avatar
    The OP's post was clear, concise, and resonated. I think it's been a tough year for WP and will continue that way for a while.

    My "opinion"?

    First, I'm no stranger to being on a down-trending platform. I still own a BlackBerry that I don't use, but can't, for some reason, yet part with. I love the way it "bridges" to my Playbook. The two are a superior platform and could have blown away anything on the market...IF... they had supported it. Like WP, the apps for Playbook just dwindled to the point that there was little one could do to prepare the Playbook for stellar productivity and personal enjoyment. There are still times when I am tempted to pull the Sim and put it back in my BlackBerry.

    Second, I humbly admit I carry an iPhone 4s. It's my primary driver lately because I can get any possible app I want, and they all WORK. Most better than I expect. I do NOT care for the iOS platform. The plastering of ICONS on screens is outdated to my taste. But, the new 8.x OS is on par with Android and close to WP.

    However;

    In my opinion, WindowsPhone with Live tiles and the 8.1 update with Cortana is a great, and I mean GREAT platform. If I could get an Amazon Prime Music app that actually streamed my Prime Music like my iPhone does, and if I could get a Banking App like my iPhone has were I can actually deposit a check via picture taking, and a decent RingTo App, I would drop my iPhone in a heartbeat. I'm not an App-Happy guy but I need what I need.

    I am amazed, as a Jazz Lover, that "Jazz Radio" actually HAS AN APP ON WINDOWS PHONE. I was SHOCKED. And it WORKS! I think the core apps of Twitter and Facebook are fine. But the lack of Banking Apps other than Wells Fargo (I wish I had a Wells Fargo Branch near me) are a pain. Even long awaited apps like Flipboard debuted with lack-luster performance. It doen't even "FLIP" for crying out loud.

    I will stick with WP because I think it's the best platform out there. Period. But I have to carry an iPhone as well. I sure wish I didn't.

    I have been able to interest TWO people in WP8.1. TWO. One of them got a WP. The other stuck with Android. That's the best I could do for you OP. Better than noting. I do tell everyone in my networking circle that I love my Windows Phone. They are always curious to look at the live tiles home page. That's, at the very least, a good sign.
    02-07-2015 10:31 PM
  13. Edge007's Avatar
    I agree that there is a problem with the apps, both in missing ones as well as ones that lack features found on other platforms or ones that are buggy and not been updated in several months or even a couple of years. However, I'm what one would consider a power user, yet my Lumia 1520 does everything I want it to do. Why? I don't care about the latest games. I rarely play anyway. I have a credit card from both Chase and BoA; very rarely opened the mobile app. My main bank is PNC; they never had a WP app but I've used the app on an iPad and found mobile deposit a big pain. You have to get the perfect picture both front and back and it often takes more than 1 attempt; then they want you to hang on to the original check for a few weeks just in case. It's far easier for me to go a few blocks and put the check in an ATM. And nowdays direct deposit is very common and eliminates the need to deposit most paper checks. And we have Mint app that is good for both downloading transactions and tracking expenses.

    So IMDB hasn't been updated in years; I just pinned the mobile site. It works great, fully functional. YouTube isn't available? Who cares. Metrotube and myTube work great. Google maps and related apps; why not use HERE and good selection of other mapping apps available in the Store. Why does it have to be Google? Snapchat - I never understood the concept. Why would you want to receive a message only to have it disappear a few seconds later and no option to save it? I think it's the most pointless thing. I don't understand the appeal. Beats Music? We still have it as of now but even if we lost it, Pandora and Spotify work just fine. How many similar apps do you need?

    So what percentage of people stay away from Windows Phone solely because of the app situation? There are a ton of people, especially the older generation, that could care less about apps. All they want to do is call, text, read the news, and check e-mail, and if they happen to have Facebook or Twitter, we have those too and they could care less if 1 or 2 small features are missing. They aren't knowledgeable enough to really even notice.
    So my question is - Are apps the primary problem or is it poor reputation/negative press or something else? Sure, there are a number of people who depend on a particular app for a given reason but 95% of all smartphone users? I think not! WP and Windows are perceived to be inferior products by the general public. In addition, Apple is considered to be cool and it's more like an exclusive club and a large number of people of a certain class want to be like everyone else and have an iPhone as well and as a bonus they get to talk to each other with FaceTime and use iMessage, something that there non-Apple friends can't do. Android is more capable, but doesn't have those exclusive apps. A typical Android chooses Android because they are locked in the Google ecosystem and likes the low prices and flexibility that Android provides. Google forces you to get an e-mail address from them and then makes one service depend on another just so you have to use them all. Then it is all advertising based so no fee to users, drawing a large appeal. Tech savvy youngsters and salespeople convince others that Android is the way to go and that Windows is a thing of the past and totally uncool to have. This is something that is difficult to overcome, but at the same time, Microsoft earned a large amount of positive press following the Windows 10 event last month. So I guess only time will tell.
    To Maaz,

    I can agree with 99% of your post, and quite actually you made some good points about how you work around app issues. But, it also shows why if the App Developers would either create an app, or update the app, then, it would make your process of using your WP easier (and, that is what Technology is supposed to be about).

    Yes, Android and Apple users act as if they belong to the "Country Club", but that is what is so isolating about being a WP user, in which, we know that we are like ******* children (not treated fairly by the media, company/app developer, and US consumer perception). To me, the Windows 10 event, is almost like the Windows 7.5 event, Windows 8 event, and Windows 8.1 event, in which, the media is nice for the 1st couple of months, but, then, when the time for Quarter results to be displayed come around, then, it becomes "History repeating itself."

    So, what can we do change the perception, and help WP grow (because, the US markets and the media are against Microsoft)? Also, think about what happened when Palm OS (namely the Palm Pre) was in this same situation, and how things started to fall apart for Palm. I don't think that this will happen to MSFT WP, but if the trend of losing marketshare continues, then, eventually MSFT will drop WP, and move to Cyanogen (and, it has made a big investment into it).

    The time to establish an extended WP future begins now, otherwise, WP will become alienated to where the question for why keep a WP become irrelevant.
    02-07-2015 11:09 PM
  14. Edge007's Avatar
    To BBerryPowerUser,

    You get a big THANK YOU because you see the same thing I see, and you did something about it by telling the two people about WP 8.1. I wish that there were more of you, and more of us.

    Kudos to BBerryPowerUser!
    02-07-2015 11:13 PM
  15. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    Edge007, I think Microsoft would allow Android apps to run on Windows to address the app gap before they converted to Cyanogen. I don't see them reversing their One Windows strategy anytime in the next few years at least. The purpose of the Cyanogen investment is to push Microsoft apps and services and take away from Google. The less reliant people become on Google, the better it is for Windows.

    Windows 10 has gotten better press than the other versions you mentioned. Sites such as The Verge and CNet who are usually anti Microsoft are changing their tone.

    I also have 2 people on WP, a friend and a family member. I see others with WPs on occasion, almost every week, but typically the lower class with prepaid cheap phones. This is good but we need others using it too.
    realwarder and eomes like this.
    02-07-2015 11:53 PM
  16. Francois Tetu's Avatar
    I use Bank of America app at least on a weekly basis to deposit checks. That app works wonderfully. I use the Wells Fargo too which works very fine, inspite of being a little finiky regarding picture framing of the check/acceptance/readiness at taking the pic. I am seriously thinking about a solution at making a choice between bank vs Microsoft. In another hand, I have vonage since 10 years. I use it when calling in Canada (international) at 9.99 a month. Vonage has an extension available as an app for iPhone & android to be able to use their service with a smartphone. Microsoft has to do something about it in forgiving the toys for the tools.
    02-08-2015 08:34 AM
  17. DavidinCT's Avatar
    I think that for all the negativity, there's positivity. Of all the apps pulled lately I am glad to say I don't use any of them, nor can I imagine them being missed by all that many users.

    In a way W10 IS a reboot because it stirs the pot up far more than previous versions have done. Let's face it, Ballmer was a buffoon. Now he's gone it feels like things are actually starting to move.
    With the loss of the Bank of America app (ending soon), Not sure this is not going to be missed by many users, in fact a lot....

    This is a big one for me, I love WP but, because of this one app (that I use a lot), I might have to re-think my option for a phone.

    Wish BOA would re-think their choice here, people who are BOA customers should hit their phone, twitter, Facebook and see if we can get this turned around.

    :(
    Edge007 likes this.
    02-08-2015 08:37 AM
  18. Blkacesvf41's Avatar
    With the loss of the Bank of America app (ending soon), Not sure this is not going to be missed by many users, in fact a lot....

    This is a big one for me, I love WP but, because of this one app (that I use a lot), I might have to re-think my option for a phone.

    Wish BOA would re-think their choice here, people who are BOA customers should hit their phone, twitter, Facebook and see if we can get this turned around.

    :(
    Yes, apps such as those do make you look and think about other platforms. I'll hang tough, wait and give Windows 10 a decent chance. If Microsoft can implement the Universal apps concept in a successful way, then there's a chance that these will reappear in the WP store.
    Edge007 likes this.
    02-08-2015 09:09 AM
  19. EBUK's Avatar
    they could care less
    *COULDN'T care less.
    02-08-2015 09:59 AM
  20. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    *COULDN'T care less.
    Okay, fine. It's a common grammatical error I made but the context made it fairly clear what I meant. Thanks for taking the time to read my post though.
    DavidinCT likes this.
    02-08-2015 10:35 AM
  21. Ryzzlle's Avatar
    I mean, having 2 of the largest banks in the U.S. kinda give up on windows phone might be saying something.
    Why do we have to pin a mobile site onto our start screens when other users with iOS and Android get an app?
    If we want people to migrate to windows phone, or make their first phone a windows phone, we really do need all these apps. If I'm an iOS user who uses Beats Music, Kik, and a few bank apps, why would I want to choose a platform that has rumors that Beat Music is going off, a kik app that hasn't been updated in nearly 3 years, and apps for banks that won't exist very soon?
    Most the arguments I've seen so far is "I don't use it, so I really don't care"
    But that's being too conformist. there is a huge percentage of people out there who do use and need these apps.
    We can't pick and choose what app we want/need based on whether or not a person actually uses it, we need to have all these apps in the marketplace so that people making the switch can be confident that they will have the same app experience on WP.
    02-08-2015 11:19 AM
  22. CSJr1's Avatar
    In response to the evil from Google and the indifference from Apple towards Microsoft, I tend to support the fighter and underdog: Microsoft. The pioneer in the mobile computing field. The one who has vision for ubiquitous computing across all devices. The one who offers services to all OS's despite the shun from others. The one focused on universal cables like USB instead of proprietary ones. The one focused on universal wireless Miracast streaming instead proprietary Airplay.

    So I support WP by finding those companies that support it. Bought a brother printer because of their wireless printing app. Home automation; Insteon because if the Insteon supported apps. I must have doubled my efforts to use my bank app just to let them know I appreciate their app support. If a couple of companies drop support of their app, drop support of them or at least express your displeasure.
    Last edited by CSJr1; 02-08-2015 at 01:23 PM.
    EBUK and rhapdog like this.
    02-08-2015 11:50 AM
  23. Edge007's Avatar
    With the loss of the Bank of America app (ending soon), Not sure this is not going to be missed by many users, in fact a lot....

    This is a big one for me, I love WP but, because of this one app (that I use a lot), I might have to re-think my option for a phone.

    Wish BOA would re-think their choice here, people who are BOA customers should hit their phone, twitter, Facebook and see if we can get this turned around.

    :(
    I am working on switching from BOA to Wells Fargo, and once completed, I will give BOA my two cents (especially, since I have been their customer for 19 years).
    02-08-2015 12:25 PM
  24. Maaz Mansori's Avatar
    I mean, having 2 of the largest banks in the U.S. kinda give up on windows phone might be saying something.
    Why do we have to pin a mobile site onto our start screens when other users with iOS and Android get an app?
    If we want people to migrate to windows phone, or make their first phone a windows phone, we really do need all these apps. If I'm an iOS user who uses Beats Music, Kik, and a few bank apps, why would I want to choose a platform that has rumors that Beat Music is going off, a kik app that hasn't been updated in nearly 3 years, and apps for banks that won't exist very soon?
    Most the arguments I've seen so far is "I don't use it, so I really don't care"
    But that's being too conformist. there is a huge percentage of people out there who do use and need these apps.
    We can't pick and choose what app we want/need based on whether or not a person actually uses it, we need to have all these apps in the marketplace so that people making the switch can be confident that they will have the same app experience on WP.
    You state there is a huge percentage of people out there who do use and need these apps. I'd like to know what this 'huge percentage' is? I'm betting the number is much smaller than you might realize. You can't calculate based on vocal 15-25 year olds in the forums. I only know 1 person who uses Kik and this person does so on a very limited basis. Almost everyone I know just uses texting and Facebook Messenger. Beats Music is owned by Apple now and Apple plans to integrate it into their own streaming service. The majority of Beats users are Android users so although Apple would very much like make it exclusive to iOS, they simply can't afford to lose that many users. What Microsoft needs to do is improve Xbox Music to properly compete with iTunes and Beats. Windows 10 looks promising but it's too early to tell.

    Banks such as Bank of America and Chase are all about maximizing profits. They couldn't care less about most customers, particularly those smaller customers who may just want the ability to make a mobile deposit, and these customers they make very little money off of in general. Also if 1% of their customers use the WP app, for example, they may have calculated that even if they lose half of them as customers, they would still be saving money by discontinuing support. Large business customers do not depend on the phone app.

    I'm certainly not saying there isn't a problem. There most definitely is. However, I think people tend to focus on the negative stuff when it comes to Windows and not anything else. This leads back to the perception I mentioned in a previous post. Tons of Android devices are currently being infected by viruses. Their phones are constantly crashing and many times apps don't work as expected. Apple recently released an iOS update that caused a lot of problems with the phones, causing many people to not be able to properly use their phones for a few days. The users don't really care though. They are quick to talk bad about Windows or Microsoft if there is an issue with it but if iOS or Android has a problem, they just shrug it off.
    02-08-2015 12:31 PM
  25. MaxyBley's Avatar
    Beats Music is in the store. FreePrints? what's that? who cares? The bank apps are important, that's a big lost.
    In case you didn't know. Apple bought Beats Music. And while at first they said that they were going to help development for all the current platforms. They are now developing a new app to replace the Beats app. This new app will be more integrated with iTunes. The app it's coming to Android but more than likely it's not coming to Windows Phone.

    I don't use Beats Music never had but it sucks for those that do.
    02-08-2015 01:10 PM
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