Does MS know how to win with consumers?

[fatclue_98]

I didn't say that the younger crowd isn't important, but to think they drive the market and that they're doing the purchasing is ludicrous. It's mom and dad for the most part, not the kids.

Sent from an old warhorse Gateway NV79

 

[Cody Patterson]

No lol, that is the point! It is the young crowd with parents who spend money that do in fact drive the market. This is not uncommon knowledge. As someone who does marketing for a living, I know that for a fact.

 

[RumoredNow]

They would have to look at people in the 16-18 year old range (young, starting first jobs, fairly hip to modern music and trends). If you asked then what they would want, a Windows Tablet or an iPad, what do you think they would say ? I would almost bet by a very high margin that they would say an iPad. Why ? Because it's cool. The Windows Tablet would see limited on younger minds because their parents use Windows and they want to be different. This is why these devices are so successful. Android is trying to get on that market and the only way they can right now is with a $59 tablet (very low prices)

Every Soccer Mom has an iPad or an Android based Kindle.

When I went overseas I saw about 16, 000 Moms and Dads in their 30's and older each day taking selfies with their iPad Air tablets.

 

[raycpl]

Ooow.. over here, adults uses 4"-6" phones, they wont be caught dead taking photos using a iPad or Tab. Those have been relegated to the little kids as baby-sitter substitutes... although I would add, I hardly see anyone using a Win tablet out in the wild....

 

[Visa Declined]

Recent reports show that Apple Watch sales have tanked.

Are you sure? Apple posts another record quarter, with over $1 billion in Apple Watch sales | The Verge

 

[Great deal]

Brands perception changes over time, people are bombarded with the latest and greatest in every area and product, most are programmed to change often. Apple has absolutely creamed and milked the idevices and there is not much more they can do with an OS that is so closed and limited. The perception used to be (still is to a degree) that macs were the go to option for designers, graphics etc, that is no longer the case.

IMO MS will eat into the Apple pie and slowly we will see bigger slices in mobile. So far as enterprise goes, MS has it sewn up and Apple has zero change of competing.

As I take a step back and look at the mobile platforms I see Intel powered devices able to work harmoniously with desktop software being the obvious choice. Continuum is the future and Apple's slice in enterprise looks likely to drop as W10 takes hold.

 

[mjperry51]

Without disclosing specific figures, Maestri said sales of the Apple Watch beat the company's expectations.

Apple gives weak forecast, shares fall nearly 7 percent

 

[MikeX74]

Apple gives weak forecast, shares fall nearly 7 percent

Don't confuse the health of the stock with the health of the company. Apple beat their own record in iPhone sales vs the year-ago quarter, while adding even more money to their already ridiculous cash hoard. Regardless of what Wall Street thinks right now, Apple is doing just fine.

 

[psiu_glen]

Don't confuse the health of the stock with the health of the company. Apple beat their own record in iPhone sales vs the year-ago quarter, while adding even more money to their already ridiculous cash hoard. Regardless of what Wall Street thinks right now, Apple is doing just fine.

Also ridiculously, look at something like Qualcomm. The 810 wasn't an epic unqualified smash hit, and one of the hedge funds that owns a huge portion of them wants to change things up.

You know, for short term stock spikes (and sells), not any actual long term business sense. You can always tell when things are about to go downhill long term when the R&D divisions get cleared out, all manufacturing is offloaded, and companies just become licensing/service platforms. The march to irrelevance and patent trolling is not far behind.

 

[mjperry51]

Don't confuse the health of the stock with the health of the company. Apple beat their own record in iPhone sales vs the year-ago quarter, while adding even more money to their already ridiculous cash hoard. Regardless of what Wall Street thinks right now, Apple is doing just fine.

I was not speaking to Apple's current corporate health. I know they're sitting on a mountain of cash, and IPhone sales were strong. The stock dropped because they didn't meet analysts expectations. Despite Apple's rhetoric, I believe IWatch sales were lower than they hoped internally. And the IWatch will not have the same open playing filed as the IPad and IPhone had at their introductions. Further -- I haven't seen the kind of Jobs-like visionary leadership out of Tim Cook that would comfort investors, and Apple sitting on that cash is going to wear on those investors over time.

My overriding point is that I view Apple as vulnerable; tablets and smartphones are becoming a saturated marketplace with solid competition. Even Yahoo Tech is doing features on Cortana.

Apple isn't going away -- however I don't see them as the invincible force they were 5 years ago.

 

[MikeX74]

I was not speaking to Apple's current corporate health. I know they're sitting on a mountain of cash, and IPhone sales were strong. The stock dropped because they didn't meet analysts expectations. Despite Apple's rhetoric, I believe IWatch sales were lower than they hoped internally. And the IWatch will not have the same open playing filed as the IPad and IPhone had at their introductions. Further -- I haven't seen the kind of Jobs-like visionary leadership out of Tim Cook that would comfort investors, and Apple sitting on that cash is going to wear on those investors over time.

My overriding point is that I view Apple as vulnerable; tablets and smartphones are becoming a saturated marketplace with solid competition. Even Yahoo Tech is doing features on Cortana.

Apple isn't going away -- however I don't see them as the invincible force they were 5 years ago.

That's right, analyst's expectations, AKA the numbers they pulled out of their asses. That's how analysts work, especially where Apple is concerned. As for the Watch, it's hard to say that sales didn't meet Apple's expectations when A: we don't know the actual sales and B: we don't know what their expectations are.

 

[mjperry51]

That's right, analyst's expectations, AKA the numbers they pulled out of their asses. That's how analysts work, especially where Apple is concerned. As for the Watch, it's hard to say that sales didn't meet Apple's expectations when A: we don't know the actual sales and B: we don't know what their expectations are.

I don't agree with your assertion of how analysts derive their expectations. What's your beef with analysts?

AFA IWatch sales go -- I expressed an opinion. I believe absent official projections from Apple as to their expectations, the nature of the organization would be to offer a more enthusiastic statement about sales if numbers were in line or exceeded those expectations. Apple has never been shy in that area. Their announcement was very "nice", and sounded a lot like the kinds of statements made by the analysts you seem to abhor. I'm not stating fact -- it's my observation. You're certainly entitled to your opinion; I'm expressing mine.

 

[Great deal]

Its all swings and roundabouts - Apple have a firm grip on consumer, Microsoft a firm grip on business. Can Apple leverage that to make inroads into MS, the answer is an easy no. Can MS leverage that to make inroads into Apple, the answer is perhaps, and we will find out over the next 12 months. I cant wait to see MS fight back, for the last year at least they have taken a beating by us armchair critics while they have been beavering away restructuring, reshaping, building, improving, listening and under Satya's obviously clear and fresh leadership they have vision and focus. What do Apple have? A great brand, wheres their innovation? I cant see anything really.

 

[Harry Wild]

In the rumor mill concerning WP; Nadella is giving WP another two more years and if it is not profitable by then; it is goners. Some countries have over 10% market share too. In the U.S.; Microsoft home market; it is around 2 to 3 percent since 2012. Back in 2005; in the U.S. Windows Mobile had a 45% market share.

 

[MDMcAtee]

Unless Microsoft puts forth the effort to market the phones in a totally different way than they have, it will never be relevant in mobile.

The carriers won't help, because they don't want to deal with Microsoft phones, and haven't for years.

Microsoft needs to go cross country and do informed studies on unscripted mobile phone users and get away from their chosen user group. This way they can see for themselves what people think about their phones.

If Microsoft elects to bypass the carriers totally, they need to really become the Uncarrier and promote the Holy he'll out of this. They have to offer financing and easy setup on all carriers in store and full on support for every device.

Their flagship phones have to be truly flagship phones, not a incremental update and have a dedicated time line for obsolescence.

The flagship phone has to be fully equipped to compete head to head and win with any flagship device. Everything has to work perfectly, as well as everything software on the phone. Work arounds won't cut it anymore, the software has to be bug free.

The perception of Windows phones has been terrible for a very long time and this has to change. It all starts with Microsoft and how the phone is marketed and putting out quality apps.

Microsoft is a software company, and there is not a reason in hades why there is a app shortage, and if they wait until some developer builds a needed app, they will always be irrelevant to the mobile phone sector.

Microsoft states that they aren't a phone oem, this has to change as well. They have to build the Surface phones and they have to be better than the other Android phones and the IPhone in every aspect. Why aren't they offered with high end wood and leather backs, along with carbon fiber like the Motorola and LG have.? . Why isn't there a "Active" type that has the ratings to compete with Samsung for waterproofing, don't Windows phone people get outside and do things where they need this? Why isn't there pen support and apps for every phone?
These things matter to millions of people all over the world. Why haven't they been addressed? This is not just about core users or brand new users it's about all cell phone users on all platforms... You have to have what the majority of people want and need to be successful.

Most people know that you have to spend money to make it in business , and yet a perfectly great phone is languishing and being tossed aside for inferior products everyday because the leadership of Microsoft is afraid to invest the money to push it's phones as they should.

Win10mobile could be the ultimate cell phone, but until the management team actually believes enough in it to invest fully for it, it will never be the best.

How can Win10mobile turn things around...... By being better than and offering more than the competition in every aspect. You have to convince the world that they need a new Win10mobile phone. If you aren't going to sell them in the carriers stores, you have to advertise the crap out of it where to buy it and then have staff in the places you are selling it that will push them to it instead of the competition's phones.

It's all well in good to have your apps on the competition's phones but you have to have the apps that the competition uses on it... Take away the uncertainty of switching to the Windows ecosystem completely.

T-mobile is claiming to be the Uncarrier.... That's not really true because they are a carrier... Microsoft can become a true Uncarrier and could use this in it's advertising.

It's time the gloves come off and they come out swinging and acting like they want the phone division to win.

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[Cleavitt76]

In the rumor mill concerning WP; Nadella is giving WP another two more years and if it is not profitable by then; it is goners. Some countries have over 10% market share too. In the U.S.; Microsoft home market; it is around 2 to 3 percent since 2012. Back in 2005; in the U.S. Windows Mobile had a 45% market share.

Nadella said almost the opposite of that. He said that MS will continue making Windows Phones for AT LEAST two more years. After that, they will continue to make Windows Phones unless OEMs are making devices that fulfill all of the needs for the three mobile markets that MS is targeting. The markets are economy/low end, business, and flagship. The whole point of Nadella's message was that mobile is so important to MS that they will continue to make phone hardware as long as there is a market shortage in any of those 3 classes. It's very similar to their Surface strategy.

Regardless of profitability, MS needs Windows phones to be available in order to complete their ecosystem. They didn't spend all this time reworking Windows, Windows Phone, Xbox, and everything involved in Universal Apps just to pack it all up in two years because their phone hardware isn't making money. Keep in mind that we are talking about a company that has taken a loss on things like Xbox, Surface, Bing, and many of their enterprise products for many years before finally making a profit. MS has no problem taking losses, waiting, and grinding away at a market when it fits their overall strategy.

 

[Queen Kong1]

Anyone know how long it will be before android apps are on WP?......I'm missing some features but i don't want to go back to Android are they on the finish line?.

 

[fatclue_98]

Anyone know how long it will be before android apps are on WP?......I'm missing some features but i don't want to go back to Android are they on the finish line?.

Finish line? The starter's pistol hasn't even gone off yet.

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[Ian_Superfly]

Well, looking at MS from the outside, it does seem like MS is more focused on iOS and Android than on WP/W10M.

 

[JamesDax]

Yes. Yes they do.