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06-13-2016 03:13 PM
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  1. Johnny Tremaine's Avatar
    This has been repeated over and over again. Continuum is an interesting concept for a very few people because no traveling business exec can ever count on there being an appropriate keyboard, mouse, and display to plug into. Businesses don't just leave keyboards, mice, and screens lieing around unused in every conference room and office--they purchase gear that will be utilized near 100% of the time. Sure, the gear might be there, might be working, etc. But, even if the gear exists, you will need the keyboard, screen, and mouse when you are in the airport, in the hotel, in a restaurant, etc. So, it will make no sense to have a complete PC in your pocket when you will still need to carry the full laptop anyway--just more junk to lug around--and the laptop will always be more powerful, quicker to set up, more versatile, and much, much cheaper to purchase and maintain. On my last business trip I carried a bag of spare cables, connectors, adaptors, power supplies, etc. that was bigger than my laptop because I know no matter where I go on business something will be missing or broken. Adding your Continuum crap to the pile of junk you need to carry will not be all that popular.
    I totally agree.
    What's more convenient: Toting around a slim, razor thin ultrabook on business trips?

    Or carrying around your Continuum enabled Surface/Lumia/Whatever Microsoft phone, along with a satchel for a slew of cables, a keyboard, dongles, a mouse, and then you better hope that your hotel TV can accept an outside input HDMI source (many hotels have this disabled, as they only want you viewing their own provided streaming content services)?
    If not, then also, better bring along a portable monitor.

    Continuum is interesting tech, but its day to day usage scenario isn't there yet, likely years down the road when it won't be as dependent on peripherals.
    theefman and n m like this.
    05-27-2016 10:13 AM
  2. Greywolf1967's Avatar
    Adding your Continuum crap to the pile of junk you need to carry will not be all that popular.
    Thinking outside the box is what the mobile Pro should be doing.......Bluetooth, DNLA (wireless connections).

    Streamline what you need to have on hand. Microsoft is hinting at a streaming stick, which makes Continuum more useful.

    Even better since Windows 10, Budget devices are coming into their own...to go pro you don't need to break the bank.

    My own case I now use an Acer W3, Microsoft Lumia 640 XL, Digital Pen and Bluetooth keyboard ( all in under the cost of a Lumia 950 ), With Luck should Ink come to Windows 10 for Mobile, and Alcatel release the Pixi 3 (8) I can then drop the 640 XL and W3 for 1 device and add a dock device.

    img_0118.jpg
    RumoredNow, v535 and aximtreo like this.
    05-27-2016 10:26 AM
  3. Ten Four's Avatar
    My own case I now use an Acer W3, Microsoft Lumia 640 XL, Digital Pen and Bluetooth keyboard ( all in under the cost of a Lumia 950 ), With Luck should Ink come to Windows 10 for Mobile, and Alcatel release the Pixi 3 (8) I can then drop the 640 XL and W3 for 1 device and add a dock device.
    I really don't see the gain in your setup over carrying a slim laptop that you just open up and boom you're working without having to pair devices, balance things etc. How do you use that setup on your lap on the bus or a train? What happens if you want to call someone while also using the computing power of your setup--that's a typical business scenario--on the phone while typing and using the PC.
    gcyoung and techiez like this.
    05-27-2016 10:39 AM
  4. RumoredNow's Avatar
    Ink will be front and center starting with Redstone...

    Whatever you imagine, picture a superior pen alongside of it.
    05-27-2016 10:39 AM
  5. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Microsoft has the right idea with the display dock, as a 7" or 8 " device can be of use while on the go. When back in the office just a click and you on a big screen, or connected to a projector, or what ever the use case needed is.

    Now combine a Pen for the mobile use and even something like entry into excel can be done with ease, something that is not so easy on a 4"-5.5" device on the go.

    I have no doubt Microsoft has a trick or two yet to come into play, much like the Surface Book was a total surprise ( no leaks that I was aware of ), all we have talked about and more could come out of a Panos design Surface Phone.

    However what leads me to think 7" device is the tease of Inking Center that will come to Windows 10, I can see a 10 mobile version not long after the Surface and Tablets get it......and Ink on a 5.5 can be done but I see them placing focus on screen space.
    Maybe, but I think a 7" would be a 100% surrender in the W10M space, really. It's just too big for an everyday phone, for most people. That's fine, if that's how they're trying to act. However, if they go that route, it means there isn't a piece of hardware for the masses to buy, and it means there really is no hope for real growth in that market. A 5.5" device would be able to be handheld. 7" is essentially asking you to carry a purse. There's no way I could fit a 7" device in my pocket, especially when I have to carry things other than it on my person.
    anon(6078578) likes this.
    05-27-2016 10:48 AM
  6. Greywolf1967's Avatar
    I really don't see the gain in your setup over carrying a slim laptop that you just open up and boom you're working without having to pair devices, balance things etc. How do you use that setup on your lap on the bus or a train? What happens if you want to call someone while also using the computing power of your setup--that's a typical business scenario--on the phone while typing and using the PC.
    I must admit I have yet to run into a need to work on the bus, but again I have had work on the tablet going, sms and whats app on the phone ( via keyboard for both ) and talking on the phone via wireless headphones all with out taking a device out of the keyboard.

    Once paired the keyboard jumps effortlessly between devices by turning the wheel, as I can run 3 different devices at the same time....as long as bluetooth is on.
    05-27-2016 10:50 AM
  7. Krystianpants's Avatar
    This has been repeated over and over again. Continuum is an interesting concept for a very few people because no traveling business exec can ever count on there being an appropriate keyboard, mouse, and display to plug into. Businesses don't just leave keyboards, mice, and screens lieing around unused in every conference room and office--they purchase gear that will be utilized near 100% of the time. Sure, the gear might be there, might be working, etc. But, even if the gear exists, you will need the keyboard, screen, and mouse when you are in the airport, in the hotel, in a restaurant, etc. So, it will make no sense to have a complete PC in your pocket when you will still need to carry the full laptop anyway--just more junk to lug around--and the laptop will always be more powerful, quicker to set up, more versatile, and much, much cheaper to purchase and maintain. On my last business trip I carried a bag of spare cables, connectors, adaptors, power supplies, etc. that was bigger than my laptop because I know no matter where I go on business something will be missing or broken. Adding your Continuum crap to the pile of junk you need to carry will not be all that popular.
    But who says the device will need any of that stuff? That's where their time to innovate comes in. So say that patent hinge device has 2 screens. One turns into a mouse one into a keyboard. The pen may turn into a projector. Not saying that this will happen. But it's not like projectors in devices are anything new. MS knows the limitations of continuum. Heck, I use it daily to replace my PC. I only game on my PC. It still has huge software limitations too. Not being able to run more than 1 full screen app is annoying at times, definitely not productive. But that's the point, if MS really wants to push this to enterprise it has to be damn good. I like the idea of the HP elite because the laptop is nothing but pure battery and screen and it can charge your phone too. So you don't have to worry about popping cables out at an airport. You keep your phone in your pocket and just use the lighter laptop dock that doesn't generate a tremendous amount of heat like laptops and is much lighter with a longer lasting battery. That in itself is honestly better than a laptop and your own private phone. Here your business phone and everything related to your business is already on the laptop because it's just a dumb terminal. Only the phone has to be maintained. That's only if the Software solution becomes much better. I still think MS made a big boo-boo not releasing multi-windows for continuum for anniversary edition. HP is releasing their phone with anniversary and continuum hasn't gotten any focus. Sure it can support an xbox controller. I don't think a business associate would really care about that. But I think that in time things will be going more towards the dumb terminal area. Why pay for the extra cpu power if phones are getting more and more powerful. You're only paying for the different input/out method. There will be specialized stuff for gaming or more hardcore processing like art. But a lot of companies are focusing on smaller/faster/more efficient chips. RISC chips are exceeding the CISC chipsets now. Even in small form factor used in phones they will become better than the CISC equivalent as they have so much more room to grow and the CISC ones are just at a standstill with intel having so many issues.
    05-27-2016 11:00 AM
  8. Greywolf1967's Avatar
    How do you use that setup on your lap on the bus or a train? What happens if you want to call someone while also using the computing power of your setup--that's a typical business scenario--on the phone while typing and using the PC.
    Just because I was curious about the soft slot in the keyboard......I picked up the keyboard and tilted it forward....it holds both devices firm as I had it almost 90 degree from flat. The 640XL has gloss back and it did not slip. I then set it on my lap and it is very easy to type with and as the keyboard is close to the weight of a laptop it is very stable. I can use the Pen on the tablet as it is in my lap and it will not tip forward.

    I know the old saying is ..."Pics or it didn't happen".....so how about video proof?

    Last edited by Greywolf1967; 05-27-2016 at 11:31 AM. Reason: Addd video proof
    05-27-2016 11:04 AM
  9. v535's Avatar
    Could it be Nokia communicator design are making a comeback?
    IJPI and ClixT like this.
    05-27-2016 11:35 AM
  10. pankaj981's Avatar
    Could it be Nokia communicator design are making a comeback?
    That's the Surface Book design if you look carefully. I don't think Microsoft is going to repeat that for the phones.
    v535 likes this.
    05-27-2016 01:50 PM
  11. Krystianpants's Avatar
    That's the Surface Book design if you look carefully. I don't think Microsoft is going to repeat that for the phones.
    It's not. It's a new patent for a hinge. The hinge itself describes different setups such as multiple screen attachment and such. It's completely different than the surface book hinge.
    v535 likes this.
    05-27-2016 03:40 PM
  12. pankaj981's Avatar
    It's not. It's a new patent for a hinge. The hinge itself describes different setups such as multiple screen attachment and such. It's completely different than the surface book hinge.
    This looks to me again...exactly how the surface book has been implemented. It has the screen, memory and small battery in the tablet-part (here First portion) and the dedicated nVidia GPU and bigger battery in the keyboard dock (Second portion). Even the hinge looks the same. I guess they wanted to use this patented design for other devices including the current Surface Book.
    05-27-2016 03:47 PM
  13. Krystianpants's Avatar
    This looks to me again...exactly how the surface book has been implemented. It has the screen, memory and small battery in the tablet-part (here First portion) and the dedicated nVidia GPU and bigger battery in the keyboard dock (Second portion). Even the hinge looks the same. I guess they wanted to use this patented design for other devices including the current Surface Book.
    Nah the hinge is completely different.

    screen-shot-2016-05-18-9.38.38-am.png
    05-27-2016 03:53 PM
  14. RumoredNow's Avatar
    Might be the difference between a preparatory draft of the design and final production. The mechanics are super-similar and the patent would go toward function. You don't re-patent the same function every time you want to move it to a new device.


    surfacebook-hinge_w_600.jpg
    aximtreo and libra89 like this.
    05-27-2016 04:27 PM
  15. Krystianpants's Avatar
    Might be the difference between a preparatory draft of the design and final production. The mechanics are super-similar and the patent would go toward function. You don't re-patent the same function every time you want to move it to a new device.


    Click image for larger version. 

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    It does look slightly similar. The patent is huge and goes into many different things but the part I find most fascinating is:

    "the user may attach a first touchscreen as the first portion and a second touchscreen as second portion, and utilize the device like a book".

    Seems they can make smaller and better versions of the hinges as there is a lot of different design examples. So a Surface Pocket would be pretty neat.

    They also have a neat patent for a Smart Ring which lets you do crazy gestures for any devices.


    One ring to own them all. :D

    ring.jpg
    05-27-2016 04:52 PM
  16. Jack Neill's Avatar
    I think a Surface Phone, will be just that. A evolution of the 9x line of phones and will not be "Lumia" branded but Surface branded. Its most likely not going to be x86 based but ARM based and will be what the original Surface line was supposed to be MS showing OEMs what can be done with hardware and then all the clones come out.

    Alas my IMHO YMMV and bring your salt shaker...
    RumoredNow, v535, aximtreo and 3 others like this.
    05-27-2016 06:16 PM
  17. ArtificiallyYours's Avatar
    I think the Surface Phone will be marketed towards surface users in general, rather than boasting about Consumer and Enterprise exclusive to one another. I have my doubts Microsoft will want to be "specific" if they ever market the 'Surface Phone', but I'll set my expectations accordingly and say it won't be for everyone.
    Last edited by ArtificiallyYours; 05-28-2016 at 01:08 AM. Reason: Holy Crap Grammar Batman
    RumoredNow likes this.
    05-28-2016 01:07 AM
  18. Chintan Gohel's Avatar
    Reading through some of the posts here, it seems most people think of continuum as a feature to help you work better when you're travelling without a laptop with you.

    Isn't the other case also that continuum is meant to reduce the amount of devices you'll need? Or to reduce the expenses in having many devices. Not right now of course but in the future when the costs come down.
    05-28-2016 01:19 AM
  19. isaac lee ishida's Avatar
    Microsoft clearly made a statement, they will focus on business only.
    Surface Phone will be a focus on enterprise, if fans want to buy
    a Surface Phone, they had to buy with very expensive price.

    Maybe we can call it Surface Mobile, because no one is sure the screen size will be used.
    05-28-2016 07:14 AM
  20. n m's Avatar
    "I think that marketing a device for enterprise rather than consumers is a bad idea nowadays. The days of carrying 2 phones, 1 work-issued and 1 personal, are pretty much over.

    BlackBerry hasn't had any success by concentrating on the enterprise market. "



    I couldn't disagree more.
    Enterprise is their strength, focus on your strength, win that part of the market first with a super slick, super secure must have "Surface Companion".
    Then, just maybe, a portion of the consumer market may follow.

    I use a work phone for personal and business, one phone works a treat. Problem is, yesterday I asked I.T to add the work email account to my mew 'Windows Phone' and the I.T consultant had never heard of a Windows Phone. How sad.
    ^^This too^^ In fact, I believe even at Microsoft itself most phones in use are BYOD. Only at the very top and in some select businesses is there even the remotest thought of supplying phones to workers here in the USA, and when you do that the execs carrying company phones don't want to have to also carry their own iPhone in order to be able to use their bank, order coffee, or check their frequent flyer miles. I don't know a single person that uses a phone supplied by their company.

    I couldn't disagree more.
    Enterprise is their strength, focus on your strength, win that part of the market first with a super slick, super secure must have "Surface Companion".
    Then, just maybe, a portion of the consumer market may follow.

    I use a work phone for personal and business, (supplied) one phone works a treat. Problem is, yesterday I asked I.T to add the work email account to my new 'Windows Phone' and the I.T consultant had never heard of a Windows Phone. How sad.
    Last edited by n m; 05-28-2016 at 08:35 AM.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    05-28-2016 08:18 AM
  21. HeyCori's Avatar
    Just because I was curious about the soft slot in the keyboard......I picked up the keyboard and tilted it forward....it holds both devices firm as I had it almost 90 degree from flat. The 640XL has gloss back and it did not slip. I then set it on my lap and it is very easy to type with and as the keyboard is close to the weight of a laptop it is very stable. I can use the Pen on the tablet as it is in my lap and it will not tip forward.

    I know the old saying is ..."Pics or it didn't happen".....so how about video proof?

    I have that keyboard as well. Usually it sits on my desk but I've used it on my lap a handful of times. It's quite impressive how well devices stay in there. I have it synced with my phone and it's great for when I need to quickly bang out a few texts.

    As for a Surface Phone, my personal opinion is that it needs to incorporate a physical keyboard. If Microsoft truly wants to attract enterprise customers, then the Surface Phone needs to be more than just a slightly bigger 950 XL. And that's on top of other features like a fingerprint scanner, Ink, and Continuum. Plus, it needs to come as part of some packaged deal that includes other Microsoft services. That's the only way I see Microsoft breaking through the BYOD wall.
    05-28-2016 10:17 AM
  22. anon(5383410)'s Avatar
    Overlapping markets. The Surface line is doing well and the only way to convince someone to buy into a Surface Phone with Continuum is to convince them to leave their tablet/phablet/laptop at home. My Surface Book is light and my messenger bag is sexy, chicks dig it. You're not convincing me to leave it at home. So how are you going to convince me I need a phone with continuum? There's just no market for it. There's no mind blowing innovative new gap for them to bridge. Keep trying to break into the smartphone market or sell it off.

    Anyone ever stop to think that no one has said Surface Phone out loud yet because *gasp* it doesn't exist?
    05-28-2016 12:32 PM
  23. Chintan Gohel's Avatar
    Overlapping markets. The Surface line is doing well and the only way to convince someone to buy into a Surface Phone with Continuum is to convince them to leave their tablet/phablet/laptop at home. My Surface Book is light and my messenger bag is sexy, chicks dig it. You're not convincing me to leave it at home. So how are you going to convince me I need a phone with continuum? There's just no market for it. There's no mind blowing innovative new gap for them to bridge. Keep trying to break into the smartphone market or sell it off.

    Anyone ever stop to think that no one has said Surface Phone out loud yet because *gasp* it doesn't exist?
    I think the surface line is great and it's for the present and near future. Far into the future one device would be all that we need which would be a mobile device able to scale up using continuum. Your surface works great as a tablet but not as a phone. Your future phone (think 5 years) works great as a phone and quite well as a pc when connected to a display
    RumoredNow likes this.
    05-28-2016 12:36 PM
  24. anon(5383410)'s Avatar
    I think the surface line is great and it's for the present and near future. Far into the future one device would be all that we need which would be a mobile device able to scale up using continuum. Your surface works great as a tablet but not as a phone. Your future phone (think 5 years) works great as a phone and quite well as a pc when connected to a display
    I don't want my laptop to work as a phone nor the opposite. When I want to dial 7 digits I want a 5.xxx inch phone. When I want to compose word docs, spreadsheets, and any work-related task I'm popping open my surface book. This coming from someone in their 30s, not some baby boomer resistant to change. I just don't need a phone that can connect to a display when I already have my very light laptop with me at all times anyway.

    Let's not forget the cool factor in all of this. Apple's slew of ads painting PCs as "geek tech" and anything Apple as cool nearly killed MS and certainly propelled Apple to the forefront. Do you really want MS pushing another enterprise "nerdware" product that overlaps with the iPhones and Galaxys of the world? "Enthusiast" is just code for nerd.
    libra89 and techiez like this.
    05-28-2016 03:38 PM
  25. Gregory Newman's Avatar
    If Intel does not make a custom Atom CPU for the Surface Pro smart phone so it can run Win32 x86 Desktop PC Programs then a Surface smart phone will run an ARMs CPU which cannot run Win32 x86 Desktop PC programs and will be like the HP Elite X3 which is a super well built Windows 10 mobile smart phone with the "Continuum" feature. Microsoft could however make an 8 inch Atom CPU tablet that is set up to dual use full Windows 10 desktop PC/Tablet OS and Windows 10 mobile OS. It appears that Microsoft will design their "Surface" smart phones but will pay "Foxconn" and other device Manufacturers make the Physical Surface smart phones for them which they will resell to Carriers and Businesses and to Individuals through their Physical stores and Online store and perhaps through 3rd party stores like Best Buy USA, Amazon. and others. Windows Surface smart phones will be designed to be "Business Class" smart phones as opposed to a Consumer based smart phone.. Windows 10 Mobile smart phones are not dead but will Probably be the new "Surface" brand smart phones with the "Lumia" brand from Nokia being "Retired".
    Last edited by Gregory Newman; 05-28-2016 at 05:41 PM.
    05-28-2016 05:09 PM
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