10-03-2016 10:55 PM
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  1. Daniel Scanlan's Avatar
    So my lumia icon is 3 years old. It's battery last long enough to go from one room in the house to the other to be plugged in (facetious but not really) so despite being a good phone for me it is near it's end.
    I held on for the 950 only to find out that a ******* match between microsoft and verizon led to no verizon support. I then waited for the Surface Phone. Then every tech expo I felt like Charlie Brown having the football pulled out by Lucy (Microsoft) at the last minute (Sorry maybe spring 2016, summer 2016, fall 2016).
    As a Microsoft stack developer and having windows based products for everythng I liked how well it integrated. I found that iPhones are nice but ............(place your disparaging apple comment here) and Android phones always felt like they were still in beta. The windows phone felt finished.

    So is october just another time I fall flat on my back again before I get go buy a droid or iphone, or will I be pleasantly surprised with a Surface Phone that runs on the verizon network (I can't get my wife to switch verizon so AT&T is not an option)?

    I plan on wearing a helmet.
    Kavu2 likes this.
    09-15-2016 03:24 PM
  2. ven07's Avatar
    The Surface Phone will not launch this year... it's a stupid rumor :/

    Everything points to 2017...
    09-15-2016 04:26 PM
  3. fatclue_98's Avatar
    I plan on wearing a helmet.
    Put on the helmet. The Surface Phone, in my humble opinion, is going to be a bigger letdown than the McLaren. I hope I'm wrong.
    09-15-2016 05:35 PM
  4. The Cincinnati Kid's Avatar
    Don't get your hopes up. In a couple weeks I'll be switching to Android. I love my Icon, but battery life is not that great at this point as you mentioned. Not interested in the 950 since it has already been out for a year, but I'd rather just keep my Icon anyway. If a Surface Phone ever does hit the market, I'll switch back in a heartbeat (well, as soon as my contract is up in a couple years). I love WP, but for now it's time to say goodbye.
    Tien-Lin Chang and Timbre70 like this.
    09-16-2016 08:18 PM
  5. xandros9's Avatar
    October is as much the month of the Surface Phone as any given year is the year of the Linux desktop.

    Go get your iPhone or Nexus and go enjoy the best modern smartphones have to offer. If Microsoft ends up pulling something enticing out of their hat next year, you can always come back.
    09-16-2016 08:40 PM
  6. Justin Jackson IOS10's Avatar
    I just ordered a iPhone 7 Plus. Thanks Microsoft for awesome Windows 10 yet no phone options. Last flagship for Verizon is my Icon 2 years ago.

    If we have to learn a new operating system while waiting on a decent phone, we won't be coming back to windows
    Last edited by xandros9; 09-16-2016 at 09:14 PM.
    Timbre70 likes this.
    09-16-2016 08:46 PM
  7. FXi2's Avatar
    I'd say in 30-45 days you'll know about all you need to know to make a good decision. Perhaps (because it's not out of the question) you might see the X3 on Verizon though that is bigger and may not be what you are after. I'm not saying to give it months, but if everyone is wrong about October, well we'll know fairly soon. I would wait even if you do go with the iPhone just to let things cool off a bit and the Note 7 needs replacement as you know as well. It just seems like every year we know by Nov 1 what's not coming till spring, what's on the market for Q4 and yet every Aug-Sep people spend all the time in the world speculating like crazy. Seems like you'll know all the Q4 stuff in a few more weeks. Whether that's good news for Windows phone lovers on VZ or not, I can only hope. I have an Icon but mine works. Seeing there are two of you with worn out ones here I might just have to lock it in a safe! :)

    Let me add that the very existence of the Icon on Win 10 officially as well as the 735 is indicative that the underlying code for Win 10 Mobile to run on VZ exists and is being worked on, so do not think a newer phone on VZ is impossible. That seems to indicate they are keeping the skills sharp and your patience may well be rewarded. What I can't tell yet is when.
    09-16-2016 09:30 PM
  8. anon(6078578)'s Avatar
    October is as much the month of the Surface Phone as any given year is the year of the Linux desktop.

    Go get your iPhone or Nexus and go enjoy the best modern smartphones have to offer. If Microsoft ends up pulling something enticing out of their hat next year, you can always come back.
    Might be best to wait for the third version of the Surface phone anyway
    vezycash likes this.
    09-16-2016 11:25 PM
  9. Timbre70's Avatar
    Surface Phone was launched three years back. The Lumia 1520 and 2520 were mislabeled.😜
    melhiore and vezycash like this.
    09-17-2016 12:59 AM
  10. vezycash's Avatar
    Surface Phone was launched three years back. The Lumia 1520 and 2520 were mislabeled.
    I hope the "surface phone" comes with exceptional battery life. Because that was the main allure of the 1520. Well, Microsoft won't do this unless Apple does it first.
    theefman, libra89 and ananve like this.
    09-17-2016 07:13 AM
  11. FXi2's Avatar
    MIT has technology that is expected in production batteries that changes the anode structure and literally doubles battery life. I don't know who will wait that long but something to look forward to. I think that may be one of the contributing factors to MS thinking of waiting till 2017 for Surface phone. The tech is literally expected to be so easy it will be in users hands by the end of next year.
    09-17-2016 10:06 AM
  12. StarLord0890's Avatar
    Switch to hp elite x3(if its on Verizon otherwise whatevs lol)
    09-18-2016 11:49 PM
  13. Cortana is Skynet's Avatar
    Have you seen the post about the possibility that Intel might still be working on mobile x86 chips? On one hand it hints that work is being done on a intel (read x86) mobile chip, against the accepted wisdom that they had given up, but on the other hand it seems clear that possibility - and thus the Surface phone as an x86 device -is as far away as it always been.

    For those of us who believe Microsoft's remaining hope (other than throwing in the towel once and for all and launching its Android skin/fork) to break it's current vicious circle - of less users leading to less developers leading to less apps leading to less users - lies in leveraging its dominance in the desktop (I.e, x86) installed base of "apps" and drivers (and from my point of view the evidence points overwhelming in that direction but I accept that it's not a universally shared view ), these comments strongly imply that there won't be a x86 Windows Phone until Spring 2018, at the earliest.

    Yes, I could be wrong; maybe they'll pull a Surface Book or HoloLens type of stunt and announce the Surface Phone in October - or at least next spring.

    I think the chances are zero.

    The Surface Book was an innovation in DESIGN only; it used standard parts, including off the shelf CPU, GPU, etc. In other words, no Technology breakthrough.

    HoloLens It's a slightly different case, but again, it uses a lot of off-the-shelf parts, and the main innovation is on the software side, Microsoft's strength (yes, I know what you thinking. Insert your favourite smartass one liner below). And while the HoloLens can claim to be some breakthrough in Technology, it actually proves the point that no x86 Surface Phone is coming in the short-term: Through the HoloLens has been announced, it will be a long time until it hits the market. And this, I think, It's the best one could hope for right now: An announcement of a x86 Surface phone that won't hit the market for a long time. Given that BOTH Microsoft and Intel are on the record saying that they will be doing more and talking less (a bit ironic perhaps - but I suppose the work part is probably going on - it's just not visible to outsiders at this point), I don't expect to see an x86 W10M phone, not even an announcement coming any time soon.

    This in not something that either Microsoft or any OEM can do on their own. You can build a Surface Book without even involving Intel (other than buying the off-the-shelf chips), but you cannot build an x86 phone without Intel (or someone else) providing the necessary chip. And it's obvious that the chips do not exist yet, nor is the technology do make them to a useful standard there right now.

    What we need then, is something to bridge that gap between W10M right now, and a future with W10M on a x86. Something that is achievable with current technology but it takes genius design, as Microsoft previously done with the Surface Pro, and more recently with the Surface Book (a strategy that Apple perfected, by the way: get available technology and put it together in ingenious ways with great design).

    If Microsoft is looking for this kind of innovation, with the overarching goal of bridging the gap until a x86 phone, what could he come up with? The original Surface added a keyboard (and later a stylus) to a tablet; the Book had a stroke of genius of separating processing\graphic power depending on the form factor. These solve similar problems that a smartphone (any smartphone, whether W10M, Android or iPhone) has to deal with as well, just more so - after all smartphones are just small tablets with telephony). So, they could also in theory be the kind of innovations Microsoft applies to the smartphone:

    i) Add better input devices to the phone such as stylus, keyboard, etc.

    ii) Separate the processing\graphical power depending on the form factor - I am sure I am not the first to have thought of putting an x86 processor and\or GPU in a W10M dock (and also surely not the first to have thought of what the point of doing so would be as the advantages are limited).

    What other ideas are currently being explored in this respect? The lapdock idea seems to be slowly gaining acceptance in the W10M fledging ecosystem - maybe the innovation will come through there - again, a design in innovation (i.e., do a better lapdock)

    There are rumours growing of a Surface AIO coming soon. This is puzzling. There are plenty of very good AIOs offered by Microsoft partners, so why would Microsoft want to enter this niche in the stagnating PC market? Let's remind ourselves that Microsoft is primarily a Software company that relies on hardware partners. Apart from peripherals (keyboards, mice, and the like) it has only entered the hardware business ("reluctantly", it claims) to either

    a) use it a vehicle for software sales - the XBox being a prime example

    or

    b) when it felt the manufactures were not innovating enough and it feared this could leave the Windows platform open to attack from outsiders. The prime examples being the entire Surface offering. Unlike the XBox, the software used by an AIO PC is, in theory, exactly the same as to any other PC. It's also not a innovative form factor and it's hard to rationalise which threats accruing from outsiders to the Windows platform from coming up with amazing AIOs - even at it's peak the original iMac, with all it's appeal, didn't make a dent in the PC world - Microsoft would be fighting. No one is going to switch to Android\Chrome if Google releases a really cool AIO Pixel.

    So if Microsoft is indeed releasing a AIO in October, I'll be one of the many people scratching my head and asking why. As I said, Microsoft relies on its partners' hardware to push Windows and other services and software, and these partners have their own AIO products. They won't look kindly to Microsoft's intrusion in their turf. With the Surface line so far, at least Microsoft can arguably claim that they have created those markets (2-1s) and they are happy to share those markets with their partners. They were\are just leading the way and providing inspiration to the manufacturers (which the manufacturers have taken it quite literally and are now shamelessly ripping off Microsoft Surface designs). Unless the Surface AIO is truly innovative on a scale capable of creating an entire new niche market, it's hard to see how this same argument could be used for such a product.

    How could Microsoft do that level of innovation with an AIO - a very mature form factor? Could this Surface AIO be something else entirely? And if so, what?

    Putting all of the above together, I have a theory.It's probably not true. Hell, it's almost certainly not true, but for your entertainment and a bit of What-If thinking, read on.

    What if the rumoured AIO (All In One) is actually a NIO (None In One)? By that I mean this: What if the Surface AIO is just an empty shell - a type of Continuum Dock but on a desktop form factor - screen included rather than the laptop form factor of the likes of the NexDock, ProDock, and HP's Lap Dock?

    What would be the innovation that such a Surface AIO continuum dock would bring that makes it better than just connecting to a standard monitor with the current Microsoft dock (or even directly with USB-C)? The honest answer is I don't know! After all, I've been thinking of this idea, putting the above pieces together, for a grand total of 3 minutes, give or take!

    But whatever the innovations are, I would expect the objective and end result to be a seamless experience for a W10M or Surface Pro device user to transition to a complete desktop experience.

    Such a Surface AIO for Continuum would be mostly a screen monitor with maybe a wireless charging mat where you drop a surface device - phone, obviously, but potentially Surface Pro as well - which would then connect to the display either via the fast-becoming ubiquitous USB-C or even wirelessly - assuming lag issues could be sorted - via NFC pairing. These docks would obviously have the usual USB and LAN ports, maybe built-in speakers and even extra storage. Unlike the laptop form-factor docks, these wouldn't be intended for mobility, so the built-in options are almost limitless and this is where I think the innovation could come. Need some extra GPU a la Surface Book? No problem - it's included in the AIO. Who knows, even an extra, more powerful x86 CPU is included in the AIO. That could give Surface Pro's some extra oomph for power hungry applications or, more usefully, the ability to run x86 'apps' on your W10M.

    All of these are basic design innovations which would cleverly combine existing technology to the further expand the desktop form-factor landscape to mobile devices via peripherals - exactly what Microsoft did with the Surface and Surface Book. Just like when you are in continuum mode you can only access apps that can run in continuum, when when undocked you would not be able to access those apps that use the extras in the dock - GPU, CPU, or whatever.

    Price-wise, I doubt this would be much cheaper than just a phone and a completely separate PC. Of course Surface line are not immune to the same challenges: It's cheaper to buy a proper laptop and a tablet than a Surface Book. Yet there's still a market for Surface Books.

    The main advantage is that your 'computer' is always with you. Take your phone\Surface to work, drop it below the monitor on your desk and it takes the shape of a a normal desktop PC, while at the same time, you're free to multitask on your phones, take calls etc. Need to visit a customer or it's time to go home? Pick up your phone\surface and take your work with you. I know dozens of people at my company (mainly in Sales) that are issued with a company phone, laptop and dock. Yet, virtually the only work they do on the laptop is email.Give them W10M and get a few AIO Surface Docks for them to hot-desk when in the office and the company could probably save money and the employees saved from carrying 2 devices everywhere.

    Many people didn't see the point of the Surface Pro when it launched, but now there is a whole market segment based on it. A AIO as a Surface Dock might not make a lot of sense the first time i thought about it (5minutes ago) but the more I think about, the more I think there could be a niche for it. Not a big market to start with (in part a good thing as it would not threaten Microsoft manufacturer partners), but as the concept was further refined both from a software as well hardware point of view, particularly as more and more units hit the market made by not just Microsoft but also OEMs (assuming W10M got any traction, at least in enterprise) then eventually these type AIO Surface docks and their OEM copies would find their places to in hotels, airports, schools, etc. All you'd have to do is drop your phone\tablet on the charging mat and continue writing that work email. With a small Tinder window on the bottom your screen, of course.

    Lets see what the rumoured Surface AIO brings in October.
    Last edited by Cortana is Skynet; 09-20-2016 at 08:47 AM.
    09-19-2016 03:14 PM
  14. Johnny Tremaine's Avatar
    Haven't Dan Rubino and Mary Jo Foley stated over and over again that their Microsoft sources are saying that if there is a 'Surface Phone', it's a late 2017 event? Not sure where these rumors about this October were started.
    09-21-2016 03:15 PM
  15. wplee's Avatar
    Haven't Dan Rubino and Mary Jo Foley stated over and over again that their Microsoft sources are saying that if there is a 'Surface Phone', it's a late 2017 event? Not sure where these rumors about this October were started.
    To be fair, I doubt Dan and Mary will learn anything about Surface Phone. They didn't know about HoloLens (which Microsoft had been working on in complete secret in a basement under their visitor centre) and I believe Surface Book took 'em by surprise too in laptop form. Even this week, everyone was shocked by the new Nokia non-smartphone announcement and earlier this Summer Microsoft surprised everyone with Project Scorpion plans. Microsoft have been doing new things differently these last 2 years.

    With Google about to take Phone hardware seriously next month with their all new Premium Pixel Phone, I believe Microsoft is also brewing something big too. Its been 18 months since design and development of the Lumia 950 project would have been wrapped up before manufacturing began.

    A Surface Phone may not be ready to go this year, BUT it could be very well revealed next month. Microsoft have little to lose at this point and everything to play for with mobile.

    Just to clarify, we are referring to this as Surface Phone but it may not be even called this. It's actually Microsoft's new flagship phone/hybrid/new device, unrelated to Lumia hence why I don't believe there will be any leaks this time.
    09-21-2016 04:49 PM
  16. anon(6078578)'s Avatar
    When they finally announce the Surface Phone, Joe Belfiore will leap onto the stage and exclaim "You've already seen the potential of phones that run Windows 10."

    "10 is often seen as the ultimate in scoring, top of its class"

    "But here at Microsoft, you've seen nothing yet, as this phone turns it all the way up to Windows 11"
    09-21-2016 06:46 PM
  17. etphoto's Avatar
    Haven't Dan Rubino and Mary Jo Foley stated over and over again that their Microsoft sources are saying that if there is a 'Surface Phone', it's a late 2017 event? Not sure where these rumors about this October were started.
    Normally click bait and its sad people fall for it.

    Twitter: @PhotographyET
    09-21-2016 07:41 PM
  18. CharlieWade's Avatar
    So my lumia icon is 3 years old. It's battery last long enough to go from one room in the house to the other to be plugged in (facetious but not really) so despite being a good phone for me it is near it's end.
    I held on for the 950 only to find out that a ******* match between microsoft and verizon led to no verizon support. I then waited for the Surface Phone. Then every tech expo I felt like Charlie Brown having the football pulled out by Lucy (Microsoft) at the last minute (Sorry maybe spring 2016, summer 2016, fall 2016).
    As a Microsoft stack developer and having windows based products for everythng I liked how well it integrated. I found that iPhones are nice but ............(place your disparaging apple comment here) and Android phones always felt like they were still in beta. The windows phone felt finished.

    So is october just another time I fall flat on my back again before I get go buy a droid or iphone, or will I be pleasantly surprised with a Surface Phone that runs on the verizon network (I can't get my wife to switch verizon so AT&T is not an option)?

    I plan on wearing a helmet.
    If you've had a phone your phone for 3 years I think you can wait one more month. Tough it out, because unless you pay full price for your new phone at Verizon, you'll have to go through the trouble of paying it off the selling it for less on ebay in order to get the phone you want. I have to say, you're quite the trooper holding onto a phone for three years, not many people have that kind of willpower.
    09-24-2016 04:56 PM
  19. grob9642's Avatar
    I suggest you cinch the chin strap on that helmet. Nothing in Microsoft's recent product plan suggests that they are going to deliver on the Surface phone. I hope I am wrong, but I very much doubt it.
    Kavu2 likes this.
    09-25-2016 09:47 AM
  20. anon(9057135)'s Avatar
    I love Microsoft but gave up on Windows Phone. I went to an Android back in April of last year and got me an HTC One M9. Microsoft's Arrow Launcher and Next Screen are so much better than Windows Phones versions. In June of this year, I went to an iPhone and Microsoft's apps on iOS are better than they were on Android and Windows Phone. I'd switch to an iPhone.
    libra89, iamakii and TechAbstract like this.
    10-01-2016 11:37 AM
  21. iamakii's Avatar
    I gave up on Windows Phone last month. I don't see me going back to WP with Surface Phone either

    Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
    theefman, libra89 and Timbre70 like this.
    10-02-2016 07:27 AM
  22. TechAbstract's Avatar
    I love Microsoft but gave up on Windows Phone. I went to an Android back in April of last year and got me an HTC One M9. Microsoft's Arrow Launcher and Next Screen are so much better than Windows Phones versions. In June of this year, I went to an iPhone and Microsoft's apps on iOS are better than they were on Android and Windows Phone. I'd switch to an iPhone.
    +1, apps are best on iOS. For OP, I wouldn't be waiting for Surface phone. You could be waiting for a long time. Try out other platforms. You can come back when they released it.
    Timbre70 and libra89 like this.
    10-03-2016 12:20 AM
  23. Migi2015's Avatar
    Might as well give up now. Band is over. Surface Phone is a pipe dream. Not happening. Switch to iPhone.
    Timbre70, xandros9 and theefman like this.
    10-03-2016 04:10 PM
  24. Kevin Rush's Avatar
    Might as well give up now. Band is over. Surface Phone is a pipe dream. Not happening. Switch to iPhone.
    Don't be ridiculous. My Windows phone does everything I need it to do and I'm happy with it. No need to waste money.
    10-03-2016 04:52 PM
  25. anon(9057135)'s Avatar
    +1, apps are best on iOS. For OP, I wouldn't be waiting for Surface phone. You could be waiting for a long time. Try out other platforms. You can come back when they released it.
    Especially OneNote on iOS. On windows phone it lacked features, on android it looked like it came from the Android Holo era (2012) where as on iOS it feels and looks modern like Office 2016. As for outlook on iOS, it's usable if you use Outlook.com but my preferred client is airmail. Word Flow is also kick *** on IOS :)
    libra89, xandros9 and Cabo Blue like this.
    10-03-2016 06:17 PM
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