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  1. Vittorio Vaselli's Avatar
    Who will buy it to carry two mobile devices (Andromeda Windows 10 and an Android
    me.

    they will not invest hundreds of millions on a product line that is destined to be DOA
    And why they should invest in an android phone with a lot of competition, in a market where nobody but apple and samsung make money for what? Feeding Google (which is one of the main competitors) ecosystem?

    the Andromeda device with Android OS and will be heavily loaded with their apps and services, which makes a lot of sense to me
    it could make a lot of sense to you, but it make no commercial sense, and we know that Nadella's Microsoft doesn't burn money for something cannot give a return.

    But not worry, I'm sure there will be a lot of OEMs that will make devices with a similiar form factor running Android, actually you can already get an Axon M from ZTE.
    06-08-2018 10:09 AM
  2. Cbarnhorst's Avatar
    I suspect this is all moot. I see an Andromeda device removing, or at least blurring, the boundary in people's minds about what a phone is versus what is a PC. It all depends on how you would use it. I see it as a mobile PC, allowing me to make calls with my PC if I want to. Who knows if it will succeed? We'll see.
    06-08-2018 10:11 AM
  3. juan almanzar's Avatar
    I think the long-awaited Surface Phone is closer than ever. For a long time, the Surface Phone has generated more rumors than any other device without having lost the expectation. And lately those rumors have increased, including a hint by Panos Panay.

    But, what will ensure the success of it?

    Who will want to buy a Surface mobile device (that won't be cheap) without access to the modern apps? Who will buy it to replace a desktop pc? Who will buy it to carry two mobile devices (Andromeda Windows 10 and an Android or iPhone? I think no one would buy it, even long time MS supporters like me and many others. You may think that Microsoft will rely on PWA to close the gap between the Microsoft Store and Google and Apple apps stores. But that's not going to happen, at least in the near future, even with the big support from Google. In my opinion, even the Surface and Surface Pro lines will not survive if Microsoft don't do something quick.

    And I would think that Microsoft knows that and they will not invest hundreds of millions on a product line that is destined to be DOA. So, I think that Microsoft is working on a surprise for everyone.

    In recent months, I have noticed a closer integration with its services and Windows 10 with Android apps, the development of new applications, even for non-MS services, and the Android support on Windows 10 (I can't wait to try "Your Phone" currently under development and still non functional in Windows 10 build 17677). All these make me think that Microsoft is developing (or should develop) the Andromeda device with Android OS and will be heavily loaded with their apps and services, which makes a lot of sense to me, and that would ensure that the device is widely accepted and would guarantee its success. Even their OEM partners would follow them with new devices, because it will be a mature and productive system as well as entertainment.

    I have been a strong supporter, follower and defender of Windows Mobile/Phone for long time (since my 2007
    AT&T Tilt until my Lumia 950) and just a few months ago I jumped out of the sinking ship to buy a Samsung S8+ and now I realize all I was missing before and all that I am missing now, and that makes me desire a combination of both worlds.

    I have my Samsung phone loaded with MS apps. I just installed Next on my Samsung (and I love it) and makes me feel closer to the Windows Mobile experience in regards to the notifications (Android notifications sucks). I was able to restore my WhatsApp backup from WM to Android (thanks to Nicola's WinWazzapMigrator), and also I transferred all my SMS to Android. I am still missing on Android the Anand Prakash's Converge app.

    I am missing a lot my Lumia 950 and I can say that Windows Mobile is a lot superior to Android but it lacks the apps we want and need now. It is a shame that Microsoft did not listen to Ballmer when he proposed to allow Android apps to run natively on Windows Mobile 10, but now is maybe too late for that formula.

    I will consider to buy an Andromeda device with Android OS and heavily loaded with all MS apps and with a like-WM experience.

    My Andromeda flavor:
    - Launcher10 as a launcher
    - Outlook instead of the Android Contacts, Calendar and Mail.
    - Next instead of Android Notifications.
    - Edge instead of Chrome.
    - I would be using Google Assistant until MS improves Cortana.
    - Bing instead of Google Search and Google Maps.
    - Google Play store.

    Which other apps or modifications would you love on an Andromeda with Android? What do you think about it?

    I will see a long life to Andromeda if MS uses android. What do you think? Does it makes sense to you?
    Que 🚩 más hermosa. Creo que sólo windows.
    06-08-2018 10:16 AM
  4. kingtigre's Avatar
    I sincerely hope with every fiber of my being that Microsoft never builds any device with Android. I currently only use Android as a stop gap. I left Windows Phone last winter and pretty much regret it daily.

    I had a "grass is greener" mentality and made the switch. Only to find out that I don't really use all that much in the way of apps. The app gap hit me on like 2-3 things. Most of which I can do with a desktop browser. Say, on a device that fits in my pocket but unfolds to reveal a desktop OS on a tablet sized screen.

    ...But it has to take my calls, Microsoft. It HAS to take my calls.
    Jcmg62 and anon(10458357) like this.
    06-08-2018 10:27 AM
  5. BanditoTR's Avatar
    True. What the future of computing holds for everyone, will require what Microsoft has done in the past 3 years and going forward. Same for companies including Amazon and the like, for what they are doing. Sometimes we only see what affects us in the here and now. "My Twitter app won't work" or "Dang it! My Lumia crashed again" ;)

    As for the OPs comments/discussion topic. No. Microsoft does not build Android based platform hardware. Software for Android based devices, YES. There are enough Androids out there anyway, and for Microsoft to add to that, would be worthless to me.
    Exactly why an MS version of Android is worthless in the end. Let's say they do Continuum on Android. You know who already has a version of it? Samsung with Dex. And it works as you would expect.
    06-08-2018 10:32 AM
  6. netmann's Avatar
    No Android please...if MS wants to sell Surface Andro with a different os, I like to see they go with iOS.
    06-08-2018 10:33 AM
  7. AndyCalling's Avatar
    No point, there's already a tonne of Android devices filling the pocketable market. Why would MS bother? I have a click-batey feeling about this thread...
    06-08-2018 10:36 AM
  8. Hirox K's Avatar
    I don't see the point too.
    Portable PC is portable PC (it's just a smaller size WoA NB), if you want an Android, get an Android. Why do you want a PC running Android when there're soooo many Androids out there?

    And what are you trying to do with it?
    News? Email? Messenger? Mobile game? Instagram? Facebook? Stock? Weather? Map?

    I can dock a Android on my gamepad but I won't be able to run XPA games on an Android. Game don't support Xbox Live. No OneDrive on Demand if you want to carry more than your HDD can hold. No light Photoshop or VisualStudio (and SVN) usage. No Surface Pen. No PC browser for me to inject scripts (and sync scripts with PCs) to do automation, to hide things I don't wanna see, to stop vid auto play, to enhance functionality. It doesn't run UWP PC runs, I cannot push 1 set of code to both PC and phone OS (IOT, AR, MR, Win10PC, WoA, Xbox are all one family now).
    Last edited by Hirox K; 06-08-2018 at 11:08 AM.
    06-08-2018 10:56 AM
  9. Abdallah Dajani1's Avatar
    The phone will be running a downsized Windows 10S version you can see it in Windows 10 right now with the phone and messaging app.
    If the phone sells well it will help with WPA but an android version will help carry the services to more people.
    Ms is not a hardware company it's a services company, it rides the hardware to deliver the software, and they used android to fix their image and deliver services, remember the rise of google and chrome they used Windows to become popular.
    06-08-2018 11:38 AM
  10. Richard Toft's Avatar
    I don't think Andormeda should be an android device MS is hoping this is going to be part of the future of windows, however if they released a full windows on android and stirp out all the google services then I'd buy that.
    06-08-2018 11:57 AM
  11. rwalrond's Avatar
    Been saying for years now that Microsoft needs to throw some money at Google and put the Play store on Windows. I'm sure the new Microsoft and Google could come to an agreement that allows Android apps to run natively on Windows. More money for Google and more users for Microsoft. Win Win for us consumers.

    So this device should run Windows as an OS but be compatible with the Play Store!
    06-08-2018 12:09 PM
  12. Dan12R's Avatar
    I think the OP misses on what Andromeda is supposedly going to be. It's not a smartphone. If it was a smartphone, it'd make perfect sense. However, the story Microsoft is apparently trying to tell with Andromeda is one where Android simply won't work. The beauty of Andromeda is its ability to transform from a pocketable telecommunications device, to a digital journal, to a small tablet, to a desktop stand-in (I also wouldn't be terribly surprised if there's some WMR connections as well). It's basically a computer Swiss Army knife. Android would need to do some serious modifications to make that work.

    We also need to look at Andromeda's rumored target market: The enterprise. There are a lot of enterprise IT groups that simply don't allow Android because they don't trust it for a host of reasons. Windows though, they trust because they've been using it since the days of Moses. So if they're looking to get a foothold in the enterprise, Android is the wrong approach.

    If Andromeda comes to market, you can be sure it will be a Windows device and it should be.
    Lobo Technician likes this.
    06-08-2018 12:12 PM
  13. mobilereboot's Avatar
    I don't think Andromeda will run anything but Windows. The whole idea of Andromeda sounds cool, but frankly I have a feeling it will quickly become another Zune/Band/Lumia/Kinect/HoloLens. It'll make a splash, but the ripples will soon be lost on the pond. Even moreso if Microsoft doesn't right the XBox ship currently taking on water. What little consumer trust is left in any kind of Microsoft device beyond keyboards and mice is dropping. Andromeda might be geared for the enterprise, but like it or not, consumers work at the enterprise and bring their experiences to work.
    06-08-2018 12:12 PM
  14. Mister Wolf's Avatar
    I don't trust Microsoft with their own OS, let alone someone else's.

    Generally though, I don't trust Microsoft. Even when they have a good thing going for them, they find innovative ways to screw things up (think about the heights 360 got to in terms of success, look at the Xbox One now).

    You can never say Microsoft doesn't innovate, they just do it in farting things up.
    anon(10458357) likes this.
    06-08-2018 12:20 PM
  15. TheNet Avenger's Avatar
    1) Run Android Apps - Yes, this would be the best way forward
    2) Run Android as the OS - No, Android is a fragmented mess using three bad OS models stacked on top of each other.

    If Android is the main OS it would have no advantages that Windows can bring, like lower power consumption, faster software, stability or security.

    Even going back to WM10 - on the 810 SoC - the Lumia 950XL was benchmarking often 2X faster than any similar device running Android. It wasn't the hardware giving it that 2X performance difference.


    Android is a problem, even Google knows it is a problem as they are ripping it apart and trying to layer it and strapping everything back together with duct tape. (Go read any of the work on P and beyond. Windows is already tight and without these issues.) As an OS Engineer/Educator Android looks like a junk drawer with various pieces duct taped together to be more organized. The current work Google is doing now is adding in a couple of plastic trays, that have broken slats and adds more duct tape.


    The idea that an aged and horrible OS like Android is used by so many people today is an embarrassment for the entire technology industry. We should ALL be ashamed we let this happen, and we should have forced Google to stop the crap as Android was first shipped. We forgave Google because Android was new and Google didn't understand OS technologies. Then it was too late, and they are giving the world the finger as they continue to produce crap.

    Stability - This is a bigger problem than people realize. How many times do you have to reboot for Bluetooth or XYZ App to start working properly? Or WiFi or pick any of 100 reasons why Android devices are restarted on average 1-2 times per day. (In contrast WP8 and WM10 devices are/were restarted once a month on average.)

    The stability issues with Android also create a series of dependability and reliability issues. Notifications not firing, Alarms not firing, communication tools not firing.

    The Android stability issue isn't just 'crashes' it is HOW ANDROID'S PROCESS works, as it will close Apps and supporting tasks that cannot be restarted properly. It will even close Active processes like VOIP software while it is in a call if a background process or new process needs more RAM. There are times users don't even realize that Android itself screwed them by closing their App for a stupid reason.


    Performance - This includes battery and App performance. In addition to the 950XL example - Android still doesn't do Big Little core management well, still doesn't throttle background tasks properly, still doesn't handle thermal threading, still doesn't use the GPU and GPGPU operations more, still can't seamless or agnostically thread to various cores/processors on the device. - All of these things are now inherent to Windows.

    Subsystems - Windows can already run Linux in a subsystem, as this is how NT was designed and how OS/2 1.x and POSIX originally ran on NT. WM10 was supposed to have Astoria - which was Native Android Apps running on WM10 - but with the benefits of WM10 and NT.

    Microsoft can still technically do this EASILY... The problem/trick is Google - they changed their terms and started moving their services from OSS and a license that allows that to pick and choose who can use it - Google is playing dirty, and this is another reason Android needs to be broken or taken away from Google... Even with Windows being Closed Source - Microsoft has never used it or leveraged it like Google does with their parts of Android now. (Yes I say this with full knowledge of the Monopoly ruling - as Google is beyond the tiny things Microsoft was accused of doing. Go ask Samsung, or HTC - they will tell people this, as Google has leveraged their control of Android against them, and Samsung was a key to Android's popularity.


    Surface Phone/Tablet (Whatever it is called) needs to be Windows to be fast, stable, secure and ironically open. It also needs an Android Subsystem at least to start out, with a better migration set of developer tools than what Microsoft has now, as in fully automated to get developers ok with their App running on Windows in the Android Subsystem and give them a One Click way forward to make it native to Windows.


    This thread and idea it should run 'Android' as the main OS is one of the most ignorant things I have read in a while, and I hope Microsoft isn't this stupid.
    Lobo Technician likes this.
    06-08-2018 12:26 PM
  16. Jcmg62's Avatar
    I think the long-awaited Surface Phone is closer than ever. For a long time, the Surface Phone has generated more rumors than any other device without having lost the expectation. And lately those rumors have increased, including a hint by Panos Panay.

    But, what will ensure the success of it?

    Who will want to buy a Surface mobile device (that won't be cheap) without access to the modern apps? Who will buy it to replace a desktop pc? Who will buy it to carry two mobile devices (Andromeda Windows 10 and an Android or iPhone? I think no one would buy it, even long time MS supporters like me and many others. You may think that Microsoft will rely on PWA to close the gap between the Microsoft Store and Google and Apple apps stores. But that's not going to happen, at least in the near future, even with the big support from Google. In my opinion, even the Surface and Surface Pro lines will not survive if Microsoft don't do something quick.

    And I would think that Microsoft knows that and they will not invest hundreds of millions on a product line that is destined to be DOA. So, I think that Microsoft is working on a surprise for everyone.

    In recent months, I have noticed a closer integration with its services and Windows 10 with Android apps, the development of new applications, even for non-MS services, and the Android support on Windows 10 (I can't wait to try "Your Phone" currently under development and still non functional in Windows 10 build 17677). All these make me think that Microsoft is developing (or should develop) the Andromeda device with Android OS and will be heavily loaded with their apps and services, which makes a lot of sense to me, and that would ensure that the device is widely accepted and would guarantee its success. Even their OEM partners would follow them with new devices, because it will be a mature and productive system as well as entertainment.

    I have been a strong supporter, follower and defender of Windows Mobile/Phone for long time (since my 2007
    AT&T Tilt until my Lumia 950) and just a few months ago I jumped out of the sinking ship to buy a Samsung S8+ and now I realize all I was missing before and all that I am missing now, and that makes me desire a combination of both worlds.

    I have my Samsung phone loaded with MS apps. I just installed Next on my Samsung (and I love it) and makes me feel closer to the Windows Mobile experience in regards to the notifications (Android notifications sucks). I was able to restore my WhatsApp backup from WM to Android (thanks to Nicola's WinWazzapMigrator), and also I transferred all my SMS to Android. I am still missing on Android the Anand Prakash's Converge app.

    I am missing a lot my Lumia 950 and I can say that Windows Mobile is a lot superior to Android but it lacks the apps we want and need now. It is a shame that Microsoft did not listen to Ballmer when he proposed to allow Android apps to run natively on Windows Mobile 10, but now is maybe too late for that formula.

    I will consider to buy an Andromeda device with Android OS and heavily loaded with all MS apps and with a like-WM experience.

    My Andromeda flavor:
    - Launcher10 as a launcher
    - Outlook instead of the Android Contacts, Calendar and Mail.
    - Next instead of Android Notifications.
    - Edge instead of Chrome.
    - I would be using Google Assistant until MS improves Cortana.
    - Bing instead of Google Search and Google Maps.
    - Google Play store.

    Which other apps or modifications would you love on an Andromeda with Android? What do you think about it?

    I will see a long life to Andromeda if MS uses android. What do you think? Does it makes sense to you?


    Whit?


    Do you follow Microsoft, or have you just popped in for a quick 5 minute chat?


    Point 1. Surface phone doesnt exist. Never has. Never will


    Point 2. Qualcomm and MS have spent years, and $Billions, developing an Arm/Windows solutions. You might have heard about it.....Windows on Arm....


    Point 3. PWA. Progressive web apps. Look them up.


    Point 4. I've used Android. I'm currently using Android. It sucks.



    Sheesh :(
    fatclue_98 likes this.
    06-08-2018 01:03 PM
  17. MorganRW's Avatar
    Besides the apps, I cannot stand Android. After plugging in all my login info, Windows Phone just worked and everything was there. And of course the Tiles were superior in every way than icons with count numbers on them. Also I constantly have issues with performance and the phone just doing things on it's own. Cant tell you how many times I pull it out of my pocket and find that I am one click away from buying 27 tickets to a movie in a theater located in another state. This even after I have the lock screen set to not open when in pocket. Also the glance screen is worthless. Nice to have apps but the rest of Android is a joke. And yes I tried MS Launcher and found that count indicators for things like missed calls broke far too often. Running the straight Android experience and while it is better, still is nowhere near as polished as Windows Phone was. Can they have an Android emulator to run android apps?
    06-08-2018 01:59 PM
  18. Robert Buckner1's Avatar
    I think the long-awaited Surface Phone is closer than ever. For a long time, the Surface Phone has generated more rumors than any other device without having lost the expectation. And lately those rumors have increased, including a hint by Panos Panay.

    But, what will ensure the success of it?

    Who will want to buy a Surface mobile device (that won't be cheap) without access to the modern apps? Who will buy it to replace a desktop pc? Who will buy it to carry two mobile devices (Andromeda Windows 10 and an Android or iPhone? I think no one would buy it, even long time MS supporters like me and many others. You may think that Microsoft will rely on PWA to close the gap between the Microsoft Store and Google and Apple apps stores. But that's not going to happen, at least in the near future, even with the big support from Google. In my opinion, even the Surface and Surface Pro lines will not survive if Microsoft don't do something quick.

    And I would think that Microsoft knows that and they will not invest hundreds of millions on a product line that is destined to be DOA. So, I think that Microsoft is working on a surprise for everyone.

    In recent months, I have noticed a closer integration with its services and Windows 10 with Android apps, the development of new applications, even for non-MS services, and the Android support on Windows 10 (I can't wait to try "Your Phone" currently under development and still non functional in Windows 10 build 17677). All these make me think that Microsoft is developing (or should develop) the Andromeda device with Android OS and will be heavily loaded with their apps and services, which makes a lot of sense to me, and that would ensure that the device is widely accepted and would guarantee its success. Even their OEM partners would follow them with new devices, because it will be a mature and productive system as well as entertainment.

    I have been a strong supporter, follower and defender of Windows Mobile/Phone for long time (since my 2007
    AT&T Tilt until my Lumia 950) and just a few months ago I jumped out of the sinking ship to buy a Samsung S8+ and now I realize all I was missing before and all that I am missing now, and that makes me desire a combination of both worlds.

    I have my Samsung phone loaded with MS apps. I just installed Next on my Samsung (and I love it) and makes me feel closer to the Windows Mobile experience in regards to the notifications (Android notifications sucks). I was able to restore my WhatsApp backup from WM to Android (thanks to Nicola's WinWazzapMigrator), and also I transferred all my SMS to Android. I am still missing on Android the Anand Prakash's Converge app.

    I am missing a lot my Lumia 950 and I can say that Windows Mobile is a lot superior to Android but it lacks the apps we want and need now. It is a shame that Microsoft did not listen to Ballmer when he proposed to allow Android apps to run natively on Windows Mobile 10, but now is maybe too late for that formula.

    I will consider to buy an Andromeda device with Android OS and heavily loaded with all MS apps and with a like-WM experience.

    My Andromeda flavor:
    - Launcher10 as a launcher
    - Outlook instead of the Android Contacts, Calendar and Mail.
    - Next instead of Android Notifications.
    - Edge instead of Chrome.
    - I would be using Google Assistant until MS improves Cortana.
    - Bing instead of Google Search and Google Maps.
    - Google Play store.

    Which other apps or modifications would you love on an Andromeda with Android? What do you think about it?

    I will see a long life to Andromeda if MS uses android. What do you think? Does it makes sense to you?
    06-08-2018 02:18 PM
  19. gamo62's Avatar
    IF they want it to succeed, it will have to run Android. And have ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with Windows Mobile, or it will fail. If it runs Windows Mobile, I won't touch it with an IOS device.
    06-08-2018 03:42 PM
  20. T5UN4M1 17's Avatar
    Not sure if Andromeda and Surface Phone are the same device. I've read here that Andromeda is not a phone replacement. If Microsoft launches a phone, it must run Android to succeed. I miss my Lumia 950, but the work and social apps I need are only on iOS or Android.
    06-08-2018 03:44 PM
  21. Hoppman's Avatar
    If Microsoft used their own fork of android without any scroogle services, then fine, but I would prefer some version of Windows 10.
    06-08-2018 03:55 PM
  22. erzhik's Avatar
    Haven't we gone over this with WP and then WM and then the failed universal app experiment? Win 10 will only succeed on a desktop/laptop. Anything else, just build the hardware and put Android on it if you even think if having success.
    06-08-2018 04:36 PM
  23. scoots37's Avatar
    The point of Andromeda is that it doesn't need mobile apps to be useful BECAUSE IT'S NOT A PHONE. Obviously the hope is that eventually the mobile apps will come, but Andromeda is first and foremost a JOURNAL. I write a ton on scratch paper (at work, at school, at home) and would LOVE to just pull out a digital journal to jot something down or solve a problem real quick.

    Microsoft would be almost dead in my eyes if they became another Android OEM as you're basically suggesting.
    06-08-2018 04:45 PM
  24. timotim27's Avatar
    If Andromeda is running on Android, at that moment I lose ALL interest in the device...
    06-08-2018 04:50 PM
  25. DRDiver's Avatar
    I've actually stuck with Windows Phone and Windows 10 Mobile. There are things I NEED that simply are impossible on any other platform or, if they ARE possible, you have to do so much tweaking to even come close. Cortana is a HUGE part of that. As for the apps, there's nothing on Android or iPhone that I need that doesn't exist on WP/W10M either natively, as a UWP app or via a pinned website.
    Lobo Technician likes this.
    06-08-2018 05:07 PM
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