05-12-2014 02:28 PM
51 123
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  1. DaT Franchise's Avatar
    Windows, sorry but the the pro is far cheaper then the MacBook as you would still need parallels to run some things, IIRC that's another $300 in software? As far as having iPad, you pretty much have a big iPhone that cant make calls.
    05-08-2014 02:51 PM
  2. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    Windows, sorry but the the pro is far cheaper then the MacBook as you would still need parallels to run some things, IIRC that's another $300 in software? As far as having iPad, you pretty much have a big iPhone that cant make calls.
    Not quite correct. The Surface Pro 2 is not far cheaper than a Macbook. You don't need Parallels if you need to run Windows apps. Oracle's VirtualBox is robust, enterprise-quality, and free. There is the cost of a Windows license that will be needed regardless of the VM option.

    Depending upon the application that needs to be run, Wine (free) / CrossOver ($60) can run Windows apps without the need for a Windows license.

    If you believe that the iPad is nothing more than an oversized iPhone then you probably have not attempted to use it for "serious" work.
    05-08-2014 04:07 PM
  3. RavenSword's Avatar
    I do not require you to understand.
    You also don't seem to have a adequate answer
    sd173 likes this.
    05-08-2014 04:12 PM
  4. DaT Franchise's Avatar
    Idk you can pick up a surface pro new for 500, a mac is starting around 1100. The pro 2 that's different at 900.
    Thanks for the correction on the virtual machine. For me getting a lot of the software for tuning electronic speed controls and doing any kind of rooting or development on android is an absolute joke on a mac. I had a MacBook a few years back and sold it within 6monts. Apple doesn't suit my needs and I hate the ecosystem with a passion.
    As for the IPad ill stand my ground on that, sorry I know a tone of people with them, just like android and there tables.
    05-08-2014 04:21 PM
  5. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    You also don't seem to have a adequate answer
    I did, but didn't feel like it was necessary. But if you must know, people say that because apple has a cult following. If the ghost of jobs came back and told everyone to jump off a bridge, about 65% of iPhone users would plummet to their deaths... joyfully.
    05-08-2014 05:52 PM
  6. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    I did, but didn't feel like it was necessary. But if you must know, people say that because apple has a cult following. If the ghost of jobs came back and told everyone to jump off a bridge, about 65% of iPhone users would plummet to their deaths... joyfully.
    ...and why do you think that is? Because consumers are stupid? Because they're gullible? Did Apple do things right? Perhaps it is all of the above. And if so, why doesn't Microsoft do the things necessary to establish that kind of fierce brand loyalty? (Or is Microsoft "above" that sort of thing)
    05-08-2014 05:54 PM
  7. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    ...and why do you think that is? Because consumers are stupid? Because they're gullible? Did Apple do things right? Perhaps it is all of the above. And if so, why doesn't Microsoft do the things necessary to establish that kind of fierce brand loyalty? (Or is Microsoft "above" that sort of thing)
    No, It's because apple did things almost right early on. Their stuff isn't all that anymore, but the average consumer is STUPID. They get stuck on the idea that a company is bad or good based on their first experience. Apple could start putting out the worst stuff on the planet and it would take 10+ years before people actually change their opinions.
    sd173 likes this.
    05-08-2014 05:58 PM
  8. Zulfigar's Avatar
    No, It's because apple did things almost right early on. Their stuff isn't all that anymore, but the average consumer is STUPID. They get stuck on the idea that a company is bad or good based on their first experience. Apple could start putting out the worst stuff on the planet and it would take 10+ years before people actually change their opinions.
    Apple bought the first iPad from a Japanese company, without buying the actual name...
    05-08-2014 06:05 PM
  9. DaT Franchise's Avatar
    Lets just say apple could release the iPhone 3g rebadged as the iPhone 6 and the isheep will wait in line for days to buy it. Apple puts an s behind anything and most people think its a massive new thing, (Samsung does it too). So yes the average low information buyers are dumb.
    anon(5445874) and sd173 like this.
    05-08-2014 06:11 PM
  10. sd173's Avatar
    But how do those stack up to the windows versions? Is the apple version the same?
    The mobile office on iOS and Android are limited in functionality compared to Office 365 for Windows.

    If you're going to get a Surface for note taking and gaming, don't even bother with the RT version, the Surface 2 has no digitizer and a limited operating system, so you won't be able to use the best note taking application for it with a stylus (desktop OneNote) and you won't be able to play every game on the store.

    However, the Surface Pro 2 has way longer battery life, a digitizer, and the ability to download any store or desktop application you want. This is definitely what would be best for you based on the original post. But, I think you should wait for May 20th in case Microsoft announces a new Surface (Pro 3 hopefully?) Tablet in addition to the small Surface that will be announced.
    05-08-2014 06:19 PM
  11. DaT Franchise's Avatar
    Dont forget your getting ultra book/laptop performance in tablet form, you can run anything you want without worrying about running in virtual machine or worrying about parallels. If you don't wanna drop a stack get the OG surface pro, $500 MacBook beat down.
    sd173 likes this.
    05-08-2014 06:24 PM
  12. DaT Franchise's Avatar
    Apple bought the first iPad from a Japanese company, without buying the actual name...
    Exactly, same played out design, outdated LG screen. Going from a 4s to a 5s is like going from a 2012 Prius to a 2013 Prius and swearing its a massive upgrade.
    05-08-2014 06:29 PM
  13. sd173's Avatar
    We'll, the surface pro is rather expensive isn't it? At that price point I'm in ultra book/MacBook territory.
    It is definitely worth it. I don't know how I lived without my Surface Pro for the first 2 years of High school. I've used it everyday for at least 6-7 hours for the last half of 11th grade and all of 12th grade this year. The stylus and Bluetooth adapter, along with the sculpt touch mouse (I hate Trackpads) make it perfect for me to do just about anything. Then there's also the HDMI and VGA adapters which make it really good for Photoshop and AutoDesk Inventor (I know you didn't mention needing that, I'm just getting into my Surface Pro promotion mode, since MS doesn't do it).
    05-08-2014 06:30 PM
  14. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    No, It's because apple did things almost right early on. Their stuff isn't all that anymore, but the average consumer is STUPID. They get stuck on the idea that a company is bad or good based on their first experience. Apple could start putting out the worst stuff on the planet and it would take 10+ years before people actually change their opinions.
    You couldn't bring yourself to acknowledge that they DID do things right early on.

    So you agree that making a good first impression is important then...that once a good reputation is established there is a momentum of loyalty that extends beyond the quality of the product being currently produced.

    ...and just to bring things back on topic....
    Given Microsoft's track record and reputation, how confident are you that Microsoft will actively support and enhance the Surface (RT) line? ...to the point of encouraging someone to invest in the platform.

    They stated a formal commitment to support Windows RT to April 11, 2017. Some might take that to mean that they will be enhancing the platform forward up until that time... but it generally means producing security updates and fixes.
    toddpart likes this.
    05-08-2014 06:31 PM
  15. DaT Franchise's Avatar
    Apples patent lawyers did it right in the beginning, if it wasn't for LG (displays) Samsung (chip sets) and Sony, apple wouldn't be who they are today. Always remember the only thing apple about an Idevice is the OS. I'll never support a company who takes technology or outside help from there competitors then turn around and sue them for "patent infringements"
    05-08-2014 06:38 PM
  16. sd173's Avatar
    This thread is starting to get off-topic . . .

    So anyway, I think if you have to get a Surface RT (1 or 2), you should make sure you won't ever need any extra programs other than Office on it, because if you do, you should get the original Surface Pro. It's actually really cheap, especially with bundles you can get from the Microsoft Store (online), compared to its original price - I almost feel ripped off because of the difference from when it came out in February 2013.
    05-08-2014 06:46 PM
  17. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    I think the main point here should be that the Surface = Greatness.
    sd173 likes this.
    05-08-2014 07:54 PM
  18. thatdennis's Avatar
    We'll, I work in retail, so my job doesn't exactly call for productivity with a device, ha ha. Like I said, it'll be for taking to class when I start up in the fall and it'll be used for things I'd use my iPad for like web, email, video, some music listening, and some games.
    I take mine to classes all the time. I download the .pdf of textbooks and so my surface is basically a textbook + notebook + essay writer.
    05-08-2014 08:31 PM
  19. godse573's Avatar
    I think what Microsoft was aiming to do was build a purely productive machine. One for school students and not much else. After 4 months of owning my surface, it has treated me very well. Office is all you really need, and some amenities are on the store like some games/apps etc. All I bought it for was for school work and nothing else, and I'd have to say, I've never been so productive and organized at the same time. Wish I had made the move sooner.
    05-08-2014 08:36 PM
  20. Cruncher04's Avatar
    If you're going to get a Surface for note taking and gaming, don't even bother with the RT version, the Surface 2 has no digitizer and a limited operating system, so you won't be able to use the best note taking application for it with a stylus (desktop OneNote) and you won't be able to play every game on the store.
    What you miss to mention is that a Surface Pro is 50% heavier, has 50% more depth, is actively cooled all while deliver almost 30% less battery duration compared to Surface 2.
    So when purely looking form tablets use-case perspektive, Surface Pro is one of the worst tablets on the market. The only thing you are loosing with Surface 2 is running x86 (desktop) programs and an active digitizer, as Windows RT is a full featured Windows. Going by the OPs requirements the 2 features you gain are hardly worth the trade-offs, when going with Surface Pro.
    05-08-2014 09:18 PM
  21. RavenSword's Avatar
    How is performance and battery on the original surface pro? Also, will the improved touch or type cover work on it?
    05-09-2014 12:27 AM
  22. anon(5445874)'s Avatar
    How is performance and battery on the original surface pro? Also, will the improved touch or type cover work on it?
    It depends on what your doing, but the battery life on the original pro isn't great. I have one and love it, you just need to keep it charged or if you're working around the house or office, plug it in. It also helps to have an extra power cord, so you can keep one at home and take the other with you in your bag.

    The new covers work just fine. They just don't work on the old RT surface. I actually have a type cover 2 on my surface pro, it's very nice. You can also use the new power keyboard on the old surface pro which would help that awful battery life. But if you're getting a new machine, you might as well get a pro2.
    05-09-2014 01:58 AM
  23. sd173's Avatar
    How is performance and battery on the original surface pro? Also, will the improved touch or type cover work on it?
    After changing the advanced battery plan settings in the control panel, I get around 5-6 hrs. using office programs, Internet Explorer, and metro applications like News. If you ever do need to do something that is more CPU-intensive, like Photoshop or Autodesk Inventor, you'll get around 3-4.5 hours.
    05-09-2014 05:23 PM
  24. onlysublime's Avatar
    So right now I'm primarily a apple user. I own a 5S, iPad 4, and Apple TV.

    Plus I'm looking for a device to take to class and type notes and papers on. So I was thinking maybe a surface 2 could be good.

    However , I'm not sure how reliable or good the device is with those things and others. I would like to use apps on it like video watching and web and email and other such apps and things.

    Also some light gaming could be fun .

    For owners of the device, what do you see as it's main selling points and as maybe it's faults? And would you recommend it? Is the experience going to be measurably better than if I just bought a keyboard for my iPad?
    I did some copying/pasting from a previous post but updated it...

    I have no experience with Surface 2.

    But I do have the original Surface RT. you get the Surface RT, knowing what it is good for: Microsoft Office with a great form factor/screen. Note that Surface 2 is a LOT FASTER than my old Surface RT.

    The Surface RT is my daily driver for my work. It's compact, great keyboard, battery lasts a long time, etc. I also have an Asus Transformer T100 with full Windows 8.1. But for what I need, the Surface RT is better. The screen is a little bigger, the screen is a lot brighter. The speed is a little less but you don't notice it while using Office or when using Metro apps. The battery pretty much lasts all day. I use an Excel spreadsheet to keep track of patients and clients and my daily workflow. I use Word extensively. Sometimes I do PowerPoint presentations. The built-in reader app is great for page flipping through PDFs. If I'm doing the meeting minutes, I can snap the sound recorder to the side and type the minutes in Word on the other side. 3 other coworkers picked up the original Surface RT because they saw what I was doing with mine (and the rock bottom pricing for the original helped out too). I warned them that Surface RT is not full Windows but they liked what I showed them and they didn't need full Windows.

    If I had the Surface when I was in college, it would've been awesome. It's liberating to go a whole day without being tethered to an outlet. Nowadays, many newer colleges have an outlet per desk but it wasn't like that in the past.

    Attachment 64684

    Note that the Type 2 keyboard is full-sized. You can type forever on this. You need to write a 30 page essay? Totally doable. It's backlit as well so you can type in the dark.

    Attachment 64686

    compare that to the tiny keyboards of a lot of tablets/Windows machines...

    It's great for presentations as well, whether you're 1-on-1 flipping through a PDF or whether you're doing an entire room and mirroring the Surface with a projector and doing PDFs or PowerPoints. At my med school, we typed our notes in the notes section of the PowerPoint presentations. so as the professor was going through the slides, we could follow along and type. you can easily record the audio and follow in powerpoint and word.

    Now, you can do light gaming as in the Windows Store apps which are like iPhone/Android games. No major gaming like true PC games in Windows 8.1.

    I also have the Surface Pro 2 (which I love). The SP2 kicks *** but it's expensive. But if you have the budget, get it. I also have the Asus Transformer T100 which is pretty good as a tablet. But as a school machine, I think it sucks because of the crappy keyboard and the not-bright screen.
    05-11-2014 09:13 PM
  25. spyderzWPC's Avatar
    again it depends on what you need it for, I would think a pro 1 would be cheap by now.

    I get about 4 hours of battery life on my surface pro 1. Again I love the size because it is tiny and light and is a full function laptop.

    the one thing that I don't think is perfect is, it is not light enough to really be used as a book. The rt is light enough and does a good job. I am curious to see what the 20th will bring us.

    also I know the new keyboards required a patch to use on the older surface pro, I picked up the extra battery keyboard, it adds another 3 to 4 hours of battery life, which is great when I need it but it adds a lot more weight then I expected.
    05-12-2014 09:17 AM
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