10-23-2013 10:43 PM
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  1. JKing106's Avatar
    I agree with what you are saying, as it applies to the Surface 2 Pro. I do see it as a way for MS to drive their OEMs. While I think it is also overpriced, I think it's not as bad as the Surface 2. The Pro 2 is meant for enterprise and power users, and the price is therefore close to being justified. I think the Surface Pro 2 price should stay where it is, but include the Type Cover. How that works logistically with all the colored Type Covers, I'm not sure.

    I think the Surface 2 needs to be priced much lower, simply as a vehicle to get people using Windows 8 by choice. My opinion on the 32gb Surface 2 is the same as the 32 gb Surface RT: there is no place for it in the market, simply due to the lack of storage. My father purchased one and was immediately turned off by this fact alone. Yes, you can purchase an expandable memory stick. And yes, 8.1 brings much better management of the expanded memory, but why should the consumer have to do this? So, my opinion is that the 64gb Surface 2, at $549, or the 32gb Surface 2 with memory stick at roughly $500, are both overpriced. Add the Touch or Type Cover, which anyone who sees a Surface associate with it because of the marketing images. and you are really getting up there in price. Add this to the fact that the Surface 2 is so limited in comparison to the iPad, and you have a tough sell. Yes, you get office on the Surface 2. When someone walks into a Best Buy to purchase a tablet, do you really think the differentiating factor will be the ability to edit Word documents in the official Word application? For the general consumer, absolutely not. It actually leads to another questions : if MS indeed intends to make a 7-8" Surface tablet, what place does the Surface 2 have? The Surface 2 seems to be in the middle, with no target audience.

    To sum up my feelings, if MS does intend to make a 7-8" Surface tablet, then I think not only is the Surface 2 overpriced, but it has no market. It absolutely can't compete with the iPad at that price point. Very few general consumers care about editing Word documents for work on their tablet. They want to watch movies, read, play the latest games, etc. If MS doesn't intend to make a 7-8" Surface tablet, then I think the Surface 2 is overpriced by at least $150.



    Microsoft should unchain the the RT/S2 from the artificial limitations they imposed to force enterprise to purchase the Pro (non-commercial Office with no Outlook, no domains, etc. ) Then, produce a commercial actually showing the thing being used for work, and play.
    09-26-2013 11:47 AM
  2. JKing106's Avatar
    "Surface, the perfect companion for work, and play. From Microsoft."

    Or something along those lines.
    09-26-2013 11:49 AM
  3. coolqf's Avatar
    At that price people will consider it, but ultimately will go with the iPad 5. After all, it's only 10% more :D Office RT is a nice addition, but without a keyboard/mouse it's a bit of a mute point, because then we would be talking about a $580 tablet, and at 580 I think we can find better alternatives for productivity via the new intel atom chip.
    09-28-2013 02:34 AM
  4. Nemesis-X's Avatar
    Why would anyone buy a Surface 2 though when the Asus T100 as someone above mentioned is coming out with Full Win 8.1 and a keyboard dock??? Am I missing something here about the Asus? And it's supposedly going to cost $400 for the 64GB version?
    09-28-2013 09:13 AM
  5. KoukiFC3S's Avatar
    I was hoping the 64GB model would be $500. Asking $100 for 32GB of extra storage is just greedy.
    09-28-2013 11:13 AM
  6. rebornempowered's Avatar
    I have a RT and really want a 2 but after seeing the price drop from what I paid last year I am going to wait. If MS has some sort of trade in deal I might consider it but otherwise I'm not paying the early adopter tax again. :)
    09-28-2013 12:50 PM
  7. Daylife's Avatar
    I was hoping the 64GB model would be $500. Asking $100 for 32GB of extra storage is just greedy.
    Telll that to Apple - 32 Gb iPad $599, not a single person complains. lol
    09-28-2013 01:05 PM
  8. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
    If this was the 64GB only model at $449, that would be outstanding. Still, its not bad start. For me, this is why the Asus t100 is more appealing because for slightly weaker specs, a bundled in keyboard and full windows 8.1, you're getting more value at $400.
    09-28-2013 01:29 PM
  9. tgp's Avatar
    Telll that to Apple - 32 Gb iPad $599, not a single person complains. lol
    Yes, but Apple's product's name starts with a lower case i. They have their reputation to ride on. Microsoft doesn't, at least not in the mobile world.
    09-28-2013 02:01 PM
  10. pbankey's Avatar
    Hmm, pricing is definitely a tricky thing for this product. I can see the argument for both sides... I can't say what I would do in that situation. Lucky for me, I'm just the consumer ;)


    I will say though that I spend $600 on a RT with touch cover when it was released on day one and I still don't ever regret the purchase at all. This device is premium. It's taught me (for real this time) that critics and tech bloggers really don't hold water with their reviews. Thank Molly Wood for perpetuating that, too.

    I still use my RT every day and I still love it. I am still fascinated by how amazingly well built it is, the type/touch covers, the kickstand, and the fact that it feels like if I showed this device to even Steve Jobs 10 years ago, he would feel like computing devices are heading in the direction he dreamed of. Really, this device still impresses me.

    So, of course I feel the next generation is worth the price and more.

    But the problem is I have owned a surface and am able to share from experience why it's so amazing and worth every cent I spent on it. Most people have not owned one. However, I am so glad that Microsoft went the route of maintaining the premium aspect of this device rather than diluting its potential for the sake of price. It may not even sell well, but at least I know I'll be completely content with it.
    09-28-2013 02:21 PM
  11. surfacedude's Avatar
    saw in interview today w/ panos that might explain the pricing. microsoft is going to sell the rt right along side surface 2 and surface pro 2. surface 2 clearly has to cost more than the rt, but i still think the pricing structure is bad. sell the rt for 250 w/ a cover, surface 2 for 400 with a cover, pro 2 for 700 w/ cover. at 250 w/ a cover, i bet microsoft would be able to get through a good bit of their rt stock.
    WillysJeepMan likes this.
    09-28-2013 04:21 PM
  12. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    saw in interview today w/ panos that might explain the pricing. microsoft is going to sell the rt right along side surface 2 and surface pro 2. surface 2 clearly has to cost more than the rt, but i still think the pricing structure is bad. sell the rt for 250 w/ a cover, surface 2 for 400 with a cover, pro 2 for 700 w/ cover. at 250 w/ a cover, i bet microsoft would be able to get through a good bit of their rt stock.
    I agree. Given that the manufacturer refurbed RT bundles were selling at an amazing rate for $199, I can see the same thing happening for NEW bundles at $249.

    As I mentioned before... wait. I'm confident that there will be door-buster pricing on RT bundles this Black Friday. Microsoft will quickly sell out of existing RT inventory that will help generate buzz for the Surface 2. If Microsoft does this, they'll be fine with the existing price structure. If they don't, there'll be fire sales on the Surface 2.
    surfacedude likes this.
    09-28-2013 04:41 PM
  13. iosified's Avatar
    Surface 2 is well worth the $449 price. Of course I would love it if it was at $400 or at its current price but with the addition of a cover, however seeing the increased performance and the benchmarks posted here, I can't really complain about price. Now SurfacePro2 is going t be interesting for me because I need a new laptop and although considering a S2 and a laptop, I might end up getting just the Pro2.
    09-28-2013 06:32 PM
  14. Dexter505's Avatar
    I don't see why the cover cost that much.
    09-28-2013 10:07 PM
  15. calfee20's Avatar
    I don't see why the cover cost that much.
    No one is making a comparable touch cover. This is new ground and since there is nothing similar how can you compare price. Even with all the ipad keyboard accessories there is nothing similar or as nice.

    I personally feel as though MS should include a free protective cover with the magnetic clips on every device. I would like a plain Surface 2 as I believe I could get along without a dedicated keyboard. The on screen one would be enough. A premium device should come with a protective cover.
    09-28-2013 11:10 PM
  16. JKing106's Avatar
    Hmm, pricing is definitely a tricky thing for this product. I can see the argument for both sides... I can't say what I would do in that situation. Lucky for me, I'm just the consumer ;)


    I will say though that I spend $600 on a RT with touch cover when it was released on day one and I still don't ever regret the purchase at all. This device is premium. It's taught me (for real this time) that critics and tech bloggers really don't hold water with their reviews. Thank Molly Wood for perpetuating that, too.

    I still use my RT every day and I still love it. I am still fascinated by how amazingly well built it is, the type/touch covers, the kickstand, and the fact that it feels like if I showed this device to even Steve Jobs 10 years ago, he would feel like computing devices are heading in the direction he dreamed of. Really, this device still impresses me.

    So, of course I feel the next generation is worth the price and more.

    But the problem is I have owned a surface and am able to share from experience why it's so amazing and worth every cent I spent on it. Most people have not owned one. However, I am so glad that Microsoft went the route of maintaining the premium aspect of this device rather than diluting its potential for the sake of price. It may not even sell well, but at least I know I'll be completely content with it.



    You really earned that check, buddy.
    09-28-2013 11:14 PM
  17. Daylife's Avatar
    Hmm, pricing is definitely a tricky thing for this product. I can see the argument for both sides... I can't say what I would do in that situation. Lucky for me, I'm just the consumer ;)


    I will say though that I spend $600 on a RT with touch cover when it was released on day one and I still don't ever regret the purchase at all. This device is premium. It's taught me (for real this time) that critics and tech bloggers really don't hold water with their reviews. Thank Molly Wood for perpetuating that, too.

    I still use my RT every day and I still love it. I am still fascinated by how amazingly well built it is, the type/touch covers, the kickstand, and the fact that it feels like if I showed this device to even Steve Jobs 10 years ago, he would feel like computing devices are heading in the direction he dreamed of. Really, this device still impresses me.

    So, of course I feel the next generation is worth the price and more.

    But the problem is I have owned a surface and am able to share from experience why it's so amazing and worth every cent I spent on it. Most people have not owned one. However, I am so glad that Microsoft went the route of maintaining the premium aspect of this device rather than diluting its potential for the sake of price. It may not even sell well, but at least I know I'll be completely content with it.

    I agree.
    09-28-2013 11:55 PM
  18. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    It's not me, it's the market.
    The market is what, saying that an upper-mid-range laptop (which often sells for around $1,000+) squeezed into a tablet body should cost $500? The RT is an iPad competitor, and it is going to sell for less than the equivalent iPad by $150 or so. What you're claiming is "the market" is a total failure of cost recognition, I think.
    09-29-2013 04:39 AM
  19. ohgood's Avatar
    The market is what, saying that an upper-mid-range laptop (which often sells for around $1,000+) squeezed into a tablet body should cost $500? The RT is an iPad competitor, and it is going to sell for less than the equivalent iPad by $150 or so. What you're claiming is "the market" is a total failure of cost recognition, I think.
    By me, or all those consumers, or both?
    09-29-2013 05:46 AM
  20. onysi's Avatar
    lol tax will take it back up to that price.
    09-29-2013 11:02 AM
  21. surfacedude's Avatar
    The market is what, saying that an upper-mid-range laptop (which often sells for around $1,000+) squeezed into a tablet body should cost $500? The RT is an iPad competitor, and it is going to sell for less than the equivalent iPad by $150 or so. What you're claiming is "the market" is a total failure of cost recognition, I think.
    umm...not quite. consumers don't and shouldn't care about "cost recognition." that's the job of the manufacturer, microsoft. microsoft determines whether or not they think consumers will buy a product and what they are willing to pay for that product. if you want top dollar for your product, then you better deliver an outstanding product relative to the competition. this is precisely why surface rt failed. i have one and love, but i can admit it failed. microsoft lost nearly a billion dollars on it. that's a failure by any metric unless the plain was to loss a ton of money. imo, it failed because of microsoft's strange marketing strategy AND hardware that was outdated even before the product was released. speed, screen resolution, volume...just those three alone make it impossible for the surface rt to really compete w/ the ipad. being able to run word doesn't make up for that and if a keyboard is supposed to sway buyers, most of them will choose an ipad w/ all of the available apps and just buy a separate keyboard if typing is that important for the experience they want.

    the problem isn't consumers, it's microsoft. they chosen to only get serious about phones, tablets, and hardware only after the market has been completely saturated by apple and to a much lesser extent, google. to break into the market, you need to think long term. offering a straight up competitor will fail because apple offers an outstanding ecosystem that works and is elegant. converting folks over from ipads means you need to be offering something incredible at an incredible price, not somthing at a comparable price that offers an inferior experience. just think if microsoft had saud, "you know what, we've set ourselves a very hard task: breaking into a consumer market dominated by apple to the tune of something like 90%. we will have to win not just buyers, but convert some buyers. with that in mind, let manage loses and plan to take a financial hit to the tune of 1.5 billion dollars over the next three cycles and offer our tablets at an incredible price. and we must also offer at least a comparable product. hopefully at the end of this experiment we will have built a legitimate alternative to ipad and airbooks. at that time we will re-evaluate our product strategy for profit opportunities."

    kind of like losing a battle or two, but winning the war....
    WillysJeepMan likes this.
    09-29-2013 11:45 AM
  22. hcrick's Avatar
    Isn't it possible that MS is simply positioning the Surface line as a premium grade, high quality, best in class product? It will be the numerous OEM products that end up offering the superior value you speak of. It will be the OEM's cumulative efforts that will make the biggest dent in the market. The upcoming products from Asus, Dell, HP, and Acer are a great start and offer tremendous value and potential, at least on paper. We will see how they perform real world.
    toddpart likes this.
    09-29-2013 06:05 PM
  23. MSFTisMIA's Avatar
    I think that MSFT knows who they're targeting, but I'm curious to see how competing tablets such as the upcoming Lumia compete with the Surface 2. How much will Nokia's success with their tablet influence the Surface 3 once the merger is complete?

    Honestly, if the Surface 2 was a 64GB model with the touch keyboard at $500, I could justify getting it over the Asus T100 - because the built in USB port, direct MSFT support and better build quality offset the fact that it runs RT instead of full Windows. Honestly, RT is enough for my needs, but when you're offering full windows at a lower price point, for the budget consumer like myself, it is a no brainer.
    09-29-2013 06:31 PM
  24. coolqf's Avatar
    I think that MSFT knows who they're targeting, but I'm curious to see how competing tablets such as the upcoming Lumia compete with the Surface 2. How much will Nokia's success with their tablet influence the Surface 3 once the merger is complete?

    Honestly, if the Surface 2 was a 64GB model with the touch keyboard at $500, I could justify getting it over the Asus T100 - because the built in USB port, direct MSFT support and better build quality offset the fact that it runs RT instead of full Windows. Honestly, RT is enough for my needs, but when you're offering full windows at a lower price point, for the budget consumer like myself, it is a no brainer.
    I'm sure they know who they're targetting, but I wonder if they know whether they're actually reaching them :D Afteralll, they did write off nearly $1 bil USD last year for the Surface RT.
    09-30-2013 10:06 AM
  25. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    Isn't it possible that MS is simply positioning the Surface line as a premium grade, high quality, best in class product? It will be the numerous OEM products that end up offering the superior value you speak of. It will be the OEM's cumulative efforts that will make the biggest dent in the market. The upcoming products from Asus, Dell, HP, and Acer are a great start and offer tremendous value and potential, at least on paper. We will see how they perform real world.
    If what you say about Microsoft's motives is true, then they appear to be as clueless as they've ever been. How can they produce a "best in class" product when the "class" doesn't exist yet? The Surface is a essentially a tablet replacement for netbooks. The Suface Pro, a tablet replacement for ultrabooks. It can be argued that those classes didn't exist prior to the introduction of the Surface. As such, they needed to carry that vision and cast it to consumers... and you don't do that by using an ad campaign of metrosexual hipsters prancing around swapping TypeCovers.

    How did Microsoft reward the early adopters of the Surface products? Given the lackluster performance of the 1st gen RT, what is MS doing to thank those customers for taking a chance on their new product that has since seen one official price drop, and one or two additional price drops via bundling? What is MS doing to build customer loyalty beyond those who are already loyal? Individual consumers are not the Fortune 500. They aren't forced to buy Microsoft products because their CIO signed a contract. They have a choice.

    I really like the Surface RT. Given Microsoft's poor track record of supporting their consumer devices, $199 for the bundle was the most that I was willing to pay for something that has a good possibility of being discontinued within the next 3 years.

    Microsoft appears to be doing the same thing with the Surface that they did with the Zune. The arguments in support of Microsoft's actions also share that similarity. Why will the outcome be different this time?
    09-30-2013 11:02 AM
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